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Windows Phone 7 developers fear platform flop - Page 5

post #161 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Not in my organization. I was pretty intimately involved with our recent mail migration and at least 60% of the current BB users were pretty PO'd they couldn't get support for the iPhone yet. It's coming the first quarter of this year - I expect a mass exodus (including me!) as soon as that happens. Sure, there will be some holdouts, but they will be the vast minority.

And the iPad - oy! Thanks to the iPad we are going to have an Enterprise Apple hardware contract for the first time. I never thought I would live to see that!

The halo effect - it's what's for breakfast.

What company is this? I want to make sure I don't do business with it. I won't productivity at work, not Angry Birds.
post #162 of 289
"Microsoft is reportedly also withholding any payments to its app developers through February 2011."

If this is true, this is just absolutely f****d.
post #163 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Man, three pages of bashing. Anyway I just took the plunge and bought a WP7. I had a 3G for almost 2.5 years and was ready for a change.

People generally bash things they fear or don't understand. Fanbois have long memories and they remember what happened last time Apple tried to battle MSFT. When Microsoft took 98% of the desktop market and Apple teetered on the brink of bankruptcy.
post #164 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by ljocampo View Post

I guarantee if the sales numbers were good, everybody would know them. MS wouldn't keep it quite. The fact that they gagging the media and developers can only mean the numbers are bad!

The numbers may be bad, who knows. However, the arguments being made for the demise of WP7 are not particularly valid, nor were they made about other OS at similar points in their life cycle.

Like I said, no one wrote that Android was doomed because they were outsold by Apple 20:1 after a month on the market. The comparison of current WP7 sales after a month to Android or iOS are absurd. The more proper metric is how long to sell a million units (iOS was a little over a month, and Android was 6 months). So if WP7 takes much longer than 6 months, it is slow.

Further, 2 complaining developers out of 15,000 does not spell doom (but is typical of AI's yellow journalism), any more than the Apple App store is doomed because a few developers leave because they are disaffected.
post #165 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

No. That's been stated elsewhere. AI doesn't make things up. Sometimes the writers give their opinions on how they feel about something, but no deliberate falsehoods.

wrong, the article with the headline stating that Ballmer said that the Apple brand did not mean much (which was subsequently changed) was made up.
post #166 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

No. That's been stated elsewhere. AI doesn't make things up. Sometimes the writers give their opinions on how they feel about something, but no deliberate falsehoods.

You have to understand the confusion though, right?

I would suggest a majority of readers view the news feed on AI as news, not a collection of opinion pieces. It's no surprise either as the articles are purposefully written as news. I searched through the last couple of days of articles and didn't come across the words "I" or "my" as in "my opinion" or "I think" or "it is my belief".

If AI is truly is a collection of opinion pieces then how, as a reader, am I suppose to tell the difference between the opinion and the fact if it is all written as fact?

Let's assume for a moment that AI is a collection of opinion pieces.

The article states "Microsoft is reportedly also withholding any payments to its app developers through February 2011".

Where was it reported that Microsoft are withholding payments? Did the writer simply forget to quote this?

The developer, Justin James, blogged that "there will be no payouts from App Hub until February 2011". He didn't report that Microsoft were "withholding payments", he just stated the fact that payments wouldn't be received from Microsoft until February 2011. As it turns out Microsoft stated prior to WP7 release that app payments wouldn't be available until February 2011.

There are a couple of possible scenarios I can see. One is that Microsoft could have the entire system up and running, have received all payments from customers and be ready to send them out to developers but decided in October to hold onto them for whatever reason. The second is that Microsoft simply didn't have the payment and reporting capabilities ready for release, they realized this in October and set the release date for this functionality at February 2011.

Personally I think it is more likely they simply didn't have the system ready by launch. I think we can assume the writer believes there is something more nefarious behind the delay.

So why say it was reported that Microsoft are withholding payments? If nothing is made up then was it the writers opinion that there would be a report somewhere that stated the same opinion as the writer?

Again, you have to understand the confusion in this.

The title of the article states "Windows Phone 7 developers fear platform flop" yet the writer makes no attempt to justify the title.

