or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › General › General Discussion › Are the French this dumb?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Are the French this dumb? - Page 3

post #81 of 115
Edit.
Note to self: Need to stop posting late at night.

[ 07-02-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #82 of 115
How the hell did you get from the White House put oil interests ahead of national security to it's not 100% the 'fault of Muslims' ?

What happened on 9/11 is not 100% the 'fault of Muslims'?!? What the hell are you on? Are you trying to say the US deserved it? They need to lock you up! Youre not fit to walk the streets, you dumb ass.


mika.

[ 07-02-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #83 of 115
Don't get hysterical Mika. I'll explain it for you.

No, no-one deserves what happened on 9/11. Re-reading my post I notice I didn't mention 9/11.

There's a difference between the emotional / moral "deserve" and being partly causally "responsible." For example, if I call you a bigot and a loony and I know you're a psycho, I "deserve" to be called to account and to explain myself. I'm partly "responsible" if you instead post over-emotional, angry things on the web about me even if I do not deserve it ... I should know 100% this is going to happen and if I want to avoid it I should take a different tack to achieve my aims.

Regarding the Taliban, if I buy someone a gun, train him how to use it even though I know he's a sick bastard and do nothing while he does bad things ... and then, later, decide he's my enemy, a percentage of the responsibility for him killing people (even my friends) it is partly mine.

Hence it isn't 100% the fault of Islam.
Hence Muslims aren't 100% bad.

Actually I know you know this already ... I guess I'm pushing my luck by trying to get you see that "we" got ourselves into "this mess" partly by our actions and not 100% those of others.
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #84 of 115
quote
No, no-one deserves what happened on 9/11. Re-reading my post I notice I didn't mention 9/11.

This thread *is* about 9/11.

quote
There's a difference between the emotional / moral "deserve" and being partly causally "responsible." For example, if I call you a bigot and a loony and I know you're a psycho, I "deserve" to be called to account and to explain myself. I'm partly "responsible" if you instead post over-emotional, angry things on the web about me even if I do not deserve it ... I should know 100% this is going to happen and if I want to avoid it I should take a different tack to achieve my aims.

So. YouÂre saying IÂm right calling you a dumb ass. Man, you are a real push-over. YouÂre too soft for this world, Harald.

quote
Regarding the Taliban, if I buy someone a gun, train him how to use it even though I know he's a sick bastard and do nothing while he does bad things ... and then, later, decide he's my enemy, a percentage of the responsibility for him killing people (even my friends) it is partly mine.

According to this logic you would be against any kind of appeasement policy. This is interesting, because, thatÂs not the impression I got from reading your posts.

quote
Actually I know you know this already ... I guess I'm pushing my luck by trying to get you see that "we" got ourselves into "this mess" partly by our actions and not 100% those of others.

How do we get ourselves out of this mess? Just curious what your solution would be vis-Ã*-vis Iraq, Iran, Syria, Saudia, Arafat, etc. It sounds like it would be even more hard-line than Sharon and Bush.


mika.

[ 07-02-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #85 of 115
still wait'n ...
post #86 of 115
Mika,

I have to say this man. You are part of the problem. You are intent on blaming one side of the conflict rather than accepting that where two people, or two parties, fight there are two to be blamed. This stubborness means that there will never be a peaceful solution because rather than concentrating on what you can contribute to peace, you concentrate on what others are not.

Once again, if you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. You are.
You cannot conquer Ireland. You cannot extinguish
the Irish passion for freedom. If our deed has not
been sufficient to win freedom, then our children
will win it by a better deed.
Pádraig Pearse

...
Reply
You cannot conquer Ireland. You cannot extinguish
the Irish passion for freedom. If our deed has not
been sufficient to win freedom, then our children
will win it by a better deed.
Pádraig Pearse

...
Reply
post #87 of 115
You read my posts, so know how stubborn I am. Youd also know that Im a fair person, and call things as they are. But Im not going to let the Ishmaelites get away with trying to steal our land. They have plenty of land of their own. They dont need ours. The only reason they maintain this conflict is so that they can justify their corrupt and dictatorial regimes.

Jews to Judea, Arabs to Arabia. Its really a simple concept.


mika.

