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Apple drops Mac mini prices internationally

post #1 of 67
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Apple on Tuesday reduced the price of its Mac mini line of desktops in markets not priced in U.S. dollars, providing a discount to international shoppers on both the standard Mac mini, as well as the server option.

The price changes, first discovered by Macerkopf.de (via Google Translate), were reportedly confirmed by Apple to impact all international sales of the device. For example, the entry-level machine was dropped by 100 euros to 709 euros, while the Mac mini with Snow Leopard Server is now 999 euros, reduced from 1149 euros.

In the U.S., the prices direct from Apple are unchanged: the entry-level Mac mini still costs $699, while the server edition runs $999. Both models ship within 24 hours.

In June, Apple released a new, unibody Mac mini that added HDMI output and support for Secure Digital Extended Capacity flash memory cards. The tiny hardware, just 1.4 inches tall, is Apple's compact desktop Mac.

The machine also has improved energy efficiency, which has led Apple to pitch it as the most affordable Mac in terms of both price and power costs. For $699, customers get a Nvidia GeForce 320M graphics processor, a 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo Processor, 320GB hard drive, and 2GB of RAM.

Reduced prices on the Mac mini are also available to readers who use AppleInsider's Mac Pricing Matrix, also included below:



In addition, Apple also slightly reduced prices of the MacBook and MacBook Pro in Germany. The white unibody MacBook is now 999 euros (from 1015 euros), while the 13-inch MacBook Pro is 1149 euros (from 1166 euros).
post #2 of 67
Well that at least puts the machine closer to the US price, still more expensive but not nearly as bad as usual.

I wonder if the Mac Mini didn't sell well in the UK and elsewhere due to the rip off pricing.

Hopefully the pricing will spur on good sales and Apple might decide to price their other machines at equivalent dollar pricing rather than profiteering.
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post #3 of 67
it's just an adjustment for the exchange rates.
post #4 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

Well that at least puts the machine closer to the US price, still more expensive but not nearly as bad as usual.

I wonder if the Mac Mini didn't sell well in the UK and elsewhere due to the rip off pricing.

Hopefully the pricing will spur on good sales and Apple might decide to price their other machines at equivalent dollar pricing rather than profiteering.

Let's see. Your corporate taxes are higher. In fact, basically all your taxes, doing business and the cost of goods & services are higher in the UK than in the US. And as long as you can, for an example, get a hip replacement for free while your American counterpart is doling out $50,000, it will always be.*

Your contention that Apple is practicing profiteering is FUD.

* Let's be clear that the cost of health care is not the only contributor to the issue. There are a lot of other differences that makes the US look a lot greener when looking out their trailer windows or vice versa for those that had to look out the from the towers of London.
post #5 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple on Tuesday reduced the price of its Mac mini line of desktops in all markets not priced in U.S. dollars, providing a discount to international shoppers on both the standard Mac mini, as well as the server option.

No change in HK Dollars at the HK store. The writer of the article should get their facts straight.
post #6 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

No change in HK Dollars at the HK store. The writer of the article should get their facts straight.

No change here in Singapore as well ...
post #7 of 67
Since we know that Apple never makes changes in prices that are temporary, this might be interpreted as a strong signal that Apple expects the US dollar to remain weak for a very long time.

It also suggests that a larger share of Apple's costs (at least for the Mac Mini) are in the US than in other countries, since a weaker dollar means higher costs in other countries. For a Mac, this seems plausibly true, since a big part of the cost is the Intel processor and the software/design costs.
post #8 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stmac View Post

No change here in Singapore as well ...

Well, the writer is mostly correct, since those are countries that peg their currency to the dollar, which means they effectively use the US dollar (unless I'm wrong about the peg, in which case, nevermind).
post #9 of 67
No change here in Canada. Should we really pay $50 more? Our dollars are pretty much at par.
post #10 of 67
Too bad Apple didn't stick with the mini's original pricing of $499. Most of the other Mac lines have either maintained or dropped their prices over the years. But each major revision of the mini (PPC -> Intel & unibody) have added $100 to the base price of the mini. A 40% price increase isn't progress.
post #11 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

Too bad Apple didn't stick with the mini's original pricing of $499. Most of the other Mac lines have either maintained or dropped their prices over the years. But each major revision of the mini (PPC -> Intel & unibody) have added $100 to the base price of the mini. A 40% price increase isn't progress.

