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Apple iPad rival HP Slate sees demand fizzle at 9,000 units - Page 2

post #41 of 134
Apple hit a home run with the iPad [leveraging an OS from their phone and the same components in the phone and now the air is brilliant.]

nobody can touch the iPad tablet as nobody can touch the iPod... the thing is, nobody "needed" a tablet computer until the iPad came out. [and still, it's a completely unnecessary form factor]
i may pick one up in a year or two if/when some good productivity apps are released, but a computer designed to consume and not create content is something i have no interest in - and don't start praising iWork on the iPad. i've tried it - and it's more frustrating than trying to get anything done at the DMV.
post #42 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by DecimusPlancus View Post

I agree. I am extremely surprised that they would even plan for a run that small. Unless they needed it as a stopgap product until their "real" tablet product (perhaps based on webOS) is released.

This screams MS throwing money at them to having something in play until Windows Phone 7 is made into a viable tablet OS. I dont think HP would go to this much trouble, and even give people $100 off an already, IMO, lower (than what would have been typical in 2009) price point.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #43 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

Well, it is not so simple, in spite of people wanting it to be.

Apparently the new 11" MBA is cutting into iPad sales (macnn.com), and the supposed reason why?

You guessed it - full OS, USB and keyboard.

you mean a real computer can do mor then a tablet 0.0

anyways on topic:
i wonder if HP is going to have a commercial if they make a second tablet saying that "our first real tablet pc have 80% more demand then the original supply

I also hope palm leads somewere.......... otherwise it will just be the death of a good (imo ofc) company, that could have made a more controlled android os cheaply... (and mass market it)

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

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PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

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post #44 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

i may pick one up in a year or two if/when some good productivity apps are released, but a computer designed to consume and not create content is something i have no interest in - and don't start praising iWork on the iPad. i've tried it - and it's more frustrating than trying to get anything done at the DMV.

Clearly, you're in a chicken-and-egg stage with iWork on the iPad. I was in a similar place. But I can quite confidently tell you that, once you get used to it -- and given the recent updates -- they're truly (and almost fully) functional. In fact, both Keynote and Numbers are superbly implemented on the iPad.
post #45 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

Apple should release a truly mobile Mac. As light and small as possible. Ideally, 400 to 600 g and pocketable (or so). Whatever form factor (tablet, slider or clamshell). The Mac in your pocket (or purse or bag). Always.

But shrinking the OSX UI wouldn't work well so maybe replace it with one optimised for a smaller screen? And a miniscule physical keyboard would be poor to type on so how about a touchscreen instead?
Android proves (as Windows & VHS did before it) that if you want to control people, give us choices and the belief we're capable of making them. We're all 'living' the American dream.
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Android proves (as Windows & VHS did before it) that if you want to control people, give us choices and the belief we're capable of making them. We're all 'living' the American dream.
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post #46 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

Well, it is not so simple, in spite of people wanting it to be.

Apparently the new 11" MBA is cutting into iPad sales (macnn.com), and the supposed reason why?

You guessed it - full OS, USB and keyboard.

There is no evidence that the new MBA is cuting into the iPads sales. In my opinion the two are in different category. The MBA is a full fledged laptop and the iPad is not. Furthermore, if you are talking about specs then the 13" white MB is more powerful and the same price as the 11" MBA.

And it is not as simple as a full OS, USB, and keyboard. You know since a tablet is without a keyboard.
post #47 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStud View Post

Maybe they had contractual obligations with MS, and had to produce a minimum number of units....?

very possible. if not, then Ballmer threw a total fit and threatened war. he'd have looked like the utter fool he is if the Slate he personally hyped proved to be total vaporware. which foolish threat probably clinched HP's purchase of Palm. nice going!
post #48 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

but.. but it has full OS, USB, and HDMI ports!

So does the average $800 Windows notebook that doesn't give up the keyboard, trackpad, or optical media drive. The HP Slate is not a game-changer. It's another in a decades-old parade of Windows tablet PCs that has yet to win over PC users at large.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #49 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

Apple should release a truly mobile Mac. As light and small as possible. Ideally, 400 to 600 g and pocketable (or so). Whatever form factor (tablet, slider or clamshell). The Mac in your pocket (or purse or bag). Always.

