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Nintendo president says Apple a bigger threat than Microsoft in games

post #1 of 44
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The president of Nintendo of America said during an interview that Apple is more of a near-term threat than Microsoft in the gaming industry, but dismissed iPod and iPhone games as casual.

Reggie Fils-Aime admitted to Brian Caulfield of Forbes that Nintendo views Apple as a serious threat, while stressing that the iPhone and iPod are used mostly for casual games that provide a "welcome distraction."

Do I think that in the near term they can hurt us more than Microsoft? Fils-Aime said. Absolutely.

Some of that hurt could come this holiday season, as Nintendo lacks a new device to drive sales. Though it has seen several minor revisions, the Nintendo DS handheld is now 6 years old, and the company's current generation console, the Wii, has been around for 4 years.

Nintendo President Satoru Iwata admitted last month that the company had originally hoped to release its 3DS handheld, which will feature glasses-free 3D gaming, in time for the holidays, but was unable to meet the goal. The device will instead ship on Feb. 26 in Japan and a month later in U.S. and Europe.

As more evidence of the company's struggles, Nintendo cut its profit forecast for the fiscal year by more than half last month. The company lowered its profit forecast from 200 billion yen ($2.39 billion) to 90 billion yen ($1.07 billion).

Fils-Aime remains undaunted, however, asserting that Nintendo has an edge because games on the Nintendo DS are more in-depth and can "consume." For example, Fils-Aime has spent 150 hours playing Dragon Quest. According to the Forbes report, Nintendo makes fourteen of the 20 best selling games for the current generation of gaming devices.

Apple isn't seen as the only threat to Nintendo, though. Fils-Aime says the Kyoto, Japan-based company is competing for people's time. "I compete with Zynga, I compete with surfing the net, I compete with the newspaper," said Fils-Aime.

For years, Nintendo has led the pack in the gaming industry, selling 20 million gaming devices in 2009, more than Microsoft and Sony combined. But, despite being a relative newcomer to the gaming device industry, Apple has the sales volume to compete with Nintendo. In the most recent quarter alone, Apple sold over 20 million iOS devices.

In September, Apple boss Steve Jobs declared the iPod touch "the number one portable game player in the world," saying "the iPod touch outsells Nintendo and Sony portable game players combined," though those numbers have been called into question.

Apple's push into the gaming market is paying off. Between its Game Center social gaming network and a new games editor position for the App Store, Apple has demonstrated that, when it comes to games, it's not playing around. According to a recent survey, Apple has joined the "major league of the portable gaming market," with over 40 million iOS gamers in the U.S.

Speculation earlier this week that Apple was looking into purchasing Nintendo rival Sony at first seemed to increase the threat that Apple could pose to Nintendo, but the rumor dissolved as analysts dismissed a buy-out as highly unlikely.
post #2 of 44
Eat it Android.
post #3 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Eat it Android.

It has nothing to do with android. It's very impressive on Apple's part though.
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post #4 of 44
Nintendo isn't shipping 3DS this Xmas? Letting Microsoft and Sony introduce HD motion gaming while letting Wii rest on its non-HD laurels? Hmm... Sounds like the biggest threat to Nintendo is Nintendo.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #5 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Eat it Android.

Looks like Nintendo might soon have some serious competition from Android.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/26/t...station-phone/
post #6 of 44
3D is a gimmick that is uncomfortable to watch. Human beings see things in 2D. This was proven in the 1950's and 1980's as a failure.
post #7 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

Looks like Nintendo might soon have some serious competition from Android.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/26/t...station-phone/

It's been what? 3 years since the iPod Touch was released? And around 2 and a half since the App Store?

The moment the iPhone hits Verizon (if it does, by Jan) Android momentum is only going to be backwards.

If Apple does not manage to release the iPhone on VZW by early next year, then all bets are off.
post #8 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Eat it Android.

Suck it Microsoft.

(and yes, that was sarcastic)

post #9 of 44
Just posted this in another thread!

Jobs doesn't understand gaming. It's kind of funny because he is such a genius with what people want out of their devices, but then as soon as it comes to gaming... poof! the man is clueless.

They should...
  • Buy out Open Feint and re-release Game Centre as a decent social gaming platform, linked in to other existing social networks.
  • Buy out EA and Zynga and start hunting for more "up and coming" studios, and\\or do a bunch of smart hires and start up Apple Game Studios
  • Release another variation of Apple TV that can do games as well. Make it a cross between the PS3 and the Wii.
  • Tie it all together. Apple Game Studios and subsidiaries creating games across all platforms. All games sold through respective App Stores. Game Centre integrated across iDevices, Apple TV + gaming, Mac.


When there is always something new and exciting around the corner it's easy to switch between game platforms unless there is something keeping you tied to a certain platform... like being invested in your online personality (i.e. Xbox Live! and PSN) or exclusive games and IP. Apple need both.
post #10 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

It's been what? 3 years since the iPod Touch was released? And around 2 and a half since the App Store?

