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Microsoft unveils plans for first nine Windows Phone 7 handsets - Page 6

post #201 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

... Apple-esquire approach which does not compete directly with Android's open approach.

I know this is just me, but is google really open? To me it's just free. Users are 'open' to use various apps. Isn't Linux really open? Symantics I guess.
Sorry for being off topic.

Back to topic, I'm sorry aesthetics do matter, and these widgets or tiles sure are ugly... IMO.
Here's hopeing iOS 5 has some limited widgets.

In the end, how much more stuff(useful hardware stuff) can they cram into these phones? Next big thing seems to be local data xfer(pay via credit card, control tv etc). Darn, off topic again, sorry.
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post #202 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post

Sprint support line: We're sorry. The issue you are having is a Windows Mobile OS problem. You will need to contact Microsoft customer support...

Microsoft support line: We're sorry. The issue you are having is a hardware problem. You will need to contact HTC customer support...

HTC support line: We're sorry. The issue you are having is a network problem. You will need to contact Sprint customer support...

Give me a break.

This is a true story.

A colleague of mine got iPhone 4 recently (here in New Zealand). He knew about antenna problem, but for some reason didn't pay much attention nor follow up, and believed problem was sorted somehow.

After a few dropped calls, once he realised, he gave Vodafone NZ an angry call to complain about the problem. Vodafone NZ support people replied he must be wrong because dropping calls was problem only in US and is not happening in NZ.

Huh???

Having clueless customer support is very common around the globe. Even if Apple support is that much better than other phone manufacturers, you still depend on other supports - in this case network support.

My colleague actually trained himself to hold phone correctly and is one happy-chappy today.
post #203 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I think it's an interesting ad, well done, but I think what they're selling (we can get you-- or perhaps more pointedly those other dicks who keep ramming into you-- involved in life again by making your phone so easy to use you rarely have to look at it) is nonsensical.

You're right that it might stir some interest, but I can't see that translating into sales. Windows Phone 7 will sink or swim on its merits, not some high concept "this fixes a terrible wrong" campaign.

The ads don't need to make sense.

Look at the entire "I'm a Mac" ad campaign, none of them made a great amount of sense. The idea was that if you are overweight, old, ugly, dull and/or stupid you own a PC, and if you are sexy, young, cool, creative and/or smart you own a Mac. A lot of people still believe this, such was the strength of the campaign.

Most advertising is like this. Flip through the first 20 pages of a womans magazine and I bet you won't come across any tech specs or descriptions of why product X is better than product Y just a whole lot of "look at all of the beautiful famous people using our product".
post #204 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I dont recall Steve Jobs marketing what will be over what they have currently. Show me one interview where Apple is pimping their current products by pimping features they would obviously add at some future date. Even the day before the iOS 4.0 demonstration multitasking still was just a rumour. Same goes for cut/copy/paste in iPhone OS 3.0.

I don't see anything wrong telling potential customers what to expect in the next update (and when is it expected). One way or another you have to wait for missing features, not knowing if they will come at all doesn't really beat knowing that they are in the pipeline.
post #205 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

I must have hit a nerve. A few points. Yes, this is an Apple board, but in spite of that, Apple is not the center of the Universe. Also, I said Apple, not iPhone, you should learn to read.

A few issues.

1. MS is creating an ecosystem for Windows users similar to that for Mac users with iTunes etc. There is no incentive for a Mac User to a WP7 phone.
2. There is no support for Mac users at all in WP7, hence Apple is not a target.
3. BB does Business well, entertainment, not so much. The WP7 phone does both. Hence, BB is a target.
4. Android has no unified ecosystem, WP7 does, hence Android is a target.
5. Windows users who have an iPhone. Depending on the person there may be an incentive to switch (e.g., active Xbox gamer with Live account), but for some Windows users there will not be a compelling reason to switch. Hence, the iPhone is only indirectly a target.

See, if you stop and take some time to think about things, it is not all that hard.

