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Free Will or Pre Ordained (Christians especially welcome)

post #1 of 70
Thread Starter 
This is a question I've been interested in for some time, and would like to hear what some members have to say on the subject, especially after browsing through the Designer Universe thread.

For the Christians here (sorry, the only Faith I know enough about to have an intelligent debate, if it ever came down to that) do you believe that you have free will, and can do as you please, or that God has a plan, and that you really have no choice in the matter.

Or some variation of the two?

-alcimedes
post #2 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by alcimedes:
<strong>This is a question I've been interested in for some time, and would like to hear what some members have to say on the subject, especially after browsing through the Designer Universe thread.

For the Christians here (sorry, the only Faith I know enough about to have an intelligent debate, if it ever came down to that) do you believe that you have free will, and can do as you please, or that God has a plan, and that you really have no choice in the matter.

Or some variation of the two?

-alcimedes</strong><hr></blockquote>
I am more an atheist , but christian culture is a part of my culture.
I think that many theologist will said you that god give us the free will, and the original sin is coming from the free will. if god planified everything in advance, he will be guilty to have let Adam eat the apple given by Eve. We have free will thus responsible of our owns acts, good or bads.
I don't think that any discussion is possible on these subject but i am not a theologian my self : so i could be wrong
post #3 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by alcimedes:
<strong>This is a question I've been interested in for some time, and would like to hear what some members have to say on the subject, especially after browsing through the Designer Universe thread.

For the Christians here (sorry, the only Faith I know enough about to have an intelligent debate, if it ever came down to that) do you believe that you have free will, and can do as you please, or that God has a plan, and that you really have no choice in the matter.

Or some variation of the two?

-alcimedes</strong><hr></blockquote>

Does it really matter?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #4 of 70
Thread Starter 
to me it's always seemed like a huge paradox in Christian belief.

almost every person i know who says they are a Christian believes that they have free will.

at the same time, they say that God is all knowing, all powerful and created the universe. there are passages in the bible referring to the martyr's names been written down (already) and other references to future knowledge, so this seems reasonable. (if you believe that what the bible says is true)

it therefore seems logical that people cannot have free will according to Christian beliefs. God made everythign. God knows everything. God is all powerful and knew from before the beginning of time that how everything that will ever happen happened.

so to me, seems like you can't believe in free will and be a Christian. if you don't believe in free will, it raises some interesting questions as to hell and heaven.

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: alcimedes ]</p>
post #5 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by alcimedes:
<strong>to me it's always seemed like a huge paradox in Christian belief.

almost every person i know who says they are a Christian believes that they have free will.

at the same time, they say that God is all knowing, all powerful and created the universe. there are passages in the bible referring to the martyr's names been written down (already) and other references to future knowledge, so this seems reasonable. (if you believe that what the bible says is true)

it therefore seems logical that people cannot have free will according to Christian beliefs. God made everythign. God knows everything. God is all powerful and knew from before the beginning of time that how everything that will ever happen happened.

so to me, seems like you can't believe in free will and be a Christian. if you don't believe in free will, it raises some interesting questions as to hell and heaven.

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: alcimedes ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
For all those christians who think they have free will, let me throw this idea out. You have free will but only get to go to heaven if you do what "god" tells you to. So, if you want eternal happiness, you really don't have free will. Bunch of freaking lemmings.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #6 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>
For all those christians who think they have free will, let me throw this idea out. You have free will but only get to go to heaven if you do what "god" tells you to. So, if you want eternal happiness, you really don't have free will. Bunch of freaking lemmings.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes indeed. That's always bothered me too. What's the point in giving us free will if He's only going to punish us by eternal damnation when we choose to exercise it?
post #7 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Hassan i-Sabbah:
<strong>

Yes indeed. That's always bothered me too. What's the point in giving us free will if He's only going to punish us by eternal damnation when we choose to exercise it?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Well, it shouldn't surprise you that religion doesn't make sense.

Of course, there is a reason why it's like that. Religion is a tool to control the ignorant masses. Give the people the illusion of free will but still threaten them with eternal damnation if they don't do what you say. The lemmings think they get to go to heaven and believe they have free will. Win-win for the men who wrote the bible.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #8 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>

Well, it shouldn't surprise you that religion doesn't make sense.

