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Gartner: Apple takes 9.7% share in Q4, grows Mac sales by 23%

post #1 of 68
Thread Starter 
Gartner has released its own estimates on US and global PC markets for Q4 and 2010, which paint a slightly better picture for Apple and a slightly worse outlook for other PC makers, compared to its market research rival IDC. Both continue to ignore the iPad.

Like IDC's parallel report on the US and global PC markets, Gartner subtly cited the iPad as the reason of weak Q4 sales, but similarly included it among "media tablets," despite the iPad representing 95 percent of the "tablet market."

Gartner was unique in also attempting to blame the contracting US PC market on "other consumer electronic (CE) devices, such as game consoles," despite the fact that 2010 marked a year of notably sluggish games sales that prompted aggressive cuts in hardware prices that still did little to boost game console hardware sales.

Netbooks come and go

Like IDC, Gartner excluded Apple's iPad from its PCs sales, while continuing to count low end mini notebooks (aka netbooks). In 2008, Gartner said Acer and Asus both "had a strong focus and acted quickly in the mini-notebook segment," which at the time was representing huge growth potential in an otherwise weak market.

In 2009, Gartner reported that Acer's netbook sales had allowed it to claim over 60 percent growth in PC sales, with the firm predicting that netbooks would grow from 10 percent of all PCs sold to 12 percent in 2010.

Instead, growth of netbooks crashed last year as the iPad was introduced. That reversal in the PC market, usually attributed to iPad sales, was explained away in Gartner's most recent report as a shift toward replacement purchases in the "professional market."

This phrasing enabled Gartner to explain why netbook makers were "facing challenges" while premium priced vendors were growing rapidly, even while ignoring iPad sales and excluding them entirely from its PC sales figures.

iPad: the elephant in the corner

Under its published charts, Gartner notes that its "data includes desk-based PCs, mobile PCs, including mini-notebooks but not media tablet such as the iPad." Apple sells more iPads than all of its Macintosh computers combined, so including iPad tablets within PC sales would dramatically boost the company's market share at the expense of generic PC makers, much like the balloon of netbook sales from Acer and Asus skewed the PC market in 2008 and 2009.

Neither Gartner nor IDC have explained why they gerrymander their PC sales data to exclude the iPad, even as they count limited functionality netbooks, scramble to invent non-iPad explanations for contracting growth in the PC market outside of Apple's own sales, and describe Apple's tablet as part of a distinct "media tablet" market that simply does not exist.

Gartner previously invented arbitrary definitions of "smartphone" that excluded devices from some makers (notably Palm) in order to flatter sales of Windows Mobile, formerly included PC servers (but not competing servers using non-Intel chips) in its PC sales reports to flatter Microsoft, and more recently has invented tens of millions of devices it says are probably using Android in order to dramatically skew its modern reports on the smartphone industry and fulfill its own predictions on mobile platforms.

Being in the consumer market is either good or bad

Acer, Gartner's report said, "faced challenges in the fourth quarter of 2010 due to a slowdown in the overall consumer mobile PC market. The company was impacted by a weakening mini-notebook segment. Due to a lower presence in the professional PC market, Acer could not benefit from the professional PC refresh demand."

Dell, which Gartner ranked in third place worldwide behind Acer (in contrast to IDC), was the only PC maker in the top three to grow its global PC sales in the fourth quarter, albeit by just 3.9 percent. The firm attributed this growth to Dell benefiting "from professional PC refreshes across key regions," and noted that "Dells weaker presence in the consumer segment meant the company was not affected as much as some other vendors due to disappointing holiday sales."

Gartner said Lenovo "marked the strongest year-on-year growth among the top 5 vendors [globally]. Lenovos strength was derived from the replacement purchases in the professional PC market, as well as its on-going efforts of getting into the consumer market."




Gartner's US PC sales worse than IDC reported, better than Gartner expected

In the US, Gartner reported a 6.6 percent decline in PC sales in Q4, worst than IDC's report of a 4.8 percent contraction but better than the 10 percent decline Gartner had predicted.

"US holiday sales were not fantastic for most PC vendors," wrote Gartner analyst Mikako Kitagawa, "but the professional market did show healthy growth during the quarter. Media tablets undoubtedly intensified the competition in the consumer market.