You have very original, albeit technically correct point of view

However... if MS manages to persuade any significant number of PC users to move from iPhone and iTunes to a platform (promised to be) better integrated with their deskops & laptops, then it really require some extra imagination to conclude Apple is not a target.

I know number of people having iPhones, and none of them has Mac. True, Apple ecosystem users will not dump iPhone for WP7 even if later does support OSX, but iPhone's success is achieved by its capability to leave limited circle of OSX users and spread among Windows users as well.

And by targeting those Windows users, MS is targeting Apple's market share, current or future.

Or do you believe there are more OSX users than Windows users among iPhone owners..?
post #206 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

I don't see anything wrong telling potential customers what to expect in the next update (and when is it expected). One way or another you have to wait for missing features, not knowing if they will come at all doesn't really beat knowing that they are in the pipeline.

Apple does that, but usually after they have solidified the features and changes, which for iOS means there is a few months before its released and the iPhone HW gets a few weeks.

Mac OS X needs a much longer lead time for development and testing and so that is longer. As a result of that extra time there have been enticing promises made that never came to fruition. And even with these short lead times Apple misses self imposed deadlines. Thats the nature of this beast and that is expected the farther out you announce a product.

What Apple doesnt do is try to stall a market with what call vapourware. Surely there is a middle ground between how Apple operates in secrecy and what others do to generate free press and stall buyers if you are companies like MS, but Ill take Apples method any day over one that promises things may not actually arrive.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

if MS manages to persuade any significant number of PC users to move from iPhone and iTunes to a platform (promised to be) better integrated with their deskops & laptops, then it really require some extra imagination to conclude Apple is not a target.

Apple and the iPhone are surely targets as all smartphones are targets but as I read his post I see that is implying that Apple is not the target that will be hit the first or hardest. If MS can pull off the ecosystem and pull people from iTunes that will be big, but it will be slow moving, especially compared to WP7-based phones taking a huge chunk of purchases away from Blackberrys and Android-based phones.
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post #207 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by boeyc15 View Post

Back to topic, I'm sorry aesthetics do matter, and these widgets or tiles sure are ugly... IMO.
Here's hopeing iOS 5 has some limited widgets.

In the end, how much more stuff(useful hardware stuff) can they cram into these phones? Next big thing seems to be local data xfer(pay via credit card, control tv etc). Darn, off topic again, sorry.

iOS will definitely "copy" MS this way - make the lock screen more functional. Show how many mails are waiting, some schedules, and what I need is reminders/to do on the lock screen... And that will be a nice improvement to iOS. Users can customise how informational or how simple their lock screen will be.
post #208 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by chocolim View Post

How long you wait for reals apps in the phone?
How long you wait for copy & paste?
How long you wait for multitask?
How long you wait for stereo audio via bluetooth? if you go to the gym with wires headphones, you blow it

Quite right. Version One of whatever MS is peddling here will be going up against a mature, battle-tested and highly-polished iOS from Apple. As if that weren't enough, the integration of software to hardware just won't be as good, since MS makes only the software.

MS just can't compete with Apple in this space. They'll pick up third place, at BEST, and will take share away from Nokia, Android, etc. Not Apple.

And they'll try to differentiate by competing on PRICE, which means all the non-Apple players will have fewer profits to plow back into R&D and new designs. Which means next year's phones won't be much different from this year's (except for including whatever new tech is developed by their suppliers). There'll be no real innovation. They'll just wait and see what Apple does, and try to catch up. (As usual.) They'll put lipstick on it, market that as 'new' and call it a day.

Ballmer & Company are a joke without a punchline. Pathetic, lost and hopeless.
post #209 of 334
Yet another phone (this time a whole new phone OS) with no Flash on it. Where are all these Full Internet phones we've been promised by Adobe et al. ?

Not so much a jab at MS but everyone that says iPhone fails because control freak Jobs don't want no Flash.

The fact of the matter is many phones are not powerful enough to run Flash, Froyo 2.2 is on a much smaller percentage of new and current phones than one might think, and WP7, Symbian and BB all don't have Flash. Not looking good for Adobe.

