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Gifford shooting

post #1 of 286
Thread Starter 
This looks bad- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_806243.html


I wonder what Sarah Palin's thoughts are? This in the Guardian-

"Palin had published a "target map" on her website using images of gun sights to identify 20 House Democrats, including Giffords, for backing the new health care law. At an event in 2009 which was similar to the one Giffords was holding today, a protester was removed by police when his pistol fell to the supermarket floor."
~http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...tucson-arizona

Sarah Palin has not yet offered an apology.
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #2 of 286
He's a lunatic. That's about all there is to it.
Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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Gangs are not seen as legitimate, because they don't have control over public schools.
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post #3 of 286
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

He's a lunatic. That's about all there is to it.

Yeah he may very well be, but Palin wasn't helping matters putting this up, in fact it could be argued it might give some people the wrong ideas, especially in the US. Pretty shocking and reckless IMO. - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_806224.html
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #4 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwinter View Post

He's a lunatic. That's about all there is to it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Yeah he may very well be, but Palin wasn't helping matters putting this up, in fact it could be argued it might give some people the wrong ideas, especially in the US. Pretty shocking and reckless IMO. - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_806224.html

There has been no link to what this person has done and Palin Internet site. I agree that it was irresponsible of her to have something like this. A similar case in point would be the pro-lifers website listing names and address of doctors who performed abortions. Several of the doctors were targeted and killed or wounded.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #5 of 286
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

There has been no link to what this person has done and Palin Internet site. I agree that it was irresponsible of her to have something like this. A similar case in point would be the pro-lifers website listing names and address of doctors who performed abortions. Several of the doctors were targeted and killed or wounded.

Whatever effect it had I think it's fair to say that it won't have helped.

I can't see the sense in this either-

"PHOENIX Favoring the constitutional right to bear arms over others' concerns about gun safety, Gov. Jan Brewer on Friday signed into law a bill making Arizona the third state allowing people to carry a concealed weapon without requiring a permit.

The measure takes effect 90 days after the current legislative session ends, which likely puts the effective date in July or August.

"I believe this legislation not only protects the Second Amendment rights of Arizona citizens, but restores those rights as well," Brewer, a Republican, said in a statement....

By eliminating the permit requirement, the Arizona legislation will allow people 21 or older to forego background checks and classes that are now required."
~ http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/20...ontent=Twitter


Who does it benefit to forego the background checks and classes, that were the law?
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #6 of 286
Thread Starter 
Giffords opinion about Sarah's gun sights-


Sarah Palin has the crosshairs of a gun sight over our district and when people do that, theyve gotta realize there are consequences to that action.
~ http://kateoplis.tumblr.com/post/265...ford-about-the
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #7 of 286
The conservative silence is deafening. Not even a "man, that's terrible. Assassination of democratically elected political leaders no matter how much you disagree with them is wrong."

Note, Gifford also had someone in attendance at a town hall meeting a year ago drop a gun. Furthermore, her glass front door of her Tuscon office was smashed in 9 months ago. There's been a pattern of intimidation and violence against her.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
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post #8 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

The conservative silence is deafening. Not even a "man, that's terrible. Assassination of democratically elected political leaders no matter how much you disagree with them is wrong."

In all fairness, John McCain remarks are pretty unequivocal:
Quote:
"Whoever did this; whatever their reason, they are a disgrace to Arizona, this country and the human race, and they deserve and will receive the contempt of all decent people and the strongest punishment of the law."

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefi...o-qhuman-raceq
post #9 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

The conservative silence is deafening. Not even a "man, that's terrible. Assassination of democratically elected political leaders no matter how much you disagree with them is wrong."

Note, Gifford also had someone in attendance at a town hall meeting a year ago drop a gun. Furthermore, her glass front door of her Tuscon office was smashed in 9 months ago. There's been a pattern of intimidation and violence against her.

The assassination was horrible. But I don't agree at all with the topic assumptions and do not feel any need to post to it. That is all.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #10 of 286
Ditto. The OP is sickening, using a terrible tragedy to advance stupid political points.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #11 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

The conservative silence is deafening. Not even a "man, that's terrible. Assassination of democratically elected political leaders no matter how much you disagree with them is wrong."

Funny, many of the press reports I'm seeing reference high-profile Republican comments as well.

