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CES: Microsoft keynote underwhelms with few surprises

post #1 of 157
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Microsoft kicked off the Consumer Electronics Show Wednesday evening with a relatively subdued keynote that highlighted an upcoming update to Windows Phone 7 and demoed Windows on ARM's system-on-a-chip architecture.

Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer took the stage late Wednesday in a keynote that, according to MSNBC, had "less ambition than expected." Prior to the event, rumors had surfaced that the Redmond, Wash., Windows maker would reveal details about its next major Windows upgrade or possibly a Windows TV set top box platform, but Ballmer instead focused on incremental feature upgrades to its Xbox, Windows Phone 7, and Windows PC products.

The software giant did, however, make news earlier in the day when it revealed that it was readying a version of Windows that would run on ARM's low-power system-on-a-chip (SoC) architecture, though attendees were disappointed to learn that demos of the next version of Windows on an Arm SoC used the Windows 7 interface.

Apple has used SoC designs for several years, culminating in the iPad's custom A4 SoC in early 2010. The A4 has since made its way into the iPhone 4, the iPod touch and the Apple TV.

"We have a chip called A4," Steve Jobs said when he unveiled the iPad, "which is our most advanced chip we've ever done that powers the iPad. It's got the processor, the graphics, the I/O, the memory controller -- everything in this one chip, and it screams."

Microsoft's move to SoC platforms, both x86- and ARM-based, is part of a broad-reaching goal to compete in markets ranging in size from smaller mobile devices to larger servers.

"Whatever device you use... Windows will be there," said Ballmer during Wednesday's keynote, Engadget reports. "Windows PCs will continue to adapt and evolve. Windows will be everywhere on every device without compromise."

Ballmer announced several new features for the Xbox platform. Hulu Plus is coming to Xbox, and Kinect motion controls to Netflix and Hulu Plus. Additionally, a new Avatar Kinect chat service will use the Kinect motion camera for an animated chat service.

According to Ballmer, the rapid success of the Kinect was a surprise for Microsoft. Microsoft had predicted sales of 5 million Kinect sensors this holiday season, but worldwide sales have already topped 8 million.

Windows Phone 7 is soon to get an update, which will add the much-missed copy and paste feature and improve speed. Also, WP7 phones will be coming to Verizon and Sprint in the first half of this year.



Ballmer also took the time to highlight his company's focus on leveraging its Xbox successes on the Windows Phone 7 platform. "Fable," a flagship game for the Xbox, will make its way onto Windows Phone 7 soon, said Ballmer.



Windows Phone 7 got off to a rocky start. Initial reviews of WP7 found it to be several years behind Apple's iOS and Google's Android OS. Microsoft VP Joe Belfiore admitted that Microsoft may need at least two years to catch up to its competitors. The company recently announced it had shipped 1.5 million WP7 phones into retail channel inventories, though it declined to say how many it had sold.

As expected, Microsoft demoed new PCs running Intel's latest Sandy Bridge processors, including several slate and tablet PCs from various manufacturers. In a better showing than last year's HP Slate debacle, all of the devices demoed are "up for order right now," according to Microsoft's Mike Angiulo.

In an attempt to catch up Apple's impressive lead in the tablet market with the iPad, a number of competitors have unveiled tablet devices at this year's CES. On Tuesday, Taiwanese PC maker Asus revealed plans for three families of tablet-style products, while Chinese computer giant Lenovo took the wraps off its LePad tablet.

Earlier Wednesday, Motorola showed off its Xoom tablet, the first tablet to run Google Android 3.0 Honeycomb. Not to be outdone, Research in Motion has the BlackBerry PlayBook tablet on display at CES.

According to Forrester Research, tablet sales will more than double this year to 24 million units, with Apple's iPad making up the "lion's share" of sales.
post #2 of 157
DED wrote this with out a doubt.
post #3 of 157
Is this article serious??? I just finished watching the keynote and I was impressed.

Hopefully Apple is still a step ahead...
post #4 of 157
I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind. This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it’ll be fashionable. That’s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.

All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade.
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post #5 of 157
I must say the Kinect sales are ridiculous!
post #6 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciwiz View Post

I must say the Kinect sales are ridiculous!

