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Apple shows interest in Verizon LTE 4G, deal with China Mobile

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
Verizon's Chief Executive said Apple's interest in his carrier's forthcoming long-term evolution 4G network helped to forge a deal to sell the iPad. Also, a new report claims Apple has entered into some type of agreement with China Mobile, the largest wireless carrier in the world.

Verizon CEO says Apple interested in LTE

In an interview with The Wall Street Journal, Verizon Chief Executive Ivan Seidenberg said his company's building of a 4G network caught the interest of Apple. It was those talks that led to the iPad being sold through Verizon when bundled with a MiFi mobile hotspot.

"Mr. Seidenberg said his embrace of LTE has drawn the interest of Apple Inc., and helped Verizon get the iPad," the report said. But he didn't comment on when Verizon might get the iPhone."

Unsurprisingly, Seidenberg declined to confirm whether the iPhone is coming to his network. Numerous mainstream media outlets, including The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal and Fortune, have independently reported that a CDMA iPhone will become available for Verizon customers in early 2011.

"If the iPhone comes to us, it's because Apple thinks it's time," he said. "Our interests are beginning to come together more but they have to take steps to align their technology with ours."

Apple reaches agreement with China Mobile - report

On Thursday the Chengdu Chinese Commercial News reported that China Mobile has entered into a "cooperation agreement" with Apple. Analyst Brian White with Ticonderoga Securities issued a note to investors in which he noted the news.

White noted that the language noting a "cooperation agreement" is vague, but he added that any relationship with China Mobile is an incremental positive for Apple's business.

China Mobile has more than 570 million mobile subscribers. It has reportedly been in talks with Apple to support the iPhone for some time, though a deal has not come to be.

Last week, The Wall Street Journal noted that China Mobile had set up a new website in which it helps users trim their SIM card to fit inside the iPhone 4, which requires a microSIM. The carrier said it was "working hard" to make microSIM cards, and would have them available in its stores soon.
post #2 of 21
What's keeping Apple from creating a "global" iPhone, like various Blackberry models and the newer Droid 2 Global? It has a CDMA radio in it, but also has a separate GSM radio in it as well. If battery life is a concern, I'm sure Apple could figure out how to completely kill the radio that's not currently in use. I still fail to see the technical hurdle, other than the fact that it might add a couple tenths of a millimeter to the thickness.
post #3 of 21
China Mobile has entered into a "cooperation agreement" with China Mobile? :-)
post #4 of 21
This story can be boiled down to just two words:

Buy stock.
post #5 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

What's keeping Apple from creating a "global" iPhone, like various Blackberry models and the newer Droid 2 Global? It has a CDMA radio in it, but also has a separate GSM radio in it as well. If battery life is a concern, I'm sure Apple could figure out how to completely kill the radio that's not currently in use. I still fail to see the technical hurdle, other than the fact that it might add a couple tenths of a millimeter to the thickness.

So far every world mode has been poorly named. For instance, the BBs on Verizon only allow users on N. American GSM networks, no UMTS bands. In fact, they typically only have one UMTS band for most of Europe, thats it.

Apple currently uses the standard four GSM bands and has five UMTS bands in the iPhone 4. On top of that, the iPhone is the smallest high-end smartphone available, whilst these world mode phones are typically larger due to the additional HW, so for Apple to support all their current radios and add CDMA/EV-DO for various carriers would probably make it impossible to keep the current size.

Even if they could keep it as small, there are outrageous patent fees for Qualcomm for simply including that tech (the reason why W-CDMA was created in the first place), even if they go unused. Then there are power costs.

But all that is inconsequential to the important question that people seem to miss: If making one handset to work for all carriers would lower costs and be easier for vendors then why arent all phones made with concept in mind? The fact that they dont means there are huge downsides to this.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #6 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Even if they could keep it as small, there are outrageous patent fees for Qualcomm for simply including that tech (the reason why W-CDMA was created in the first place), even if they go unused. Then there are power costs.

