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Apple's fifth-gen iPhone may support dual model GSM/CDMA but not LTE

post #1 of 40
Thread Starter 
Apple's fifth-generation iPhone will be capable of running on networks based on both of the world's most popular 3G wireless standards but will forgo support for the faster 4G networks that are just now coming online, according to a new report.

Citing rumors that stem back to last November, TechCrunch claims that Apple's next major iPhone revision will run on both GSM and CDMA networks -- presumably via a dual-mode Qualcomm baseband chip -- but won't support the next-generation of faster, Long Term Evolution (LTE) networks, more communally referred to as 4G networks.

Instead, the Cupertino-based company will reportedly take a less aggressive approach that will see it delay the iPhone's support of 4G networks until some time in 2012, allowing it to bypass the first generation of power-hungry and potentially problematic LTE baseband controllers in favor of boosting its efforts around proprietary technologies like FaceTime.

Such an approach would mirror Apple's efforts with the launch of the original iPhone, which only supported AT&T's robust 2.5G EDGE network despite broad availability of the faster 3G technology around the same time.

"Apple simply doesnt want to be the guinea pig on new LTE networks that arent ready for primetime, and Steve Jobs knows not to trust the hype thats spewed by the carriers on 4G," the report says. "The truth is that 3G networks have many more years of life, and the transition to LTE will be much slower than the carriers want you to believe (LTE doesnt even have its voice standard fleshed out yet)."

It's for these reasons, the report adds, that AT&T has been upgrading its network for broader support of the faster, HSPA+ -- or so called 3.5G -- standard while Verizon has been working to implement an enhancement to the CDMA standard that will let future devices transmit both data and voice communications simultaneously.
post #2 of 40
Just like with 3G, they were among the last to include it, as they waited until performance was acceptable.

So it will be, with 4G.

I've said it dozens of times before, I believe the iPhone will not be fully 4G until 2012 earliest.

I'm still waiting for the HSPDA+ that AT&T has been "rolling out" for 3 years.
post #3 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Long Term Evolution (LTE) networks, more communally referred to as 4G networks.


more communally

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post #4 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

more communally

In Soviet Russia, phone networks long term evolve you!

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post #5 of 40
Makes sense to me. Why build in unsupported features at the cost of battery life and have an entire iPhone generation out there to test the crap that VZ and others are rolling out.

About as useful as having MMS and tethering available from AT&T - doesn't matter if the phone supports it if it is not turned on but in a few small places.
post #6 of 40
I got a question for those who know the 3G to 3.9G transition.

Let's say all the latest/ data consuming smart phones from Motorola and HTC move on over to 3.9G. Would that free up the space for 3G users, and maybe make iPhone actually faster during that time. In other words, will there be a jam in the freshly released LTE, leaving more bandwidth available to those on 3G?
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post #7 of 40
This makes sense. 4G, even though it's not really true 4G, isn't ready for primetime. The battery life is currently unacceptable. It isn't proven yet in the US and as a poster already said, maybe 2012 at the earliest.
post #8 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by theAppleMan912 View Post

I dont get why is is such a problem not to include an undeveloped not widely adopted network standard. People switch to verizon as they have better overall coverage and speeds.

Verizon has better coverage, but slower speeds. The CDMA systems they use are slower that what AT&T is using on GSM.
post #9 of 40
I have read that the dual tech UMTS/CDMA phones are very complex... need separate power amps, etc. Plus royalties to QCOM and the UMTS group. QCOM alone charges 5.5%.... that is $35/phone. UMTS royalties got to be at least that much ex QCOM. Extra RF circuits and incremental chipset cost at least another $20. So we are talking nearly +$100. Only few subs roam outside the US.

It certainly does not make sense to have this kind of phone as a universal phones since CDMA is less than 15% of global handsets. The CDMA tech will be phased out. Even just for VZ it is too expensive, if we factor lower subsidies from ATT due to the loss of monopoly.