Edit: BBC News has a long list of comments, many from Conservative leaders. So can we agree BR, that your post is, at best, inaccurate?
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #12 of 286
If I produced a blog with a "target map" of Republicans I am critical of, do you not think I might get some attention from the secret service? How about when people on my "target map" start getting shot/killed? Why does Palin get a pass on this?

And I agree, BR's post didn't make sense. But I think he was referring to non-politician Republicans. Look at news boards, and with a few exceptions, pretty much all the self-declared conservatives or Republicans are either staying silent on this or criticizing Liberals for blaming this tragedy on politics.
post #13 of 286
She doesn't need to get a pass. It's a fair point for criticism, even though "targeting" certain politicians during an election campaign is fairly standard parlance.

But immediately linking this issue to a terribly tragedy where there is no proof the assailant was motivated by her (and plenty of facts to argue that he's motivated by other things) is seriously stupid.

The suspect also wrote comments to suggest that he doesn't believe in God.
Should conservatives have used this as an occasion to immediately fearmonger against atheists?
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #14 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

She doesn't need to get a pass. It's a fair point for criticism, even though "targeting" certain politicians during an election campaign is fairly standard parlance.

But immediately linking this issue to a terribly tragedy where there is no proof the assailant was motivated by her (and plenty of facts to argue that he's motivated by other things) is seriously stupid.

The suspect also wrote comments to suggest that he doesn't believe in God.
Should conservatives have used this as an occasion to immediately fearmonger against atheists?

Agreed!
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #15 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

If I produced a blog with a "target map" of Republicans I am critical of, do you not think I might get some attention from the secret service? How about when people on my "target map" start getting shot/killed? Why does Palin get a pass on this?

And I agree, BR's post didn't make sense. But I think he was referring to non-politician Republicans. Look at news boards, and with a few exceptions, pretty much all the self-declared conservatives or Republicans are either staying silent on this or criticizing Liberals for blaming this tragedy on politics.

I was referring to the conservatives on this board.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #16 of 286
Also, came across this picture. Pretty much sums it up.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #17 of 286
Thread Starter 
One might have thought that Palin would have at the very least taken down her crosshairs map, but no. It's still up.

I wonder if the shooter would have been legally sold this gun before the governor changed the law to allow them to be bought with no background checks or to have taken classes. The shooter was thrown out of college due to his mental state. Other students have said he was strange and talked in incomprehensible ways. Why aren't Repubs joining up the dots?
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #18 of 286
As I said...

"...with a few exceptions, pretty much all the self-declared conservatives or Republicans are either staying silent on this or criticizing Liberals for blaming this tragedy on politics."
post #19 of 286
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

As I said...

"...with a few exceptions, pretty much all the self-declared conservatives or Republicans are either staying silent on this or criticizing Liberals for blaming this tragedy on politics."


There's now a petition to have Palin indicted. We may never know the full extent of the harm called by Palin's facebook page and rhetoric but at least we can try and make those guilty of fanning the flames of violence think twice in the future.

Here's the petition- http://www.PetitionOnline.com/IndictSP/petition.html
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #20 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

This looks bad- http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_806243.html


I wonder what Sarah Palin's thoughts are? This in the Guardian-

"Palin had published a "target map" on her website using images of gun sights to identify 20 House Democrats, including Giffords, for backing the new health care law. At an event in 2009 which was similar to the one Giffords was holding today, a protester was removed by police when his pistol fell to the supermarket floor."
~http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...tucson-arizona

Sarah Palin has not yet offered an apology.

To bad is was not Palin who got shot instead of this woman Gabrielle Giffords.I hate Palin in my heart.
post #21 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

There's now a petition to have Palin indicted. We may never know the full extent of the harm called by Palin's facebook page and rhetoric but at least we can try and make those guilty of fanning the flames of violence think twice in the future.

Here's the petition- http://www.PetitionOnline.com/IndictSP/petition.html

Anyone who can make the logical leaps to somehow connect this shooting to Sarah Palin sounds just as incoherent, troubled, and mentally deranged as the person who engaged in this shooting.

What do you think is being posted here but rhetoric? If rhetoric is a crime, indict yourself first.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #22 of 286
Thread Starter 
The girl who was killed was born on 9/11 (as was one of my nieces).