If WP7 starts giving Android a run for its money that means essentially of all the OSes for phones only Android has Flash, marginalising Flash even more.
post #210 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

The ads don't need to make sense.

Look at the entire "I'm a Mac" ad campaign, none of them made a great amount of sense. The idea was that if you are overweight, old, ugly, dull and/or stupid you own a PC, and if you are sexy, young, cool, creative and/or smart you own a Mac. A lot of people still believe this, such was the strength of the campaign.

No. That was absolutely not the point of those ads. The point was to stress the idea that Macs are relatively trouble fee, not beset by the security and complexity problems of PCs and to do so in a fairly light-hearted, not mean spirited way. The characters in the ads were intended as personifications of the computers themselves, not their users.

At any rate, pitching the Mac as funner and less prone to problems than PCs makes perfect sense. Sure the truth of that is arguable, but it's not incoherent.

OTOH, pitching your cell phone as the solution to cell phones is incoherent. Acting as if the epidemic of cell zombies is somehow a problem addressable with a new phone OS is incoherent.

Quote:
Most advertising is like this. Flip through the first 20 pages of a womans magazine and I bet you won't come across any tech specs or descriptions of why product X is better than product Y just a whole lot of "look at all of the beautiful famous people using our product".

Most advertising makes appeals to the emotions, vanity, sex, etc. (although interestingly Apple general skips all that and just shows their products doing stuff in a fun way).

Again, the Windows Phone 7 ad doesn't do any of that, it just presents a flatly self-contradictory idea. Just because much advertising isn't particularly logical doesn't mean it doesn't make a certain kind of sense. I don't think the ad in question makes any kind of sense.
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post #211 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

If MS can pull off the ecosystem and pull people from iTunes that will be big, but it will be slow moving, especially compared to WP7-based phones taking a huge chunk of purchases away from Blackberry and Android-based phones.

I completely agree with this. I see comments from people that have totally invested themselves in the Apple eco-system saying things like "I don't see the point in switching to WP7"... the answer for them is simply "you shouldn't".

However if someone is a BB or Android user, or an Xbox gamer, or work for a business that utilizes Microsoft products... then there is a reason to look at WP7.




Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Surely there is a middle ground between how Apple operates in secrecy and what others do to generate free press and stall buyers if you are companies like MS, but Ill take Apples method any day over one that promises things may not actually arrive.

This I'm not so sure of. "Vapor-ware" is bad, that's a given.

However a road-map is important, especially for business. Company wide decisions can be made with months or even years of lead time. That's assuming that promises made are actually delivered.
post #212 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

What a horrible ad. Sure it is pretty but seeing the back of the phone does nothing to sell the phone.

As cheesy as the iphone/ipod/ipad ads are, at least we are seeing the device in action

Microsoft is trying to sell the phone as a device to not use. Doesn't really work when you don't show why you won't be navel gazing at it all the time

Ha: Fanboy! Apple didn't show a Mac on TV for 4 years through their "I'm a Mac" campaign.
post #213 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denton View Post

If this has been posted elsewhere, you'll excuse me I'm sure.

Windows Phone Really? Ad

Some ad company got a nice bit of dough from MS... That said, while the promise is interesting, the best feature of this fancy new phone is that you use this fancy new phone less. Ambitious.
post #214 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Again, the Windows Phone 7 ad doesn't do any of that, it just presents a flatly self-contradictory idea. Just because much advertising isn't particularly logical doesn't mean it doesn't make a certain kind of sense. I don't think the ad in question makes any kind of sense.

Sounds like you don't really understand advertising. That's cool, don't stress on it.
post #215 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I agree that the WP7 looks quite credible. But I think MS would be stupid to target Apple. Apple is not their rival here.

Their real target should be Android. Their goal is persuading Android manufacturers to switch to MS. And I think the way to do that is to keep pushing their "delightful" and "personal" selling points.