Why are you the one who always comes asking Apple to build seemingly impossible (or at least impractical) stuff? What, do you want a 20g iPhone with that?

iPhone 4S 64GB, Black, soon to be sold in favor of a Nokia Lumia 920
Early 2010 MacBook Pro 2.4GHz, soon to be replaced with a Retina MacBook Pro, or an Asus U500

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iPhone 4S 64GB, Black, soon to be sold in favor of a Nokia Lumia 920
Early 2010 MacBook Pro 2.4GHz, soon to be replaced with a Retina MacBook Pro, or an Asus U500

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post #50 of 134
They must have a hell of a profit margin if they figured only 5000 would cover the development and tooling costs.
post #51 of 134
I heard from someone who is working on Thor, that "everyone" on set was using iPads and Filemaker Go. I took that to mean that producers/coordinators/assistants etc. were using it. I'm sure they all looked very cool and relevant while doing so. Now, if someone was using a HP tablet on set, can you imagine the ridicule they would receive?! They would never work in this town again i'd guess.
post #52 of 134
Jobs has put his neck and Apple's coffers on the line and won big for the last 10 years. His winnings are big enough to take some losses now. But I wouldn't bet against Job's right now, he's on a roll and the new products alone look to be able to let Apple coast for a while if it wanted. for they are still hungry and seem to have some big cards up their sleeve still with their still under wraps data center and whatever plans they have for their 50 billion dollar coffers and their ARM design companies.
The Verizon iphone, ipad and mac apps store are only going to see their coffers continue to grow next year. Steve Jobs, CEO of the decade for sure.
post #53 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Before one gets too worked up about the story, I would first be a little skeptical about the 5,000 to 9,000 unit builds. These numbers from a leaked document might be true, but I wouldn't stake any money on it.

On the plus side, however, we do have some indication how much effort it requires for any company, even an HP, to build or contract to build factories to produce the components and assemble them and deliver them. Apple's logistical expertise is top of class and HP would need much time to compete just on those terms, regardless of how "magical" their product might be.

Nonetheless, skepticism of the 5,000 unit numbers is still in order.

It depends. I don't necessarily believe that this was all they ever intended to produce, but it could very well be all they made for a first run. Remember that everything we read, no matter where we read it, says that Win 7 tablets won't be a success. And as has been already stated here, Hp could have been contractually obligated to produce some minimum number. But, with that, it could be that this is a test run. Companies do that. If a couple of tablets were bought by a lot of companies, and they got them for evaluation, then in anywhere from a month to 6 months from now, it's possible that Hp will see dozens of orders from each of those companies, or not.
post #54 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

You would lose your bet. MS has publicly said that tablets will be based on either the embedded version of Windows 7 or on Windows 8. But of course your view is common in the MS is evil crowd.

Where are you getting your (wrong) information? MS said no such thing!

Before making incorrect statements about something easily discoverable, check to see if you're correct before posting.

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/pscmi..._Datasheet.pdf
post #55 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Its hard to say that having a USB or HDMI port is a bad thing and while I like having them the Slate was a bad idea from the start. I have an HDMI out on my Evo and it would be nice to have one on my iPad.

I was actually surprised they decided to even release the Slate I thought the project got killed a long time ago.

Here's something interesting that I read about a month ago in Computerworld. It seems that one of the reasons why business likes the iPad so much is because it DOESN'T have a full fledged USB port. It seems as though that's a main port of entry for those stealing company info. Shove a USB stick with some nasty software in it and download whatever you want. No can do with the iPad (so far!).
post #56 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

I'd be more than skeptical. I'd be willing to bet that it's wrong.

5,000 units at $800 is only $4 M - and that even assumes that the retailer doesn't keep any of the selling price.

There's no way HP would develop a product for $4 M. Even if MS did all the software work, the tooling costs, marketing cost, testing costs, and support costs alone would more than eat up that much money.