Two developer blogs are quoted. Justin James blogged about his disappointing experience publishing an application through Microsoft's App Hub. He concludes that Microsoft need to fix up the App Hub before it can be seen by developers as a source of revenue.

Nowhere does he state he fears the platform will flop.

The other developer, Nicholas Yu, has since posted a scathing response to the "journalists" (his emphasis, not mine) that misrepresented his original post. Again, nowhere did he state that he fears the platform will flop.


So we have to assume the title is the writers opinion as well. Unfortunately this time the opinion is not backed by any solid facts, and if an opinion is not based on any actual facts then how far is this away from simply being "made up"?

At this point I have to ask, why bother writing these stories at all? If opinion is getting mingled with news, and those opinions may be constructed from thin air giving them no more authority than any other comments on these forums.

Like I said, you have to understand the confusion in this. Where do we stand as readers in what we should believe and what we shouldn't?

It's not like I don't think opinion has a place on the site.

Firstly my preference would be to see a complete separation of the Apple insider news feed (which I love) with other tech news (which I generally find unhelpful at best). However I understand this site is funded by clicks, so that may not be practical.

What I do believe you should have is news articles followed by an opinion piece. The news article should come first and be based on actual facts instead of opinions.

You then have another section under the article with a title like "John's take on this..." where the writer would state their own opinion on the news story, hopefully based on some solid tech background.
post #167 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

"Microsoft is reportedly also withholding any payments to its app developers through February 2011."

If this is true, this is just absolutely f****d.

See above...
post #168 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

Tie them in a not?

That's a "knot," you ignorant sod.
post #169 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

I'm not surprised. AI is great for breaking stories and finding new information about Apple products, which is the reason I'm a regular.

When it comes to competitors though AI may as well make stories up for all the credibility they have.





EDIT********************************************** *****

This is a warning, any insults will result in a demerit.



How many apps have you ever installed on your phone? Stats for the App Store show a majority of downloads are from the top few percent of the apps in the store.

Any App Store only needs a few thousand "AAA" quality applications. The rest is just marketing bullshit.




Ballmer did mention something about that in an interview. I can't quite remember the specifics. The man rambles on about unrelated stuff like a lunatic.

You're missing the big picture, buddy.

You're assuming that getting a few thousand good to great apps for a store means having a few thousand to offer. Really? To have a few thousand great apps you need hundreds of thousands in your store. That's just life; most movies, books, etc. are of poor quality. For every Citizen Kane there's a thousand Encino Mans.

Second, the hundreds of thousands of apps in Apple's store testifies to the massive popularity of the platform with developers.

Android is picking up the Apple haters and the clueless. Where does that leave MS?
post #170 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

You have to understand the confusion though, right?

I would suggest a majority of readers view the news feed on AI as news, not a collection of opinion pieces. It's no surprise either as the articles are purposefully written as news. I searched through the last couple of days of articles and didn't come across the words "I" or "my" as in "my opinion" or "I think" or "it is my belief".

If AI is truly is a collection of opinion pieces then how, as a reader, am I suppose to tell the difference between the opinion and the fact if it is all written as fact?

Let's assume for a moment that AI is a collection of opinion pieces.

The article states "Microsoft is reportedly also withholding any payments to its app developers through February 2011".

Where was it reported that Microsoft are withholding payments? Did the writer simply forget to quote this?

The developer, Justin James, blogged that "there will be no payouts from App Hub until February 2011". He didn't report that Microsoft were "withholding payments", he just stated the fact that payments wouldn't be received from Microsoft until February 2011. As it turns out Microsoft stated prior to WP7 release that app payments wouldn't be available until February 2011.

There are a couple of possible scenarios I can see. One is that Microsoft could have the entire system up and running, have received all payments from customers and be ready to send them out to developers but decided in October to hold onto them for whatever reason. The second is that Microsoft simply didn't have the payment and reporting capabilities ready for release, they realized this in October and set the release date for this functionality at February 2011.

Personally I think it is more likely they simply didn't have the system ready by launch. I think we can assume the writer believes there is something more nefarious behind the delay.