At best, it makes sense just to do a CDMA phone for the minority carriers.
post #10 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Just like with 3G, they were among the last to include it, as they waited until performance was acceptable.

So it will be, with 4G.

I've said it dozens of times before, I believe the iPhone will not be fully 4G until 2012 earliest.

I'm still waiting for the HSPDA+ that AT&T has been "rolling out" for 3 years.

Considering that most of their network is still 2.5g, I wouldn't hold my breath.
post #11 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRoethig View Post

Considering that most of their network is still 2.5g, I wouldn't hold my breath.

Over 70% of AT&T's customers are on 3G. That's certainly more than those on 2.5.
post #12 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheff View Post

I got a question for those who know the 3G to 3.9G transition.

Let's say all the latest/ data consuming smart phones from Motorola and HTC move on over to 3.9G. Would that free up the space for 3G users, and maybe make iPhone actually faster during that time. In other words, will there be a jam in the freshly released LTE, leaving more bandwidth available to those on 3G?

The rollout of LTE on both AT&T and Verizon (ie 3.9G) involves entirely different sets of frequencies. Verizon won the FCC auction to get a nationwide spectrum in the 700MHz band and AT&T won almost as good a spectrum in the 850MHz band. What this means is that LTE networks will not utilize the same frequencies as current 3G networks, BUT and this is IMPORTANT, if the carriers colocate their 3G and 3.9G facilities (likely) that means that BOTH will share the backhaul connection from the cell tower to the internet. AT&T has been investing literally billions to upgrade their backhaul connections to fiber in anticipation of LTE and to resolve existing bottlenecks in areas like SFO and NYC. Verizon has been a little tighter lipped about their backhaul network, but they do have major expertise in fiber backhaul (ie FiOS). At the same time, Verizon's current EVDO RevA data network runs at significantly slower speeds as compared to AT&T and as such would likely play nicer on a common backhaul connection.

So, short answer, probably...
post #13 of 40
I love how AI reports this as "news". Anyone could see this coming. Everyone harps on about how VZ is getting a CDMA-only phone. It doesn't make sense for Apple to develop a CDMA only phone. Apple loves simplicity, and having 2 phones is not simple (different marketing/product deistribution, separate development costs, etc.). A dual band phone was the only realistic option.

As for the support of LTE, it makes sense for a couple reasons as to why Apple would not include it in the first version of the iPhone that has GSM and CDMA support. First of all, LTE is not ready for primetime and thus will only waste battery life for most people as it continuously searches for an LTE network that is not in place (though people could feasibly turn it off, though Apple wouldn't want to make people do this, their technology is supposed to "just work" and be very simple). Second, if Apple introduces a CDMA/GSM/LTE phone the following summer (2012) when AT&T and Verizon's LTE networks actually have some coverage, then it will be marketed as a big speed/network upgrade and will result in more people upgrading/more money for Jobs and Apple. Apple doesn't want to give you everything at once, as it results in lower profits.

My prediction is that a GSM/CDMA phone will be released in the summer of 2011, and then a GSM/CDMA/LTE phone the following year. Yet there is still another factor that everyone also seems to ignore, which is that the iPhone was introduced in Jan 2007 and sold in June 2007. AT&T received a 5 year exclusivity agreement, which means no VZ phone until 2012. However, iirc some reports said that the agreement might end a year early, which would thus be perfectly timed for a summer GSM/CDMA iPhone. Also, the summer release would time in perfectly to when VZ finishes revising their CDMA network (to Rev. B) to support simultaneous voice/data, which is essential to a complete iPhone experience (i.e. the commercials that showed a guy looking up some info for a friend while on the phone with him at the same time).
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post #14 of 40
Just common sense and rumors. Theres no substantiation to any of this at this point in time.
post #15 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple's fifth-generation iPhone will be capable of running on networks based on both of the world's most popular 3G wireless standards but will forgo support for the faster 4G networks that are just now coming online, according to a new report.