True, but what if they made 100,000, and people didn't buy them? That would be worse. as a past manufacturer, I can say that making a minimum number is a better bet than making a lot more that may not sell. As we've read, Hp can always make more. But one thing I've read that seems odd, is Hp having to recall the personnel. Are they actually making this themselves, and not having one of their contract manufacturers do it? Why would they do that?
post #57 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by maccherry View Post

How low will HP go!
OMFG! That is just classless!
I read the specs for that "SLATE" and was not impressed! It's nothing but a keyboardless netbook. Period.
The ipad is a content consumption device but many in the press have misconstrued the purpose of the ipad so they could set up other competing product along side it in what has become a hunt for the unicorn.
Look at that Playbook(vaporware!) by RIM. LOL!
Are we to believe that RIM, in just 4 months, will all of a sudden manufacture, along with credible software, 'THE BUSINESS TABLET" that apparently the world has been longing for?
GTFOOH!

It has two things the iPad needs: 1) Stylus input (not the crappy 3rd party stylus) and 2) full Windows 7 handwriting recognition that can handle multiple languages as well as mathematical notation.

WHY CAN'T THE IPAD DO THIS??? So many of use students, polyglots, and artists would kill for a slate that could do this!
post #58 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukeskymac View Post

Why are you the one who always comes asking Apple to build seemingly impossible (or at least impractical) stuff? What, do you want a 20g iPhone with that?

There's nothing wrong with wanting it. If 22 years ago, when Apple came out with the Macintosh Portable, at 16 pounds, with low rez B/W screen for $6,500, you asked for a laptop that weighed less than 3 pounds, with a high rez color screen, and wanted it for less than $1,000, people would have thought you were nuts.

If you said you wanted several GB RAM, and a 64 or 128 GB HDD, they would have begun the commitment papers. And if you said that it had to be an SSD with high speed wireless networking, then they would have put you away without finishing the papers.

Who knows what will be available in a few years?

Oh, I almost forgot, that $1,000 22 years ago is about $1800 today, so working back, $1,000 today would be about $560 back then. That would mean that the 11.6" Macbook Air would have had to cost $560 back when the Macintosh Portable came out.
post #59 of 134
this article is so funny
Who in a right mind would purchase stylus oriented tablet with microshit windows ?

why did HP bothered to produce this tablet?
post #60 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

It has two things the iPad needs: 1) Stylus input (not the crappy 3rd party stylus) and 2) full Windows 7 handwriting recognition that can handle multiple languages as well as mathematical notation.

WHY CAN'T THE IPAD DO THIS??? So many of use students, polyglots, and artists would kill for a slate that could do this!

There's nothing wrong with the third party pens for the iPad. I use one when drawing. It works just fine. The problem with Win 7 on a tablet, is that because of the poor interface Windows presents on a tablet, a stylus is required. It's not optional. That's bad, not good.

As far as handwriting recognition goes, what's the big deal here? How many people really need, or want that? Useful, but required? I doubt it.
post #61 of 134
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post #62 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

5,000 units at $800 is only $4 M - and that even assumes that the retailer doesn't keep any of the selling price.

There is no retailer. HP is selling this direct to businesses through its online store and business reps.

Quote:
There's no way HP would develop a product for $4 M. Even if MS did all the software work, the tooling costs, marketing cost, testing costs, and support costs alone would more than eat up that much money.

You're assuming HP planned to make 5000 all along. They've been developing this for a long time, at least as long ago as last January, when Ballmer announced it. Their plans obviously changed at least once. There was a time when the Slate was rumored to have been cancelled and HP neither confirmed nor denied it. They probably finally realized that the iPad has the lion's share of the market and they couldn't compete in terms of quantity with a Windows 7 tablet. But that doesn't mean they couldn't have other reasons for completing and selling it. It could still be a learning experience for their WebOS tablet, a way to test technologies they intend to use, like the 7" multitouch screen and the cameras. Better to get the bugs out with a small production batch of an insignificant product than to find out about them only when their mass market consumer device is released. Besides, HP customers can be as loyal as Apple's. I know someone in an all-HP shop who was evaluating the iPad for an in-house app for customer field reps. He wasn't happy at all about doing it, calling the iPad a limited functionality toy and hoping for the day the Slate would be released. I'm sure pressure from people like that factored into HP's thinking.
post #63 of 134
For a lot of people (myself included), the iPad is way too big and heavy. Apple has to make something smaller and/or lighter to attract our $$.
post #64 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

As far as handwriting recognition goes, what's the big deal here? How many people really need, or want that?