If this doesn't start to get repubs and some on the left too to start speaking out about the danger of inciting violence intended or otherwise, perhaps nothing will.

"Christina Taylor Green, nine-year-old victim in today's Tucson shootings, once was an infant designated to be a "Face of Hope" by virtue of her birth on September 11, 2001. She was one of the children born on 9/11, reports Tucson blogger David Abie Morales. And she is thereby featured in the book by Christine Pisera Naman, entitled Faces of Hope, Babies Born on 9/11, dedicated to all the mothers who gave birth and to their babies born on the day the World Trade Towers in New York City were taken down by an act of terrorism.Ironically, today her life ended in violence, as she fell under the attack of a gunman at a political function at a supermarket. A neighbor was going to the Giffords event today, the Arizona Republic reports, and invited Christina along simply because she thought she would enjoy it, according to Christina's uncle, Greg Segalini. Christina was newly elected to the student council at her school."
~ http://www.allvoices.com/contributed...a-gunmans-hand
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

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post #23 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

The girl who was killed was born on 9/11 (as was one of my nieces).

If this doesn't start to get repubs and some on the left too to start speaking out about the danger of inciting violence intended or otherwise, perhaps nothing will.

By definition this incident is the exception. It is not the rule. Asking everyone to monitor speech, give up speech or claims that speech someone promotes, proves or incites the exception is bad logic and reasoning.

It's nothing more than running the numbers. Someone today will buy a beer and then go shoot someone. Thus by this reasoning, beer incites violence. Someone else will buy a pop tart, eat breakfast cereal, or watch Sponge Bob before going off to shoot someone. No one should demand apologies or actions against any of those items as well.

It's sad that this happened. The only thing sadder is watching people try to use the senseless deaths of others for political gain or as a pawn in a game of political bloodsport. The man that did this was clearly mentally disturbed. The parties that will try to use this for gain or action, are clearly much worse.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #24 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

By definition this incident is the exception. It is not the rule. Asking everyone to monitor speech, give up speech or claims that speech someone promotes, proves or incites the exception is bad logic and reasoning.

It's nothing more than running the numbers. Someone today will buy a beer and then go shoot someone. Thus by this reasoning, beer incites violence. Someone else will buy a pop tart, eat breakfast cereal, or watch Sponge Bob before going off to shoot someone. No one should demand apologies or actions against any of those items as well.

It's sad that this happened. The only thing sadder is watching people try to use the senseless deaths of others for political gain or as a pawn in a game of political bloodsport. The man that did this was clearly mentally disturbed. The parties that will try to use this for gain or action, are clearly much worse.

Nick, if today you posted a map online and put crosshairs or body targets all over it, labeled with the names of prominent politicians, you can bet the Secret Service will be knocking on your door. Try it!

It's not free speech. And it shouldn't be selectively enforced.
post #25 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Nick, if today you posted a map online and put crosshairs or body targets all over it, labeled with the names of prominent politicians, you can bet the Secret Service will be knocking on your door. Try it!

It's not free speech. And it shouldn't be selectively enforced.

It is free speech.
  • What
  • do
  • we
  • call
  • these?

Bullet points. Did anyone who uses them just call for and incite violence?

Also why are the rhetorical claims only one way? Why is all the baiting, hating and heated rhetoric by government officials against their own constituents suddenly given a free pass? Who was it that labeled anyone who stood against specific aspects of his agenda as "enemies?" That's right it was President Obama. So if one wants to be illogical and irrational at least take off the blinders and make it a two lane insanity highway.

Also you don't really know this shooters politics. Considering the stuff that has come up so far has him as hostile towards religion, reading the communist manifesto and being busted for drug paraphernalia, you might want to narrow that broadbrush a bit.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #26 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

It's not free speech. And it shouldn't be selectively enforced.

I didn't like Palin's map, which was clearly gun sights, with the congressman already saying they were retiring noted in blood red, but.....

that is most certainly free speech, and is most certainly protected from government suppression. It doesn't come anywhere close to meeting the legal definition of incitement.
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post #27 of 286
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDi...layer_embedded

If anything good can come of this, it is that Palin is finished. Is she an accessory to attempted Murder?
post #28 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcUK View Post

Good!


