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Piper: Apple not expected to enter new product categories in 2011 - Page 2

post #41 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCarbon View Post

80% of all statistics are made up.

If the shoe fits, buy another one just like it.
Please don't be insane.
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post #42 of 67
What can't Apple get into?
Enterprise is ripe:
How about retail for small stores. An apple based turnkey solution for small business ( Inventory, Registers, Website, Reports, etc) plus handling credit card transactions ( to pay for the system) in the NC cloud.

Medical record keeping electronically is a new area, fertile and presently a mess. More Cloud Business.

Automotive. Seems logical. Look at MS. Imagine what Apple would do there. ( and google is into automotive, by the way, their into those self driving cars, remember?)

Home appliances are nothing but returns, and , except design wise, seem to be of low interest to Apple. TV's? Don't know. But the Airplay features will really create markets unknown.

Apple is sitting on a big nut. And Jobs said he wanted to do something big with it. If nothing but upgrades happen this year, expect something interesting in the next.

I wouldn't be surprised if Apple created a new company to handle some part of its growth.
post #43 of 67
Running out of ideas ? ...

Apple TV can stream from anywhere - take security cameras, lighting control, ...
All these days Apple was into large devices. Smaller devices stopped at the ipod and iphone. Enter Apple TV - when they said it was a hobby, they did not mean less interest - they did not fathom the extent to which it can be deployed. Actually I would not be surprised if it is not going to be a major revenue earner for them in multiple threads in the next couple of years.

Why did they make iOS the software on it ? They can morph its behavior based on the OS version and app it runs at any time. I would not be surprised if they give it a profile manager and make it an access point, a video streamer, a voice controller, a security scanner, a camera monitor, ...

Apple has a few patents on voice recognition and control. Imagine electronic locks for the home with cameras attached to stream who is talking into it via Apple TV - monitoring home improvement activities from work, child monitor, come on guys ...

To quote the venerable George Carlin - "Hey, I can dream, Can't I ?".

Dudes and Dudettes, Welcome to the new decade.
post #44 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastdoor View Post

Apple "only" seems to create entirely new markets every 3-5 years. That's actually an amazing achievement -- to expect more is to expect the impossible.

But I do expect Apple to do something pretty amazing this year involving that NC server farm...

I agree with all that you said, and believe that the as yet unknown uses of the NC facility may well be another jaw dropper about to be unveiled. I believe that as with past "products", Apple may use this facility in ways nobody sees coming, and certainly nobody has before. Time will soon tell. But if the new Air, with it's 64-256 GB storage capacity is the future of computing, my guess is that this facility is going to be a game changer.
post #45 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

An appliance is an instrument, apparatus, or device for a particular purpose or use. The implication that it only applies to machines that are used for domestic use or in a kitchen is not the only or original meaning.

Putting that aside, how would a TV fit into their lineup? Where in there stores would they house dozens of TV models of various sizes to accommodate all the various needs and desires of even their top tier buyers? Or would they simply have a few different TV panel sizes that would work for everyone? It’s not like the PC market where you tend to sit about the same distance from the monitor regardless of the user.

What benefit does having the AppleTV in an AppleHDTV serve if you can buy a better and cheaper HDTV from another and then a $99 AppleTV? Does not switching inputs to connect to an AppleTV worth it? I think a layover for apps would be nice, but wouldn’t this be more easily resolved by partnering with various TV makers to offer a special AppleTV interface across multiple brands?

How much can they feasibly make from HDTVs? Here’s an article that shows Sony only made $300M for the entire year. How many HDTV models do they sell?

http://www.i4u.com/37320/sony-tvs-dr...ny-back-profit I see more of a market for Apple to make an internet appliance with the capabilities for television. Something more along the lines of Sony’s internet TVs.

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...ns#googleTVSet

It doesn't matter what you think the original meaning for appliance is, a Tv is not considered to be one of them.

I don't see a single argument you have here that's meaningful for this purpose. You might as well say the same thing about almost all of Apple's products. Amazingly enough, with dozens of computers on Best Buys shelves, Apple's sell the best, not the most overall, but the best. Same thing for music players and phones in the phone stores. If Apple sells a Tv, it won't be out with all the others. And you're forgetting that Apple has it's own stores as well.

Price also isn't a factor. With the advantages I mentioned in Apple's patents there would be visual superiorities to Apple's products. Apple wouldn't have to be the biggest Tv producer, just the most profitable, as they are for computers, phones and tablets.

I see no problem here.

An addendium:

Sony's profits aren't relevant. Sony has losses in other areas. If Apple sold a million Tv's for $1,500 apiece, on average, which it could do, it could make the $300 million profit on Tv sales alone.
post #46 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

An Apple television doesn't seem to make sense. People don't change their television sets very often. Apple wants you to buy a new model of an iDevice in a couple of years which is why the AppleTV box makes sense. Get the new one, install it in your home theater, put the old one in the guest bedroom or give to the kid who's going to college.

