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HP releasing $799 Slate 500 to take on iPad in tablet market - Page 5

post #161 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

Can you please elaborate? In my experience, Windows 7 is a very capable operating system. Not as aesthetically pleasing as MacOS X, but just as functional (if not more so).

What exactly does "eeek" mean?

It means "I love Apple. I am one of us".
post #162 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by genovelle View Post

Once you figure in the 17 Gigs for a full version of windows 7 before it starts to bloat and the relatively large size of Windows programs like Office, there wont be much space left so you will need to add more flash and 2 gigs of ram sounds like a minimum for running 7 efficiently. Wait, does this thing have a cdrom? How will you get all of those wonderful full programs on CD installed? And battery life will be a joke!!

From the HP website:
This system may require upgraded and/or separately purchased hardware and/or a DVD drive to install the Windows 7 software and take full advantage of Windows 7 functionality.

and:

Requires separately purchased Ultra Capacity Battery and customer download of the latest Intel graphics driver and HP BIOS. Notebook must be configured with optional Intel 80GB SSD drive and HP Illumi-Lite LED Display and requires XP operating system. Battery life will vary depending on the product model, configuration, loaded applications, features, and power management settings. The maximum capacity of the battery will decrease with time and usage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

Be happy to. Apple has absolutely no business chaining the iPad to AT&T's 3G network. You might be able to justify this in the phone space, but the iPad is not a phone and it should have been open to every carrier from day one. To do otherwise is monolithic and I think we have enough of that in this business.

Put a USB port and let users get the best service for the area of the planet they work in. Do that and anyone can buy an iPad and use it in the Enterprise space.

Any questions class?

Yes. So why is Verizon going to be selling them then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

What's the difference? It doesn't work on all carriers right now.

If you are a business person and you are on the road and need to stay connected and you work in an area with poor ATT coverage, you will not buy an iPad and you may get this HP thing with the USB port. That is bad for Apple's business which affects the stock holders.

Get it?

So why is Verizon selling them then? Oh ya, because you can get a wifi 3g hotspot!
Do you get it now?


Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

You seem to have very particular attitudes. IMO, the vast majority of consumers think different from you.

Anti-virus, for example, usually comes preinstalled, and is a "set it and forget it" background process. And the number of people who use iWork instead of Office is a rounding error.

I think that what is important to you is irrelevant to the typical consumer.

Set it and forget it, except for updates (hope you get the latest before the virus of the week slams you), and popups, and lost performance and, of course, your subscription.
I think that what you think is irrelevant to you is important to the typical consumer.

I can not understand people that troll Apple forums for the fun of it. Or maybe they are that upset about Apple's success.
post #163 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iphtashu Fitz View Post

Because the tablet runs Windows 7 and Windows 7 isn't designed for you to interact with via your fingers. Just try touching the maximize button in the corner of a window with your index finger. You might get lucky and maximize it, or you might minimize it, or you might close it altogether. iOS is designed from the ground up to be able to work with a pointing device as large as a finger. Windows 7 isn't. To navigate many of the UI features in Windows you need something with a much finer point than a finger.

MacOS X wasn't designed to be accessed via your finger either. But Apple was able to rewrite what is essentially the Finder to be finger accessible for the iPhone. Why do you doubt that Microsoft can't also put a finger-based interface in front of Windows?
post #164 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

What does this mean? Please elaborate.

It means lose the "book" from "netbook"
post #165 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerald apple View Post

HP will never even come close in sales to the i pad.They quality control and customer service stinks.

doesn't HP own webos? it is very nice. why not use it instead of windows???
post #166 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wurm5150 View Post

I don't see why people would buy this over a laptop/netbook? W7 may have some touch feature to it but it is still built to be used with a mouse and keyboard.

Why would somebody buy an iPad instead of a MacBook? Same story.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Wurm5150 View Post

Until MS builds an OS that is touch based from the ground up, it just doesn't work. At least for me.

Microsoft has certainly done such a thing for Windows Phone. Why do you believe they can't do the same for Windows 7? It's essentially just a shell in front of the OS. As the iPhone interface is to the back end OS (a stripped down version of MacOS X).
post #167 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

You want to ban somebody for saying something that you don't agree with? Because they quote material that you didn't provide yourself? You'd prefer that everyone just wore Apple-supplied blinders?

I don't want to ban anybody. I use the ignore feature. That way I can get the interesting tidbits without seeing the undesirable posts.
post #168 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

doesn't HP own webos? it is very nice. why not use it instead of windows???

They will, but it takes time to write a proper OS. Simply resizing WebOS for smartphone isnt going to cut it. Android is also being rewritten to take advantage of the larger displays.
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post #169 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by mytdave View Post

My install of MacOS X 10.6.4 is 11.07GB - still less than Windows if your numbers are accurate. I don't know how you got only 9GB unless you've removed stuff.

