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Sources: Apple to unveil revamped 11.6-inch MacBook Air next week - Page 3

post #81 of 177
As long as the storage is a PCIe solution, it'll be cool. If it's just a SATA solution, it's Apple saving volume for smaller form factor and bigger battery. The PCIe SSD solution would be cool. And a 2 GHz low voltage C2D would be fine.

Still, any MBA will be a niche device. Maybe if they raise the floor of the MBP 13 to $1299, they can slot this in at $1099 or something.
post #82 of 177
This device sounds fantastic. Finally a true portable. The 13.3" screen is too big for a portable.
post #83 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

this sounds expensive until you think about it as the same hardware as the iPad, in a clamshell with a keyboard.

1 GHZ / 512mb / 32gb for $799
1.2GHZ / 512mb / 64gb for $999

128gb BTO

That kinda sounds like an underpowered netbook at three times the price.
post #84 of 177
I am very worried about that 11.6 display...

won't it be too small? The only way I can see it not being small is if it's not 16:10. I sure hope apple do the right thing and add a 4:3 ratio one, really the vertical real estate of the 11.6 will be atrocious otherwise.

But then again apple are prone to a few idiocies (such as that horrid glass on the imacs and lappies) so I think they won't have the right aspect ratio in, which will be a shame.
post #85 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

But then again apple are prone to a few idiocies (such as that horrid glass on the imacs and lappies)

Still in the "glossy sucks" crowd, eh? Quit whining.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #86 of 177
When Apple brought out the MBA, people said the footprint was too big, especially for airplane tables. Apple said they chose 13" because netbook screens were small and the keyboards cramped.

If they drop to 11.6", they will probably have to drop the resolution down from 1280 x 800 to 1024 x 640.

On the plus side, it will be very light and a PCI SSD will be cheaper than 3rd party. If they use 25nm direct from the manufacturer, they can get decent capacities at close to $1 per GB. They can easily do a 300GB model.

Core 2 Duo + 9400M is expected (320M might be too much heat/power) and I like Apple ditching Intel's IGPs. It's a shame to miss out on faster CPUs but it's no big deal. If they can squeeze a 320M in there, even better.
post #87 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

If they drop to 11.6", they will probably have to drop the resolution down from 1280 x 800 to 1024 x 640.

Every 11.6" screen on a notebook/netbook today is 16:9 and 1366x768.
post #88 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

If they drop to 11.6", they will probably have to drop the resolution down from 1280 x 800 to 1024 x 640.

More likely 1366 x 768. (Edit: beaten by FuturePastNow.)
post #89 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

When Apple brought out the MBA, people said the footprint was too big, especially for airplane tables. Apple said they chose 13" because netbook screens were small and the keyboards cramped.

That certainly would give more room for those tiny cramped seat back trays on planes. And if they make it a tablet, too, you could have even more options for playing video. So far, the iPad is great for such things, but being productive on a flight isnt one of its strong points if you need a typical PC app for business.

Quote:
If they drop to 11.6", they will probably have to drop the resolution down from 1280 x 800 to 1024 x 640.

I dont get this. Why? 1280x800 sounds reasonable to me. It puts it around both the PPI of the high-res MBP displays and the iPad. In fact, it sounds too coincidental not to be expected..

Quote:
On the plus side, it will be very light and a PCI SSD will be cheaper than 3rd party. If they use 25nm direct from the manufacturer, they can get decent capacities at close to $1 per GB. They can easily do a 300GB model.

25nm would be nice, but I doubt wed see more than 256GB in such a machine. Id thin it will be regulated as a satellite computer therefor not needing excessive storage.

Quote:
Core 2 Duo + 9400M is expected (320M might be too much heat/power) and I like Apple ditching Intel's IGPs. It's a shame to miss out on faster CPUs but it's no big deal. If they can squeeze a 320M in there, even better.

Ill be shocked if they use the same CULV C2D tech in the current MBPs. Im fully expecting Core-i chips.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #90 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Every 11.6" screen on a notebook/netbook today is 16:9 and 1366x768.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iDave View Post

More likely 1366 x 768. (Edit: beaten by FuturePastNow.)