The previous claim that it would outsell the iPad look to be correct, and by a large margin.
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post #7 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The previous claim that it would outsell the iPad look to be correct, and by a large margin.

My take is I don't think the claim was specifically aimed at Ipad, just the nature of demand.

Quote:
"The preorders have been really strong. As far as what we're looking at for Holiday, this is going to be stuff that'll blow away any of the sales you've seen with iPad," says Tsunoda, when asked what he though about the device's chances of success.

Kudo Tsunoda Interview
post #8 of 157
I know MS$ is a touchy subject here, but this might give Intel the boot to start trying to compete with ARM processors. Intel may have the next best thing right now, but ARM is taking quite a bit of market share from them between tablets, and now net books and phones. I think phones will really be the computer of the future. Just my opinion.
post #9 of 157
I'd like to see a full Snow Leopard/Lion desktop running on ARM.
post #10 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciwiz View Post

My take is I don't think the claim was specifically aimed at Ipad, just the nature of demand.

Quote:
"The preorders have been really strong. As far as what we're looking at for Holiday, this is going to be stuff that'll blow away any of the sales you've seen with iPad," says Tsunoda, when asked what he though about the device's chances of success.

Kudo Tsunoda Interview

As your quoted text clearly shows his comment specifically names the iPad. I think it’s then fair to see if that claim was accurate or merely bombastic. 8 million in 2 months beats all previous iPad unit sales. A win is a win, even if these sales aren’t likely sustainable.



Quote:
Originally Posted by JustReelFilms View Post

I'd like to see a full Snow Leopard/Lion desktop running on ARM.

Looking at iOS I’d say they’re a lot further along with that than MS is right now.
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post #11 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

As your quoted text clearly shows his comment specifically names the iPad. I think its then fair to see if that claim was accurate or merely bombastic. 8 million in 2 months beats all previous iPad unit sales. A win is a win, even if these sales arent likely sustainable.

And iPhone case sales will blow away Kinect sales by an order of magnitude! Wow!

Apples and oranges. I don't understand why they are making the comparison they are. Shouldn't they be talking about the Sony motion controller sales intead?
post #12 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sessamoid View Post

And iPhone case sales will blow away Kinect sales by an order of magnitude! Wow!

Apples and oranges. I don't understand why they are making the comparison they are. Shouldn't they be talking about the Sony motion controller sales intead?

It’s simple marketing. The iPad was the biggest new CE product of 2010. So they made a claim against that new product. Whether Tsunoda actually believed it would blow away the iPad sales at a 5M estimate is unknown, but the effect was prominent. The news spread across the net quickly. Ask yourself this: Do you think AI would have covered the article if he said the Kinect would outsell the Wii this holiday?
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post #13 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sessamoid View Post

And iPhone case sales will blow away Kinect sales by an order of magnitude! Wow!

Apples and oranges. I don't understand why they are making the comparison they are. Shouldn't they be talking about the Sony motion controller sales intead?

They don't have anything to talk about there.

Sony didn't give any numbers today and at last count it was 4.1million Move controllers in 2 months. (Also, I'm not sure how they are counting, as for some games you might use 2 controllers.)
post #14 of 157
It might be instructive to google "Windows Everywhere." Seems to me, Microsoft began using this slogan during the mid-90s. And here I thought they'd allowed that undeliverable, not to mention undesireable, concept to slip beneath the waves long ago.

But "LePad" is the real winner here. Buy one and take it home in your LeCar.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #15 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind. This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it’ll be fashionable. That’s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.

All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade.

ARM Cortex A-15 has up to 4 cores. And this is a new decade.

post #16 of 157
Ha Har When I posted the rumour that Windows on ARM was going to be announced at CES on this thread: http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=116280

Several said it wasn't going to be Windows 7 Desktop on ARM

Insanity is releasing Windows 7 Desktop on Intel Tablets and failing,
and releasing Windows 7 Desktop on ARM Tablets... and failing again.

That said fair enough this was just a demo so who knows what Windows for ARM will actually be like.
post #17 of 157
Shh... Don't tell Wizard(Dave)... He says ARM is way too slow to be useful, let alone for i86-equivalent apps! (Yes, I'm paraphrasing you somewhat Dave)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

ARM Cortex A-15 has up to 4 cores.


Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind. This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it’ll be fashionable. That’s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.

All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade.
post #18 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

ARM Cortex A-15 has up to 4 cores.

That’s what I thought up until an hour ago when I read that it will have up to 8 cores and was told by another that 8 cores was correct. I should have stuck with 4 in my post. :/

edit: Under the Performance tab it does say "1.5GHz – 2.5 GHz quad-core, octo-core or larger configurations” and first assumed that was multiple processors on one board.

http://www.arm.com/products/processo...cortex-a15.php
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post #19 of 157
No surprises from Balmer. None expected. HO-Hum
post #20 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolian View Post

I know MS$ is a touchy subject here, but this might give Intel the boot to start trying to compete with ARM processors. Intel may have the next best thing right now, but ARM is taking quite a bit of market share from them between tablets, and now net books and phones. I think phones will really be the computer of the future. Just my opinion.

The funny thing is that Intel had a competent ARM architecture (StrongARM, X-Scale) a few years back for PocketPCs... but once the market for dedicated PDAs died, Intel bailed and sold the assets to Marvell.

DOH!!

They still have an ARM license though, so who knows what will happen...
post #21 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Its simple marketing. The iPad was the biggest new CE product of 2010. So they made a claim against that new product. Whether Tsunoda actually believed it would blow away the iPad sales at a 5M estimate is unknown, but the effect was prominent. The news spread across the net quickly. Ask yourself this: Do you think AI would have covered the article if he said the Kinect would outsell the Wii this holiday?

Ah, a pissing contest. Got it.
post #22 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post

The funny thing is that Intel had a competent ARM architecture (StrongARM, X-Scale) a few years back for PocketPCs... but once the market for dedicated PDAs died, Intel bailed and sold the division to Marvell.

DOH!!

Kind of like when AMD sold it's mobile graphics division to Qualcomm, where it is now part of the Snapdragon processors as the Adreno graphics.
post #23 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

DED wrote this with out a doubt.

My thoughts exactly. All DED did was read Engaget's liveblog then turn around and write a flame title with little to back up his claims in the body.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolian View Post

Is this article serious??? I just finished watching the keynote and I was impressed.

Hopefully Apple is still a step ahead...

The title doesn't even match the article. Microsoft moving to ARM for its flagship Windows OS is huge news. Sandy Bridge is big news on the performance front for Windows. 8 million Kinects sold is a surprise to everyone.

So what exactly is underwhelming?
post #24 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciwiz View Post

I must say the Kinect sales are ridiculous!

That's funny... I heard they were ridonkulous...

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post #25 of 157
I just had two macallan 25s...

so forgive me if I am not getting this...

Are you guys comparing kinects and ipads?

wtf?
post #26 of 157
So pathetic. And he is bragging that "Whatever device you use... Windows will be there.." like somehow that's a positive thing!

ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL ROFLOL
post #27 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind. This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before itll be fashionable. Thats a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.

All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade.

Yeah, I'm still waiting for Apple to surprise us with a new XServe packed with dozens of low powered A4 processors running OS X Server. That would be nice.

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post #28 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

It might be instructive to google "Windows Everywhere." Seems to me, Microsoft began using this slogan during the mid-90s. And here I thought they'd allowed that undeliverable, not to mention undesireable, concept to slip beneath the waves long ago.

But "LePad" is the real winner here. Buy one and take it home in your LeCar.

LeLOL!

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #29 of 157
It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.

There were grumblings two years ago that the hardware required to deliver a great "tablet" experience would become available in 2010. There were even mainstream media reports almost 18 months ago.

It shouldn't have been a surprise to anyone, and certainly not a tech company as big as Microsoft.

Microsoft need to realize there is a difference between the consumer and enterprise market.

Staying out of the tablet market for another 18 months just so they can deliver a business focused device is madness.

I think it would be really interesting if they delivered two tablets. An Xbox/Zune branded consumer focused device based off CE/WP7 running on ARM and another "Windows 8" ARM/x86 business focused device in 18/24 months when it's ready.