[ 07-03-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #88 of 115
Much of the problem in the middle East stems from the fact that after the second worls war NATO divided up much of Palestine and gave land to the Jews.
post #89 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by Vargas:
<strong>Much of the problem in the middle East stems from the fact that after the second worls war NATO divided up much of Palestine and gave land to the Jews.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes it's true, but NATO was right to do this : during the genocide more than 7 millions of jews where killed (perhaps for you it's just a member but it's imply that entire jews family where anhilated, and that most jews have one of few member of his family killed in WW2, some others survive but where shocked for their entire life after the time they spent in a concentration camp).

I think that giving land to the jews was the least that world can do for them ( a very little compensation). A land for them was the warranty that these people can leave in safety under their own governement without being prosecuted for the simple fact to be a jew.

Perhaps the initial plan of the NATO take not enought warranty , but as i say everyday to some of my patients who want to know everything of their future we should have all a crytal ball.

Israel has the Moral right to exist since his beginning (and now he exist, and this question is no more relevant than to ask if US or France has the right to exist)

I would just add that Palestine in my opinion have the right to exist but they choose a bad way with terrorism. My major criticism against the jew governement is their politic of settlements. This has been dealt many times here on AI, i will not discuss it more time, but as you are new here Vargas, i just wanted to precise my opinion.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: powerdoc ]</p>
post #90 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>You read my posts, so know how stubborn I am. Youd also know that Im a fair person, and call things as they are. But Im not going to let the Ishmaelites get away with trying to steal our land. They have plenty of land of their own. They dont need ours. The only reason they maintain this conflict is so that they can justify their corrupt and dictatorial regimes.

Jews to Judea, Arabs to Arabia. Its really a simple concept.


mika.

[ 07-03-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Jews to Judea. Interesting. Does that mean all Jews? Including the ones in the US and Europe?

Irish to Ireland, British to Britain. If necessary, by force as done by both Arabs and Jews. Well the British are still in Northern Ireland so may I assume you support the IRA? Terrorists as you would call them?

Anyway, back to my point. Again you are telling me how the Arabs are trying to take your land and how they have evil regimes etc. Are you trying to prove me right? Tell me some things Israel has done wrong? Most of all, tell me some things Israel can do to achieve peace. Trust me mate, Israel will never achieve victory in this war, nor will the Arabs. Peace, a treaty and cutting your losses is the best you can get.

I'm just happy a growing number of people in the occupied part of my country is starting to understand that.

I will, and have in plenty of posts, pointed out the wrongdoings of the British. But I will never let those obstruct reason in a discussion because it doesn't solve anything. Nor will I deny the wrongdoings by my own people.

I am ready for peace mate. I am aching for it. You, obviously, are not. You can stop blaming the Arabs for not wanting it, even if all of them did, you still wouldn't want it.

It's a small group of people that want to keep this conflict going, and you're part of it.
You cannot conquer Ireland. You cannot extinguish
the Irish passion for freedom. If our deed has not
been sufficient to win freedom, then our children
will win it by a better deed.
Pádraig Pearse

...
Reply
You cannot conquer Ireland. You cannot extinguish
the Irish passion for freedom. If our deed has not
been sufficient to win freedom, then our children
will win it by a better deed.
Pádraig Pearse

...
Reply
post #91 of 115
quote
Tell me some things Israel has done wrong? Most of all, tell me some things Israel can do to achieve peace.


Ive already posted similar thoughts elsewhere on this board, but here we go again.

Israel has made a cardinal mistake trying to accommodate the Arab population within its borders. I believe Israel should aggressively use psychological, economic, and other pressures to disconnect these populations from its land. Contrary to popular belief, these Arab populations are nothing more than economic parasites, attracted to area by Israels economic success.

In terms of policy, I think Israel is correct in building a fence. This will have significant implications on these populations, and in a decade or so you will start to see the drying up of this population as they move along to greener pastures.

And you are absolutely correct. I do not yearn for peace with Arabs/Muslims. Israel has little to gain from such mind-set, and a lot to lose.


mika.