"These devices do not replace primary PCs, but they are viewed as good enough devices for these who want to have a second and third connected device for content consumption usage. Mini-notebook shipments were hit the most by the success of media tablets."

The report noted that "Gartners preliminary study shows that Toshiba and Apple were the only vendors in the top 5 to increase shipments [in the US market], as Toshibas shipments grew 14.4 percent, while Apples shipments increased 23.7 percent."

Like IDC, Gartner seemed to carefully avoid making any pointed observation of how Apple's iPad has shifted PC sales dramatically while doing nothing to slow Apple's own PC growth.

Ixnay on the padisay

Gartner's Kitagawa seemed careful not to use the word "iPad" within any direct quote in the report, using it only twice (apart from notes explaining that its PC sales numbers excluded the iPad), each time in the context of "media tablets, such as the iPad."

IDC's entire report only used the word "iPad" once, preferring instead to similarly use the phrase "media tablet" as a euphemism for iPad sales.

Gartner estimated that Apple sold 1.86 million Macs in the fourth quarter, assigning it 9.7 percent market share in the US. IDC's report gave Apple 8.7 percent of the US market in Q4, and described its Mac growth as being just 15.2 percent year over year.

post #2 of 68
Gartner vs. IDC has a vertical height issue rendering, but fine when you open the image in a separate tab.
post #3 of 68
So what did Toshiba do differently?
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
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From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
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post #4 of 68
Slow the good news down a bit Dan. The trolls can't catch their breath at this pace. They're turning blue in the face.
post #5 of 68
Appleinsider, iPads are not PCs so quit bitching about it. I'm sure it would improve the value of your Apple stock if the numbers were reported differently, but you're doing fine as it is.
post #6 of 68
Their sales reps claimed to "customize" data to help customers' marketing goals.
post #7 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel001 View Post

Appleinsider, iPads are not PCs so quit bitching about it. I'm sure it would improve the value of your Apple stock if the numbers were reported differently, but you're doing fine as it is.

You could have said the same thing about laptops when they were introduced. The only real factors I can think of that distinguish iPads from PCs are that file management is inconvenient on the iPad and you still need to connect it to a PC for updates. Otherwise it's just an arbitrary distinction. If iPad sales are impacting PC sales then they're probably fulfilling the same role.
post #8 of 68
2011 will be an interesting year for analysts. With so many tablets coming out of CES that are capable of replacing the traditional PC they will either have to include a media tablet report that is independent of the PC and smartphone stats, or they will have include them in the PC stats. Either way, itll be a change over the previous designation to include tablets that were running Windows desktop as PCs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Slow the good news down a bit Dan. The trolls can't catch their breath at this pace. They're turning blue in the face.

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post #9 of 68
My guess is that analysts will soon create a separate category for media tablets, just like smartphone market analysis is now separated from analyses on the entire mobile telephone market. Once there is a significant growing worldwide market for a product category, it'll be tracked separately, but it can't be a one-pony show. Someone other than Apple needs to ship product in quantity to make the analysis meaningful.

At some point, they may fold media tablets back into the PC category, especially if the manufacturers stop separating sales figures. But for the next several years, I think we will see media tablets as a separate product category, mostly because the growth will be exponential and the analysts need to have separate visibility on something that is rapidly changing.
post #10 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple_headlines View Post

2011 will be another good year for Apple.

That, I agree with.
post #11 of 68
I'm interested in hearing from people who would claim that the iPad is not a PC. I'd like to know how exactly you can say it isn't.

PC stands for Personal Computer. How is the iPad not a Personal Computer? It is perhaps one of the most personal computers ever made!
post #12 of 68
The technical definition and market definition are two separate beasts. Who picks the market definition? Consumers really.

The analysts will probably use the market definition.

It's the same with fruits and vegetables. What's a tomato? It's a fruit if you use the botanical definition. It's a vegetable if you use the common household/culinary definition. If you go to a grocery store, where do you expect to find tomatoes? With the oranges or with the carrots?
post #13 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

My guess is that analysts will soon create a separate category for media tablets, just like smartphone market analysis is now separated from analyses on the entire mobile telephone market. Once there is a significant growing worldwide market for a product category, it'll be tracked separately, but it can't be a one-pony show. Someone other than Apple needs to ship product in quantity to make the analysis meaningful.