You think Apple will drop 16:10 which is already short enough as it is, for a 16:9 display that is even shorter? I dont think so.
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post #91 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You think Apple will drop 16:10 which is already short enough as it is, for a 16:9 display that is even shorter? I dont think so.

16:10 would be preferable to 16:9, I agree.
post #92 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Proprietary storage is not cool, Apple.

Why is that so?
post #93 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by iDave View Post

That kinda sounds like an underpowered netbook at three times the price.

i hope its around 500 dollars and sells like mad so that companies like ASUS will lower their prices on netbooks so i can get a sweet price.
post #94 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

i hope its around 500 dollars and sells like mad so that companies like ASUS will lower their prices on netbooks so i can get a sweet price.

For those prices it would have to use ARM or Atom. I cant see either one of those for Mac OS X.
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post #95 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You think Apple will drop 16:10 which is already short enough as it is, for a 16:9 display that is even shorter? I dont think so.

I don't know what Apple will do, but that's what all the 11.6" screens on the market are.
post #96 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

I don't know what Apple will do, but that's what all the 11.6" screens on the market are.

Exhibit A: Everything about the HW Apple used in their tablet.

It’s just a WVGA display with a 11.6” ratio. While it’s more common for 12.1” displays, it’s a ratio that is certainly used more than the 4:3 display that they smartly brought back for the iPad.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #97 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


Ill be shocked if they use the same CULV C2D tech in the current MBPs. Im fully expecting Core-i chips.

prepare to be shocked. MacNN is reporting that they will still be using Core 2 chips.

Here is the link.

http://www.electronista.com/articles...ut.use.core.2/
post #98 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

prepare to be shocked. MacNN is reporting that they will still be using Core 2 chips.

Here is the link.

http://www.electronista.com/articles...ut.use.core.2/

I certainly understand the Intel and Nvidia issue, but that will not go over well even though there are some pros and cons between sticking with C2D or moving to Core-i.
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post #99 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

Or we'll have gotten beyond using a 19th century input technique that's intentionally designed to be inefficient.

Seems to me there's a good reason the input method has persisted for so long. If we really want to predict the future on text input we need to come up with another, better, silent method for getting the text you want on the screen. Speaking won't cut it. No one wants to bear you writing and editing your paper.

So what would it be? Short of mind reading or tracking your eyes on the screen as the hover over letters, or ??? Typing will be around for a loooooong time.
post #100 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I love my 15" MBP but this sounds really tempting. I'm leaving on a long vacation next month and I'll be bringing along my iPad and also my MBP which is more weight than I carried last year due to the addition of the iPad, but with the new Air I can get all the functionality I need from a notebook as well as much less weight.

How does Apple do it? They continually bring out new products with the minimum amount of overlap so that I am compelled to buy all of them.

Is "long vacation" code for going to prison?
post #101 of 177
Awesome, can't wait to see the new macs. I like the iDevices, but Macs are still essential for me, so seeing apple having a Mac focused event is very encouraging.
--SHEFFmachine out
Da Bears!
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--SHEFFmachine out
Da Bears!
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post #102 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I certainly understand the Intel and Nvidia issue, but that will not go over well even though there are some pros and cons between sticking with C2D or moving to Core-i.

It's not a new issue, but then, nothing has changed either. Apple finds 2x graphics performance and 20% less CPU performance in a smaller footprint better value than a Core-i3 system. All arguments will be rehash of the 13" MB/MBP arguments.

Who knows, maybe Apple will reveal some OpenCL driven UI magic in Mac OS X 10.7 or Mac OS XI that really needs the GPU. If so, this will make a lot of people happy, no?
post #103 of 177
It just hit me... 10.7 will not be dual boot, no need for it. OS X will simply just run all your iOS apps. Mac hardware is powerful enough to easily tackle virtually any iOS app, even in emulation or whatever.
post #104 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by McDavies;

What sucks is that i have no money. Hell, i'm using the library computers right now.

Sorry to hear that. I went broke in 2003-2004 buying all kinds of Apple stuff and selling them on eBay to buy new Apple gear. I kinda solved it by working in an Apple Reseller the past few years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe hs;

(kinda off topic): Will there be another live stream of this event?