I agree. MS has been slow to execute in this space. The Kin was irrelevant by the time it reached market, and offered no upgrade path for Danger Hiptop customers, assuming the were going after the same customer base. I'm sure they had the intention of shooting for the market leader when they started this project, and that was Apple. Apple still has the mindshare, so it's probably a good thing that they compare themselves to Apple, but I do think that when WP7 cannibalizes sales, it will be Android customers, not iPhone customers. Most Apple fans would not give up the iOS platform that easily. I also think MS is in it for the long haul, so they might not see any marketshare reversal until 2012, but I doubt they'll kill it as quickly as they did Kin if it sells slowly.

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post #216 of 334
Zunetastic!!!!! I think I just squirted myself.
post #217 of 334
The tiles thing seems like a good idea. Sure the colors are gaudy and the design is a little busy, but the at-a-glance info is cool. I'd like something similar on my iPhone.

The multi-colored tiny text on the Agenda screen would be very hard to read I think.
post #218 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

You have very original, albeit technically correct point of view

However... if MS manages to persuade any significant number of PC users to move from iPhone and iTunes to a platform (promised to be) better integrated with their deskops & laptops, then it really require some extra imagination to conclude Apple is not a target.

I know number of people having iPhones, and none of them has Mac. True, Apple ecosystem users will not dump iPhone for WP7 even if later does support OSX, but iPhone's success is achieved by its capability to leave limited circle of OSX users and spread among Windows users as well.

And by targeting those Windows users, MS is targeting Apple's market share, current or future.

Or do you believe there are more OSX users than Windows users among iPhone owners..?

Solipsism said it quite rightly . I would only add a couple of things.

First, I think MS is turning itself around (Windows 7 is quite good, Bing is now the second search engine, etc), and many of the posters here that blithely dismiss MS as an extinct irrelevant dinosaur sound a lot like MS fans in the 90's re: Apple. We all know how that turned out.

That said, when you look at Android, you get the feeling that the iPhone was in the cross hairs the entire time it was being designed. Android was built explicitly to take on the iPhone.

WP7 feels different (although I could be wrong). I think MS sat down, knew they were getting killed, and they knew they had to do something different. So they looked at all the phones, saw what was good and bad, and tried to build something that filled in all or most of the gaps. As such, Apple was not the direct target the way it was with Android.

I also think that Apple saw the potential threat of WP7, and addressed some of the holes in iOS to fend off MS. Hence we now have Ping, Game Center, and maybe subscription music services, all of which MS has had for a long time, and all of which have been highlighted by MS since the announcement in February. I could be wrong in this, but the coincidence of WP7 release and a slew of new features in iOS is interesting.
post #219 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

Sounds like you don't really understand advertising. That's cool, don't stress on it.

Yeah, that must be it.

So do you have any actual observations re the difference between emotional appeals and incoherent appeals? Or are you just going to go with stock internet douche move #12 and call it a day?
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post #220 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I dont recall Steve Jobs marketing what will be over what they have currently. Show me one interview where Apple is pimping their current products by pimping features they would obviously add at some future date. Even the day before the iOS 4.0 demonstration multitasking still was just a rumour. Same goes for cut/copy/paste in iPhone OS 3.0.

Tethering for OS 3.0, didn't come out in the US until almost a year later (but you'll blame this one on ATT, fair enough)

-Game Center (huge part of OS4.0 announcement, didn't launch with it, said it would come in an update)
-airplay (Big part of the ipod announcement, won't be on the main device they pimped it on, the ipad, until November)
-OS 4.0 for ipad

I'm sure there are more, but as all those happened in the last few months, I figured that was as good a spot to start as any.
post #221 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbonner View Post

Hmmm, except the Kin and Zune.

I quite like my Zune HD. I much prefer it over my iPod Touch for music.
post #222 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Yeah, that must be it.

So do you have any actual observations re the difference between emotional appeals and incoherent appeals? Or are you just going to go with stock internet douche move #12 and call it a day?