At some point, they may fold media tablets back into the PC category, especially if the manufacturers stop separating sales figures. But for the next several years, I think we will see media tablets as a separate product category, mostly because the growth will be exponential and the analysts need to have separate visibility on something that is rapidly changing.

That sounds reasonable and follows what I think will happen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by REC View Post

I'm interested in hearing from people who would claim that the iPad is not a PC. I'd like to know how exactly you can say it isn't.

PC stands for Personal Computer. How is the iPad not a Personal Computer? It is perhaps one of the most personal computers ever made!

Its not a PC to Gartner and IDC because they dont define it as such. It that simple It doesnt mean that its not a PC by other criteria, it simply means that how the qualify it. Did we ever categorize PDAs as PCs even though they could do a lot more than the first PCs? I dont think so. The iPhone and iPod Touch would probably pass all the same criteria most here would have for the iPad, but I think most here would be less inclined to say that the iPhone or Touch is an PC.

Lets use LTE, Verizon and the ITU as an example. Verizons 2nd generation network is CDMA and their 3rd generation network is CDMA2000/EV-DO, but I hear all the time that Verizon shouldnt allowed to refer to their 4th generation network overhaul as 4G' even though they dont say its 4G as defined by the ITU. Note that ITU just last month relaxed some of their requirement as to what 4G so these delimiters can move.

I see your point and I agree with it, I just dont agree with a single stringent definition that all must abide by.
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post #14 of 68
a person wonder what would happen to market share if they decided to tackle the low price range segment. Is it possible to have both the cake and eat it too?
post #15 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

The only real factors I can think of that distinguish iPads from PCs are that file management is inconvenient on the iPad and you still need to connect it to a PC for updates. Otherwise it's just an arbitrary distinction.

It is arbitrary, but it's still worth making the distinction. Functionally, the iPad has more in common with an iPod touch than with a desktop PC or a laptop. Lumping them together doesn't achieve anything other than making Apple fans feel pleased about their burgeoning market share.

Quote:
Originally Posted by REC View Post

PC stands for Personal Computer. How is the iPad not a Personal Computer? It is perhaps one of the most personal computers ever made!

On that basis a digital watch is also a PC.
post #16 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary54 View Post

a person wonder what would happen to market share if they decided to tackle the low price range segment. Is it possible to have both the cake and eat it too?

The margins would plummet and shareholders would not be pleased. Apple is very profitable because they choose not to compete in the low-margin markets.
post #17 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel001 View Post

It is arbitrary, but it's still worth making the distinction. Functionally, the iPad has more in common with an iPod touch than with a desktop PC or a laptop. Lumping them together doesn't achieve anything other than making Apple fans feel pleased about their burgeoning market share.

On that basis a digital watch is also a PC.

Wikipedia defines the iPad as a PC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_computer

"A personal computer (PC) is any general-purpose computer whose size, capabilities, and original sales price make it useful for individuals, and which is intended to be operated directly by an end-user with no intervening computer operator. PCs include any type of computer that is used in a "personal" manner."

and

"A personal computer may be a desktop computer, a laptop, a tablet PC, or a handheld PC"

Good enough for me.
post #18 of 68
Again, you people are ignoring the fact that there is a difference between a technical definition and a market definition.

Market analysts don't use the computer science definition of PCs. They use the market definition of PCs, what ordinary people think.

Same thing with people who analyze grocery store sales. They don't classify tomatoes as fruits because that's the botanical definition. They use the consumer definition of vegetable. How a botanist classifies a tomato is irrelevant to market analysts. Hell, if you go to a place like a nursery, you will find tomato seedlings with the other vegetables.

Talk about the technical definition until you are blue in the face; the market will have its own ideas.

(I will also take the opportunity to point out that Apple itself does not refer to the iPad as a computer. They refer to it as a device.)
post #19 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

Again, you people are ignoring the fact that there is a difference between a technical definition and a market definition.

Market analysts don't use the computer science definition of PCs. They use the market definition of PCs, what ordinary people think.

Same thing with people who analyze grocery store sales. They don't classify tomatoes as fruits because that's the botanical definition. They use the consumer definition of vegetable. How a botanist classifies a tomato is irrelevant to market analysts. Hell, if you go to a place like a nursery, you will find tomato seedlings with the other vegetables.

Talk about the technical definition until you are blue in the face; the market will have its own ideas.