Come to think of it, I have removed a couple of things so 11.07GB is probably more accurate.
14 and 20GB are from microsofts windows 7 sys requirements webpage.
post #170 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

doesn't HP own webos? it is very nice. why not use it instead of windows???

Because different people buy different products? Because one size rarely fits all?
post #171 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Did you see the part about a whole extra slide out panel to display the paper stick on license MS insist is there on all pre installed Windows machines? How 21st Century eh?

Am I missing the sarcasm? This is the 21st century. How "today"?
post #172 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by studiomusic View Post

So why is Verizon selling them then? Oh ya, because you can get a wifi 3g hotspot!
Do you get it now?

So I'm supposed to add another contraption to the cart to make my device work? All for the glory of having a revolutionary iPad? That sounds insane to me. How about you? Before you answer, turn off the RDF and put down the Apple pie and think for a minute.

Are you gettin' it?
post #173 of 434
Hey, you might want to purchase this. This will be one of those devices that will sell about 500 units and then be a novelty in about 10 years because only 500 sold.

Then it will be worth a lot of money and you can resell it on eBay
post #174 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

So I'm supposed to add another contraption to the cart to make my device work?

Only if the device is an iPad. The HP has a port so that it is convenient to hook up to any cell service.
post #175 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

I don't want to ban anybody. I use the ignore feature. That way I can get the interesting tidbits without seeing the undesirable posts.

I guess "undesirable" is in the beauty of the beholder. Those posts are certainly part of the discussion. Since this is an Apple-based forum, I can understand your desire to see things that promote Apple products. But to blind yourself to opposing viewpoints is silly. Just roll with the punches. Ask people to explain themselves if they're just spouting nonsense. Ignore the ones that you think are just trying to get you riled.
post #176 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Because different people buy different products? Because one size rarely fits all?

a fool and his/her money...
post #177 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

It means "I love Apple. I am one of us".

I guess I'm not one of "us". I do enjoy quite a few Apple products. But Apple the company? I'm not one of the bigger fans.
post #178 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Damn that thing looks sweet!



I'll be very interested in the actual hands-on reviews. Until we see them, we know basically nothing except that it has GREAT specs. It should be VERY fast with all that RAM and that sweet processor.

It does look pretty great, it looks like, like, kind of like... an iPad! Except it's a little fat.

I don't think the specs are that great however... it's the bare minimum for Windows 7 to run - or were you being sarcastic?
post #179 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

I guess "undesirable" is in the beauty of the beholder. Those posts are certainly part of the discussion. Since this is an Apple-based forum, I can understand your desire to see things that promote Apple products. But to blind yourself to opposing viewpoints is silly. Just roll with the punches. Ask people to explain themselves if they're just spouting nonsense. Ignore the ones that you think are just trying to get you riled.

OK. I'll take your advice.

Please explain to me why you think I have a "desire to see [only?] things that promote Apple products"?
post #180 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

So I'm supposed to add another contraption to the cart to make my device work?

If you want your iPad to work on another carrier besides AT&T, then yes, you'll need another contraption. But then again, it also gives you the same capability for additional devices. Your laptop for instance (should you carry it and an iPad at the same time) could use the same connection. Your friends, each with an iPad, could share the connection.

That extra contraption does bring additional functionality. It's not just another thing to carry around.
post #181 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac_dog View Post

"...It's really like a full-function PC, it runs Windows..."

that's all i need to know. bring on the iPad.

Bang on!
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post #182 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Me, personally, I have no interest whatsoever in a tablet computer that includes only a cellphone OS. I already have an iPhone, and the limitations frustrate me. When I want to use a real computer on the couch, I sure as hell don't use my iPhone. I use my laptop.

when i want to use a 'real' computer i use my desktop. when i am on the couch or laying in bed i use the ipad.
post #183 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

doesn't HP own webos? it is very nice. why not use it instead of windows???

Because HP is no Apple.
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post #184 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

OK. I'll take your advice.

Please explain to me why you think I have a "desire to see [only?] things that promote Apple products"?

Because you want to ignore opposing viewpoints. You want to ban a user that posts data from an HP website. You'd prefer not to see the comparison. If it doesn't fit your narrative, you want it gone. At least that's the way it seems to me. I do apologize if I've mischaracterized your intent.
post #185 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by striker_kk View Post

Because HP is no Apple.

I would hope the decision would go deeper than that. Buy the product with the Apple logo no matter what the compeition may have. That's weak.
post #186 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

So the iPad can work with Verizon and Sprint and T-Mobile? Didn't know that. Thanks for the update.