Of course, there is a reason why it's like that. Religion is a tool to control the ignorant masses. Give the people the illusion of free will but still threaten them with eternal damnation if they don't do what you say. The lemmings think they get to go to heaven and believe they have free will. Win-win for the men who wrote the bible.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Well, quite.
post #9 of 70
<strong>Originally posted by alcimedes:
to me it's always seemed like a huge paradox in Christian belief.</strong>

That isn't a problem for religion. Being logical and rational aren't the point. It may even be necessary. Remember what the Book of Job says. Remember!

<strong>at the same time, they say that God is all knowing, all powerful and created the universe. there are passages in the bible referring to the martyr's names been written down (already) and other references to future knowledge, so this seems reasonable. (if you believe that what the bible says is true)</strong>

Well, a believer is free to choose, but God knows how the believer chooses (perhaps knows all the possibilities). Of course, this means Gods is, as others have said, an umitigated bastard, but that apparently isn't a problem, and perhaps a necessary function of the belief. Remember the Book of Job.
post #10 of 70
Quick, everyone, let's dis God.

Noah J's on holiday.
post #11 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Hassan i-Sabbah:
<strong>Quick, everyone, let's dis God.

Noah J's on holiday.</strong><hr></blockquote>

A real smartass comment would be: it's pointless to dis something that doesn't exist.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #12 of 70
it therefore seems logical that people cannot have free will according to Christian beliefs. God made everything. God knows everything. God is all powerful and knew from before the beginning of time that how everything that will ever happen happened. so to me, seems like you can't believe in free will and be a Christian. if you don't believe in free will, it raises some interesting questions as to hell and heaven.
---------------
I dont follow this. How do you NOT have free will right now? Just because God knows everything how does that even relate? There is no correlation where you are sketching one. You are referring to the age old 'predestination' argument. The simple explanation is God gave all me free will. That means you are free to go to heaven, or free to go to hell. Your choice. He is also all knowing. He knows where you will chose and as such, recorded your name in the appropriate book. There is no paradox here. You are refering to 'free will' as 'absolute freedom'. The rules which he made explain what you must do to get into heaven.
------------------
For all those Christians who think they have free will, let me throw this idea out. You have free will but only get to go to heaven if you do what "god" tells you to. So, if you want eternal happiness, you really don't have free will. Bunch of freaking lemmings.
--------------------
Thats right bud. Lemmings walk off a cliff and die. You walk off a cliff into a lake of lava. How does that make Christians lemmings? Sounds like youre the lemming. Further what are you talking about? Of course you have to do what God tells you to do to get to heaven. It is your free choice whether or not you do as he commands. If you want eternal happiness you sure do have a free choice. What you are referring to is a common silly atheist question about free choice. You arent talking about a free choice, your talking about a free pass. Having a free choice to chose heaven or hell doesnt mean getting there is free at all.
---------------------
That's always bothered me too. What's the point in giving us free will if He's only going to punish us by eternal damnation when we choose to exercise it?
--------------------
If you are exercising your free choice then it is YOU who chooses dumbass. Read your own bloody post! Like God would ever come down to punish you. How pious! News flash, you arent THAT important to warrant Gods time buddy. You arent THAT special. He isnt punishing anyone. You have the choice, and you are free to chose what you want. Sounds like you have a problem owning up for your decision.
---------------
Well, it shouldn't surprise you that religion doesn't make sense. Of course, there is a reason why it's like that. Religion is a tool to control the ignorant masses. Give the people the illusion of free will but still threaten them with eternal damnation if they don't do what you say. The lemmings think they get to go to heaven and believe they have free will. Win-win for the men who wrote the bible.
---------------
Ignorant masses? Sounds like you are a substantial portion of those ignorant masses. (or at least you have one between your ears) Dont surmise that everyone is a dim witted as you are. Dont think your so clever as to have figured it all out. How many times can I say over again, you have your bloody free will, and what the hell you do with it is your own dang business. I dont care whether your in heaven OR hell. Your right, you do get eternal damnation if you dont do what God says, and choosing whether or not to do as God says is your FREE CHOICE. What your really mean is you dont like the consequences that are in place for choosing not to follow God and in doing so exercising your free will. Well guess what.nobody cares what you like and dont like. You can easily go to heaven, and have free will. If I chose to believe then I chose to go to heaven. Simple huh? Sometimes the lemmings leap off in herds, other times one at a time.
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post #13 of 70
NOTE TO MORONS:

Not all Apple Insiders are atheists. Not all Apple Insiders are stupid either.
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post #14 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>

A real smartass comment would be: it's pointless to dis something that doesn't exist.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Absolutely, but I was making a joke at Noah J's expense rather than engaging in theological debate.
post #15 of 70
I knew a born again Christian who believed in that "Free Will" crap. Sure, it's cool to go to Hooters and ogle chicks, get drunk and rude to your wife and basically do whatever you please. Of course you have to go to church on Sundays...accept Jesus as your savior...and you're "cleansed"...all ready to raise hell the next week. Sad... <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> ?

He's also the one too that said my late 16 year old nephew (killed by a hit and run drunk driver) went to Hell because he hadn't accepted Jesus as his savior...almosted clocked him for that.
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post #16 of 70
[quote]Thats right bud. Lemmings walk off a cliff and die. You walk off a cliff into a lake of lava. How does that make Christians lemmings? Sounds like youre the lemming. Further what are you talking about? Of course you have to do what God tells you to do to get to heaven. It is your free choice whether or not you do as he commands. If you want eternal happiness you sure do have a free choice. What you are referring to is a common silly atheist question about free choice. You arent talking about a free choice, your talking about a free pass. Having a free choice to chose heaven or hell doesnt mean getting there is free at all.<hr></blockquote>
That's not free will. That's coercion. god basically has a gun to my head saying, "do whatever you want but if you don't do what I say I pull the trigger." That is NOT free will.

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: BR ]</p>

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #17 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Artman @_@:
<strong>I knew a born again Christian who believed in that "Free Will" crap. Sure, it's cool to go to Hooters and ogle chicks, get drunk and rude to your wife and basically do whatever you please. Of course you have to go to church on Sundays...accept Jesus as your savior...and you're "cleansed"...all ready to raise hell the next week. Sad... <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> ?

He's also the one too that said my late 16 year old nephew (killed by a hit and run drunk driver) went to Hell because he hadn't accepted Jesus as his savior...almosted clocked him for that. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Sorry for your loss. Don't take out your hate for the world on a group of people who didn't hurt you. You must really believe in God to hate him so much. BTW, hipocrites exist in every religion. So all the people who do the things you mentioned above are better then the Christians who do it and then repent? Your nephew was at an age where he could decide his own faith and his eternal destination was in his own hands. In his heart if he believed I'm sure you'll be reunited in heaven. I hope you also join him there when you pass.
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post #18 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>
That's not free will. That's coercion. god has basically has a gun to my head saying, "do whatever you want but if you don't do what I say I pull the trigger." That is NOT free will.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes it is. YOU have the gun, and you have the choice. If you can't take the respondsibility for your actions then that is another problem. Just because you dont' like the choice doesn't make it any less YOUR CHOICE.
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post #19 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>

Yes it is. YOU have the gun, and you have the choice. If you can't take the respondsibility for your actions then that is another problem. Just because you dont' like the choice doesn't make it any less YOUR CHOICE.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Wrong. It's not my rules. It's "god's" rules. It's not my gun. It's his. Don't you have some abortion clinics to blow up? Go away, jackass.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #20 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>

Sorry for your loss. Don't take out your hate for the world on a group of people who didn't hurt you. You must really believe in God to hate him so much. BTW, hipocrites exist in every religion. So all the people who do the things you mentioned above are better then the Christians who do it and then repent? Your nephew was at an age where he could decide his own faith and his eternal destination was in his own hands. In his heart if he believed I'm sure you'll be reunited in heaven. I hope you also join him there when you pass.</strong><hr></blockquote>



Yeah, sure pal. See ya there...
I AM THE Royal Pain in the Ass.
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post #21 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>

Wrong. It's not my rules. It's "god's" rules. It's not my gun. It's his. Don't you have some abortion clinics to blow up? Go away, jackass.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Man you must hate it real bad when someone else is right. <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> This thread is about free will and free choice. NOT FREE RULES (jackass yourself!). It has nothing to do with 'who makes the rules' it's about whether you have the choice to follow them. Talk about miopia!
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post #22 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Artman @_@:
<strong>



Yeah, sure pal. See ya there... </strong><hr></blockquote>

Lol. Hey, that sure looks like a plastic toy to me...I WANT ONE!