Maybe about 1.3 billion Chinese, another 120 million or so Japanese, some Koreans, Vietnamese, etc.? Not everybody uses languages that rely on small alphabets that are conducive to keyboard input.
post #65 of 134
What fizzle? On other sites, I read that orders for 9,000 HP Windows Slate 500 tablets was considered overwhelming demand. I'm looking for HP stock to rise because those extra 4,000 tablets weren't priced into target prices. It's only fair. Apple might sell only 12 million iPads this year and fail to meet analyst's predictions of 13 million. Look for Apple share price to take a big hit because of underwhelming iPad demand. Thanks to Ashok Kumar for that juicy bit of possible information.
post #66 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

I think that HP released this because of a commitment to MS.

Bingo.

Plus, there were likely a lot of sunk costs (R&D) that couldn't be recovered. Taking the final step of launching the device probably didn't cost them too much more.

The other less obvious motivation would be to gain more experience. The teams of people at HP developing this device will probably have many valuable insights that they can integrate into the next, more serious tablet device.
post #67 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

For a lot of people (myself included), the iPad is way too big and heavy. Apple has to make something smaller and/or lighter to attract our $$.

There's a niche for everyone, but in this case I think your lack of normal human muscle structured and inability to handle 1.5 pounds is a unique situation. Medical therapeutic aids are better suited to meet your specific needs. Seriously dude... whine much?
post #68 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

A 7 inch screen is "meaningless unless your tablet also includes sandpaper, so that the user can sand down their fingers to around one quarter of their present size," Jobs said. He added that Apple has done extensive research on touchscreen interfaces and what works best for users, which is how it arrived at a 9.7 inch display for the iPad.

If a 7 inch screen is to small then how do people manage to use the iPod touch and iPhone?
post #69 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuisDias View Post

Apple fanboyism strikes again, and who is a greater fanboy than Daniel?

Oh, man, I love you Daniel, but really, how on earth do you know that the Samsung Galaxy Tab was "quickly turned to anticipation of the next model"? Do you have the numbers that they are selling? FYI, they are already selling here in Portugal and I am still waiting for an iPad. Go figure...

You negated yourself, turbo.

Of course the Slate is already on sale in Europe, and as you pointed out, that's exactly why you're still waiting for the iPad. You don't need a single fanboy to reach such a conclusion, nor does it take one to point it out.
post #70 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

I am surprised HP didn't wait to release this until they could put a different OS on.

I'm not. Apple's way is to keep a product in house for years, throwing out prototypes and starting over until it is perfected to the point of being a serious product. Others companies prefer to learn by doing. They put something out, then keep replacing and updating until they finally get it right. The Zune is a good example. The risk is that your early failures tend to make you lose credibility. Or that by the time you get it right, Apple has a huge, and perhaps insurmountable lead. Android has a third strategy, flood the market with different hardware versions and see what floats.

Your comment made me think of the notion that the hardware is just a vessel for whatever OS you might want to pour into it. Apple developed the hardware and the OS to go together. I think that approach tends to result in a superior product.
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post #71 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

If a 7 inch screen is to small then how do people manage to use the iPod touch and iPhone?

Too small for what you would prefer a tablet for. I have read a book on my iPhone, but much prefer to do it on my iPad. For ease of data entry and interaction, and for viewing content rich screenfuls, the large format is better. Small screen iPhone for extreme portability, large screen iPad for productivity or media consumption.

It's not that hard.
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post #72 of 134
This is JooJoo-grade!
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post #73 of 134
Remember when the Hp Slate was supposed to be the then not-yet-released iPad killer? This even worst than the Zune and Kin failures.