The moment the iPhone hits Verizon (if it does, by Jan) Android momentum is only going to be backwards.

If Apple does not manage to release the iPhone on VZW by early next year, then all bets are off.

Verizon is just one network in one country. It is a big network I'll grant you that but iOS and Android are global platforms.
post #11 of 44
I pretty much agree. Games on iOS devices are casual. They aren't nearly as immersive as complex as most DS games. That's not to say they aren't fun or entertaining or anything, but you will never find an RPG as deep as say, Pokemon or Final Fantasy, on an iOS device like you might find on a DS.
post #12 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

Just posted this in another thread!

Jobs doesn't understand gaming. It's kind of funny because he is such a genius with what people want out of their devices, but then as soon as it comes to gaming... poof! the man is clueless.

They should...
  • Buy out Open Feint and re-release Game Centre as a decent social gaming platform, linked in to other existing social networks.
  • Buy out EA and Zynga and start hunting for more "up and coming" studios, and\\or do a bunch of smart hires and start up Apple Game Studios
  • Release another variation of Apple TV that can do games as well. Make it a cross between the PS3 and the Wii.
  • Tie it all together. Apple Game Studios and subsidiaries creating games across all platforms. All games sold through respective App Stores. Game Centre integrated across iDevices, Apple TV + gaming, Mac.


When there is always something new and exciting around the corner it's easy to switch between game platforms unless there is something keeping you tied to a certain platform... like being invested in your online personality (i.e. Xbox Live! and PSN) or exclusive games and IP. Apple need both.

EA is a chop shop. Apple will not touch it. I know from personal experience some very sharp professionals who were glad to get out of that dump.
post #13 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Eat it Android.

It's just a phone operating system.

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Although I no longer own Apple products like I did before, I'll continue to post my opinions.

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post #14 of 44
Is Apple working on a GAMING DEVICE????? If they are it could easily be integrated with IPHONE5. Apple realizes the value of the gamers and I'm sure is going to be extremely accomondative. The first example of some serious games (as opposed to casual) will be those by Epic, which are scheduled to be released in November.
post #15 of 44
The gaming market is segmenting into two separate battles. Microsoft vs. Sony in traditional gaming and Apple vs. Nintendo in the casual market. There's virtually zero overlap between the two.
post #16 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

3D is a gimmick that is uncomfortable to watch. Human beings see things in 2D. This was proven in the 1950's and 1980's as a failure.

Have you ever heard of depth perception? That's the perception of the Z-axis...it's also why we have two eyes in the front of our head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth_perception
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post #17 of 44
that very cool!
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post #18 of 44
I was sceptical of the original DS, but was blown away by the titles and ended up buying the DS at launch. As always with Nintendo it's their software that's special.

I'm sure the 3DS will be good, but Reggie is right to be worried about some casual players.

Traditionally, Nintendo's hand held consoles were always low tech, but affordable by the casual or young players. If they price it too close to the iPod Touch they might lose some of those people.

Apple's advantange is the high quality multipurpose device, app store and game pricing.

Nintendo has the dedicated game controls, physical games that can be shared / traded and the advantange of many revered game characters.
post #19 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quillz View Post

... you will never find an RPG as deep as say, Pokemon or Final Fantasy, on an iOS device like you might find on a DS.

Funny you should say that, because Final Fantasy is on the iOS. Not that either system is going to see a new FF from the main series. Only classic games re-released and dumbed down spin-offs.
post #20 of 44
Apple could re-invent the iPod touch with a 5/6" screen to target the portable gaming market. We would then start to see more immersive games. Keep the iPod nano as the music only version, preferably with more memory.
post #21 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

Apple could re-invent the iPod touch with a 5/6" screen to target the portable gaming market. We would then start to see more immersive games. Keep the iPod nano as the music only version, preferably with more memory.

I doubt we'll have an iPod Nano next year. It's the tenth anniversary of the iPod and I doubt that Jobs would keep the Classic going any longer, and we might just see the end of the IPod Nano and Shuffle too.
post #22 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

EA is a chop shop. Apple will not touch it. I know from personal experience some very sharp professionals who were glad to get out of that dump.

Then they can pick someone else. Point is they need a company with a history of publishing quality games and ownership of existing franchises.
post #23 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

3D is a gimmick that is uncomfortable to watch. Human beings see things in 2D. This was proven in the 1950's and 1980's as a failure.

I hope you meant on a screen because you're a dumb ass if you don't know real life is in 3D.
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #24 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

I hope you meant on a screen because you're a dumb ass if you don't know real life is in 3D.

As long as you havn't got technology to project 3D surfaces in the air, 3D will never be more then a gimmick.
post #25 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

i hope you meant on a screen because you're a dumb ass if you don't know real life is in 3d.