The GSM world has their so-called patent troll as well --- it's Interdigital.

http://news.cnet.com/Nokia-loses-pat...3-6013449.html
post #7 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Our interests are beginning to come together more but they have to take steps to align their technology with ours."

Translation: We'll be on CDMA for a long time, so Apple has to release a CDMA iPhone if they want to be on Verizon.
post #8 of 21
As far as I know, China Mobile uses GSM and is deploying SD-TCDMA that is their equivalent 3G tech. Apple would have to make a special phone for this tech. The advantage would be minimal royalties.

My guess is that after catching up with the UMTS 3G worldwide demand for the iPhone, Apple now wants to go after the fragmented markets that use different tech like CDMA, SD-TCDMA.
post #9 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by AjitMD View Post

As far as I know, China Mobile uses GSM and is deploying SD-TCDMA that is their equivalent 3G tech. Apple would have to make a special phone for this tech. The advantage would be minimal royalties.

My guess is that after catching up with the UMTS 3G worldwide demand for the iPhone, Apple now wants to go after the fragmented markets that use different tech like CDMA, SD-TCDMA.

you are right, i'm on china mobile and we still need to use sim card...

my way or the highway...

Macbook Pro i7 13" with intel SSD 320 series and 8GB RAM, iPhone 5, iPad 3 (Retina)

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my way or the highway...

Macbook Pro i7 13" with intel SSD 320 series and 8GB RAM, iPhone 5, iPad 3 (Retina)

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post #10 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"If the iPhone comes to us, it's because Apple thinks it's time," he said. "Our interests are beginning to come together more but they have to take steps to align their technology with ours."

Translation: "We at Verizon Wireless are the only major carrier actively deploying an LTE network. The rest of the world is focusing on upgrading their HSPA to HSPA+ and won't start to deploy LTE until 2012. The steps that Apple will take to align their technology includes at least two generations of HSPA+ handsets while they wait for a substantial percentage of the world's mobile operators to roll out their LTE networks. Also, we realize that the voice part of LTE hasn't even been finalized and there are currently no multi-protocol chips that are appropriate for use in handset that should be getting 7 hours of talk time."
post #11 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

Translation: "We at Verizon Wireless are the only major carrier actively deploying an LTE network. The rest of the world is focusing on upgrading their HSPA to HSPA+ and won't start to deploy LTE until 2012. The steps that Apple will take to align their technology includes at least two generations of HSPA+ handsets while they wait for a substantial percentage of the world's mobile operators to roll out their LTE networks. Also, we realize that the voice part of LTE hasn't even been finalized and there are currently no multi-protocol chips that are appropriate for use in handset that should be getting 7 hours of talk time."

Translation: While we overlay LTE on top of our current network, we'll be on CDMA for a long time. If Apple wants to release an iPhone on Verizon anytime soon, it will be CDMA or hybrid CDMA with LTE.

http://www.electronista.com/articles...ma.before.lte/
post #12 of 21
Another translation: "As a telecom CEO, I would have to keep my mouth shut if there was a deal in the works. Since there's not, I can blab about Apple and say how much we'd like to work with them. But at the end of the day, we got nothing. NOTHING."
post #13 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

Another translation: "As a telecom CEO, I would have to keep my mouth shut if there was a deal in the works. Since there's not, I can blab about Apple and say how much we'd like to work with them. But at the end of the day, we got nothing. NOTHING."

I'll put $20 on a CDMA iPhone by March 2011. You can PayPal me the money when you lose.
post #14 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadash View Post

I'll put $20 on a CDMA iPhone by March 2011. You can PayPal me the money when you lose.

Nope.

You find someone else to take the bet. This is just a rumor site. I can dish out the commentary with no recourse as long as I stay on topic. I've been wrong on plenty of other subjects.
post #15 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

Nope.

You find someone else to take the bet. This is just a rumor site. I can dish out the commentary with no recourse as long as I stay on topic. I've been wrong on plenty of other subjects.