It can work with T-Mobile out of the box, yes (it's not locked to ATT like the US iPhone). It can work with Verizon and Sprint with a MiFi-style router you toss in your bag or keep in your pocket. I use a 3G router with my iPod Touch on a daily basis, and I can tell you that it works great.

You really know very little, don't you?
post #187 of 434
in so little time.

Interesting how the fans on either side of this debate are taking this so seriously and are unwilling to debate reasonably.

Some questions to throw out there that defend this HP tablet. Haven't there been tablets that have run Windows products before(I am asking the question because I don't know)? If so, why haven't these tablets sold well previously and what is different about this tablet that would make it sell better than previous models, if they truly did exist?

Would you buy this tablet(especially prior to knowing what the battery life is like)? If not, why haven't you bought previous versions of the tablet? Could it have had something to do with the fact the the systems were not optimized for a tablet like device or that it didn't fill a need?

My own take on what I am seeing is that HP is trying to capitalize on the iPad tablet craze that Apple has created. From what I have seen about the device, though, I don't see that it includes many of the things that have made the Apple iPad successful. Apple made the iPad, hardware AND software specific to the tablet and made it useful to the consumer. That is why it has sold so well in such a short period of time. I just don't see this with this tablet but am open to any reasonable arguments. If HP is only going to market this to businesses whose IT is wedded to MSFT, then if that market exists, then they could have some success with this tablet but I think it will be rather limited. But that is just my opinion on this. The tale will be in the sales figures once this goes on sale. Anyone see a date as to when this goes on sale?

Neal
post #188 of 434
These are Netbook specs, people. It's not going to be anywhere NEAR as responsive as the iPad, when doing just about anything, especially browsing. So... more expensive, less responsive, lower resolution screen...

The only thing that's attractive about this is the Wacom stylus, which could make it a great tool for illustrators, if Photoshop is responsive enough (has yet to be seen that it is).
post #189 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Here's a full comparison prepared by HP:


the ram and processor comparison really don't mean much since they don't run the same software

a good attempt at pointing out a strength which may or may not be there (we all know windows though...)
post #190 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolian View Post

As a buisnes owner, and you know what your talking about, will this run my office software? It's a simple question, and I'm sure you have a lot of answers, but I just need a yes or no. You're the guys that know what's up with this stuff. My guys are using excell on their iPad. Should I buy more of them, or this? It's windows, so it should work with everything else I have right?

This HP slate is running Window 7, therefore any apps that are compatible with Win 7 should run on the device. There are some things you have to keep in mind. Some software has certain hardware requirements of its own. Some programs require certain processor speeds or graphics capability. This device is not going to successfully run many, many games with 3D requirements, or anything that has high processing demands (I would not try running AutoCad on it for example). It should run MS Office fine. I don't know how usable Excel spreadsheets would be on a 600 pixel screen however...
post #191 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

when i want to use a 'real' computer i use my desktop. when i am on the couch or laying in bed i use the ipad.

I used to do that. Now I use the iPhone only when out of the house or in bed. And that's only when I leave the laptop in the other room.

If I had a tablet that was a "real" computer, I likely would use it. But having a bigger screen running a cellphone OS is not what I am looking for.
post #192 of 434
I don't see this appealing to many people. Stylus? Very small keyboard. Atom processor. For not a whole lot more you could get one of the new Air's if you need to run things like Photoshop. Not sure who this is aimed at and if they will want it.
post #193 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

MacOS X wasn't designed to be accessed via your finger either. But Apple was able to rewrite what is essentially the Finder to be finger accessible for the iPhone. Why do you doubt that Microsoft can't also put a finger-based interface in front of Windows?

But that's just the point. Microsoft HASN'T put together a finger-based interface. HP has written their own UI extensions to kludge together a touch interface on top of Windows. So HP apparently had to come up with their own way of doing things like dealing with somebody trying to tap on the minimize/maximize/close buttons in the title bar of a window, or to right-click to bring up a context menu.

Microsoft should have learned from Apple and created a whole new UI paradigm for tablet devices rather than leaving it up to third party vendors. The OS should have been redesigned so that you don't have things like right-click context menus, drop down menus, etc. and applications should be redesigned so that they don't require those sorts of UI components. They shouldn't leave that sort of thing up to the hardware vendors.

The great thing about the iPhone, iPod, and iPad, is the consistency of the UI. Since Microsoft is essentially leaving it up to third party vendors to kludge together touch-UI's on top of Windows then it's just going to fragment the Windows touch market. HP tablets with HP's idea of a touch interface will probably be different from IBM's which will be different from Dell's, etc.
post #194 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

So I'm supposed to add another contraption to the cart to make my device work? All for the glory of having a revolutionary iPad? That sounds insane to me. How about you? Before you answer, turn off the RDF and put down the Apple pie and think for a minute.

Are you gettin' it?