Citing rumors that stem back to last November, TechCrunch claims that Apple's next major iPhone revision will run on both GSM and CDMA networks -- presumably via a dual-mode Qualcomm baseband chip -- but won't support the next-generation of faster, Long Term Evolution (LTE) networks, more communally referred to as 4G networks.

Instead, the Cupertino-based company will reportedly take a less aggressive approach that will see it delay the iPhone's support of 4G networks until some time in 2012, allowing it to bypass the first generation of power-hungry and potentially problematic LTE baseband controllers in favor of boosting its efforts around proprietary technologies like FaceTime.

Such an approach would mirror Apple's efforts with the launch of the original iPhone, which only supported AT&T's robust 2.5G EDGE network despite broad availability of the faster 3G technology around the same time.

"Apple simply doesnt want to be the guinea pig on new LTE networks that arent ready for primetime, and Steve Jobs knows not to trust the hype thats spewed by the carriers on 4G," the report says. "The truth is that 3G networks have many more years of life, and the transition to LTE will be much slower than the carriers want you to believe (LTE doesnt even have its voice standard fleshed out yet)."

It's for these reasons, the report adds, that AT&T has been upgrading its network for broader support of the faster, HSPA+ -- or so called 3.5G -- standard while Verizon has been working to implement an enhancement to the CDMA standard that will let future devices transmit both data and voice communications simultaneously.

LoL... I think people consider AT&T's EDGE network many things, but I don't think that "robust" is one of the words that they use.
post #16 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiolos View Post

I love how AI reports this as "news". Anyone could see this coming. Everyone harps on about how VZ is getting a CDMA-only phone. It doesn't make sense for Apple to develop a CDMA only phone. Apple loves simplicity, and having 2 phones is not simple (different marketing/product deistribution, separate development costs, etc.). A dual band phone was the only realistic option.

As for the support of LTE, it makes sense for a couple reasons as to why Apple would not include it in the first version of the iPhone that has GSM and CDMA support. First of all, LTE is not ready for primetime and thus will only waste battery life for most people as it continuously searches for an LTE network that is not in place (though people could feasibly turn it off, though Apple wouldn't want to make people do this, their technology is supposed to "just work" and be very simple). Second, if Apple introduces a CDMA/GSM/LTE phone the following summer (2012) when AT&T and Verizon's LTE networks actually have some coverage, then it will be marketed as a big speed/network upgrade and will result in more people upgrading/more money for Jobs and Apple. Apple doesn't want to give you everything at once, as it results in lower profits.

My prediction is that a GSM/CDMA phone will be released in the summer of 2011, and then a GSM/CDMA/LTE phone the following year. Yet there is still another factor that everyone also seems to ignore, which is that the iPhone was introduced in Jan 2007 and sold in June 2007. AT&T received a 5 year exclusivity agreement, which means no VZ phone until 2012. However, iirc some reports said that the agreement might end a year early, which would thus be perfectly timed for a summer GSM/CDMA iPhone. Also, the summer release would time in perfectly to when VZ finishes revising their CDMA network (to Rev. B) to support simultaneous voice/data, which is essential to a complete iPhone experience (i.e. the commercials that showed a guy looking up some info for a friend while on the phone with him at the same time).

AT&T is running 3G on 850 MHz.
post #17 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiolos View Post

I love how AI reports this as "news". Anyone could see this coming. Everyone harps on about how VZ is getting a CDMA-only phone. It doesn't make sense for Apple to develop a CDMA only phone. Apple loves simplicity, and having 2 phones is not simple (different marketing/product deistribution, separate development costs, etc.). A dual band phone was the only realistic option.