+1000
post #26 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cbswe View Post

As long as you havn't got technology to project 3D surfaces in the air, 3D will never be more then a gimmick.

Real life is 3D. Life isn't a gimmick.
post #27 of 44
The competition is getting rougher and the choices larger. Nintendo is metting its match in a market that is quickly duplicating what they have been doing. xbox and play station now have the whole motion contol thing and developers are getting busy making software for it.
post #28 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Surfer Rosa View Post

I was sceptical of the original DS, but was blown away by the titles and ended up buying the DS at launch. As always with Nintendo it's their software that's special.

I'm sure the 3DS will be good, but Reggie is right to be worried about some casual players.

Traditionally, Nintendo's hand held consoles were always low tech, but affordable by the casual or young players. If they price it too close to the iPod Touch they might lose some of those people.

Apple's advantange is the high quality multipurpose device, app store and game pricing.

Nintendo has the dedicated game controls, physical games that can be shared / traded and the advantange of many revered game characters.

you are spot on as the Brits would say. I tried to summarize it like you did but I had early morning writer's block. Lol!
I would add that as the competition heats up potential Nintendo gamers will be swept up into the arms of Apple and the other folks leaving a very fragmented field of gamers.
But right now Nintendo can rest assured that their very safe baby sitter(ds) at its cheap price point will do fine. I always see some young kid with a ds following behind the parent in the mall or grocery store.
post #29 of 44
I think Apple bought a chinese software gaming company earlier this year and if that is correct, then this might help with the adoption of Apple iOs devices in China. With the launch of the Apple China app store, this should also help Apple get a leg up in China.

As to the other markets, one of the strong points of games made for iOs vs the other console games is the cost. I don't mind spending a buck or two(or slightly more on the iPad) for a game. The console games are pretty expensive and sometimes don't live up to the hype so it is a much greater risk and investment. I think that is at least one of the reasons why iOs has been a hit with portable gaming.

Lastly, as in the phone market, there is room for more than 1 winner here. I think there will be different winners at different times depending on multiple factors causing Apple to be up in this market sometimes, and sometimes someone else. As long as Apple stays competitive and is near the top, as an investor, that is what I want to see.

Just my quick opinion.

Neal
post #30 of 44
To complete with Apple, Nintendo needs to accelerate their release schedule... New hand-helds and consoles every other year that are backwards compatible with the previous generation...
post #31 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe hs View Post

I doubt we'll have an iPod Nano next year. It's the tenth anniversary of the iPod and I doubt that Jobs would keep the Classic going any longer, and we might just see the end of the IPod Nano and Shuffle too.

So wrong. End of the Classic? Perhaps. End of the entire line of iPod music players leaving only the touch? No way.
post #32 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by maccherry View Post

you are spot on as the Brits would say. I tried to summarize it like you did but I had early morning writer's block. Lol!

Thanks. I'm supposed to be working, but got distracted by the internet!
post #33 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7600/132 View Post

Funny you should say that, because Final Fantasy is on the iOS. Not that either system is going to see a new FF from the main series. Only classic games re-released and dumbed down spin-offs.

I wouldnt be so hasty as to say that. Look at the new Kingdom Hearts thats out for PSP which is a full size game, as well as MGS: Peacewalker...last i recall the latest Dragon Quest was only on DS as well. These are titles that are full blown games, and sold amazingly well for an ailing overpriced system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maccherry View Post

you are spot on as the Brits would say. I tried to summarize it like you did but I had early morning writer's block. Lol!
I would add that as the competition heats up potential Nintendo gamers will be swept up into the arms of Apple and the other folks leaving a very fragmented field of gamers.
But right now Nintendo can rest assured that their very safe baby sitter(ds) at its cheap price point will do fine. I always see some young kid with a ds following behind the parent in the mall or grocery store.

Dont count on it ever happening. There are 130+ million of these dedicated gaming devices. The experience is very different for a DS and iOS device, and the games quality are miles apart. I look at say just simply Nintendogs and there is nothing on iOS that can touch it. I wish that werent the case but it simply is. And that is just a small segment of games. Nintendo DS spans a vast age range from very young to very old (take a trip to a nursing home and you'll see old folks breaking hips and fingers playing Wii and DS)

Is that to say there arent good games on iOS? No, but when the best there is to be offered is Nazi Zombies, Cut the Rope, Angry Birds, a watered down Sonic 4 (so god awful compared to the console versions, this coming from a Sonic fanboy) and N.O.V.A its miles away from capsizing Nintendo. Maybe that spiffy engine Carmack wrote will boost gaming on iOS beyond free/.99 apps to something of a serious platform where major developers with major titles will flock to and users will actually spend money on it.