Hopefully. I think there should be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogun;

How about a sheet of paper? Too thin to be useful? How about a clipboard? In ten years the MBA will be the thickness of a clipboard. It'll stand by itself and the camera will watch your fingers type on the tabletop and input the text. Then, maybe, it'll be thin enough. Maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow;

Proprietary storage is not cool, Apple.

Apple will not rest until everything is just a thin sheet of glass bordered in liquid metal. Or just borderless.

Let the ranting about nothing on the MBA being replaceable begin...!!!
post #105 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrike View Post

It's not a new issue, but then, nothing has changed either. Apple finds 2x graphics performance and 20% less CPU performance in a smaller footprint better value than a Core-i3 system. All arguments will be rehash of the 13" MB/MBP arguments.

I dont understand why its always assumed it will be a Core-i3 if its a SFF CULV. Id think Apple would go for the SFF CULV Core-i7, then i5, and possibly not even touch the Core-i3.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

It just hit me... 10.7 will not be dual boot, no need for it. OS X will simply just run all your iOS apps. Mac hardware is powerful enough to easily tackle virtually any iOS app, even in emulation or whatever.

Ive made mention before of an intermediate layer that can run iOS apps like the Xcode simulator, and not unlike the Front Row app that became the AppleTV UI. I dont think anything but iPad apps would look good, but that is same with running iPhone/Touch apps on the iPad, too.
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post #106 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii;

You can't get ahead of the competition without doing something new. And new things can't be a standard (though they could eventually become that).

Mmmm them kool-aid sure taste nice inside the walled garden, huh...

(Couldn't resist. I thought the trolls will be all over this...)
post #107 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism;

I’ve made mention before of an intermediate layer that can run iOS apps like the Xcode simulator, and not unlike the Front Row app that became the AppleTV UI. I don’t think anything but iPad apps would look good, but that is same with running iPhone/Touch apps on the iPad, too.

Ah but the OS X advantage is that your iOS apps don't have to run full-screen. IPhone apps would be like widgets in the "layer" like Dashboard or simply sit like a normal app in it's own window. Ditto for iPad apps, though those could run full-screen as well.
post #108 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

mention of a proprietary SSD drive is somewhat of surprise to me. i suppose it was customised for the MacBook Air form factor.

It was a surprise, but now that we've heard it you know it sounds 110% like what Apple would do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove;

I am very worried about that 11.6 display...

won't it be too small? The only way I can see it not being small is if it's not 16:10. I sure hope apple do the right thing and add a 4:3 ratio one, really the vertical real estate of the 11.6 will be atrocious otherwise.

But then again apple are prone to a few idiocies (such as that horrid glass on the imacs and lappies) so I think they won't have the right aspect ratio in, which will be a shame.

I think it will be 16:10. Take a stroll through your local netbook store and see the display that will be in your MBA. The display will be LED, though not IPS, and while better quality than a netboook be similar ratios to what netbooks are.
post #109 of 177
I just hope it has a decent display. I'm not sure, it will probably have a crappy display. I just hope it is at least 1280x800 and I hope it has a decent sized trackpad.
A macbook air with an 11.6" display and at 16/10 or 16/9 screen aspect will be very wide, and unless they have a 2" thick bezel around the outside of the screen to give it depth, it's going to be hard to fit in a full sized keyboard and trackpad.
I hope for a 1280x800/720 screen but I can't see that happening.
Although, I am 90% certain we will see Macbook/13" MBP updates soon too. A 1440x900 13" display? i3 processor?
post #110 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Ah but the OS X advantage is that your iOS apps don't have to run full-screen. IPhone apps would be like widgets in the "layer" like Dashboard or simply sit like a normal app in it's own window. Ditto for iPad apps, though those could run full-screen as well.

Out with the old dashboard - meet IOS. It makes sense... kinda. The trouble is that running IOS on OSX will be very messy. Especially since OSX has a 'finder' and IOS doesn't. The last thing Apple will want to do is confuse the simplicity of IOS and add a layer of complexity to OSX. But with millions of IOS users who have never been near OSX they are sure to try to capitalize on IOS. Somehow.
post #111 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by hlfnlsn View Post

How about an iPad that can dual boot? When it is in its docking shell with a keyboard and track pad it can boot into OS X, when it is taken out it boots into iOS. When docked they could make the OS X partition sync with iOS. Or maybe the switching between the two OSs could be more seamless like parallels does the windows/OS X thing. Hey, one can dream right?