I don't doubt Palin's intention that these are gun sites, however the USGS does use the same symbol in their Provisional Maps as the Principal Point...which has something to do with aerial photography...

...lower right corner Principal Point**
http://www.mapcenter.com/?section=usgs_map_symbols

or @

USGS Map Symbols
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #29 of 286


I dont think "Its time to take a stand" leaves much to debate.

How interesting, Hello NoahJ....
post #30 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcUK View Post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDi...layer_embedded

If anything good can come of this, it is that Palin is finished. Is she an accessory to attempted Murder?

If anything good can come of this? Something good can come of anything if people only let it. However in this case, reading these posts by people of a certain political persuasion, nothing good will come of it. It will only be used to further restrict freedom.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #31 of 286
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

By definition this incident is the exception. It is not the rule. Asking everyone to monitor speech, give up speech or claims that speech someone promotes, proves or incites the exception is bad logic and reasoning.

It's nothing more than running the numbers. Someone today will buy a beer and then go shoot someone. Thus by this reasoning, beer incites violence. Someone else will buy a pop tart, eat breakfast cereal, or watch Sponge Bob before going off to shoot someone. No one should demand apologies or actions against any of those items as well.

It's sad that this happened. The only thing sadder is watching people try to use the senseless deaths of others for political gain or as a pawn in a game of political bloodsport. The man that did this was clearly mentally disturbed. The parties that will try to use this for gain or action, are clearly much worse.

Perhaps you should consider volunteering as a spokesman for Palin, you seem to make about an equally intelligent case for her as an aide for her has done-

"On March 23, she posted an announcement about the campaign on her Facebook page, which was accompanied by an image of her targeted districts. The districts all had crosshairs over them, which are usually associated with gun sights.
But SarahPAC staffer Rebecca Mansour, who has been tweeting in defense of her boss since the tragedy took place, is stating that the crosshairs were never intended to be gun sights.
"We never ever, ever intended it to be gun sights," she said in an interview with talk radio host Tammy Bruce Saturday. "It was simply crosshairs like you'd see on maps." Bruce suggested that they could, in fact, be seen as "surveyor's symbols." Mansour added that "it never occurred to us that anybody would consider it violent" and called any attempts to politicize the Arizona tragedy "repulsive."
The suggestion that the symbols were related to guns seemed to come, however, from Palin herself. On March 23, Palin tweeted to her supporters a note about the aforementioned Facebook message, writing, "Commonsense Conservatives & lovers of America: 'Don't Retreat, Instead - RELOAD!' Pls see my Facebook page." And as Politico's Jonathan Martin points out, in November Palin boasted about defeating 18 of the 20 members on her "bullseye" list."
~ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_806375.html
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #32 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcUK View Post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tTDi...layer_embedded

If anything good can come of this, it is that Palin is finished. Is she an accessory to attempted Murder?

NO....it would be a long stretch. Maybe her actions and rhetoric were irresponsible, but it does not raise to the level of being an accessory to the crime. If you go to a ball game and the ref makes a bad call, you yell kill the ref and someone goes up the ref and shoots him/her...are you an accessory? You had no knowledge that someone would act on your suggestion nor did you have any contact with the person.
Quote:
In Criminal Law, contributing to or aiding in the commission of a crime. One who, without being present at the commission of an offense, becomes guilty of such offense, not as a chief actor, but as a participant, as by command, advice, instigation, or concealment; either before or after the fact or commission.

An accessory must knowingly promote or contribute to the crime. In other words, she or he must aid or encourage the offense deliberately, not accidentally. The accessory may withdraw from the crime by denouncing the plans, refusing to assist with the crime, contacting the police, or trying to stop the crime from occurring.

Accessory: An Accessory is one who with knowledge does counsel, command, encourage, or aid in the perpetration of a crime.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #33 of 286
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

I don't doubt Palin's intention that these are gun sites, however the USGS does use the same symbol in their Provisional Maps as the Principal Point...which has something to do with aerial photography...

...lower right corner Principal Point**
http://www.mapcenter.com/?section=usgs_map_symbols

or @

USGS Map Symbols

That is not the same symbol.
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #34 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I was referring to the conservatives on this board.

That is beyond pathetic. You and Hands both start threads with ridiculous premises, and then you ask why the conservatives on the board aren't playing your stupid games?