Jesus. You were the one who suggested adding a USB wireless-to-WiFi modem. How is a MiFi you drop in your pocket (I hang mine around my neck) "another contraption" but a USB sitck that you have to leave sticking out of the side of the thing, making the modem and the USB port both susceptible to breakage, not "another contraption"!?
post #195 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

MacOS X wasn't designed to be accessed via your finger either. But Apple was able to rewrite what is essentially the Finder to be finger accessible for the iPhone. Why do you doubt that Microsoft can't also put a finger-based interface in front of Windows?

The point is they haven't. It's been almost a year since the iPad was announced and AFAIK all these are running Windows 7 as it is? Where's the finger accessibility? Serious question here to MS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

So I'm supposed to add another contraption to the cart to make my device work? All for the glory of having a revolutionary iPad? That sounds insane to me. How about you? Before you answer, turn off the RDF and put down the Apple pie and think for a minute.

Are you gettin' it?

Dude, the 3G in the iPad is unlocked and based on the international standard. Apple makes global products now right off the bat. Yes, down the line a CDMA+everything world chip would be nice. Point is, if you are in the US, MiFi is a workaround but I can't say Apple or ATT is being evil here. Anyone that needs intense 3G usage for long periods of time would subscribe to ATT, anyone that wants casual 3G usage has Verizon, T-mobile as another poster mentioned. There's always WiFi. These are better options than so many netbooks and laptops that don't have any 3G and you have to tether anyway, draining precious phone battery or using a USB 3G modem that drains laptop battery.

Yes, you could get a USB 3G modem stick for the Slate (assuming it works), in which case the user might as well go with a laptop and the 3G stick, why are they bothering with tablets anyway? A tablet with a USB 3G stick doesn't make much usability sense as a tablet with a wireless MiFi thingy in your pocket.
post #196 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) How are you basing your numbers of Mac OS X? The total files on a Restore Disc, a retail copy of SL, a fresh install or what your drive is current using? Are you using Base-2 or Base-10 (Note: That Apple moved to Base-10 for the representation in user space for SL)?

2) Note that the SL and iLife installers are contained on an 8GB USB stick for the new MBAs.

3) Just to make sure Ive covered all the bases, if were comparing the HP Slate to the iPad to see which has more space for the user to consume we should use iOS for the iPad in a comparison..

Yes, good detail points...

1. The installed OS on the HD, not the restore disc. Base 10, clean full install of 10.6 + updates.
2. I know. Install files are also compressed to fit on the stick - they expanded upon install.
3. True. Not comparing to iPad - comparing Win 7 to MacOS X 10.6. If you want to compare to iOS, iOS takes up far less space than OS X, due in large part to leaving out all the stuff the iPad doesn't need.
post #197 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

Please define "dismal".

dis·mal   
[diz-muhl]
adjective
1. causing gloom or dejection; gloomy; dreary; cheerless; melancholy: dismal weather.
2. characterized by ineptness or lack of skill, competence, effectiveness, imagination, or interest; pitiful: Our team played a dismal game.
3. Obsolete .
a. disastrous; calamitous.
b. unlucky; sinister.

Tried using Windows on a touch-screen, many, many times. It's a dismal user experience. Maybe that's why the past 10 years of Windows touch-screen devices have been such a "rousing success"?
post #198 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Dude, the 3G in the iPad is unlocked and based on the international standard. Apple makes global products now right off the bat. Yes, down the line a CDMA+everything world chip would be nice.

As an aside, based on all the info Ive read a true world mode setup (quadband GSM radios, the current, pentaband radios in the iPhone 4, plus another radio for T-Mobile USAs 1700MHz spectrum, and CDMA/CDMA2000 radios*) would be possible in an iPad based on the current dimensions it offers.

This does not seem possible in an iPhone and I cant find a single cellphone that offers that kind of coverage. The ones on Verizon that are listed as world mode are enfeebled in N. America to only allow GSM 2G (because they cant get around this) and no UMTS 3G, typically with only one band for Europe or some other region of the world that uses 3GSM technology. Not exactly an open world mode phone like the one people envision and they are much larger with worse battery life due to the size of the chips even though they have less total bands than the current iPhone.


* I purposely left LTE out for this discussion.
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post #199 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Here's a full comparison prepared by HP:

I love how Windows 7 is not listed as an advantage.

BTW 1080p playback is great but where are they going to get the content? Even illegally it takes hell a long time to download. Let alone the battery drain when playing it back. Not all 1080p video file formats will be hardware accelerated.
post #200 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by mytdave View Post

2. I know. Install files are also compressed to fit on the stick - they expanded upon install..

This Im aware, but even on the Restore Disc, IIRC, before being installed they take more than 8GB. The new iLife 11 DMG is about 3GB.
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