PS. I really like your sig. "WHEN THE LAW BREAKERS ARE THE LAW MAKERS THERE IS NO LAW". Someone should mark it on UN buildings.
post #92 of 115
Your real question is: Are only the French this dumb? The answer's no surprise. You said it: "Foreign rights have also been sold in 16 countries (a Spanish version is already on sale), and Mr. Meyssan traveled to Abu Dhabi in the United Arab Emirates in April to present his arguments at a local university". Go to any country in the Middle East from Saudi "NIMBY" Arabia on. Doesn't surprise me people buy this horseshit.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: fantastic happy dinner man ]</p>
post #93 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>quote
I believe Israel should aggressively use psychological, economic, and other pressures to disconnect these populations from its land. Contrary to popular belief, these Arab populations are nothing more than economic parasites, attracted to area by Israels economic success.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

I wish there was a smilie weeping with its head in its... er, hands.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: Hassan i-Sabbah ]</p>
post #94 of 115
Mika,

How about the Arabs whose families have lived contiguously in that area (now called Israel) since before it existed?

Would you apply this same ethnic cleansing (because that's what you're describing) to them to get rid of them, even though they weren't "attracted" by Israel's economic anything (THEY WERE THERE ALREADY).

Simple question, simple answer please. I want to see how deep this goes with you.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: Harald ]</p>
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #95 of 115
Waiting.
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #96 of 115
I would treat them in exactly the same way as the Jews of Arabia have been treated.

mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #97 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>I would treat them in exactly same way as the Jews of Arabia have been treated.

mika.</strong><hr></blockquote>

In that case you're every bit as bad as they are.

It's funny, other people in the world have a problem with ethnic cleansing.

My next question:

Can you see why other people in the world have a problem with ethnic cleansing (which you don't deny you are proposing)?
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #98 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by Harald:
<strong>

In that case you're every bit as bad as they are.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Im no different than anyone else.


mika.
post #99 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>

Im no different than anyone else.


mika.</strong><hr></blockquote>

1) You have twice chosen not to deny you are proposing ethnic cleansing -- by which I infer you admit that's what you're proposing.

2) You chose not to answer my question ("Can you see why many people have a problem with ethnic cleansing?").

You're very different to me and every single person I love. You are only no different to people who propose or proposed ethnic cleansing:

Adolf Hitler for example.

For once, it is not an over-the-top insult or provocative slander to say this, nor insulting to the memories of people like my grandfather's family, dead in a Lithuanian ditch.

You are proposing a 'solution' (ethnic cleansing) to a 'problem' that comes from the same mindset as the Nazis.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: Harald ]</p>
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #100 of 115
I find it a little disingenuous of you to criticize me for this, since the Arabs have been practicing this for centuries and still go on practicing this. Yet you turn a blind eye to their practices. However, when I propose a similar strategy be adopted by Israel you become all indignant. You stink of duplicity and double standard, Sir.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #101 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>I find it a little disingenuous of you to criticize me for this, since the Arabs have been practicing this for centuries and still go on practicing this. Yet you turn a blind eye to their practices. However, when I propose a similar strategy be adopted by Israel you become all indignant. You stink of duplicity and double standard, Sir.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

But Mika, Mika, why is bad when the Arabs do it and OK when you want to do it?
post #102 of 115
That's 3 times you've chosen not to deny you're proposing ethnic cleansing. In fact you've supported this with your comments but not had the guts to use the phrase.

That's twice you've chosen not to tell me why you think people round the world abhor ethnic cleansing.

That's once you've chosen not to deny you're proposing a fascist solution to a problem, but used someone else's obscene behaviour to justify your own.

[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>I find it a little disingenuous of you to criticize me for this, since the Arabs have been practicing this for centuries and still go on practicing this. Yet you turn a blind eye to their practices. However, when I propose a similar strategy be adopted by Israel you become all indignant. You stink of duplicity and double standard, Sir.</strong><hr></blockquote>

1) I'm talking to *you*, not an Arab.
2) I have never, would never condone ethnic cleansing under any circumstances. Hence no duplicity.
3) If someone else does it, it doesn't make it right.

You are proposing Israel should "aggressively use psychological, economic, and other pressures to disconnect these populations from its land", land that is theirs by birthright -- literally: they were born there, their parents were born their, their parents were born there.