So why say it was reported that Microsoft are withholding payments? If nothing is made up then was it the writers opinion that there would be a report somewhere that stated the same opinion as the writer?

Again, you have to understand the confusion in this.

The title of the article states "Windows Phone 7 developers fear platform flop" yet the writer makes no attempt to justify the title.

Two developer blogs are quoted. Justin James blogged about his disappointing experience publishing an application through Microsoft's App Hub. He concludes that Microsoft need to fix up the App Hub before it can be seen by developers as a source of revenue.

Nowhere does he state he fears the platform will flop.

The other developer, Nicholas Yu, has since posted a scathing response to the "journalists" (his emphasis, not mine) that misrepresented his original post. Again, nowhere did he state that he fears the platform will flop.


So we have to assume the title is the writers opinion as well. Unfortunately this time the opinion is not backed by any solid facts, and if an opinion is not based on any actual facts then how far is this away from simply being "made up"?

At this point I have to ask, why bother writing these stories at all? If opinion is getting mingled with news, and those opinions may be constructed from thin air giving them no more authority than any other comments on these forums.

Like I said, you have to understand the confusion in this. Where do we stand as readers in what we should believe and what we shouldn't?

It's not like I don't think opinion has a place on the site.

Firstly my preference would be to see a complete separation of the Apple insider news feed (which I love) with other tech news (which I generally find unhelpful at best). However I understand this site is funded by clicks, so that may not be practical.

What I do believe you should have is news articles followed by an opinion piece. The news article should come first and be based on actual facts instead of opinions.

You then have another section under the article with a title like "John's take on this..." where the writer would state their own opinion on the news story, hopefully based on some solid tech background.

Let me make it simple, Firefly.

Windows Phone 7 is failing miserably.

That factual enough for ya, buddy?
post #171 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

"In the UK, an Orange launch event opened to a line of just two people."
Wow! I bet one was DaHarder....

post #172 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

Dont like my snarky tones? Really the whole article is snarky.

"I can't stand Microsoft, or any of their products"

it's not what the article is telling.

appleinsider is reporting the launching is "meh" and Microsoft has significant challenge on the market (for once : an open market, the bane of Microsoft)
post #173 of 289
http://blog.taotaotech.com/2010/11/2...ing-my-stance/ :
Quote:
As I am wrapping up my vacation in San Francisco on a perfect day, I found a couple of comments waiting for approval in my inbox. To my surprise, none of these comments were GoVoice questions, which was what this blog was set up for. Instead, they were trackbacks of blogs and reports twisting what I said on my previous entry. After reading a few articles, I found none of those trackbacks are actually loyal to what I have said, and there is a need to clarify.

First of all, I will never express opinions on the blog regarding anything other than GoVoice. The blog is never meant to be used as a commentary about Microsoft or Windows Phone. The only reason this blog existed was for me to provide support for my customers. So if you want to quote this blog for anything else, you are misrepresenting my words.

Secondly, I acknowledge that currently reporting is not available until January/February of 2011. However, that information was announce on the Windows Phone Developer Blog back in October. I am not surprised for not getting a paycheck now, and I will not starve to death before February. I dont know if anybody should be worried unless you are one of those reporters who would do anything for a story. I also know that there are third-party solutions available like PreEmptive and Silverlight Analytic Framework. I didnt use them in the first release simply because I ran out of time. In 1.6 I used my own solution because I was setting up a server anyway. I never thought this would be interpreted as me complaining that Windows Phone marketplace being useless.

Lastly, (and please dont quote me out of context,) GoVoice was born because it was one app missing that prevented me from migrating to Windows Phone. I developed the app because there was no other way to make long distance calls to the significant other. I figured solving my own problem would mean others could benefit too. Its very simple like that. If no one had bought that app, it would have been worthwhile because I needed it.

If it still isnt clear to those journalists, here is my opinion: I enjoy submitting my apps to the marketplace. It has its bugs for sure, they always reliably and professionally test my app within 2 business days with a detailed of explanation if it fails. Its much better than waiting for 9 months for a black-box to study it just like what happened to GV Mobile.
post #174 of 289
FTA:
Quote:
That report also noted that the new WP7 models "are by and large generic phones from well known manufacturers, and in most cases an almost identical model is available from the same manufacturer with Android, and given the choice people seem to be picking Android."