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iPod nano 5th Gen 8GB Orange, iPad 3rd Gen WiFi 32GB White
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post #74 of 134
Only on Apple fanboi sites will you see reality distorting headlines like this. Why is that? It's not like Jobs needs the support or otherwise won't sell his iDevices. I love the iPad and wouldn't want anything else than my Mac but I absolutely hate the way Jobs and his cronies want to dominate the PC market, the internet and now even TV with their closed down, dumbed down, sandboxed apps (coming soon to your Mac too!). HP even believed the anti-hype and very conservatively estimated to sell 5000 units. Imagine everyone's surprise when they actually sold 9000! Leave it to appleinsider to turn even this kind of success into a description of failure. It reminds me of religious fundamentalists that see every unexplained scientific fact as "proof" that their invisible magical friend actually exists.
post #75 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Maybe about 1.3 billion Chinese, another 120 million or so Japanese, some Koreans, Vietnamese, etc.? Not everybody uses languages that rely on small alphabets that are conducive to keyboard input.

You would have a point, except that the iPad, iPhone and iPod Touch all have Chinese and Japanese handwriting input, built-in. Or did you not know that?
post #76 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Maybe about 1.3 billion Chinese, another 120 million or so Japanese, some Koreans, Vietnamese, etc.? Not everybody uses languages that rely on small alphabets that are conducive to keyboard input.

I guess you never used Japanese keyboard on iPhone/iPad.
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Fun and relaxing way to prepare Japanese Language Proficiency Test (JLPT) test with Juku Apps
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post #77 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

You would have a point, except that the iPad, iPhone and iPod Touch all have Chinese and Japanese handwriting input, built-in. Or did you not know that?

Do you mean CJK Input, or CJK Handwriting Input? I mean - can I actually write the kanji characters on the screen and enter text that way? I know they have the Keyboard option - but that is not the same as Handwriting Input.

But in any case, talking about entering CJK - you would be amazed at how adept the Japanese (and I am sure the Chinese and Koreans too) are, at entering text in their native language, using just the 12-button keypad of feature phones! In fact some are so good at it that they can enter text extremely quickly, and even without seeing the keyboard!
post #78 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

For a lot of people (myself included), the iPad is way too big and heavy. Apple has to make something smaller and/or lighter to attract our $$.

If a ten inch tablet that weighs less than a hardback text book is too big and heavy for you, I suggest you get down the gym. Apple do make something smaller and lighter - choose from the iPad or iPhone.
post #79 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

The most reckless 'fanboyism' on this site inevitably comes from the haters who show up like clockwork, screaming "iSheep". They're so predictable you'd think they were a bunch of... droids. I suppose you could point out that their own commercials show them being happily reduced to mindless, humorless automations, but of course the irony would be lost on them.

Oh the hatred. Spare me. I love Daniel rants on RoughlyDrafted, but that doesn't detract from the fact that he is a fanboy and it shows. He does it with style, and that's why I like it, but sometimes he just jumps the shark, almost doing so in every AI article.

In this case, it's his desire for the Galaxy Tab to be unsuccessful that makes him report as a fact what was Job's prediction that the tab will be a DOA. That's a confusion. Having the Galaxy S sold like hell, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Galaxy Tab selling well too. They do have something iPad doesn't have, video-chat. Apart from that, I agree that the iPad is better. But will the public agree with that?

Perhaps someone knows about this. But I haven't seen any numbers reported thus far.
post #80 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by oxygenhose View Post

You negated yourself, turbo.

Of course the Slate is already on sale in Europe, and as you pointed out, that's exactly why you're still waiting for the iPad. You don't need a single fanboy to reach such a conclusion, nor does it take one to point it out.

I wasn't talking about the Slate. Dude, pay attention. I was speaking about the Tab.

Now you can make an argument that iPads are still not selling in Portugal because apple is having trouble in shipping them, so many are being sold in the States, etc. But that's merely speculation. Unless Daniel provides the numbers, I could also speculate other reasons for this. Perhaps Samsung is primarily shipping the Tab in countries where the iPad isn't first, to get those markets before the iPad. Do you have any knowledge about these facts or are you just making shit up, like Daniel appears to be?
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