I wasn't really going to bet you. But I think I'm still right. Either way we'll see next year. I am using a jailbroken iPhone on T-Mobile instead of a Droid that I returned. I guess that is my bet - waiting and hoping it goes to somebody besides AT&T soon.
post #16 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"If the iPhone comes to us, it's because Apple thinks it's time," he said. "Our interests are beginning to come together more but they have to take steps to align their technology with ours."

Another translation. "We need that iPhone Apple! Our Droids ain't bringing new customers to our network!"
post #17 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

What's keeping Apple from creating a "global" iPhone, like various Blackberry models and the newer Droid 2 Global? It has a CDMA radio in it, but also has a separate GSM radio in it as well. If battery life is a concern, I'm sure Apple could figure out how to completely kill the radio that's not currently in use. I still fail to see the technical hurdle, other than the fact that it might add a couple tenths of a millimeter to the thickness.

Why should Apple bend over backwards for a country (United States) whose wireless is so backwards a person from a third world country would laugh at the pathetic state of affairs. How about instead Vertizon and others finally all move to UTMS like the rest of the world are doing right now.
post #18 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by macintoshtoffy View Post

Why should Apple bend over backwards for a country (United States) whose wireless is so backwards a person from a third world country would laugh at the pathetic state of affairs. How about instead Vertizon and others finally all move to UTMS like the rest of the world are doing right now.

Yeah, NTSC is a bit of a joke too compared to PAL but that's the price for being first. It will all get sorted in the long run.
post #19 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by enzos View Post

Yeah, NTSC is a bit of a joke too compared to PAL but that's the price for being first. It will all get sorted in the long run.

But the difference is that many of the CDMA2000 networks that use to exist have already been replaced by UTMS or in the process right now - Verizon still hasn't even any sort of plan to migrate off CDMA2000 in the next 5 years; they're going to keep flogging a dead technology to death. If New Zealand, a country with a GDP roughly 1-2% the size of the United States can migrate fully from CDMA2000 to UTMS within a 2 year span and eventually kill off CDMA2000 within 5 years of the original UTMS launch then I think the richest country in the world can achieve such a feat.
post #20 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by macintoshtoffy View Post

But the difference is that many of the CDMA2000 networks that use to exist have already been replaced by UTMS or in the process right now - Verizon still hasn't even any sort of plan to migrate off CDMA2000 in the next 5 years; they're going to keep flogging a dead technology to death. If New Zealand, a country with a GDP roughly 1-2% the size of the United States can migrate fully from CDMA2000 to UTMS within a 2 year span and eventually kill off CDMA2000 within 5 years of the original UTMS launch then I think the richest country in the world can achieve such a feat.

New Zealand is also a fraction of the size, doesn't have the wildly varying landscape of the U.S., probably doesn't have nearly as many centralized urban areas where cell phone coverage is tricky to get, and most importantly, doesn't have all the legal crap U.S. companies have to wade through. I couldn't find a source, but I do remember reading somewhere, maybe even on this site, about it taking almost a full year just to get new towers approved in San Francisco. As much as I hate the telecoms here, they do have a lot of crap to wade through to get anything done.

And also, one factor I can only speculate on, but I wouldn't be surprised if Verizon has a long-term deal with Quallcom for a while still.
post #21 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In an interview with The Wall Street Journal, Verizon Chief Executive Ivan Seidenberg said his company's building of a 4G network caught the interest of Apple. It was those talks that led to the iPad being sold through Verizon when bundled with a MiFi mobile hotspot.

"Mr. Seidenberg said his embrace of LTE has drawn the interest of Apple Inc., and helped Verizon get the iPad," the report said. But he didn't comment on when Verizon might get the iPhone."

And how on the Earth could it not?

Ummm... iPad, being far less mobile, than iPhone, and lacking voice features, may indeed be a very good ramp into LTE for Apple...

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

Reply
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