(I will also take the opportunity to point out that Apple itself does not refer to the iPad as a computer. They refer to it as a device.)

Well said.


PS: Are Macs PCs?
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post #20 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

PS: Are Macs PCs?

Uh, sure, when you boot Windows in Parallels, etc.

post #21 of 68
How does it even matter that analysts are skewing numbers or deliberately giving credence to one device and not another? Apple is selling its products regardless of what analysts say or don't say. In reality, the iPad is likely cutting into PC sales. Who are these analysts trying to fool? Themselves? The fact is that buying consumers are the ones that have the final say. They're not looking at any charts to decide what product to buy. If a company lies and says they sold twice as many products as another company, they'll know that it didn't happen that way and won't have the actual money to back up those claims even if they fudge their accounts. In the long run, their lies and deceptions will be discovered when they start shutting down production and laying off employees. Analysts not telling their clients the true picture is really cheating them.

So they don't see the iPad as a true personal computer because of this or that. The iPad costs from $499 up to $829 which certainly overlaps a lot of Windows PCs prices. When a consumer goes out and buys an iPad instead of a Windows PC in that price range, the money still counts no matter what they call it or what neat little category an analyst puts it in. Apple makes money. Revenue is revenue no matter what category the product falls into. The consumer is happy. Apple shareholders are happy. Screw the analysts. Their obfuscations count for nothing.
post #22 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That sounds reasonable and follows what I think will happen.




It’s not a PC to Gartner and IDC because they don’t define it as such. It’ that simple It doesn’t mean that it’s not a “PC” by other criteria, it simply means that how the qualify it. Did we ever categorize PDAs as “PCs” even though they could do a lot more than the first “PCs”? I don’t think so. The iPhone and iPod Touch would probably pass all the same criteria most here would have for the iPad, but I think most here would be less inclined to say that the iPhone or Touch is an “PC”.

Let’s use LTE, Verizon and the ITU as an example. Verizon’s 2nd generation network is CDMA and their 3rd generation network is CDMA2000/EV-DO, but I hear all the time that Verizon shouldn’t allowed to refer to their 4th generation network overhaul as ‘4G' even though they don’t say it’s 4G as defined by the ITU. Note that ITU just last month relaxed some of their requirement as to what ‘4G’ so these delimiters can move.

I see your point and I agree with it, I just don’t agree with a single stringent definition that all must abide by.

I imagine that the labeling will change when they don't need to be tethered for backups and OS updates and upgrades. Until then, they are isolated when no "computer" is available. I would love to be able to use a portable HDD or memory card to back up my stuff on my iPad. And, i'd love it if we could update and upgrade the OS directly through the wireless connection, or connect to the network.

If we could do everything with our iPads that we can do with our Macbooks and MacBook pro's, except use iOS instead, then they will call them computers. I don't mind them not being called that yet. Maybe someday.
post #23 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by REC View Post

Wikipedia defines the iPad as a PC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_computer

There are clear differences between an iPad and the established definition of a PC, and the market research companies know this. The current iteration of a Wikipedia article isn't going to change that.
post #24 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

You could have said the same thing about laptops when they were introduced. The only real factors I can think of that distinguish iPads from PCs are that file management is inconvenient on the iPad and you still need to connect it to a PC for updates. Otherwise it's just an arbitrary distinction. If iPad sales are impacting PC sales then they're probably fulfilling the same role.

To me the major distinguishing factor is the operating system. Notebooks and even netbooks run the same OS and applications as desktop computers. Tablets run smart phone operating systems that offer significantly fewer features. I think that justifies their exclusion from stats regarding sales of computers.

On the other hand nothing justifies Gartner's refusal to tell the truth about iPads. Many people are finding that their mobile needs are met by a smart phone or tablet so they have no need for a netbook.

So instead of trying to massage the numbers to make the PC manufacturers look good they need to state the truth: some of the market for traditional computers is gone, never to return.
post #25 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I imagine that the labeling will change when they don't need to be tethered for backups and OS updates and upgrades. Until then, they are isolated when no "computer" is available. I would love to be able to use a portable HDD or memory card to back up my stuff on my iPad. And, i'd love it if we could update and upgrade the OS directly through the wireless connection, or connect to the network.

If we could do everything with our iPads that we can do with our Macbooks and MacBook pro's, except use iOS instead, then they will call them computers. I don't mind them not being called that yet. Maybe someday.