Boom. Try convincing Michael Douglas that instead of sleeping with his wife for free, he should instead pay some random tramp for the same. Michael Douglas, in this analogy, is HTC, and Catherine Zeta Jones is Android. The idea that Microsoft can charge anything, at all, for the 'privilege' of using WP7, is in question. Welcome to four years ago, MS. You're late; the keg has run dry.
post #175 of 289
http://www.fudzilla.com/mobiles/item...ped-by-android

Quote:
A UK supplier claims that Microsoft's new Windows Mobile 7 is not doing very well against Android. Writing in his blog, Ben Pusey, of Mobiles Please said that Windows Phone 7 has got off to a sluggish start as far as his punters are concerned.

Only three per cent of smartphone sales and a little under two per cent of overall sales through MobilesPlease.co.uk have been using the Windows Mobile 7 OS. The 800,000 people who visit these mobile channels a month are enough to show that the initial public reaction to Windows Phone 7 is luke warm at best, he said.

Even Symbian 3 handsets outsold Windows 7 Phones by three to one, which is a little embarrising. The Symbian 3 sales were almost entirely made up of one handset, the Nokia N8, Pusey said. With Windows Phone 7 Microsoft have genuinely made an effort to differentiate, however they have arrived very late to the market and catching up with the other players will be a Herculean task, he added.

Other retailers have said that demand for iPhone, Blackberry and HTC handsets were strong in the smartphone sector.Some retailers were not even bothering displaying Windows Phone 7 machines, Pusey claimed. He said that with no killer handsets, and the stuffy, suit and tie image that Microsoft have tried so hard to shed still lingering, Microsoft need to pull something impressive out of the bag soon if they are going to compete in the mobile phone market.

http://www.fudzilla.com/mobiles/item...phone-7-update

Quote:
Microsoft is rumoured to be readying a major Windows Phone 7 update. While it might seem a bit odd to update a relatively fresh OS, it appears that WP7 simply isnt doing too well against Android and iOS devices.
The update should include some form of multitasking, as well as copy/paste support. One might say that these crucial features should have been included from the get-go, but then again its a clear case of better late than never.

In addition, the update should include Bing turn-by-turn directions and other improvements, as well as custom ringer support.

Despite this WP7 seems destined to face an uphill struggle against Google and Apple offerings. It obviously wont flop like the Kin, but there is already too much skepticism surrounding Microsofts new mobile platform.

More here.

I can smell the fail from here.
post #176 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeBarnes View Post

You're assuming that getting a few thousand good to great apps for a store means having a few thousand to offer.

Nope.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeBarnes View Post

To have a few thousand great apps you need hundreds of thousands in your store.

Nope. People here could give you a lot of info about the relative quality of apps between Android and iOS.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeBarnes View Post

Android is picking up the Apple haters and the clueless. Where does that leave MS?

There is room for more than two types of phone in the market.
post #177 of 289
Windows Phone 7 launched alongside a $500 million ad campaign last month to lackluster sales estimated to be in the tens of thousands.

If MS kept the phones and sold every one of 10,000 customers $50,000 cash for the price of the phone they would have been better off than spending $500M marketing the phones!

I know I'd buy, it's about the only thing I would buy from MS!
post #178 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeBarnes View Post

Let me make it simple, Firefly. Windows Phone 7 is failing miserably. That factual enough for ya, buddy?

Actually not that bad

In the context of your comment you define what "failing" means, so you could easily argue that position.