As for the support of LTE, it makes sense for a couple reasons as to why Apple would not include it in the first version of the iPhone that has GSM and CDMA support. First of all, LTE is not ready for primetime and thus will only waste battery life for most people as it continuously searches for an LTE network that is not in place (though people could feasibly turn it off, though Apple wouldn't want to make people do this, their technology is supposed to "just work" and be very simple). Second, if Apple introduces a CDMA/GSM/LTE phone the following summer (2012) when AT&T and Verizon's LTE networks actually have some coverage, then it will be marketed as a big speed/network upgrade and will result in more people upgrading/more money for Jobs and Apple. Apple doesn't want to give you everything at once, as it results in lower profits.

My prediction is that a GSM/CDMA phone will be released in the summer of 2011, and then a GSM/CDMA/LTE phone the following year. Yet there is still another factor that everyone also seems to ignore, which is that the iPhone was introduced in Jan 2007 and sold in June 2007. AT&T received a 5 year exclusivity agreement, which means no VZ phone until 2012. However, iirc some reports said that the agreement might end a year early, which would thus be perfectly timed for a summer GSM/CDMA iPhone. Also, the summer release would time in perfectly to when VZ finishes revising their CDMA network (to Rev. B) to support simultaneous voice/data, which is essential to a complete iPhone experience (i.e. the commercials that showed a guy looking up some info for a friend while on the phone with him at the same time).

I really don't see Apple working on a dual chip phone, I think the it would be to costly with little benefit and I'm not sure you would actually see much demand for that. I don't doubt them waiting on LTE. If it advances to a point where a simple firmware upgrade would resolve power issue then they may actually build it into the phone but activating it would be unlikely until they feel the positives would outweigh the negatives. Right now people would rather have their battery life last all day than have the ability to use LTE should they happen to be in one of the very few LTE areas.
post #18 of 40
I have no idea how well Verizon will implement it's LTE network, but earlier this year I did go buy Sprint's Overdrive 4G WIMax/3G box thinking that it would be really handy to carry around for use with my Wifi iPad and also the occasional need to have a backup to cable modem (in the home office) for the rare but inconvenient occasions where the service goes down.

I ended up being pretty disappointed with the service and returned it after 3 days of messing with it. I live in Houston, which is one of the cities that is supposed to be supported, but in driving around there were precious few places that the 4G worked. At home even 3G service was pretty spotty despite being well within the coverage area.

Lots of people complain about AT&T, and I'm sure there are legitimate gripes, but where I am and the places I travel to, the service is really very good.

Sprint 4G may be decent for what I wanted it for given a little time, but it ain't there yet, and I am not about to pay $60 a month while they're trying to figure it out.

Apple has tended not to jump on the bleeding edge in favor of putting out a product that will give the customer a great experience. If these latest round of rumors have any veracity, I think that they would be doing the right thing.
post #19 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

in favor of boosting its efforts around proprietary technologies like FaceTime.

Facetime is an open standard so probably not proprietary but anyhow, faster data networks would let people use it anywhere not just over wifi so pursuing Facetime shouldn't be at the expense of faster data networks.

The network providers should be driving towards data only so that when the encryption fails in standard communication protocols (like now), they can update it and use the data network just the same. There would also be no call-time charges, just data charges.

IMO, given the usage model of the iPhone, LTE and 4G are more important than CDMA. CDMA just means paying someone else for poor service.
post #20 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by BUSHMAN4 View Post

Just common sense and rumors. Theres no substantiation to any of this at this point in time.


BORING. Verizon Already stated that they will have 5 LTE phones available in the Spring of 2011.
What I'm (was) hoping for in addition would be also an iphone 4g that's 4G! That would be nuts.

Vodaphone & China Unicomm are also gearing up around the same time.
post #21 of 40
Qualcomm is currently testing the MDM9600 which supports CDMA 2000, EVDO Rev B, SVDO, UMTS, HSPA+ and LTE. Apple will most likely use this cellular modem chip in the next iPhone in Q3 2011. Here in Canada Rogers Communications announced last week that they are in the process of upgrading their HSPA+ (3.5G) network to support LTE (4G) in 2011. Rogers current top speed is 21 Mbps over HSPA+ and stated LTE will provide up to 150 Mbps.
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post #22 of 40
The real 4G spec, which might turn out to be a variant of the current LTE, isn't even finalized yet. It might be LTE Advanced, which will be all-IP packet-switched just like other internet traffic. So it might just be a firmware update beyond today's LTE. But either way, LTE isn't 4G.