Both devices could run the same applications and use the same application store based on XNA/Silverlight, but I would assume the business focused device would also allow side-loading and management through Windows Server (like normal Windows)

The consumer based device would also have strict hardware requirements and hardware iterations (like WP7/Xbox/Zune) where the business device would be more of an OEM free-for-all.

Eventually, down the road, the consumer focused device could have its core moved to Windows 8 (or 9) without any impact to applications (as all are based on XNA/Silverlight) well as any other devices Microsoft decide to merge (Zune, Xbox, WP7 etc).

I also think that Media Center should be moved over to the "Entertainment" division and integrated with Xbox, so they can offer "gaming/tv/media anywhere" and tight integration between Xbox, Zune, WP7 and the new Xbox Slate... but that's a story for another day.
post #30 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

It's absolute madness that Microsoft still don't have an entry into the "tablet" market at this stage.

Neither does RiM, Nokia nor Android. Apples still the only modern mobile OS "designed for tablets" on the market.
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post #31 of 157
Some really weird and odd comments on this thread. To say this is the best CES for MS??? Really?

Microsoft are hopelessly behind in everything. And wow, Kinnect? Big deal. It's a 5th of the price of an iPad and there is no comparison to be made, except in Ballmers' dreams...

Another sad day for Microsoft, on its way to breakup and ultimate oblivion.
post #32 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Ah, a pissing contest. Got it.

Some might call it marketing...
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post #33 of 157
Porting Windows - full Windows - to a new architecture is hardly an "incremental" feature (I'm tempted to add ", Daniel." as this is plainly a DED article). This is a serious development.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The previous claim that it would outsell the iPad look to be correct, and by a large margin.

So what? It's like saying Starbucks sells more muffins than Durex sells condoms. It was a meaningless comparison when MS made it and it's a meaningless comparison now.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRR View Post

I just had two macallan 25s...

so forgive me if I am not getting this...

Are you guys comparing kinects and ipads?

wtf?

Yes, they are. In other news, Tetley sells more tea-bags than Aston-Martin sells Vanquishes.
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post #34 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

DED wrote this with out a doubt.

...and?

Why do you make a point of coming here with pointless posts like this?

Microsoft had nothing apart from vapourware windows 8 running on ARM, a small blip on the horizon, coming late to a market where Apple already are and Android, WebOS, Blackberry and others soon will be.

Underwhelming and you try to shoot the messenger which is all you seem to be good for.

So I get it you don't like DED, so why keep bleating on about it?
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post #35 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I know people will laugh at Windows 8 on ARM but Cortex-A15 will be up 2.5GHz, have up to 8 cores and be designed with actual servers in mind. This will not be an area MS will want to ignore. This is a smart move and being done well before it’ll be fashionable. That’s a good thing for a company that has been notorious for only reacting after the fact.

All said, i think this is the best CES MS has had this decade.


Fair enough, considering that this decade is only 6 days old
post #36 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Fair enough, considering that this decade is only 6 days old

2010 started this decade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010s

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post #37 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

2010 started this decade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010s

You are right. My apologies to all.
post #38 of 157
You think 8 million Kinects is a lot? You guys clearly don't know squat about video games.

There is no doubt, these sales ARE NOT sustainable. This is just like a less successful, similar-fated HD Wii.

Which is quite funny because xbox people often say the Move (PS3' motion controller) is a Wii-clone... but in a software sense, it's exactly the other way around: Sony is actually pushing it (although poorly, I must say) towards REAL games (known to casuals as "hardcore" games).

Just Google SOCOM 4. Oh, and the Sony keynote blew this crap out of the water. 2011 will definitely be the year of the Playstation.

And comparing a $150 Kinect with a <$500 iPad? Seriously people?

Anyway, I DO believe iPad will still outsell it.

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iPhone 4S 64GB, Black, soon to be sold in favor of a Nokia Lumia 920
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post #39 of 157
Onhka, You were correct in the post. This decade is six days old. 2010 was the final year of the first decade of the 21st century.
post #40 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Ah, a pissing contest. Got it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bageljoey View Post

Some might call it marketing...

Yup, one and the same.
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