Apple needs to keep its priorities straight when dealing with the living room. They need to sign more content deals, particularly with the sports leagues before then can really dive into this market.

Besides that, the margins on television sets are far below what Apple's typical gross margins are. A television is a commodity. As an AAPL shareholder, I'd rather prefer to see them in something with a higher margin.

Let's see here. Margins on computers are well below what Apple expects, so Apple should get out of the computer business because all those OTHER manufacturers can't make a decent profit doing it.

The same thing is true for music players, smart phones, tablets, downloadable music, Tv shows and movies.

Well, I guess that does it. Michael Dell was right after all. Apple should close down and give the money back to the shareholders because since other manufacturers can't make a decent profit on what they sell, then Apple can't either.
post #47 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

What else can Apple get into? I already have too many devices (although I love each and every one of them!!). Between portable media players, phones, tablets, computers, and a TV set-top box, I don't really know what else Apple needs or wants to get into as a consumer electronics company.

Heart valves.

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post #48 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by iCarbon View Post

80% of all statistics are made up.

My source says the actual number is 93.6%... and it's a very reliable source... Me!

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post #49 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by OllieWallieWhiskers View Post

TVs. it's the last screen we look at that doesnt have an apple logo on the back.

i don't see them getting into cameras/camcorders, but rather improving the iPod/iPhone cameras. other than that, i don't know what else there is...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tardis View Post

Only one person seriously thinks that Apple would get into manufacturing TV displays, and that is Gene Munster at Piper Jaffray, and he has been banging on about this idea for many years, since long before the first Apple TV was announced.

Gene Munster's stupid idea about Apple making a living-room-style TV has not been able to even take on board the latest changes that Apple made to the "Apple TV" hardware module, in particular the consumer-friendly $99 pricing, that will encourage many people to try it out.

It's too soon yet to see the effect of the $99 Apple TV on Xmas 2010 sales, but we have already heard that a million have been sold. I am sure that those sales will help Apple in its move into supplying TV content to Apple products such as the Mac, iPhone, iPad etc. and of course via the Apple TV to many HDTV screens made by so many different makers in so many different sizes.

I am equally sure that Apple will not turn into a home-appliance seller anytime soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmx View Post

I agree with others that the server farm will dish out some surprises. Personally, I would like to see them solidify their email/calendar services to be enterprise-ready. If they had an entry to replace the way overpriced outlook it would be a huge revenue stream.

As for a TV - to my mind it is a silly idea. There are a large number of entrenched players in that field and I don't think they could ever hope to make the margin levels that they are used to. In the short run they might, but in the long run they would not be sustainable.


I wonder... maybe we're trapped in thinking the way TV has to be delivered -- is the way TV is currently delivered.


We have ATT u-verse cable TV and Internet as well as mobile -- that's 3 ATT bills per month.

We have 3 TVs and 3 u-verse boxes, so each can watch or record a different show concurrently.

We also have 2 iPads, soon to be 3.

We can stream NetFlix over our ATT Internet connection to our AppleTV -- and over our ATT Internet connection, then WiFi to the iPads.


Why can't we stream Live TV (or anything available to the u-verse box(es) to the iPads?


We also have a Mini media library that we can stream (StreamToMe) to the AppleTV and the iPads over WiFi.


Why can't we stream Live TV (or anything available to the u-verse box(es) to the iPads?


If we wish, we can stream NetFlix and our media-library to an iPad over 3G.


Why can't we stream Live TV (or anything available to the u-verse box(es) to the iPads?


Why doesn't somebody fix that?


We, and, I suspect, most families already have the stationary TV situation covered.


Why can't the iPad be used as a FULL Mobile TV -- in the home and out and about?

.
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post #50 of 67
Of course Apple will continue to give the iPhone ,Touch and the iPad more and more things,
(new MAPS by them; a BUTLER type service; perhaps even 3G FaceTime).

But there really is TWO THINGS that Apple can do to make it a complete year.

1) They will follow up on that patent they are waiting for. They will make the Living Room our very own personal 3D theater. They will perfect that system shown. Nobody wants to wear those dumb glasses. Some of us don't really get the full effect from it anyway.
Lucas has already said that he will redo the Star Wars franchise in 3D. Any day now they will say the same thing about Star Trek. And some other movies are being offered up.
The theater is getting to expensive.

BUT the 2nd reason is gonna make that more appealing.

2) I am thinking that the Data Farm or Farms that Apple is making is gonna be a glorified storage facility.
Of course it will cost us a little bit. Perhaps Mobile Me will be a requisite for us, but hopefully for a reduced price ($25 or even $50 depending on how much we store on it).