I had figured that Apple would stonewall the AT&T criticism until true 4G had been rolled out and widely adopted. And only then would they make a universal AT&T/Verizon/Whoever iPhone that runs the 4G standard. But that can't possibly happen until 2013 at the earliest, which could be about a year after the real 4G rollout begins.

There's just too much money to be made in 3 years. And Apple is in a long-term battle with Google for eyeballs on iAd and AdMob mobile ads. Apple would be giving up too much ground (and profits) by waiting until iPhone 7 in 2013 before creating a multi-carrier phone. They can't wait for all the carriers to adopt 4G, then roll it out widely enough to be interesting.

(Of course, this assumes that Android will survive the Oracle Java license violation lawsuit. There won't be an out-of-court cash settlement on this one. Larry Ellison doesn't give a crap about money.)

Here are the Wikipedia articles on 3.9G and 4G:

LTE aka 3.9G

LTE Advanced aka 4G

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post #23 of 40
does this mean it will work on T-Mobile?
post #24 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtidmore View Post

The rollout of LTE on both AT&T and Verizon (ie 3.9G) involves entirely different sets of frequencies. Verizon won the FCC auction to get a nationwide spectrum in the 700MHz band and AT&T won almost as good a spectrum in the 850MHz band.

WRONG. Thanks for pretending you know what you are talking about, but it really is not helpful. Verizon "won" the 700 mhz C block nationwide liscense. AT&T won a bunch or regional 700 mhz B block licenses and also purchased the neighboring 700 mhz B block licenses held by Aloha. AT&T actually has more 700 mhz bandwidth than Verizon in most parts of the country including all of the top 100 populations centers.

The 850 mhz spectrum was auctioned off long ago and is owned by Versizon and AT&T and that has been a big factor in their better coverage and higher level of success than Sprint (roams on Verizon) and T-mobile (no signal outside of urban areas).
post #25 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Werner View Post

does this mean it will work on T-Mobile?

Are there any dual-band CDMA/GSM chips that run at 1700MHz? If so, the answer is maybe.
post #26 of 40
In related news, another source "Close to an Apple" has revealed that the iPhone 5 may be the first to include a vegetable peeler.

"This would make the next iPhone indespensable to the Kitchen Crowd" said Analyst Imso Fullakrap in a report for Browne Financial "And would trly set the device apart from other phones out there - only the Palm Pre has approached combining Kitchen Utensils with a Mobile Data Device. A Peeler would truly be a pure Jobsian innovation, his vegetarianism shows that his fingerprints are all over this device"

---
We can continue to repeat other peoples crap, or make up our own. I vote for the latter.
post #27 of 40
Quote:
Citing rumors that stem back to last November, TechCrunch claims that Apple's next major iPhone revision will run on both GSM and CDMA networks -- presumably via a dual-mode Qualcomm baseband chip -- but won't support the next-generation of faster, Long Term Evolution (LTE) networks, more communally referred to as 4G networks.

Instead, the Cupertino-based company will reportedly take a less aggressive approach that will see it delay the iPhone's support of 4G networks until some time in 2012, allowing it to bypass the first generation of power-hungry and potentially problematic LTE baseband controllers in favor of boosting its efforts around proprietary technologies like FaceTime. [...]

It's for these reasons, the report adds, that AT&T has been upgrading its network for broader support of the faster, HSPA+ -- or so called 3.5G -- standard while Verizon has been working to implement an enhancement to the CDMA standard that will let future devices transmit both data and voice communications simultaneously.