The threat right now is minuscule BUT lingering. Sure Apple has the hardware in place, and easy way to distribute software...but their titles are nothing but 98% trash. Should killer software come to iOS then i would be ready to say Nintendo has a serious problem.
post #34 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Nintendo isn't shipping 3DS this Xmas? Letting Microsoft and Sony introduce HD motion gaming while letting Wii rest on its non-HD laurels? Hmm... Sounds like the biggest threat to Nintendo is Nintendo.

Exactly. How long has the Wii been out? We have 2 of them - and obviously aren't going to buy another. If they released a new product with better features, I very well might buy one - and possibly new versions of some of the games, as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

3D is a gimmick that is uncomfortable to watch. Human beings see things in 2D. This was proven in the 1950's and 1980's as a failure.

Not entirely true. PROPERLY done, 3D imaging can be useful for some subset of the population. The problem is that a large portion of the population CAN NOT use it (either because of vision problems or because it creates headaches and so on). So they run the risk of a bad reputation and massive returns from people who are unable to use it. Plus, computing resources that could be used to improve the quality of the game are wasted on 3D.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Not_Sure View Post

Have you ever heard of depth perception? That's the perception of the Z-axis...it's also why we have two eyes in the front of our head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depth_perception

Partially correct. However, a substantial portion of the population (I've seen estimates like 10%) do not have binocular vision and simulate depth perception in other ways. For example, I have never had binocular vision and do not have depth perception in the sense that you are describing it - yet I have not problem playing basketball, driving, or doing other things that require depth perception. There are other ways to simulate depth without using a binocular image.

Not to mention that the fact that most people can see 3D in real life doesn't necessarily mean that a 3D game is going to be better than a non-3D game. It might be that the computing resources are better used for higher resolutions and faster motion - even for those who DO have binocular vision. And for those who don't, 3D makes the game unplayable.
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post #35 of 44
If Apple should buy anything with it's billions it should be NINTENDO. That would bring some great value into the company! And plenty would still left for buying some high grade silicone designer/maker.
post #36 of 44
$0.99 / $1.99 / $4.99 games or $19.99 / $24.99 / $29.99 for games? As a parent I know which I prefer (iPod Touch over DS)
post #37 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Exactly. How long has the Wii been out? We have 2 of them - and obviously aren't going to buy another. If they released a new product with better features, I very well might buy one - and possibly new versions of some of the games, as well.



Not entirely true. PROPERLY done, 3D imaging can be useful for some subset of the population. The problem is that a large portion of the population CAN NOT use it (either because of vision problems or because it creates headaches and so on). So they run the risk of a bad reputation and massive returns from people who are unable to use it. Plus, computing resources that could be used to improve the quality of the game are wasted on 3D.



Partially correct. However, a substantial portion of the population (I've seen estimates like 10%) do not have binocular vision and simulate depth perception in other ways. For example, I have never had binocular vision and do not have depth perception in the sense that you are describing it - yet I have not problem playing basketball, driving, or doing other things that require depth perception. There are other ways to simulate depth without using a binocular image.

Not to mention that the fact that most people can see 3D in real life doesn't necessarily mean that a 3D game is going to be better than a non-3D game. It might be that the computing resources are better used for higher resolutions and faster motion - even for those who DO have binocular vision. And for those who don't, 3D makes the game unplayable.

All of which are valid points if it werent for the fact that Satoru Iwata has mentioned that the stereoscopic 3d effect on the 3DS screen can be turned off, altered to a reduced level so as not to risk young childrens eye-sight.
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post #38 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

Verizon is just one network in one country. It is a big network I'll grant you that but iOS and Android are global platforms.

The US is bout 30% of the modern smartphone market - and the iPhone has 28% of that on a network with 25% of all devices. It could easily get to 40% of the American market - a market which makes the headline news. In other coutries, except China it seems, the iPhone is ahead.
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post #39 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by maccherry View Post

you are spot on as the Brits would say. I tried to summarize it like you did but I had early morning writer's block. Lol!
I would add that as the competition heats up potential Nintendo gamers will be swept up into the arms of Apple and the other folks leaving a very fragmented field of gamers.
But right now Nintendo can rest assured that their very safe baby sitter(ds) at its cheap price point will do fine. I always see some young kid with a ds following behind the parent in the mall or grocery store.

My baby sitters are two iPod Touches.
They are actually cheaper when you factor in game prices.
Not only that but add video, music, email, etc.
The value proposition of the iPod touch rises even further.
post #40 of 44
Of course apple are the biggest threat to nintendo. They both make platforms that specialise in party gaming/occasional gaming/crap gaming.

No serious gamer buys anything from nintendo or apple for gods sake.

Apple gaming = shit
nintendo gaming = great if you are under 12 or want something quirky


Microsoft and Sony are where it is at and I don't see that changing. Like another poster said, Steve Jobs doesn't get gaming and we all know apple is a one man band
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