I think I'd rather see Apple hold the Mini price at its current point, but add approximately 40 GB of SSD to the motherboard for OS and apps. That would make the Mini feel like a very fast machine.

heck, they should do that across the Mac lineup. They could put the OS and the applications folder on the SSD, and default to having all other user files (pictures, movies, music, documents, downloads, etc) on a traditional mechanical drive.
post #12 of 67
Still far too expensive. 699$ do NOT equal 699€. No amount of shipping, taxes etc. can make this conversion this "convenient" for Apple. As of now, 699$ equals 499€ (rounded UP). So every European citizen pays about 200$ because Americans couldn't get their economy straight. Congratulations.
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post #13 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

Too bad Apple didn't stick with the mini's original pricing of $499. Most of the other Mac lines have either maintained or dropped their prices over the years. But each major revision of the mini (PPC -> Intel & unibody) have added $100 to the base price of the mini. A 40% price increase isn't progress.


So, if the major revisions aren't worth the additional cost, buy the original?

But before you make that decision, perhaps you should do some spec'ing. There was a lot more than just changing the processor and case.
post #14 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denmaru View Post

Still far too expensive. 699$ do NOT equal 699€. No amount of shipping, taxes etc. can make this conversion this "convenient" for Apple. As of now, 699$ equals 499€ (rounded UP). So every European citizen pays about 200$ because Americans couldn't get their economy straight. Congratulations.

Besides the cost of living, corporate taxes, cost of doing business, etc, etc., your Austrian list price of 699€ price includes 116.50€ VAT. Or just in case you need math lessons, or can't read your own Apple store, the base price is 582.50€.

The US store does not include taxes because they vary from one state to another.

Remember, you decided to form an European Union in part for economic reasons. And your suggestion that European citizen pays more because Americans couldn't get their economy straight is ludicrous. Perhaps you should look in you own backyard like Greece and/or Portugal and Spain for that matter, before you rake others.
post #15 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Let's see. Your corporate taxes are higher. In fact, basically all your taxes, doing business and the cost of goods & services are higher in the UK than in the US. And as long as you can, for an example, get a hip replacement for free while your American counterpart is doling out $50,000, it will always be.*

Your contention that Apple is practicing profiteering is FUD.

* Let's be clear that the cost of health care is not the only contributor to the issue. There are a lot of other differences that makes the US look a lot greener when looking out their trailer windows or vice versa for those that had to look out the from the towers of London.

Health care in the UK is not free, I have to pay for it in a special tax called national insurance and so does every other working person, we pay tax and then we also pay national insurance.

Now back to the Mac, the system is built in China and shipped directly to the country which it's sold so there are no additional shipping costs.

Now lets allow for fluctuating currencies higher petrol costs etc which probably are a factor.

For a basis, lets run off the new Apple TV which has a $99 US Price which is of course before any tax.

Now $99 is £61.80. UK VAT stands at 17.5% so £61.80 + 17.5% = £72.61.

Now out of fairness Apple probably does have to spend a little bit more to deal in the UK, I'm not an economist but surely it can't be more than 5%? For arguments sake let's go with 10%.

So £72.61 + 10% = £79.87 that means that even on a generous 10% mark up on the US price Brits have got to pay an additional £20 or $32.03 over an American customer which surely any reasonable person here will agree is wrong, we pay it because we have no choice if you want an Apple product you have to pay their extortionate prices.

Now perhaps you feel I am being unreasonable, but I don't think I am.

I call that profiteering, feel free to correct me with hard facts and I will happily bow to superior evidence and logic.

David
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post #16 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by katastroff View Post

it's just an adjustment for the exchange rates.

Not really. It's an adjustment to remain competitive with other, similar products in those markets. That's how non-commodity products are priced, not by calculating exchange rates.
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post #17 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stmac View Post

No change here in Singapore as well ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

No change in HK Dollars at the HK store. The writer of the article should get their facts straight.

No change in Malaysia.
post #18 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastdoor View Post

Well, the writer is mostly correct, since those are countries that peg their currency to the dollar, which means they effectively use the US dollar (unless I'm wrong about the peg, in which case, nevermind).

Singapore and Malaysia have controlled floats. Meaning it's a peg to a "basket of currencies" of which the US Dollar usually has a strong weighting.

What happens in Malaysia anyways is that whenever new Apple products are announced the current Malaysian Ringgit to US Dollar rate is used to price the new Apple products. So as the US Dollar depreciated a lot in the past few years prices of Macs and iPods have come down quite a bit.