Videotron in Quebec, Canada, just launched its new cell phone network, termed 3.75G. I suppose that this means that Android phones will reign supreme, without any competition from Apple, for a period of 18 months. And what about the new Windows Phone 7 phones?

Steve Jobs and Apple VPs have an unparalleled ability for self delusion if they believe for an instant that consumers will wait 18 months for Apple to come back to its senses and build an iPhone capable of running on 3.75G and 4G networks.

Apple sells iPhones with a 250% markup, paying $200 to build iPhones and selling them for $700, much higher than the standard 40% markup of retail sales. Now, what will happen to the iPhone's market share for 18 months while consumers take advantage of lower priced and speedier Android and Windows 7 smartphones?

Is this Windows 95 all over again? Is this the beginning of the end for iPhones? And what will happen when Microsoft, Google and every smartphone builder bombard consumers with catchy publicity highlighting the speed, features and lower cost of new smartphones, especially when compared with last year's technology offered by Apple iPhones?

Is this Apple's attempt to give Microsoft and Google a strong foothold in the smartphone market, once pioneered by Apple?

Competition is ruthless. Not everyone will buy the lame excuses of Apple's executives for offering an inferior phone for an out of this world price. As the saying goes:

'Lead, follow, or get out of the way'.


post #28 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Videotron in Quebec, Canada, just launched its new cell phone network, termed 3.75G. I suppose that this means that Android phones will reign supreme, without any competition from Apple, for a period of 18 months. And what about the new Windows Phone 7 phones?

Steve Jobs and Apple VPs have an unparalleled ability for self delusion if they believe for an instant that consumers will wait 18 months for Apple to come back to its senses and build an iPhone capable of running on 3.75G and 4G networks.

3.75G is HSPA (on UMTS networks). HSPA is a combination of HSDPA and HSUPA, both supported by the iPhone 4.

Quote:
Apple sells iPhones with a 250% markup, paying $200 to build iPhones and selling them for $700, much higher than the standard 40% markup of retail sales. Now, what will happen to the iPhone's market share for 18 months while consumers take advantage of lower priced and speedier Android and Windows 7 smartphones?

Not a lot really. Same reason Rolls Royce and BMW are still in business when we can all go buy a cheap Hyundai.
post #29 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Videotron in Quebec, Canada, just launched its new cell phone network, termed 3.75G. I suppose that this means that Android phones will reign supreme, without any competition from Apple, for a period of 18 months. And what about the new Windows Phone 7 phones?

Steve Jobs and Apple VPs have an unparalleled ability for self delusion if they believe for an instant that consumers will wait 18 months for Apple to come back to its senses and build an iPhone capable of running on 3.75G and 4G networks.

Apple sells iPhones with a 250% markup, paying $200 to build iPhones and selling them for $700, much higher than the standard 40% markup of retail sales. Now, what will happen to the iPhone's market share for 18 months while consumers take advantage of lower priced and speedier Android and Windows 7 smartphones?

Is this Windows 95 all over again? Is this the beginning of the end for iPhones? And what will happen when Microsoft, Google and every smartphone builder bombard consumers with catchy publicity highlighting the speed, features and lower cost of new smartphones, especially when compared with last year's technology offered by Apple iPhones?

Is this Apple's attempt to give Microsoft and Google a strong foothold in the smartphone market, once pioneered by Apple?

Competition is ruthless. Not everyone will buy the lame excuses of Apple's executives for offering an inferior phone for an out of this world price. As the saying goes:

'Lead, follow, or get out of the way'.



Please check your facts. Videotron towers are in limited areas of Quebec which run at the same data speeds as Rogers, Bell and Telus. Videotron customers traveling outside of Quebec are roaming on Rogers Nationwide network. Videotron customers are also roaming on Rogers towers in parts of Quebec. Since the iPhone is sold on the big three (Rogers, Bell, Telus) it would be less costlier to use one of those three networks which provide HSPA+ 3.5G Nationwide instead of Videotron which rents towers from Rogers to provide coverage for their customers.