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #23 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>

Man you must hate it real bad when someone else is right. <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> This thread is about free will and free choice. NOT FREE RULES (jackass yourself!). It has nothing to do with 'who makes the rules' it's about whether you have the choice to follow them. Talk about miopia!</strong><hr></blockquote>
co·erce (k?-ûrs')
tr.v., -erced, -erc·ing, -erc·es.
To force to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel.
To dominate, restrain, or control forcibly: coerced the strikers into compliance. See synonyms at force.
To bring about by force or threat: efforts to coerce agreement.

Ya, free will my ass.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #24 of 70
[quote]gnorant masses? Sounds like you are a substantial portion of those ignorant masses. (or at least you have one between your ears) Dont surmise that everyone is a dim witted as you are. Dont think your so clever as to have figured it all out. How many times can I say over again, you have your bloody free will, and what the hell you do with it is your own dang business. I dont care whether your in heaven OR hell. Your right, you do get eternal damnation if you dont do what God says, and choosing whether or not to do as God says is your FREE CHOICE. What your really mean is you dont like the consequences that are in place for choosing not to follow God and in doing so exercising your free will. Well guess what.nobody cares what you like and dont like. You can easily go to heaven, and have free will. If I chose to believe then I chose to go to heaven. Simple huh? Sometimes the lemmings leap off in herds, other times one at a time. <hr></blockquote>

how very christian of you.
post #25 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Artman @_@:
<strong>

Yeah, sure pal. See ya there... </strong><hr></blockquote>

I don't recall saying I was going to be there.
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post #26 of 70
The only thing I hate more than fundamentalists are militant fundamentalists.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #27 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>
co·erce (k?-ûrs')
tr.v., -erced, -erc·ing, -erc·es.
To force to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel.
To dominate, restrain, or control forcibly: coerced the strikers into compliance. See synonyms at force.
To bring about by force or threat: efforts to coerce agreement.

Ya, free will my ass.</strong><hr></blockquote>

And putting a definition up here does what?

God is not forcing you to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel. If you are feel threatened that has nothing to do with free will. You are free to act as you will. Don't be such a pussy about the consequences.
How is he dominatin or restraing, or controling you? You can blashphem him all day long and he isn't stopping you. Silly kids and your bitter hate of anything rational.
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post #28 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by running with scissors:
<strong>

how very christian of you.</strong><hr></blockquote>

See above. I don't recall claiming to be a Christian.
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post #29 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>

And putting a definition up here does what?

God is not forcing you to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel. If you are feel threatened that has nothing to do with free will. You are free to act as you will. Don't be such a pussy about the consequences.
How is he dominatin or restraing, or controling you? You can blashphem him all day long and he isn't stopping you. Silly kids and your bitter hate of anything rational.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Threat of eternal damnation...hmm................................... ................

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #30 of 70
I really wish I could find a picture (or had a camera to take a picture) of my magnet I have on my fridge...It says...

"Stop using jesus as an excuse to be a narrow-minded, bigoted asshole."

So, please follow my magnet's advice people.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #31 of 70
i always found it disturbing about christianity that you could lead "decent " life helping others, and abiding by the basic precepts of said religion (thou shall not kill...ect.), yet if you do not believe in god your going to hell. sounds like that kind of a god is a real dickhead in my book and i want nothing to do with him. i mean really, if he's all powerful and all knowing, why would he/she give a shit if we believe in him or not.