I say we store on it because: we will no longer have to buy any DVD's or Bluray discs. They all get scratched or lost anyway. The worst thing about them is that usually we can't carry them with us or worst yet, we don't have enough storage room in our phone, pad or Air.

Apple is gonna solve that real nice and pretty for us. With one yearly payment, we can stream everything we need, (even those home made movies we make) to any and all those Apple devices.

Storage is and will continue to be the biggest problem that we will have for the foreseeable future. Sure you can continue renting from Netflix. A lot of people still buy movies. If you buy them once, you will be able to see it when and as many times as you want.
post #51 of 67
Dang! Here I was hoping Apple would be brining a transporter beam and the food replicator this year.
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post #52 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

In that sense (in the sense of fixing crap things) their biggest unfinished job is the computer, because people still find computers confusing, even the Mac. The Mac App Store will help a lot but there's more to be done. There are fundamental computing/visualization problems, like how you manage and easily browse large amounts of data. And speech recognition. And just the general stupidity of computers at understanding what the user wants to do. If you could just explain to the computer what you want, like with another person, you could have a lot less cluttered user interface. But that kind of thing is 30 years away I guess. But if they *could* get something like that working, it would be like the release of the original Macintosh, the whole audience would mess themselves.



vs




'Nuff said?

.
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"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #53 of 67
No new products! I have been waiting since 1947 for a Dick Tracy Watch!
post #54 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmx View Post

I agree with others that the server farm will dish out some surprises. Personally, I would like to see them solidify their email/calendar services to be enterprise-ready. If they had an entry to replace the way overpriced outlook it would be a huge revenue stream.

As for a TV - to my mind it is a silly idea. There are a large number of entrenched players in that field and I don't think they could ever hope to make the margin levels that they are used to. In the short run they might, but in the long run they would not be sustainable.

That's what everybody said when Apple got into the cel phone market.
post #55 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It doesn't matter what you think the original meaning for appliance is, a Tv is not considered to be one of them.

I don't see a single argument you have here that's meaningful for this purpose. You might as well say the same thing about almost all of Apple's products. Amazingly enough, with dozens of computers on Best Buys shelves, Apple's sell the best, not the most overall, but the best. Same thing for music players and phones in the phone stores. If Apple sells a Tv, it won't be out with all the others. And you're forgetting that Apple has it's own stores as well.

Price also isn't a factor. With the advantages I mentioned in Apple's patents there would be visual superiorities to Apple's products. Apple wouldn't have to be the biggest Tv producer, just the most profitable, as they are for computers, phones and tablets.

I see no problem here.

An addendium:

Sony's profits aren't relevant. Sony has losses in other areas. If Apple sold a million Tv's for $1,500 apiece, on average, which it could do, it could make the $300 million profit on Tv sales alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Let's see here. Margins on computers are well below what Apple expects, so Apple should get out of the computer business because all those OTHER manufacturers can't make a decent profit doing it.

The same thing is true for music players, smart phones, tablets, downloadable music, Tv shows and movies.

Well, I guess that does it. Michael Dell was right after all. Apple should close down and give the money back to the shareholders because since other manufacturers can't make a decent profit on what they sell, then Apple can't either.

Everything sounds like youre trying to put Apple in this magical position of being able to overtake any industry. The TV market is not the PC market. Ive seen not a single argument that says that Apple would sell $1500 AppleHDTVs in their stores and not a single person who really wants it has addressed any of the issues Ive mentioned. How does Apple deal with the logistics of selling 100lb HDTV whose only noted benefit is that the AppleTV is built in? What stores can handle that in the show room and warehouse? How many units would they have and how would the space they are displacing affect much smaller and lighter items that would surely yield a much more profitable take for the same size and weight? How many HDTVs does a store like Best By sell in a day? How many would Apple have to have on hand? Even if they were profitable for a TV would it be worth the effort sell them in your stores when 300 iPhones or 20 MacBooks Pros would be yield bigger gains? How many models do they make? Do people tend to buy HDTVs based on portability or what fits on a desk a foot in front of them, or what fits in the enumerable entertainment system sizes and living room sizes throughout the world? Would they offer only huge HDTVs or small ones, too, for guest rooms and such where you dont want the largest size? As cool as it would be and as nice as Im sure theyd be no one seems to be able to answer these logistical questions, and since Apples focus is on profits and are growing in both Macs and iPhones and iPads I cant see where this would fit in. Hell, theyre even chipping away at their more larger, more expensive PCs because they arent as profitable.
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post #56 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by luvosx View Post

Running out of ideas ? ...

Apple TV can stream from anywhere - take security cameras, lighting control, ...
All these days Apple was into large devices. Smaller devices stopped at the ipod and iphone. Enter Apple TV - when they said it was a hobby, they did not mean less interest - they did not fathom the extent to which it can be deployed. Actually I would not be surprised if it is not going to be a major revenue earner for them in multiple threads in the next couple of years.