As for 4G the first Canadian company to be working on this is Rogers who announced it to the media last week which is being tested on the 1700 and 700 MHz spectrums that was sold by the CRTC to several Canadian telecoms. The new Qualcomm MDM9600 which may be in the iPhone next year will support EDGE, EVDO, HSPA+ (3.5G) and LTE (4G). This would fall in line with Rogers network plans for 2011 to provide support for LTE and backwards compatibility for HSPA+ and EDGE cellphones and USB modems. The MDM9600 would also provide expanded coverage for Bell and Telus customers who currently cannot use GSM cellphones on EVDO.

Reference http://redboard.rogers.com/2010/roge...ial-in-canada/
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post #30 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Apple sells iPhones with a 250% markup, paying $200 to build iPhones and selling them for $700, much higher than the standard 40% markup of retail sales. Now, what will happen to the iPhone's market share for 18 months while consumers take advantage of lower priced and speedier Android and Windows 7 smartphones?

Not quite. I assume you are (mis)using iSuppli's figures? Those don't take into account the entire cost of creating the iPhone, only manufacturing and some distribution. No R&D, no administrative, no marketing, no sales, etc, etc, etc. What would the markup be on that $19.95 plastic toy that has about 5 cents of materials in it be? How about that $1.50 bottle of soda in the vending matchine that cost Coke about 2 cents to make? (Just making that up, but you get the point.)

I'm not saying Apple doesn't ask for a premium for their products. But I believe the estimates are between 20-40% gross margin, depending on the item. Definitely higher than other electronics manufacturers get. But like they say, you get what you pay for.
post #31 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Steve Jobs and Apple VPs have an unparalleled ability for self delusion ...

I agree, as evidenced by how incredibly delusional Apple's stock price is today compared to what it was in 2001.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Competition is ruthless. Not everyone will buy the lame excuses of Apple's executives for offering an inferior phone for an out of this world price. As the saying goes:

'Lead, follow, or get out of the way'.

I think you are confusing the iPhone with the Microsoft KIN.
post #32 of 40
I know this is a rumours site but come on. This is the same shit posted last year and the year before. Surely if you post the same shite then one day you will be right?!?

Unless these runour mongerers provide even a scrap of proof please ignore their bullshit ramblings. (if you can't then please create a page 3. use this to deal with the "one day this rumor will come true" moniker.
post #33 of 40
Yes, but will it come in white?
post #34 of 40
I am somewhat confused. This is only a RUMOR article, but it seems to say that the iPhone 5 will miss on the next great thing in terms of speed, thereby opening the market wide for iPhone competitors, presumably running faster on faster networks (3.75G, 3.9G or 4G). If this is true, then Android and Windows 7 phones will have a field day, helped by catchy publicity campaigns.

But some comments seem to indicate that the iPhone 5 will run just fine on newer or upgraded existing networks, taking full advantage of 22 mbps speeds offered by upgraded or newer networks. Videotron is just an example of a new network still under construction, but offering speeds up to 22 mbps. Other networks are investing billions to upgrade their equipment.

So, will the iPhone 5 offer competitive speeds of up to 22 mbps?


post #35 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

This makes sense. 4G, even though it's not really true 4G, isn't ready for primetime. .

given the flack that Apple has gotten with ATT's weak spots etc, no way are they going to jump too fast for 4g.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aiolos View Post

I love how AI reports this as "news". Anyone could see this coming.

Anyone that is a techno geek and phone freak sure. But remember that's only like 2% of the buyers for Apple stuff. Most have little to no clue.

They are hearing 4g this and 4g that and how it is the greatest thing since sliced bread. So they will expect it for the new iphone. When it doesn't happen it is possible the stock price could suffer.