The connection to Palin is downright ridiculous. I agree with Midwinter's assessment entirely, but if we're going to play games, let's note that he's a liberal, anti-God, flag-burning nutbar who reads the communist manifesto. The idea that he's motivated by Palin or Beck or the Tea Party is a lie. And you all know it.

This is precisely why people hate liberals. They see no further than the political scoreboard, and are willing to use the most terrible tragedies as fodder for political gamesmanship.

There were a million ways to start a thread on this tragedy with respect and serious discussion on political discourse in the U.S.
It's a pity the liberals on this board aren't willing to engage in stuff like that.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #35 of 286
As far as the accused is concerned, he was obviously "mentally unbalanced"... but is that the whole story? The suspect has invoked his 5th Amendment rights.. but what is the point of his "rearranging the deck-chairs in the Titanic" in this instance? He was caught "red handed" committing the crime and any court will convict him of multiple 1st degree murder, regardless of whether he further "self incriminates" during questioning. Why is he not talking, if not to protect any possible accomplice(s) etc., in exchange for something we know not what?

In court, his lawyer(s) might claim "temporary insanity" at the time of the shooting... but if so, what would have been the factor that caused "temporary insanity" enough to premeditatively and deliberately arm himself with intent to use, then attend a rally, then kill 6 and hurt 12? He sure became rapidly "sane" enough, immediately after his arrest, to claim his Constitutional rights.

The FBI is investigating to determine if there was an accomplice (according to all the mainstream media reports to date).

Motivation? Who will benefit from such a shooting, and the inevitable fall-out?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #36 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerald apple View Post

To bad is was not Palin who got shot instead of this woman Gabrielle Giffords.I hate Palin in my heart.

That's horrible. No matter how much I think Palin is a terrible person and awful for our country, I do NOT want ANYONE shot.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #37 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

That is beyond pathetic. You and Hands both start threads with ridiculous premises, and then you ask why the conservatives on the board aren't playing your stupid games?

The connection to Palin is downright ridiculous. I agree with Midwinter's assessment entirely, but if we're going to play games, let's note that he's a liberal, anti-God, flag-burning nutbar who reads the communist manifesto. The idea that he's motivated by Palin or Beck or the Tea Party is a lie. And you all know it.

This is precisely why people hate liberals. They see no further than the political scoreboard, and are willing to use the most terrible tragedies as fodder for political gamesmanship.

There were a million ways to start a thread on this tragedy with respect and serious discussion on political discourse in the U.S.
It's a pity the liberals on this board aren't willing to engage in stuff like that.

That's rich coming from you.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #38 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

As far as the accused is concerned, he was obviously "mentally unbalanced"... but is that the whole story? The suspect has invoked his 5th Amendment rights.. but what is the point of his "rearranging the deck-chairs in the Titanic" in this instance? He was caught "red handed" committing the crime and any court will convict him of multiple 1st degree murder, regardless of whether he further "self incriminates" during questioning. Why is he not talking, if not to protect any possible accomplice(s) etc., in exchange for something we know not what?

In court, his lawyer(s) might claim "temporary insanity" at the time of the shooting... but if so, what would have been the factor that caused "temporary insanity" enough to premeditatively and deliberately arm himself with intent to use, then attend a rally, then kill 6 and hurt 12? He sure became rapidly "sane" enough, immediately after his arrest, to claim his Constitutional rights.

The FBI is investigating to determine if there was an accomplice (according to all the mainstream media reports to date).

Motivation? Who will benefit from such a shooting, and the inevitable fall-out?

Well if you lived in Tucson, AZ you'd never make it to the Jury room.

Since the crime was against two Federal Employees, it will probably go to the Feds. He can also be tried in State court on the other counts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital...ral_government
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #39 of 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by br View Post

that's horrible. No matter how much i think palin is a terrible person and awful for our country, i do not want anyone shot.

Ditto
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #40 of 286
We need to remove the violent rhetoric from our political debates. Nobody should be bringing guns to rallies. Nobody should be talking about "second amendment solutions." Nobody should be putting gun sights on maps of opposing candidates. Nobody who did the previous should be telling her supporters to RELOAD.

Whether this shooter was motivated by the above or not, it doesn't actually matter. Our political discourse in this country has become far, far too violent and aggressive.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
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