I wasn't being facetious. It actually sounds like you don't really get how this kind of advertising works, and that's fine. If you can't understand it you probably aren't affected by it either, which with the constant barrage of advertising is, in many ways, an enviable position to be it.

Attempting to keep it more literal the WP7 ad goes something like this... "sometimes it appears that smartphone users are so absorbed in their phones that they miss out on the world around them. If you don't see yourself as that kind of person, or don't want to be that kind of person, you should have a look at WP7"

WP7 doesn't need to project information directly into your cerebrum just like Red Bull doesn't need to make you grow wings and Calvin Klein underpants don't need to make you look like a semi-naked David Beckham because they aren't describing a literal feature set, they are selling an idea.
post #223 of 334
As someone who has owned 2 iPhones (currently on an iPhone 4), I have to say I like Windows Phone a lot from what I've seen. Rather than just being an iOS clone (like Android), it's something new and original.

The hardware line-up is pretty ugly though, and curiously seems to top out at 16gb of storage. (64gb next time please) But I do like the idea of a choice of models, some with huge screens, and I like the idea of Xbox Live/Achievements, and allowing apps to integrate themselves fully into the phone. (such as Last FM plugging directly into the Zune app)

Sounds like a good start to me and I'll be watching closely. Plus the Zune desktop app is massively superior to the mess that is iTunes.
post #224 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu View Post

As someone who has owned 2 iPhones (currently on an iPhone 4), I have to say I like Windows Phone a lot from what I've seen. Rather than just being an iOS clone (like Android), it's something new and original.

The hardware line-up is pretty ugly though, and curiously seems to top out at 16gb of storage. (64gb next time please) But I do like the idea of a choice of models, some with huge screens, and I like the idea of Xbox Live/Achievements, and allowing apps to integrate themselves fully into the phone. (such as Last FM plugging directly into the Zune app)

Sounds like a good start to me and I'll be watching closely. Plus the Zune desktop app is massively superior to the mess that is iTunes.

The top memory is either 32 or 40 GB, it is not clear. There is an internal micro SD slot that accepts up to 32 GB. It needs to be installed before activation. It is not clear if this is in addition to (40 GB) or a replacement for (32 GB) the 8 GB that comes installed in the phone.
post #225 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

if MS manages to persuade any significant number of PC users to move from iPhone and iTunes to a platform

Not enough PC users in the worl or what? iPhone and iTunes is till a drop in the ocean.

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post #226 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by palegolas View Post

I gotta admit Windows Phone 7 looks great. Booth screens and videos. If it works as smooth as it looks I think it'll take a large cut of the cake.

I guess everyone would know that the freshly installed windows boots and works like anything. The moment it is not rebooted & lots of applications are installed you will see the "true colors". and then there will be bugs with Service packs as fixes which will bring the OS to its knees.
post #227 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysBlackmore View Post

Actually, I think I would disagree with you here. What Microsoft is doing (and certainly MUST do) with this release is two fold. Differentiate from the Apple GUI benchmark (where Android went, instead of the BB model GUI). And play to their "strengths".

So first, differentiate. With Android being the primary eroder of the WinPhone market on the usual handsets and all the carriers - they need to address that. This does it rather successfully - it is different than the Android platform GUI which is necessary - but still on familiar hardware and all the carriers. You KNOW they will partner with the handset makers to BOGO or market the crap out of these, and incentivize downscaling Android - whether by lawsuit or by licensing. They will incentivize the carriers in the usual manner.

Second, playing to their strengths. While you may not think of Zune as anyone's idea of a strength - XBox arguably is. And if you can combine services delivery between the two systems - so much the better. Whether they have the right approach remains to be seen. XBox requires a fair amount of overhead, so that is not a given. Office - that's a given. Do they have a decent touch interface for the platform - not from what I've seen so far - but that can change. The tiles thing is a meh in my book, too much fishing for where things are - especially as my needs change as i move from work mode to play mode.