Let me preface this by saying I understand it's a dream, but you got me thinking, so...

I like the idea a lot, the execution seems like it would risk being confusing software-wise and inelegant hardware-wise. I'd imagine that it'd go straight into iOS with no reboot. Probably there'd be a SSD in the iPad part/screen part and a bigger SSD or HDD in the keyboard part and they sort of sync key specific folders into apps. Ignoring the notion that folders don't have anything to do with the iOS philosophy...

Software-wise: particularly when doing something with Microsoft Office that's on OS X, but not available for iOS, when you take off the iPad part on a whim, what happens to your work in the unsupported program? It just disappears? Is it securely saved on the keyboard part as it goes to sleep? People are going to wonder why they can't just finish their word doc when they split it. And to be elegant, it should just be available instantly but with a touchscreen keyboard instead of the physical in an iOS equivalent program. Before anyone says iWork... not enough people use that, especially at work. Plus there's other programs where this'd be a problem, Word's just a Prime example.

Hardware wise:

1. How are you going to have a keyboard that's able to be easily separated from the screen, yet still feel like a single, solid device when it's together? It'd be hard to make it feel solid like a unibody macbook.

2. Plus... you've got to be able to do something cool with the keyboard when the screen is undocked. If it's just sitting around useless, well that makes it clutter, especially if it's only designed to be docked with the iPad part. But then, if you give it the ability to hook up to a monitor like a standard mac, then you're going to be stuck with two basically separate computers doing two separate tasks and they'll never really link up without breaking one computer or the others work flow.

3.Or (assuming my software issue above were solved) what if you're doing a word doc on the full computer, then break off to the iPad part and continue working, then later you plug the keyboard into the monitor and go off in another direction with your story/report/whatever? Then you need to merge two dissimilar documents based on the same thing. That or you need to save another copy (to avoid overwriting) which might make you think twice about putting them back together at all. And you'd want to be encouraged to put them together effortlessly since they're supposed to be one thing.

I think it'd be really cool, don't get me wrong. But, I don't know how you'd solve this stuff in a slick way. Not even getting into the cost part of things, just as a concept it seems like it'd be difficult to execute. That said, if they do it, I want one too.

(pardon my lazy writing, I'm beat)
post #112 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogun View Post

Seems to me there's a good reason the input method has persisted for so long. If we really want to predict the future on text input we need to come up with another, better, silent method for getting the text you want on the screen. Speaking won't cut it. No one wants to bear you writing and editing your paper.

So what would it be? Short of mind reading or tracking your eyes on the screen as the hover over letters, or ??? Typing will be around for a loooooong time.

Spot on!

Just imagine voice to text:
- Composing business correspondence, emails home or to significant other on a plane.
- An office with several computers being used.
- imagine the privacy issues, potential embarrassment and noise levels at internet cafes, any indoor public hot spot etc.
+ Might cut down a lot of the sexting problem with teens and others on smartphones.

I don't see speech ever replacing typing in a major way, in niche areas yes but not in general EVER.

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

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"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

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post #113 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick View Post

I just hope it has a decent display. I'm not sure, it will probably have a crappy display. I just hope it is at least 1280x800 and I hope it has a decent sized trackpad.
A macbook air with an 11.6" display and at 16/10 or 16/9 screen aspect will be very wide, and unless they have a 2" thick bezel around the outside of the screen to give it depth, it's going to be hard to fit in a full sized keyboard and trackpad.
I hope for a 1280x800/720 screen but I can't see that happening.

1) Why would the display be crappy? This isnt something Apple typically does, especially not on their MacBook Air.

2) If its !6/9(sic) aspect ratio it cant be 1280x800.

3) What is a "1280x800/720 screen?
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #114 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Either Jobs was wrong or the iPad is not a computer.

Apple never said it was.

Quote:
Or the iPad is a piece of junk.

A very profitable piece of junk.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #115 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Wow with sources like this ... it must be a done deal!

Just wait until you hear what a third person said. Prepare to have mind blown.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #116 of 177
.