If you presented that as a news article you would get a giant "F" though.
post #179 of 289
Thanks for the info
Bangkok people are excited to be visiting. gclub in Singapore, but mostly just not going to go play the game. gclub each other very much
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Bangkok people are excited to be visiting. gclub in Singapore, but mostly just not going to go play the game. gclub each other very much
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post #180 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNSF View Post


What the hell, dude? I won't be able to sleep for a week! Not cool.
"Don't be a dick!"Wil Wheaton
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post #181 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1337_5L4Xx0R View Post

Microsoft is rumoured to be readying a major Windows Phone 7 update. While it might seem a bit odd to update a relatively fresh OS, it appears that WP7 simply isnt doing too well against Android and iOS devices.
The update should include some form of multitasking, as well as copy/paste support. One might say that these crucial features should have been included from the get-go, but then again its a clear case of better late than never.

In addition, the update should include Bing turn-by-turn directions and other improvements, as well as custom ringer support.

I have to call BS on that. You're talking about features that took Apple 3 years to implement... and they control the hardware as well as software.

The impression I get is that Microsoft are throwing a lot of man hours at WP7, and from that they have an accelerated development cycle compared to other Microsoft products... but all of those features in just a few months of development... I just don't think it's possible. Certainly not when they need to test across multiple devices.

I think they will do Copy+Paste early next year (Jan/Feb) then stick to their 12 month release cycles.
post #182 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

Their "do more with less clicks" sales pitch is an appealing one. This seems to be what your average person cares most about when it comes to smart phones. The learning curve on even an iphone can confuse, frustrate, and infuriate some customers. I know it seems silly, but some people really don't get along with technology very well, and it's these people that the sales pitch is working with.

I don't think anyone expected long lines and high demand for the first WP7 devices. The whole thing has potential though and won't just die off like kin did.

Are you serious "learning curve on even an iphone can confuse, frustrate and infuriate customers".
What customers are you writing about, single cell bacteria perhaps ?
My youngest when she was 6 could use an iPhone after about 5 mins. She simply watched us and caught on very quickly. Perhaps that is why there is no hard copy user manuals, none are needed.
Please refrain from lying, because that is what you are doing, "steep learning curve", I can't help from not chuckling at the sheer stupidity of your comment.
post #183 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

Their "do more with less clicks" sales pitch is an appealing one. This seems to be what your average person cares most about when it comes to smart phones. The learning curve on even an iphone can confuse, frustrate, and infuriate some customers. I know it seems silly, but some people really don't get along with technology very well, and it's these people that the sales pitch is working with.

I don't think anyone expected long lines and high demand for the first WP7 devices. The whole thing has potential though and won't just die off like kin did.

Are you serious "learning curve on even an iphone can confuse, frustrate and infuriate customers".
What customers are you writing about, single cell bacteria perhaps ?
My youngest when she was 6 could use an iPhone after about 5 mins. She simply watched us and caught on very quickly. Perhaps that is why there is no hard copy user manuals, none are needed.
Please refrain from lying, because that is what you are doing, "steep learning curve", I can't help from not chuckling at the sheer stupidity of your comment.
post #184 of 289
It took Android a while to get going and now it's market leader. It's way, way too early to make any judgement on the success or failure of Windows Phone.

Stating the obvious too but MS have the pockets to keep pushing this for as long as it takes.
post #185 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu View Post

Stating the obvious too but MS have the pockets to keep pushing this for as long as it takes.

I am sure they will.

But if you are a developer. And you have some vague interest in paying your mortgage / bar-bill.

What *exactly* would motivate you to invest time and money in creating apps for the WP7 platform.

C.
post #186 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by SevenInchHeels View Post

Heh. I saw someone with an Apple computer the other day (Starbucks) and I thought to myself. Wait, Apple makes computer? If you have a job, you just don't see Apple computers. They've pretty much been banished from the enterprise. Xserve sales are booming though!


Not true. We are an enterprise corp(mutual fund) here using all Macs.. you obviously haven't used OSX server. Costs are far less than the Licensing fiasco Microsoft uses..

and if you were in a Starbucks, Im surprised you didn't realize EVERYone in there uses a mac..

back on topic.. Microsoft just hasn't stepped up to the plate when it comes to ANY of there products.. Vista; flop, win7; getting a little better.. WinMo EPIC fail.. it took how long before an update was even available.. YEARS....
post #187 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I am sure they will.

But if you are a developer. And you have some vague interest in paying your mortgage / bar-bill.