I don't see the iPhone productivity/usability thing as an Achilles heel issue. In fact the jugular as I mentioned previously is on the Android platform or the Blackberry/RIM platform. Apple has never been seen as a threat from the corporate side to Redmond, and isn't now. No, these are targeting RIM and Google - RIM for its intrusion into corporate delivery systems - Microsoft want's you off those BES and solely on Exchange - with a native Exchange client on the WP7 device. And they want you on a handset running WP7, not Android - or at the very least running on a version of Android licensed by Microsoft. The number of business users from the corporate side who would actually do anything other than review docs on a smartphone is very small, and is not playing to the larger consumer market. Now it may well be a part of the market Microsoft wants nailed down in their OS, but it's not a larger market threat.

FWTW, I don't "hate" Microsoft. I carry a number of their certs as a professional, but I don't think they actually "get it" in the same way Apple gets it from a consumer perspective. And again, it LOOKS like they are not aiming ahead of the target with this - but I will be just as happy to be proven wrong on this.

RIM is gone for sure. Whether we like it or not Microsoft has a better integrated environment compared to RIM. And only those people using RIM who will not flock to WP7 are the ones who needs a keyboard (but there are WP7 with keyboards). But, it's the Exchange/office support that will bring all the RIM users to WP7.
post #228 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Yes, but these are third party add-ons and at least one requires a jailbreak. I was talking about the basic functionality of the device as envisioned by the designers (Apple). Moving files around between iOS devices or between iOS devices and desktops is basically non-functional at this point. The kludge they use in iTunes to force files onto the device is counter-intutitve at best, buggy, and has different implementations depending on what app you are using.

It seems clear even to a casual observer that Apple doesn't *want* (at least so far), to allow users easy access to their files or an easy way to move files on and off the devices. Needless to say, I find this a huge barrier to productivity of any kind.

Apple usually quotes security concerns as the reason why they don't (when they comment at all), and they use the same excuse for not having a home screen that updates with useful information as almost every other device on the market has. I find these to be specious claims that are just handy to throw out as excuses.

Maybe they will fix all this stuff someday. I'm just tired of waiting.

1. You don't need to jailbreak for using ssh file server. It's built into the Pro version.
2. I agree the mechanism is not the obvious one as it not out of the box support. Probably they should have done this as the have the bonjour built into the OS ( I think the first step they are taking is adding the most obvious print support).
3. There are obvious security reasons behind live updating and displaying it on the screen as it might enable some one else to also see what they. Ideally it should have similar to the calendar APP which updates the date and displays it on the app and only a authorized user can see those and providing a push & pull mechanism on item basis.
post #229 of 334
Will security be an issue on this new phone? I don't know and probably no one else does either but is this a concern, especially since this is MSFT, or is this not an issue right now? Anyone care to speculate?

Neal
post #230 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

Or are you waiting on the Microsoft miracle that somehow as soon as they open they will outshine all the rest of the developers from all other platforms all over the globe that have worked their asses off these past years to actually make app stores a reality?

Most likely, the store will debut with pretty much every "must have" app that is currently in the apple store.

Also included will be many popular niche programs.

And my guess is that there will also be exclusive titles, unavailable in an apple version.
post #231 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


Im talking about the AppleTV, Im talking about iDevices like the iPhone, Touch and iPad being in the hands of people who are in the living room. What Apple hasnt won is the TV or entertainment center in the living room.

Last night was typical around here.

TV on, kids looking at their cellphones, etc.

One kid had a brand new Droid X. WOW! That thing is GREAT! He was showing off videos on his huge screen.

Another had some sort of cheap keyboard phone. My kid used his netbook.

I found a cool video, plugged my laptop into the HDMI, and we watched on the 46 inch panel in 5.1 sound. My iPhone stayed in my pocket.
post #232 of 334
.....
post #233 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Yet another phone (this time a whole new phone OS) with no Flash on it. Where are all these Full Internet phones we've been promised by Adobe et al. ?

Not so much a jab at MS but everyone that says iPhone fails because control freak Jobs don't want no Flash.