How about an MBA with a touch screen and an OSX Touch/Legacy OS -- a transitional system, if you will?

,
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

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"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #117 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Every 11.6" screen on a notebook/netbook today is 16:9 and 1366x768.

The UI elements are tiny though. When Apple's philosophy is about the end user experience, I don't think they'd do this. The OS X UI running on an iPad is usable though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnra9p0GtuE

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism

And if they make it a tablet, too, you could have even more options for playing video. So far, the iPad is great for such things, but being “productive” on a flight isn’t one of its strong points if you need a typical PC app for business.

They could have a hinge that lets you flip the display almost right round but lets you prop it up like a tent with the screen facing you and the keyboard facing away. If they can run the OS in an 'iPad mode' in this configuration, you'd get pretty good battery life on a flight. The footprint would be even smaller too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism

I don’t get this. Why? 1280x800 sounds reasonable to me. It puts it around both the PPI of the high-res MBP displays and the iPad. In fact, it sounds too coincidental not to be expected..

Possibly, I just feel 1280 x 800 makes UI elements quite small on even a 13" screen. I think they'll stick to 13".

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism

25nm would be nice, but I doubt we’d see more than 256GB in such a machine. I’d thin it will be regulated as a satellite computer therefor not needing excessive storage.

I agree, I think this class of device can get by fine with at most 256GB and the PCI SSD chip rumour points to this being the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism

I’ll be shocked if they use the same CULV C2D tech in the current MBPs. I’m fully expecting Core-i chips.

The picture in the new MBA design article has the heatsink going over two chips. It wouldn't have a 330M and IGPs don't work with the core-i series chips so it has to be an NVidia IGP plus Core 2 Duo. It's the only way Apple can get OpenCL running on a GPU.

Also AFAIK, Apple doen't use ULV chips in the Air.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008

It was a surprise, but now that we've heard it you know it sounds 110% like what Apple would do.

It's not such a big issue for the MBA. Because they have 1.8" drives people would opt for an already difficult to upgrade SSD anyway. This is just a cheaper way of getting an SSD and it will be faster.
post #118 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Mmmm them kool-aid sure taste nice inside the walled garden, huh...

I don't know what you mean about Kool-aid, it's just logic: if you use the same technologies as everyone else you'll be at the same place as them.
post #119 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

The UI elements are tiny though. When Apple's philosophy is about the end user experience, I don't think they'd do this. The OS X UI running on an iPad is usable though:

It is more than usable on my Dell Mini 10 HacBook and that's a resolution of 1024 x 600. Mind you, the hight is an issue sometimes, but as for size of UI elements, it's fine.

Quote:
Possibly, I just feel 1280 x 800 makes UI elements quite small on even a 13" screen. I think they'll stick to 13".

Did I miss something?. Doesn't the news clearly state there will be a 11,6" display?

EDIT:
Hm, you might be right after all....
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/16/i...w-macbook-air/
/EDIT

Quote:
Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post

Every 11.6" screen on a notebook/netbook today is 16:9 and 1366x768.

I'd also go with the already mentioned 16:9 option, because it will give the MBA enough width to still hold a full-sized keyboard. The screen bezel would have to be about the same size and at the same time the margin around the keyboard would have to go. At the moment Apple is using that margin to "sink" the keyboard so it doesn't touch the screen when the lid is closed. But they could make the keyboard look like the desktop keyboards and simply have a deeper rim around the screen bezel, so the lid would still seal the MBA when it's closed.

That's what I would do, but the reports said that the new MBA is pretty much a smaller version of the current one. If that refers not only to the "outside" (appearance with closed lid) but also the look of the MBA when its opened, I have no idea how Apple wants to fit a full-sized keyboard on that thing...

The anticipated problem with 16:9 is that there might not be a lot of space for a decent sized trackpad. On the other hand, the trackpad usually has the same aspect ratio as the screen, since it virtually represents the screen. So a trackpad for a 16:9 display doesn't need a lot of "hight".
post #120 of 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Still in the "glossy sucks" crowd, eh? Quit whining.

I know you man, from mac rumors, i remember your nick, you can still post over there if you want to be a prick, it's a very conducive climate there for such attitudes.
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