AI is countering the assumption that the next iphone will be 4g by giving very valid reasons why Apple might say no. And putting them out into an environment where it could be quoted, linked etc. Because many blogs pointed towards a less techno readership do source from AppleInsider etc

Quote:
Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

Apple sells iPhones with a 250% markup, paying $200 to build iPhones and selling them for $700

I love it when folks post nonsense like that. Some site guesses that the components cost perhaps $150 but they are talking literally about the components. They don't address licensing etc. It's not like Apple can just shove in what they want cause they want. If they could they wouldn't be mixed up in easily 2 dozen patents just over the iphone.

Quote:
Competition is ruthless. Not everyone will buy the lame excuses of Apple's executives for offering an inferior phone for an out of this world price.

The literally millions of iphones, ipads etc suggest that in fact everyone does buy Apple's "lame" excuses for offering a phone you feel is inferior at a price you think is absurdly high

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply
post #36 of 40
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(LTE doesnt even have its voice standard fleshed out yet).

Why does LTE need a voice standard? maybe my perception is out of context.. but with LTE's pipeline, who is really going after tier'd voice? i thought data would over rule this?
post #37 of 40
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Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

[snip]
Citing rumors that stem back to last November, TechCrunch claims that Apple's next major iPhone revision will run on both GSM and CDMA networks -- presumably via a dual-mode Qualcomm baseband chip -- but won't support the next-generation of faster, Long Term Evolution (LTE) networks, more communally referred to as 4G networks.
[mo' snip]


Funny... that's not what TC was saying in August.

And I think they're not in a terrible rush to get the simultaneous surfing and talking extension[s] working on CDMA/EV-DO, either. I rarely talk and surf at the same time with my computers and telephone... the only killer app for it is skype-type calling... but that can run completely on data. i.e. it doesn't really *need* segregated voice and data sections to work. Once that reaches critical mass, traditional telcos might as well start pulling out their wires to sell for scrap copper. In my honest opinion.

Was communally the author's attempt at a Palinism, or spell-check run amok by the way?
post #38 of 40
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Originally Posted by ouragan View Post

I am somewhat confused. This is only a RUMOR article, but it seems to say that the iPhone 5 will miss on the next great thing in terms of speed, thereby opening the market wide for iPhone competitors, presumably running faster on faster networks (3.75G, 3.9G or 4G). If this is true, then Android and Windows 7 phones will have a field day, helped by catchy publicity campaigns.

But some comments seem to indicate that the iPhone 5 will run just fine on newer or upgraded existing networks, taking full advantage of 22 mbps speeds offered by upgraded or newer networks. Videotron is just an example of a new network still under construction, but offering speeds up to 22 mbps. Other networks are investing billions to upgrade their equipment.

So, will the iPhone 5 offer competitive speeds of up to 22 mbps?



For a Phone user though, 22Mbps isn't going to be more competitive than 2Mbps, you're just not going to notice the difference in phone data usage.

For Road warriors and us Geeks, the difference is notable there, but we're not the majority.
post #39 of 40
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Originally Posted by sheff View Post

I got a question for those who know the 3G to 3.9G transition.

Let's say all the latest/ data consuming smart phones from Motorola and HTC move on over to 3.9G. Would that free up the space for 3G users, and maybe make iPhone actually faster during that time. In other words, will there be a jam in the freshly released LTE, leaving more bandwidth available to those on 3G?

The answer is no. For every user that gets a 3.9G phone, there will be 1.X users still moving to 3G. In other words, only the bottom end users shrink. Middle user counts will continue to increase until the industry fully transitions.

There won't suddenly be an over capacity. Once there was, they'd start shutting things down.
post #40 of 40
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Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple's fifth-generation iPhone will be capable of running on networks based on both of the world's most popular 3G wireless standards but will forgo support for the faster 4G networks that are just now coming online, according to a new report ...

given that Rogers (the main carrier here in Canada) has just recently started non-lab tests of a 4G network in Ottawa this does not surprise me. i do hope, however, the 4G rollout to other parts of Canada will occur throughout 2011.
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