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: running with scissors ]</p>
post #32 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by BR:
<strong>
Threat of eternal damnation...hmm................................... ................</strong><hr></blockquote>

WHAT THREAT? That is a consequence of your free will. You DO have a choice (and a pretty easy one to make at that). This is one of the end results of you free choice. That is what the tread is about. Start a new one called 'God isn't fair' if you want to talk about this.
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post #33 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>I don't recall saying I was going to be there.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I wouldn't know either. I thank you for your sympathies toward my nephew. But I believe that came from your heart. So maybe that'll score some points with the big guy up there...

Oh, and BR? <a href="http://shop.store.yahoo.com/jsbstash/dogmer.html" target="_blank">You can get "Buddy Christ" here...</a>
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I AM THE Royal Pain in the Ass.
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post #34 of 70
Hello Jonathan! Only going to address my bit of your reply here. BR et al can handle theirs.


[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>
That's always bothered me too. What's the point in giving us free will if He's only going to punish us by eternal damnation when we choose to exercise it?
--------------------
If you are exercising your free choice then it is YOU who chooses dumbass. Read your own bloody post! Like God would ever come down to punish you. How pious! News flash, you arent THAT important to warrant Gods time buddy. You arent THAT special. He isnt punishing anyone. You have the choice, and you are free to chose what you want. Sounds like you have a problem owning up for your decision.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Where in my two-line post do I say that God's going to single me out by punishing me in the here-and-now for my transgressions against his Law? I don't think I do. I'm referring to the Hereafter, where God will punish me for all eternity for my manifold sins, chief of which is my not accepting him as my saviour (kind of rough on Mahatama Ghandi, too, I always thought, but I'm sure your God's a great guy really.)

I have no problem owning up to my choices: I do the best I can and when I do wrong I let down me and us rather than some nebulous bearded dude. The threat of damnation is compulsion. Creation is flawed from bottom to top if the Creator wrote blackmail into the script from the beginning.

Firstly, I can't see how you can stand there and boast of the generosity of a, well, a blackmailer who may as well be saying "You don't have to pay, but I will send you your daughters fingers in the post if you don't" (hey, no-one has to pay), and secondly how you can square this kind of behaviour with someone who did after all make everything in the cosmos, who had a choice of His own and who created all the physical and spiritual laws that the universe has operated on from the first moment of creation, with any notion of 'perfection', 'love', 'forgiveness', whatever.

Keep him. I'm with Ghandi.
post #35 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by running with scissors:
<strong>i always found it disturbing about christianity that you could lead "decent " life helping others, and abiding by the basic precepts of said religion (thou shall not kill...ect.), yet if you do not believe in god your going to hell. sounds like that kind of a god is a real dickhead in my book and i want nothing to do with him. i mean really, if he's all powerful and all knowing, why would give a shit if we believe in him or not.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Being the ultimate power may make you look like a dickhead (since so many people are scared of you or envious of you). Don't take it personally man. Also, you with the magnet. If anyone is being narrow minded etc. it is you. (so lets try to keep the clever comebacks to a minimum shall we?)

When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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post #36 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Artman @_@:
<strong>

Oh, and BR? <a href="http://shop.store.yahoo.com/jsbstash/dogmer.html" target="_blank">You can get "Buddy Christ" here...</a> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Thanks! I actually would love on of these! (The movie they were from was a riot! I love poking fun at catholics (mostly because it's so easy to do!). I wonder if they make 'stripper mary' too? lol <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> Thanks again!
When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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post #37 of 70
oops

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: Hassan i-Sabbah ]</p>
post #38 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Hassan i-Sabbah:
<strong>Keep him. I'm with Ghandi.</strong><hr></blockquote>

That's cool too.
When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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When it's my turn to be God you're going to be in real trouble...
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post #39 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Hassan i-Sabbah:
<strong>oops

[ 07-12-2002: Message edited by: Hassan i-Sabbah ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hello. Nice to meet you. My name is BR. It's not often I run across someone who is on the same page as me. I just thought I'd take a moment to formally introduce myself.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #40 of 70
[quote]Originally posted by Jonathan Brisby:
<strong>

Being the ultimate power may make you look like a dickhead (since so many people are scared of you or envious of you). Don't take it personally man.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

don't sweat it man. i don't take it personally because i don't believe in god.
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