Repricing only happens on newly introduced models though. That means prices for previous models are not repriced up or down regardless of exchange rates.

At least that's how it is in this country with Apple products in the past few years, even for the iPhone RRP price which carriers use to base their contract fees on, etc.
post #19 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Not really. It's an adjustment to remain competitive with other, similar products in those markets. That's how non-commodity products are priced, not by calculating exchange rates.

Possibly... But what I have seen in the UK, Australia, Singapore and Malaysia is that Apple pricing is most heavily influenced by exchange rates rather than competitors. That is, the most significant price moves seem to be related to how the US dollar is doing relative to those currencies. I could be wrong though.
post #20 of 67
Let's do the Math with todays exchange rate
for Germany:

699 $ = 499

499 + 19 % Tax = 594
594 + 16 "Urheberrechtsabgabe" = 610
And now add some amount for the EU's / Germany's 24 month "Gewährleistung" a kind of mandatory warranty, for you people outside of Germany

That is only the RAW conversion and only an example.
You will still have to account for higher living standards, higher costs for
Apple in Europe, employees costing Apple more in Europe, etc., etc.

If you have any knowledge of business and finances you will know that this means there's
virtually no difference.

I hope we can settle this once and for all.
post #21 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denmaru View Post

Still far too expensive. 699$ do NOT equal 699. No amount of shipping, taxes etc. can make this conversion this "convenient" for Apple. As of now, 699$ equals 499 (rounded UP). So every European citizen pays about 200$ because Americans couldn't get their economy straight. Congratulations.

Other than the sales tax vs VAT, which I'm sure will be argued to death, there are all kinds of other costs of doing business. Everything from corporate tax, employee salaries, payroll tax, property tax, import tax, etc, etc. The cost of gas alone to get the products to the stores is far more expensive than in the US. The last time I was in Germany, the price of a liter of gas was about the same as a gallon in the US (that's 1 gallon = 3.8 liters for the metrically challenged). It all adds up. I don't know the impact of all those things; but unless you account for all of those variables, you can't really make a strong point that Apple is profiteering off European sales.

Is Apple making a little more on sales in Europe? Perhaps. But I hear the same complaints for just about everything, not just Apple products. So either every single overseas company is in on a grand conspiracy to cheat Europeans out of their money, or those extra costs add up to much more than you think they do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

So, if the major revisions aren't worth the additional cost, buy the original?

But before you make that decision, perhaps you should do some spec'ing. There was a lot more than just changing the processor and case.

I purchased both a PPC mini and an Intel mini. Yes, the specs have improved. But so have the specs of Apple's other product lines. Yet the mini is the only one that went up dramatically in price. Was it worth it? Maybe. But I'd strongly argue that while unibody construction for a mobile device is a good thing because they need to take more abuse, unibody construction on a desktop machine is a waste.

I just don't think the mini has improved 40% above and beyond the general improvement trend of other computers to justify the 40% increase in price.
post #22 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by electonic View Post

Let's do the Math with todays exchange rate
for Germany:

699 $ = 499

499 + 19 % Tax = 594
594 + 16 "Urheberrechtsabgabe" = 610
And now add some amount for the EU's / Germany's 24 month "Gewährleistung" a kind of mandatory warranty, for you people outside of Germany

That is only the RAW conversion and only an example.
You will still have to account for higher living standards, higher costs for
Apple in Europe, employees costing Apple more in Europe, etc., etc.

If you have any knowledge of business and finances you will know that this means there's
virtually no difference.

I hope we can settle this once and for all.

Maybe Apple is showing the Germans some love, still in the UK we don't have the extended warranty etc that you do and we still by way over the odds.
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post #23 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Not really. It's an adjustment to remain competitive with other, similar products in those markets. That's how non-commodity products are priced, not by calculating exchange rates.

So where's the evidence that "similar products" have seen visible drops in pricing in recent months?
post #24 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Possibly... But what I have seen in the UK, Australia, Singapore and Malaysia is that Apple pricing is most heavily influenced by exchange rates rather than competitors. That is, the most significant price moves seem to be related to how the US dollar is doing relative to those currencies. I could be wrong though.