Initial usage without first connecting to iTunes.
HDD support (which I want anyway for the Apple Home Server)
External display support.
Small, OTA updates .

I think all of these will eventually come, but I like the careful stepping Apple is doing. I like the focus on specific features before progressing.

PS: At CES there was one pretty cool phone that could also connect up to be PC replacement when placed in its dock. That concept might always reside in Sci-Fi. My reasoning is the HW to do that has been fast enough for years, and yet we dont do that because the traditional setups keep dropping in relative price while offering a lot more in terms of features and performance so were reaching for something thats always ahead of us.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bregalad View Post

Tablets run smart phone operating systems that offer significantly fewer features.

I agree with your overall statement, but not at the remark that the iPad is just a smartphone OS. Remember that Apple made Mac OS X into iOS by first working on a tablet, not a smartphone, and that iOS for iPad a display I/O that was designed specifically for it. Its no more a smartphone OS as iOS for iPhone is anymore a tablet OS.
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post #26 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Initial usage without first connecting to iTunes.
HDD support (which I want anyway for the Apple Home Server)
External display support.
Small, OTA updates .

I think all of these will eventually come, but I like the careful stepping Apple is doing. I like the focus on specific features before progressing.

PS: At CES there was one pretty cool phone that could also connect up to be PC replacement when placed in its dock. That concept might always reside in Sci-Fi. My reasoning is the HW to do that has been fast enough for years, and yet we dont do that because the traditional setups keep dropping in relative price while offering a lot more in terms of features and performance so were reaching for something thats always ahead of us.

If you let them set it up for you, it could be said that you don't need to use itunes for inital setup. But that would be cheating.

External display support is sorta half way here.

I'd like all updates/upgrades to be available over the air, or through the mythological network connector.

There was a company at CES that is offering a small external HDD, or SSD that allows files to be moved to and from it from the iPad. I didn't bookmark it, though I meant to. I don't know how it works, or how well. But if it does work, then it's a major product, and I hope it gets some bigger publicity. If I can find the link, I'll put it here.
post #27 of 68
I found it! This looks interesting. The price is right.

http://www.ipodnn.com/articles/11/01...b.per.sd.card/
post #28 of 68
So here is an interesting thought... has Apple reached the tipping point yet? Or is that yet to come?

Is there a point in the near future, say 10-15% share, where Apple's growth is going to explode and significantly alter the balance of power in the PC market?

If I were a PC manufacturer I would be very freaked out by this prospect.
post #29 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNSF View Post

So here is an interesting thought... has Apple reached the tipping point yet? Or is that yet to come?

Is there a point in the near future, say 10-15% share, where Apple's growth is going to explode and significantly alter the balance of power in the PC market?

If I were a PC manufacturer I would be very freaked out by this prospect.

10% USA is a psychological barrier, but I don't see it affecting sales. Frankly, I thought we were there already. These numbers seem too low.

But this all depends on whether Apple can maintain the same 25 - 35% increase in Mac sales for the next several years. If they get to 15%, and sales are 30% when the industry is at 10% would mean that marketshare will pop to 17%. The next year it could go to a bit over 19%, and so on. But that depends on Apple maintaining that growth and the rest of the industry maintaining theirs.
post #30 of 68
So, what exactly are these reports? They are for industry insiders. What do those insiders want to learn from these reports? They want to know what their customers are buying, and if people are buying an iPad instead of a netbook, then that is something they want to track and understand. People weren't buying PDAs as laptop replacements, but a segment of the population is surely buying iPads instead of a 2nd or 3rd computer. Excluding the impact of iPads makes the report less meaningful.

Just looking at the data they supply and knowing nothing about tablets and the iPad, you'd totally misunderstand what is happening in the computing marketplace, and THAT's why tablets and iPads need to be included. Reports are meant to be informative, not obfuscating.
post #31 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

10% USA is a psychological barrier, but I don't see it affecting sales. Frankly, I thought we were there already. These numbers seem too low.

Apple's share of the consumer/retail market in the US is now over 20%, which is why it might seem like these overall numbers are low. They're diluted by enterprise sales, where Apple trails.