What *exactly* would motivate you to invest time and money in creating apps for the WP7 platform.

C.

There could potentially be a bunch of reasons.

One of the developers in the article simply wanted a WP7 device but realised he was missing the app that would let him call his girl long distance, so he wrote it himself.

The skill set for WP7 development overlaps with a lot of other Microsoft technologies. This counts for a couple of different points.

Firstly time spent on WP7 development is going to count toward getting you a job if you decide to go back to working for the man instead of being an App developer.

Secondly the cost of entry into WP7 could be a lot lower if you already possess the skills required.

I've actually seen this first hand with developers starting on iOS not only had to buy a Mac, but they had never even touched a Mac. It took them months to get up the same level of proficiency with iOS development as they were already at with Windows.

All that said, if you are one of the special few that have an idea for a killer application that is going to get 20 million hits in the iStore then no amount of WP7 time saving is going to be worth it. Sure, if the application is that good it's going to be economically feasible to write it for WP7 as well... just not until the iOS and Android versions have been released!

Whatever the reasons are it doesn't seem to have stopped the developers. There were something like 10000 **EDIT it's actually 15K** registered WP7 developers the last time I heard.
post #188 of 289
kotatsu:
Quote:
way too early to make any judgement on the success or failure of Windows Phone.

I'm clairvoyant

WP will fail until MS gives it away for free, making money solely off apps in their app store and 'cloud services.'

Android will dominate at over 70% marketshare.

Apple becomes a bit player that commands a disproportionate percentage of profits.

##########################################

Apple: $$$, luxury, integration, run by irritating control freaks, well marketed.

Linux: Free, bulletproof, open source, developer friendly, transparent, more than 'good enough'

WebOS: Very good, day late, dollar short, last gasp effort. May show up in printers and tablets some day soon.

RIM: does email.

Meego: See Android, far fewer developers.

WP: ???

Please fill in the blanks.
post #189 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1337_5L4Xx0R View Post

WP will fail until MS gives it away for free

I think they basically are giving it away for "free".

It's licensed for something like $15. Apparently a combination of easier management & deployment, Microsoft handling device testing and law suits against Android manufacturers for infringing Microsoft patents makes WP7 a cheaper alternative than "free" Android.
post #190 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbmcavoy View Post

Actually, a dispassionate review isn't extremely anything. It's "meh." \

Not necessarily. As long as it's not motivated by personal feelings (one way or the other), it's dispassionate. I could write a really positive review that is objective and not motivated by my personal feelings, and it would be dispassionate. So if I did a feature compare and said that something was lacking or feature-rich based on the evidence, that would be dispassionate. If I wrote a review of Win phones and said its nothing to get excited about (i.e., "meh") because i happen to like iOS and dont want to see it getting good coverage (but also dont want to be too obviously a fan boy), it wouldnt be dispassionate...
post #191 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

I don't care, and I sincerely doubt, Apple cares about capping anyones growth.

Steve has repeatedly said this, and all their actions clearly demonstrate that Apple believes this: If you build the best products in the world, people will seek them out and things like profit and market share will take care of themselves.

I think this is refreshing and directly applicable to Apple's success. They aren't worried about their competitors, they are worried about their customers.

Many companies and posters in forums like this could do well to understand the difference.

Sure they take pot shots at competitors from time to time. Who says work has to always be boring But to infer from the occasional pot shot that Jobs obsesses about Android "eating their lunch" is just insane. If it helps you sleep at night, run with it - but there are far more interesting things to fantasize about

I never said Apple wanted to cap anyone elses growth. I said Apple fans should want WP7 to succeed as a means of capping Androids growth. I repeatably stated that marketshare is not a major concern of Apple's and there is no reason for it to be, but fanboys of all stripes seem to care a lot about it.
The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
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The key to enjoying these forums: User CP -> Edit Ignore List
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post #192 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

I have to call BS on that. You're talking about features that took Apple 3 years to implement... and they control the hardware as well as software.

The impression I get is that Microsoft are throwing a lot of man hours at WP7, and from that they have an accelerated development cycle compared to other Microsoft products... but all of those features in just a few months of development... I just don't think it's possible. Certainly not when they need to test across multiple devices.