I've been hearing much the opposite. The complaint I've been hearing for many years now from Apple product buyers outside the US, is they feel they should be paying the same at home as they could theoretically if they were spending their currencies in the US. Pricing simply doesn't work that way. Maybe it would if they were selling bauxite or some other commodity, but not with consumer goods, which are priced competitively with other products in the same market.
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post #25 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by tarZen View Post

So where's the evidence that "similar products" have seen visible drops in pricing in recent months?

The evidence is that Apple felt the need to reduce some product prices. They'd have no other reason to do so. If you can think of a different one, then by all means, feel free to state it.
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post #26 of 67
If my maths are correct:

$699 x 0.7129 (todays exchange rate) = £498 + 17.5% VAT = £585

So £599 is not too bad. Shame VAT is going up to 20% soon lol.
post #27 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

Health care in the UK is not free, I have to pay for it in a special tax called national insurance and so does every other working person, we pay tax and then we also pay national insurance.

Now back to the Mac, the system is built in China and shipped directly to the country which it's sold so there are no additional shipping costs.

Now lets allow for fluctuating currencies higher petrol costs etc which probably are a factor.

For a basis, lets run off the new Apple TV which has a $99 US Price which is of course before any tax.

Now $99 is £61.80. UK VAT stands at 17.5% so £61.80 + 17.5% = £72.61.

Now out of fairness Apple probably does have to spend a little bit more to deal in the UK, I'm not an economist but surely it can't be more than 5%? For arguments sake let's go with 10%.

So £72.61 + 10% = £79.87 that means that even on a generous 10% mark up on the US price Brits have got to pay an additional £20 or $32.03 over an American customer which surely any reasonable person here will agree is wrong, we pay it because we have no choice if you want an Apple product you have to pay their extortionate prices.

Now perhaps you feel I am being unreasonable, but I don't think I am.

I call that profiteering, feel free to correct me with hard facts and I will happily bow to superior evidence and logic.

David

Look in your own backyard.

Compared to the US, your fuel is 2-3 times higher, cost of living is higher, minimum wages are double, rent is higher, taxes are higher, etc. Virtually everything in the UK is higher period!

Unfortunately, I can't find the import tariffs, if there are any on electronics. However, there is a cost in freight forwarding, import registrations, etc., on everything coming into the UK.

Clearly the advantages in the US is the lack of a federal sales tax and the exclusion of state and local taxes. For example, in California, "At 8.25%, California has the highest state sales tax in the United States, which can total up to 10.75% with local sales tax included."*

In all fairness, if we were to add a VAT to the US prices, the list price would jump to $118. And add the exchange rate, which is a highly fluxing figure and the differences dwindle significantly.

Obviously, Apples declared gross profit margins are a determining factor is setting prices. As such, Apple fiduciary responsibilities will help dictate just how much they can price their goods at. And are open for inspection every time they submit their obligatory financial reports.

* ^ a b Equalization California Board of (July 2009). "Publication 71, California City and County Sales and Use Tax Rates, April 1, 2009 Edition" (PDF). Retrieved 2009-09-26.
post #28 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Obviously, Apples declared gross profit margins are a determining factor is setting prices. As such, Apple fiduciary responsibilities will help dictate just how much they can price their goods at. And are open for inspection every time they submit their obligatory financial reports.

What? Apple is always going to charge for their products the most that any given market will bear. This is the most basic rule of pricing economics.
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post #29 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

If my maths are correct:

$699 x 0.7129 (todays exchange rate) = £498 + 17.5% VAT = £585

So £599 is not too bad. Shame VAT is going up to 20% soon lol.

The exchange rate is 0.623556 so the pricing is £435 + 17.5% = £511

So the UK price was nearly £140 too much before the change. Dropping that figure to £90 is much better as you can almost get the 4GB RAM for the difference but the UK price at £549 would still be £40 over.

I don't think anyone would complain about a £549 price point and it would be equivalent to $748.

They don't do this on the other Mac models to the extent they have on the Mini. At least now the Mini should fall in line with the iMac tax-for-not-being-American.
post #30 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

Health care in the UK is not free, I have to pay for it in a special tax called national insurance and so does every other working person, we pay tax and then we also pay national insurance.

Now back to the Mac, the system is built in China and shipped directly to the country which it's sold so there are no additional shipping costs.

Now lets allow for fluctuating currencies higher petrol costs etc which probably are a factor.

For a basis, lets run off the new Apple TV which has a $99 US Price which is of course before any tax.

Now $99 is £61.80. UK VAT stands at 17.5% so £61.80 + 17.5% = £72.61.