YOU are suggesting this.
I am talking to YOU.

You, the Israeli who uses chains of thought Hitler would have understood.
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #103 of 115
Its really a reactionary policy. I much prefer the American model. But,

Its part of their religion. And as long as they believe in their religion, little can change. And just like the building in Judea Samaria and Gaza has brought a change in their mindset and has prompted the Arabs to the negotiating table, this policy, I hope, will bring the same change of mindset with regards to this issue.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #104 of 115
quote
I have never, would never condone ethnic cleansing under any circumstances. Hence no duplicity.


Really?!? But you have.

Why should Israel "dismantle" Jewish Settlements in Judea Samaria and Gaza, to produce an ethnically cleansed Palestine, yet not pursue such a policy with regards to its Arab population?


mika.
post #105 of 115
There's no real way to respond to this. Beyond abuse, which is coming very shortly.

You are a fascist, a racist, a sophist, and an idiot.

You've admitted to proposing ethnic cleansing, and you've tacitly acknowledged this is fascist. I'm not going to get through to you, I'm not going to make you see that -- without rhetoric -- you are no better then a Nazi.

I just wish you could see that you are as bad as the worst people that ever walked the earth. As bad as the worst of the Arabs you hate.

I am also quite, quite certain you have never experienced satisfactory sex with a woman. This thought will make me smile whenever I am forced to face the fact that scum like you take breath on this earth. My dead granny and all the other Jews that died in the holocaust join me in laughter at your pitiful genitals, to assuage the pain caused by an Israeli putting himself on the same side of the moral fence as the Nazis, no matter his justificaction. Vanishingly small penis, premature ejaculation or possibly an appalling odour that discourages even the most desperate female. I don't know. Object of derision. Denied the eye-opening awe caused by any meaningful orgasm.

Respond how you like fella, I'm not coming back to this thread to argue the toss with a goat-shagging shitwit like you.

[quote]Originally posted by PC^KILLA:
<strong>Its really reactionary policy. I much prefer the American model. But,

Its part of their religion. And as long as they believe in their religion, little can change. And just like the building in Judea Samaria and Gaza has brought a change in their mindset and has prompted the Arabs to the negotiating table, this policy, I hope, will bring the same change of mindset with regards to this issue.</strong><hr></blockquote>

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: Harald ]</p>
meh
Reply
meh
Reply
post #106 of 115
[quote]Why should Israel "dismantle" Jewish Settlements in Judea Samaria and Gaza, to produce an ethnically cleansed Palestine, yet not pursue such a policy with regards to its Arab population?<hr></blockquote>
Do the settlements and settlers have legal rights to the land they have settled, vis-a-vis the situation with "Israeli arabs" who have Israeli passports, are officially Israeli citizens, and are entitled to legal rights offered to all Israeli citizens.

It is my understanding that some settlements are constructed on confiscated land, whereby the legal owners have not been compensated for their loss of property. That, under the laws of many countries makes them illegal.
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
post #107 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by Harald:
<strong>There's no real way to respond to this. Beyond abuse, which is coming very shortly.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Er... no shit, Harald.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: Hassan i-Sabbah ]</p>
post #108 of 115
quote
I just wish you could see that you are as bad as the worst people that ever walked the earth. As bad as the worst of the Arabs you hate, as bad

I am also quite, quite certain you have never experienced satisfactory sex with a woman. This thought will make me smile whenever I am forced to face the fact that scum like you take breath on this earth. My dead granny and all the other Jews that died in the holocaust join me in laughter at your pitiful genitals, to assuage the pain caused by an Israeli putting himself on the same side of the moral fence as the Nazis, no matter his justificaction. Vanishingly small penis, premature ejaculation or possibly an appalling odour that discourages even the most desperate female. I don't know. Object of derision. Denied the eye-opening awe caused by any meaningful orgasm.


Calm down Stipmy.

All Im doing is holding up a mirror. It is you who were defending these creatures, remember? Now, if leftist pinkos like you only applied their pious standards to those that are deserving of them, maybe they would make affect some change in the world. But so far, I've heard very little criticism from you as regards the Arabs and their fascist practices. In fact, youve done your utmost to deflect and to shift the blame from the Arab fascists onto their victims.