I think they will do Copy+Paste early next year (Jan/Feb) then stick to their 12 month release cycles.

Apple of the past was working on older hardware, naturally, which forced different design decisions. Further, they had to establish for themselves how to spend space, power and processor cycles in a way that MS would not. I think it is entirely possible that MS' development time will be radically shorter than Apple's was. Of course, if all they do is catch up, they'll end as also-rans.
post #193 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You really should look things up before saying what you think the meaning is. It's easy enough.

Exactly! A dispassionate review is an unbiased review. It is entirely possible for an unbiased device review to weigh all the evidence, and still reach a conclusion that strongly advocates, or conversely strongly argues against, the merits of a particular device.

And, in the context of the word's use inside Appleinsider's article at the beginning of this thread, I do not think the editor actually intended to say that the reviews were largely unbiased. Don't get me wrong, I don't think Appleinsider was attempting to accuse the reviewers of bias either. I simply think that an evaluation of the reviewers' bias simply was never meant to come into the discussion at all.

Rather, my personal experience in reading comprehension, combined with a little bit of reading in between the lines when an incongruous word popped up ('dispassionate', given the context of the surrounding paragraph), led me to conclude that the article's editor intended to say that the reviews (unbiased or not, it's really irrelavent) led to mostly noncommittal-to-negative conclusions.
post #194 of 289
This will be a day long remembered. It has seen the end of Windows Phone 7, it will soon see the end of Microsoft.
post #195 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

One word:

Zune.

Better word:

Windows.
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post #196 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu View Post

... It's way, way too early to make any judgement on the success or failure of Windows Phone.

A strange comment, considering your prediction of Apple's "exit from the PC market altogether"
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post #197 of 289
WP7 is very comparable to the Zune - decent product with some nice features, but simply too late. the train has already left the station, and it ain't coming back.

how much PMP market share does the Zune actually have? 5%? that's where WP7 will wind up too. MS will continue to improve and globalize it, so it will become respectable. and pour money into keeping it going. so it won't die. MS probably will subsidize developers to offer all the important apps. it will become MS' "hobby." to much derision from AI, no doubt.

there is a long range hope for WP7 - all the anti-Android litigation by Apple, Oracle, and MS. Android may wind up in a serious legal mess, and become more expensive and/or limited as an outcome. but that is years down the road. that might open the door to Windows Phone one day.

and there is also one other very possible wildcard - MS makes a deal, or even "merges" with Nokia and WP7 replaces Symbian for the entire Nokia lineup. actually, i bet this happens. Elop is a MS plant.
post #198 of 289
W7 phone makes me wanna line dance in the MS store. Goodbye Zune, hello zunephone!
post #199 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1337_5L4Xx0R View Post

kotatsu:


I'm clairvoyant

WP will fail until MS gives it away for free, making money solely off apps in their app store and 'cloud services.'

Android will dominate at over 70% marketshare.

Apple becomes a bit player that commands a disproportionate percentage of profits.

##########################################

Apple: $$$, luxury, integration, run by irritating control freaks, well marketed.

Linux: Free, bulletproof, open source, developer friendly, transparent, more than 'good enough'

WebOS: Very good, day late, dollar short, last gasp effort. May show up in printers and tablets some day soon.

RIM: does email.

Meego: See Android, far fewer developers.

WP: ???

Please fill in the blanks.


WP7 and a tablet might have a good chance if they got Mobile office to print, a real web browser, and full functionality with their cloud. this needs to be done NOW not after everyone else does it better.
oh and better battery life....
post #200 of 289
Quote:
there is a long range hope for WP7 - all the anti-Android litigation by Apple, Oracle, and MS

Oracle doesn't have a case, and at this late in the game, Apple didn't invent touch-based computing, and MS... is years behind the curve, but like to threaten the linux world every now and then with vague statements.

Android is the number one player right now, so that is where the money is (in google's pockets), so patent trolls flock to Android like moths to a flame. Witness Apple's alleged lawyering up for the same reason.
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