Now out of fairness Apple probably does have to spend a little bit more to deal in the UK, I'm not an economist but surely it can't be more than 5%? For arguments sake let's go with 10%.

So £72.61 + 10% = £79.87 that means that even on a generous 10% mark up on the US price Brits have got to pay an additional £20 or $32.03 over an American customer which surely any reasonable person here will agree is wrong, we pay it because we have no choice if you want an Apple product you have to pay their extortionate prices.

Now perhaps you feel I am being unreasonable, but I don't think I am.

I call that profiteering, feel free to correct me with hard facts and I will happily bow to superior evidence and logic.

David

It's not that bad really. I bought an iPod Touch in Florida this year using my credit card and also thinking i was getting a much better deal. When my credit card statement came i'd only saved a fiver. So not that big of a saving.

Their prices are also pre-tax (plus 5%). It's horses for courses.
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post #31 of 67
I thought $499 was high when the first mini was released, Thats why when Apple came out with the 1.25ghz g4 mini I snagged a logic board and ide adapter off of ebay for $100.00 and built my own.

The current Mini starts at $750CAD. I dont care how Apple fans want to rationalize it, the mac Mini is over priced.

http://configure.dell.com/dellstore/...tudio-xps-7100

I know its not a tiny little mini, but come-on it comes with a 23" monitor and a keyboard!

The Mini wasnt what the Mac community wanted originally anyway its what Steve gave us. I remember people wanting a headless Imac with one video slot and maybe one or two expansion card slots.

I still hate the fact that in-order to get a real desktop at Apple I have to pony up $2600.00USD plus tax for a quad-core (close to $3K) by the time your done. The most I've ever paid for a Mac product was $2500.00 for a PowerMac G5, 3 months before Steve announced the switch to Intel, Im not doing that again.

Mac price premium is a myth? I think not.
post #32 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by katastroff View Post

it's just an adjustment for the exchange rates.

Then why hasn't Apple done any mid-revision price drops since the early 1990s?

Quote:
Originally Posted by katastroff View Post

I know its not a tiny little mini, but come-on it comes with a 23" monitor and a keyboard!

And isn't in any way geared toward the same audience as people who would buy the Mac Mini, rendering it completely meaningless.

Quote:
I still hate the fact that in-order to get a real desktop at Apple I have to pony up $2600.00USD plus tax for a quad-core (close to $3K) by the time your done.

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.

That's a good one. That's rich. So what's your definition of a "real desktop", then? The iMac comes with a monitor and keyboard. That seems to be good enough for you given your previous definition.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #33 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Then why hasn't Apple done any mid-revision price drops since the early 1990s?



And isn't in any way geared toward the same audience as people who would buy the Mac Mini, rendering it completely meaningless.



HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.

That's a good one. That's rich. So what's your definition of a "real desktop", then? The iMac comes with a monitor and keyboard. That seems to be good enough for you given your previous definition.

I never met such a fan of acutely designed obsolescence. However if thats your thing, here.


http://www.dell.com/ca/p/inspiron-on...FileVariation2

(Prices are in Canadian)

I realize it isnt a direct comparable product to an Imac but still.


Dont get me wrong I like Macs, but their lack of technical innovation in the last few years, besides artsy industrial design, doesnt warrant the price tag.

Apple has to stop pulling on my heart strings and start engineering again, hardware and software (on the PC). I will pay for that.
post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stmac View Post

No change here in Singapore as well ...

Or Australia and as our dollar is pretty much at parity, we are now paying $A999 ($986) for the base model and $A1399 ($1381) for the server version.
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post #35 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by agolongo View Post

I never met such a fan of acutely designed obsolescence. However if thats your thing, here.


http://www.dell.com/ca/p/inspiron-on...FileVariation2

(Prices are in Canadian)

I realize it isnt a direct comparable product to an Imac but still.


Dont get me wrong I like Macs, but their lack of technical innovation in the last few years, besides artsy industrial design, doesnt warrant the price tag.

Apple has to stop pulling on my heart strings and start engineering again, hardware and software (on the PC). I will pay for that.

That's actually a pretty poor comparison. Check out the Tech Specs on that page. 1.6 GHz processor? 320 GB hard drive? Only 802.11 b/g?