The fact of the matter is many phones are not powerful enough to run Flash, Froyo 2.2 is on a much smaller percentage of new and current phones than one might think, and WP7, Symbian and BB all don't have Flash. Not looking good for Adobe.

If WP7 starts giving Android a run for its money that means essentially of all the OSes for phones only Android has Flash, marginalising Flash even more.

That was exactly what struck me first. All the Apple hating trolls constantly said it was only Apple who wouldn't / couldn't run Flash and now this new MS OS comes out without Flash. It has to make them wonder if they had it wrong .... nah ... they don't actually think.
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post #234 of 334
I can not believe what I am looking at! These winthudd fonies ( spelling intentional )

They have really lost their minds. This stuff all looks so 20th century. I just can't believe a company with 10's of billions of dollars actually released these things.
Just to look at them hurts my eyes........Now, perhaps, the Microthudd illusion of viability will begin to fade. Or, are all the windows loyalists just really stupid?

If they sell a few thousand, that will be impressive. If they sell millions, I know which side of evolution I am truly on! .......ughhhhhhhhhh!
post #235 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Are you proud to be a simpleton? Throwing in with those too stupid to compare products?

Why?

Don't they teach etiquette in troll school these days? There is no need to insult someone when debating.
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Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
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Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
Reply
post #236 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

You just get an iphone because you can't be arsed to look over spec sheets from 9 phones and do a mini bibliographical report on them, just to get a damn phone, there are more important things in life than trying to figure out why these bozos had 9 phones out to begin with.

That's why I don't drive. I can't possibly choose which car to buy!

I wish somebody made just one model. That would be the manufacturer for me!



C'mon. Don't be absurd.
post #237 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

Tethering for OS 3.0, didn't come out in the US until almost a year later (but you'll blame this one on ATT, fair enough)

-Game Center (huge part of OS4.0 announcement, didn't launch with it, said it would come in an update)
-airplay (Big part of the ipod announcement, won't be on the main device they pimped it on, the ipad, until November)
-OS 4.0 for ipad

I'm sure there are more, but as all those happened in the last few months, I figured that was as good a spot to start as any.

Isn't the point though that if you know about these few things in Apple's pipe line you are reasonably confident they are not rumors? That is quite a contrast to the countless products and features that are openly announced as existing and turn out to be vaporware from certain companies. One has to suspect attempts to slow up or delay potential buying of Apple's products when this happens.

Of course, to be fair to MS, they may have in some cases, been showing things intended for production but pulled them when Apple made them obsolete over night. So production was halted. This may happen a lot to MS these days.
Use duckduckgo.com with Safari, not Google Search
Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
Reply
Use duckduckgo.com with Safari, not Google Search
Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
Reply
post #238 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by nealg View Post

Will security be an issue on this new phone? I don't know and probably no one else does either but is this a concern, especially since this is MSFT, or is this not an issue right now? Anyone care to speculate?

Neal

WP7 should be more secure. No-one can really say until its been in the wild for a while though.
  • All applications must be installed via the application store.
  • All applications are sand-boxed.
  • All applications running on the Dot Net CLR which means the potential for better application profiling during the application store vetting process.
  • Apparently much stronger hardware based DRM so it's harder (or even impossible) to run unsigned code.
  • From memory Microsoft can push out "minor updates" (i.e. security patches) via an over-the-air update so flaws that do arise could potentially be patched without connecting the device to a PC.
post #239 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Nothing in my post suggested that iOS 5.0 would only be for the G5 iPhone.

Then I misunderstood you. My bad.
post #240 of 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

apple has in no way won the 'living room'. and they aren't going to with that lame apple tv that just came out. that was the biggest let down of the year.
watching the old 'think different' ad on youtube the other day, i realized that apple today is not counterculture, it isn't 'revolutionary' (in the way they portray it) and it is about as relevant as Paul Mccartney (you admire him for what he did in the past but he isn't really doing much except entertaining the old folks at this point).
i should add the young too. its the computer made by Disney....

Wait for Airplay to show the true potential.
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