Quote:
But this all depends on whether Apple can maintain the same 25 - 35% increase in Mac sales for the next several years. If they get to 15%, and sales are 30% when the industry is at 10% would mean that marketshare will pop to 17%. The next year it could go to a bit over 19%, and so on. But that depends on Apple maintaining that growth and the rest of the industry maintaining theirs.

Apple has had impressive growth, but I think they could grow even faster in the future. The biggest risk I see is the PC market in general. If the market is cannibalized by mobile sales (tablets and phones) then I can see flat or slowing growth. However, I don't see any other major risk factors. Windows 7 clearly isn't slowing Apple's growth and there isn't anything new on the horizon from PC manufacturers.
post #32 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Its not a PC to Gartner and IDC because they dont define it as such. It that simple It doesnt mean that its not a PC by other criteria, it simply means that how the qualify it...

I seem to recall Steve Jobs called the iPad "post PC" or something like that when he introduced it. It's not the same as a PC, but that's what makes it great.
post #33 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNSF View Post

Apple's share of the consumer/retail market in the US is now over 20%, which is why it might seem like these overall numbers are low. They're diluted by enterprise sales, where Apple trails.

I'm talking about overall sales. By my math, it should be close to 11%
post #34 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNSF View Post

So here is an interesting thought... has Apple reached the tipping point yet? Or is that yet to come?

Is there a point in the near future, say 10-15% share, where Apple's growth is going to explode and significantly alter the balance of power in the PC market?

If I were a PC manufacturer I would be very freaked out by this prospect.

Apple has already significantly altered the balance of profitability in the PC market. They are walking away with the lion's share of the industry's profits.

The PC manufacturers need to worry more about other devices encroaching on traditional PC sales. AMD's CEO just resigned because he was unable to respond to the threat of mobile devices.

CES was full of tablets, hundreds, all wannabee iPad killers. How many will make it to market? How many will become credible competitors to the iPad?

I think this is the year when we will really see how much the iPad is a game changer. It has irrevocably altered the way I see all of my computing devices. It won't reply a primary PC, but it can easily replace a 2nd, 3rd or 4th computer in a household. I use my Mac far less today than a few months ago.
post #35 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I found it! This looks interesting. The price is right.

http://www.ipodnn.com/articles/11/01...b.per.sd.card/

First: Thanks for the link melgross! This device looks perfect for a number of my clients.

We're rolling out our sales people with the iPhone first, and when the iPad2 comes out. A few people already have the iPad, and this looks like the "missing link" for us all, such as when they stop by my office and I want to drop presentation material(s) and designs directly, rather than through email or Dropbox.

BTW: I said it before in a different thread recently, but again, I think these analysts and their numbers are seriously skewed and can NOT be taken seriously.

First and foremost, I want "consumer vs. enterprise" break downs.

Second: they're going to have to except the fact that the iPad is going to be the leader and standard-bearer in the "tablet" category, and have a huge lead over any individual producer of Android, WebOS, or even Win7 devices. Regardless, this category also needs to be broken down "consumer vs. enterprise".

It appears they absolutely hate that fact, just as much as they hate to break down the numbers based on individual smart-phones vs. iPhone. Instead, lumping ALL Android devices together against 1 phone.

And I can tell you this fact from where I'm standing: the iPhone, and the iPad1 and future iPad2, has cost Acer and Toshiba almost 100 laptop sales in my circles alone (Q4-2010 going forward).

I just made a presentation to my largest client this last weekend that I alluded to in another longish post... and they are freaking wild with excitement and can't wait to get going with the iPad and our new CRM and Briefing Analysis apps, among others. iPhone users are rolling as we speak... and I have the rest on a short leash waiting patiently for iPad2.

Any analyst that doesn't pin the iOS and/or Android, WebOS, Win7, etc tablet explosion against future PC desktop/laptop sales, is delusional diplomatically speaking... and a plain idiotic BSer and in plain English... or Emoticon.
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post #36 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNSF View Post

Apple's share of the consumer/retail market in the US is now over 20%, which is why it might seem like these overall numbers are low. They're diluted by enterprise sales, where Apple trails.



Apple has had impressive growth, but I think they could grow even faster in the future. The biggest risk I see is the PC market in general. If the market is cannibalized by mobile sales (tablets and phones) then I can see flat or slowing growth. However, I don't see any other major risk factors. Windows 7 clearly isn't slowing Apple's growth and there isn't anything new on the horizon from PC manufacturers.