The problem with Macs isn't that they are over-priced. It's that they are over-spec'd. Macs & PC's are similarly priced if you spec them the same. But most people don't need all the features Apple crams into their computers, and they have to pay for them whether they want them or not. Take the screen for example, unless you have a chance to compare them side-by-side, most people wouldn't know which type of screen is better or that Apple tends to use better screens. (Which is my biggest iMac pet peeve...why should I have to buy a new monitor every time I want to upgrade my computer?) Why should my Mac purchase subsidize development of Garage Band if I don't want it and will never use it?

That's why these price comparisons are pointless outside of the context of how the computer will be used. If all I'm doing is email and web browsing, the Dell is probably fine. But I certainly wouldn't be editing my DLSR photos with such a slow processor.

The question isn't whether Apple should charge less for their computers. The question is whether Apple should build lower-end computers. Apple used to have a good option in the $500 mini. Under-spec'd compared to other Macs, but well priced. Things like unibody construction add cost without really adding value (in my opinion), contributing to the perception that Macs are over-priced.
post #36 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by katastroff View Post

I realize it isnt a direct comparable product to an Imac but still.

So you realize your argument's invalid. Fine.

Quote:
Dont get me wrong I like Macs, but their lack of technical innovation in the last few years, besides artsy industrial design, doesnt warrant the price tag.

That's what they've always been. Don't like it, don't buy it. Simple.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

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post #37 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Or Australia and as our dollar is pretty much at parity, we are now paying $A999 ($986) for the base model and $A1399 ($1381) for the server version.

Which only goes to show that the price you pay has remained the same, because strangely enough, Australians earn and spend Australian dollars in Australia.
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post #38 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

That's actually a pretty poor comparison. Check out the Tech Specs on that page. 1.6 GHz processor? 320 GB hard drive? Only 802.11 b/g?

The problem with Macs isn't that they are over-priced. It's that they are over-spec'd. Macs & PC's are similarly priced if you spec them the same. But most people don't need all the features Apple crams into their computers, and they have to pay for them whether they want them or not. Take the screen for example, unless you have a chance to compare them side-by-side, most people wouldn't know which type of screen is better or that Apple tends to use better screens. (Which is my biggest iMac pet peeve...why should I have to buy a new monitor every time I want to upgrade my computer?) Why should my Mac purchase subsidize development of Garage Band if I don't want it and will never use it?

That's why these price comparisons are pointless outside of the context of how the computer will be used. If all I'm doing is email and web browsing, the Dell is probably fine. But I certainly wouldn't be editing my DLSR photos with such a slow processor.

The question isn't whether Apple should charge less for their computers. The question is whether Apple should build lower-end computers. Apple used to have a good option in the $500 mini. Under-spec'd compared to other Macs, but well priced. Things like unibody construction add cost without really adding value (in my opinion), contributing to the perception that Macs are over-priced.

Ok point taken but that was one SKU, check out the other SKU's

http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-one-2305-amd/fs#

I know its not Apples to Apples, but look at the higher end sku's, you get a quad core Athlon II processor, 4gb RAM, 750GB HD, 23" screen, and I admit lower spec'd video for $799, I think thats pretty damn competitive at least againt the entry level i3 $1200 Imac there is a $400 delta. Now its up to the user to determine if the value of OS X and Ilife are worth the additional $400

Back to your argument about Mac's being highly spec'd, I agree with you on some of their offerings but not all, the Mini and the 13" Macbooks are not cutting edge their using a pretty geriatric technology and still commanding a premium.

IMO the Mini in its current form should be $499.00USD, that would be fair.
post #39 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you realize your argument's invalid. Fine.



That's what they've always been. Don't like it, don't buy it. Simple.


First, there is no reason to get indignant. Im trying to have a balanced conversation not a shouting match.

Second, if you go shopping for a 50" TV at a Best Buy, and are trying to decide between two comparable products one is $1000 and the other is $500 however the $1K unit has three hdmi's and one component input while the $500 dollar unit has only two HDMI but two component inputs, do you automatically disregard giving the cheaper unit consideration because its not a comparable product to the $1000 dollar unit that you deem to be the gold master?

Of course not, everyone in the business use's product differentiation to establish a competitive advantage over the other with a slightly different mix to entice the prospective customer. Its up to the consumer to judge the pro's and con's and make a decision. Yes the Dell 2305 isnt exactly the same as a low-end Imac, but make no mistake, they are comparable.
post #40 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by agolongo View Post

IMO the Mini in its current form should be $499.00USD, that would be fair.

On that we agree. I could see $599. But $699 is a pretty steep price for what you get.
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