You are a sanctimonious duplicitous hypocrite.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #109 of 115
Oh Mika, you're such a fool.

In your last few posts you've given a great definition of ethnic cleansing, endorsed the policy, claimed victimhood and then accused the man who says you're behaving like a fascist of hypocrisy.
post #110 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by cowerd:
<strong>
Not quite so black and white in the Middle East. A portion of those with no rights in the Middle East also reside inside Israel, they just happen to be Israeli Arabs [technically they do have rights, there is just a large gap between theory and practice</strong><hr></blockquote>

[quote]Originally posted by cowerd:
<strong>
Do the settlements and settlers have legal rights to the land they have settled, vis-a-vis the situation with "Israeli arabs" who have Israeli passports, are officially Israeli citizens, and are entitled to legal rights offered to all Israeli citizens.

It is my understanding that some settlements are constructed on confiscated land, whereby the legal owners have not been compensated for their loss of property. That, under the laws of many countries makes them illegal.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Make up your mind. They do or they dont ...

And your understanding is wrong. Also, the legal situation, according to international law, is that the State of Israel is sovereign over the entire area of the Judea, Samaria, and Gaza.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
post #111 of 115
[quote]Originally posted by Hassan i-Sabbah:
<strong>Oh Mika, you're such a fool.

In your last few posts you've given a great definition of ethnic cleansing, endorsed the policy, claimed victimhood and then accused the man who says you're behaving like a fascist of hypocrisy.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Not at all.

I've just pointed out the duplicity of your arguments and your position. While my proposals were theoretical, you were defending people who every day practice these fascist policies. Again you confuse fiction and reality.


mika.
post #112 of 115
[quote]Make up your mind. They do or they dont ...<hr></blockquote>
read carefully--technically they are supposed to have rights accrded to them, in practice...
[quote]And your understanding is wrong. Also, the legal situation, according to international law, is that the State of Israel is sovereign over the entire area of the Judea, Samaria, and Gaza.<hr></blockquote>
Which would make the confiscation of said property illegal under Israeli law. But then again there are two sets of rules in operation. You just advocate making them explicit--like apartheid in South Africa.
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
post #113 of 115
Oh righty. Then theyll be happy to join their Arab brethren across the border in Jordan, Egypt, and Syria. Or maybe they can orchestrate another intifada inside the green line. Either or these will be fine by me.

And Ill repeat again. Your understanding is wrong.

The Jewish residences are built on mountain or hilltops overlooking their Arab counterparts. So your confiscation and expropriation argument is bogus as far as they are concerned.

Moreover, the legal history of the "West Bank" gives Israel a lawful claim to sovereignty over the entire land from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan river and beyond.

Jordanian rule over this territory was never recognized by the international community. Indeed, the British Mandate allocated it for Jewish development, eventually to become a Jewish state. This was ratified by The League of Nations in 1922 and 1923.

Since then there has been another world war, followed by the establishment of the United Nations; but the Partition Plan of Nov. 1947 did not abolish those earlier international commitments, especially since the Arabs rejected them.


mika.
post #114 of 115
"International humanitarian law prohibits an occupying power from transferring citizens from its own territory to the occupied territory. An occupying power is also prohibited from undertaking permanent changes in the occupied area, unless they are undertaken for the benefit of the local population or are for urgent military needs. Israel's settlement policy violates these regulations."

<a href="http://www.btselem.org/English/Press_Releases/2002/020513.asp" target="_blank">http://www.btselem.org/English/Press_Releases/2002/020513.asp</A>
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
four more beers, four more beers
Reply
post #115 of 115
So?!

How does this apply? Did you not read my last post? The legality of the situation is quite clear. Israel is in full compliance with international law.

Let me ask you this. You say Israel is an occupying power. What country is Israel occupying? In fact, one can argue that since these Arabs are illegal combatants, under international law, Israel can do as she wishes with these people.


mika.

[ 07-04-2002: Message edited by: PC^KILLA ]</p>
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Discussion
AppleInsider › Forums › General › General Discussion › Are the French this dumb?