@TNSF - where did you find those numbers? I've Googled, but can't find anything really relevant, Also, I would like to see numbers broken down by world regions, i.e. NA, Euro-zone, SA, etc. Have a good link for me?
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #37 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

First: Thanks for the link melgross! This device looks perfect for a number of my clients.

We're rolling out our sales people with the iPhone first, and when the iPad2 comes out. A few people already have the iPad, and this looks like the "missing link" for us all, such as when they stop by my office and I want to drop presentation material(s) and designs directly, rather than through email or Dropbox.

BTW: I said it before in a different thread recently, but again, I think these analysts and their numbers are seriously skewed and can NOT be taken seriously.

First and foremost, I want "consumer vs. enterprise" break downs.

Second: they're going to have to except the fact that the iPad is going to be the leader and standard-bearer in the "tablet" category, and have a huge lead over any individual producer of Android, WebOS, or even Win7 devices. Regardless, this category also needs to be broken down "consumer vs. enterprise".

It appears they absolutely hate that fact, just as much as they hate to break down the numbers based on individual smart-phones vs. iPhone. Instead, lumping ALL Android devices together against 1 phone.

And I can tell you this fact from where I'm standing: the iPhone, and the iPad1 and future iPad2, has cost Acer and Toshiba almost 100 laptop sales in my circles alone (Q4-2010 going forward).

I just made a presentation to my largest client this last weekend that I alluded to in another longish post... and they are freaking wild with excitement and can't wait to get going with the iPad and our new CRM and Briefing Analysis apps, among others. iPhone users are rolling as we speak... and I have the rest on a short leash waiting patiently for iPad2.

Any analyst that doesn't pin the iOS and/or Android, WebOS, Win7, etc tablet explosion against future PC desktop/laptop sales, is delusional diplomatically speaking... and a plain idiotic BSer and in plain English... or Emoticon.

I just ordered one. Since it uses "G" rather than "N" for WiFi in this first model, I'll be using it with USB. But I've got several male female USB cables. So I'll take an 18" one and use that. I get a bit nervous having something large directly connected to the socket.

The iPad is being used in business in large ways already, with several buying up to 12,000 to one time, and planning to double that number this year. It's amazing, really.

Lots of links, but I'll give a few;

http://www.informationweek.com/news/...yText=&isPrev=

http://www.informationweek.com/news/...yText=&isPrev=
http://www.electronista.com/articles...mping.in.2011/
post #38 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

@TNSF - where did you find those numbers? I've Googled, but can't find anything really relevant, Also, I would like to see numbers broken down by world regions, i.e. NA, Euro-zone, SA, etc. Have a good link for me?

I'll give you one, though Apple has published a number of figures for worldwide sales.

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2008/04/...ow-21-percent/
post #39 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I just ordered one. Since it uses "G" rather than "N" for WiFi in this first model, I'll be using it with USB. But I've got several male female USB cables. So I'll take an 18" one and use that. I get a bit nervous having something large directly connected to the socket.

The iPad is being used in business in large ways already, with several buying up to 12,000 to one time, and planning to double that number this year. It's amazing, really.

Lots of links, but I'll give a few;

http://www.informationweek.com/news/...yText=&isPrev=

http://www.informationweek.com/news/...yText=&isPrev=
http://www.electronista.com/articles...mping.in.2011/

Thanks for the links MG! The electronista I have as PDF here already. infoweek has been added to my ever growing list of "follow" pages.

I also had a passing second thought re: hanging the brick off of the iPad directly. Thanks for a nice solution if it becomes a problem.

Would also have preferred N instead of G; maybe in v2, but still, pretty neat device.

Over the weekend I was trying to stay concentrated on my project, and still staying up to date on what was going on at CES. I must admit, the Moto Atrix "idea" was not all that bad, but we're still staying focused with iOS devices. Enterprise deployment is really sweet stuff!
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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post #40 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I'll give you one, though Apple has published a number of figures for worldwide sales.

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2008/04/...ow-21-percent/

Thanks again for the link... but a wee bit outa date: April 1, 2008 8:46 AM

That's been my problem finding recent data as well. Maybe just have to wait a week after the year-end numbers from Apple are officially released. Because iPad really did "change everything".
Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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Knowing what you are talking about would help you understand why you are so wrong. By "Realistic" - AI Forum Member
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