Why did they make iOS the software on it ? They can morph its behavior based on the OS version and app it runs at any time. I would not be surprised if they give it a profile manager and make it an access point, a video streamer, a voice controller, a security scanner, a camera monitor, ...

Apple has a few patents on voice recognition and control. Imagine electronic locks for the home with cameras attached to stream who is talking into it via Apple TV - monitoring home improvement activities from work, child monitor, come on guys ...

To quote the venerable George Carlin - "Hey, I can dream, Can't I ?".

Dudes and Dudettes, Welcome to the new decade.


I like your thoughts -- I would add a Home Server (with cloud backup) -- In the words of that same George Carlin: "a place to put your stuff!"

BTW, hay dudas que se dice "Dudes and Dudettes"

Quizas, "Dudes y Dudas" -- mas o menos!
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post #57 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post



vs




'Nuff said?

.

I couldn't have said it better myself
post #58 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

6. Remote control

That is one I want them to enter. 3rd-party offerings are poor and expensive.

The Remote app on iOS is a start. On the other hand, yes, the Apple Remote included with Apple TV is just barely acceptable. And those 150-button Logitech remotes are a joke. 1 dollar per button is not a bargain IMHO.

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post #59 of 67
Munster: ..."an all-in-one Apple television could move the needle when connected TVs proliferate"...

The key words here are "when connected TVs proliferate." So far Google TV has done zero to proliferate connected TVs. Samsung has rolled out their Internet@TV line, but it's selling even worse than 3D TVs are.

Remember the MP3 player market in 2001? The smartphone market in 2006? The pad computing market in January 2010? They all had several major and minor competitors, all with feeble products just waiting to be killed off by Apple. iPod, iPhone, and iPad swept in and crushed the competition.

So why hasn't Apple moved Apple TV out of the "hobby" category? Because the connected TV market still hasn't gained any mindshare among mainstream consumers. And TVs have had a "computer input" for decades. Anybody with a pee cee or Mac could have attached their computer to their TV and gotten the "full internet" on their living room big screen. Very few ever bothered.

Apple released the original Apple TV 1 as a placeholder in the connected TV space. The updated Apple TV 2 is a result of what they learned from the old model. And the next version, which could be built into HDTVs themselves, will use what Apple will learn from Apple TV 2. By taking it slow and testing things over time, Apple learns what works and what doesn't work.

Google, on the other hand, simply dumped Google TV onto the market as though they had ignored the past decade of WebTV failure. Consumers don't want internet complexity bolted onto TV simplicity. Sure, it's possible that consumers could eventually want that. But not right now.

The market isn't ready, Apple knows it, and that's why Apple TV is simple.

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post #60 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by EyeNsteinNo View Post

No new products! I have been waiting since 1947 for a Dick Tracy Watch!

You could strap an iPhone to your wrist.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #61 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by EyeNsteinNo View Post

No new products! I have been waiting since 1947 for a Dick Tracy Watch!

They came out in the '80's. No one bought them.
post #62 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

They came out in the '80's. No one bought them.

Yeah, thanks to that terrible movie with Warren Beatty.

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post #63 of 67
Apple's next big push will be around AirPlay and Apple TV. Just think of the current implementations of these products as the sandbox, the play area where we the public get to see just a glimpse of the real potential of these things. The real, full use is yet to come. Apple is doing a dozen different things right now that will all culminate in the next big thing.

Yes, I'm still 100% sure Apple will introduce a television. It makes financial sense, it makes strategic sense... and they have to do it. Otherwise they will surrender the living room to Google and Google will use that as a wedge to split apart the Apple ecosystem.

And please don't try and tell me that the TV market is too mature, or that margins are too low, yada yada. Apple has smashed through such barriers many times before.
post #64 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Yeah, thanks to that terrible movie with Warren Beatty.

I think that almost every movie with him is terrible.
post #65 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

What else can Apple get into? I already have too many devices (although I love each and every one of them!!). Between portable media players, phones, tablets, computers, and a TV set-top box, I don't really know what else Apple needs or wants to get into as a consumer electronics company.

With Apple's war chest, what can't they get into? How about domestic robots? Holographic displays? Effective and affordable VR?
post #66 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post

Markets Apple could enter, but probably wont:
  1. Dedicated game consoles
  2. Blu-ray players
  3. TVs
  4. Camcorders
  5. Printers

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

6. Remote control

That is one I want them to enter. 3rd-party offerings are poor and expensive.

1 Possibly but doubt they will.
2-5 Commodity products, tight profit margins, so NO.
6 Tight margins here too. If Apple just makes them work, they could charge a premium on them. I too would enjoy an Apple 'it just works' remote.

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post #67 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I think that almost every movie with him is terrible.

I think Eva Marie Saint taught Henry how to act in the 1962 movie "All Fall Down".
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