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Rumor: Apple's iPhone 5 to sport new A8 processor, Qualcomm baseband - Page 2

post #41 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

I really don't understand why this matters. In what way would it improve the iOS products?

True. None of this matters until the specs show more power/speed and less battery use. From there, then Apple can add more features to iOS, which provide tools to app developers, which provide value to iOS.

But the chip is key to this. UX on these things require _snappy_ response. the more heuristics put into the response requires more processor, ideally using the same power per action as the previous experience.
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post #42 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

No it would be dual 1GHz Cortex A9, I just mean the A8 naming convention works to suggest it's dual-core vs the A4.



It wouldn't be the aqua UI though, it would be Lion's fullscreen UI. Apple doesn't wait for consumer interest either otherwise there wouldn't be an iPad right now. At the moment, the Motorola Atrix phone is the only device doing this and it's not great because the performance is sluggish. I remember back when the only real touchscreen phone before the iPhone was the LG Prada and then Apple upped the game for everyone.

It's convenient that Lion and the next iPhone will debut at the same time.

It's also convenient that Apple rolled out an app store 6 months prior to get Mac apps all curated and prepared to go onto iOS (w/ only cocoa support, no carbon, java, etc...) This was their "nice" way of getting developers to switch all apps over to using cocoa only so that they are portable to iOS and will be handled by different UIs for different situations (iPhone, iPad, ATV, Desktop). I think this year will be too early still though, but iOS 6 will be the time it will be brought forward I think, iOS 5 seems a bit early still [but I'm always open for Apple to surprise us]!
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post #43 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

The average consumer will read specs if they are presented to them and they will assume that the A9 is faster. It's not a good perception, even if it doesn't impact their buying decision.

The problem here is that people are adding to the confusion by misinterpreting and shortening the actual name of the ARM product... ARM sells application processors called "Cortex-A" There are currently four versions in the series; Cortex-A5, Cortex-A8, Cortex-A9 and Cortex-A15. They are not known as the A5, A8, A9 or A15 they are in fact "Cortex-A" models 5,8,9, and 15.

Please educate yourselves and others, and stop the spread of confusion.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #44 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:43pm
Apple's SOC is fully optimized for its specific software and hardware needs. While everyone else is using generic off the shelf SOC.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

Ok what's different about this processor VS the other ones?
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post #45 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

People aren't buying Android phones because they get excited by the latest mobile CPU, as much as tech blogs and enthusiasts like to salivate over same. They buy Android phones because they went to the Verizon store and they wanted to upgrade and that's what was there. Sure, the sales guy is right there to assure them that the more expensive choice goes to 11, but that's the case regardless of what's under the hood.

How many people give a shit, or even know, what's in the current iPhone compared to what's in the latest wonder Android phone? They care if their battery goes dry before they can get through a day, they care if video plays without dropping frames, they care if the UI feels reasonably fluid and doesn't have weird stutters and pauses that make the machine more difficult to use.

I couldn't agree more and actually I think the way Apple have done their physical stores has made specs even less interesting to the average consumer.

People can now go into the stores and expect to play with the choices available to them, and will make a decision on which feels right for them.

It's like buying a car. They have specs galore available for them, but I'll buy the one I feel drives the best in the price range I'm looking for.
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post #46 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I don't think the Cortex A8 can actually *do* dual core. Aren't all the dual core Arm chips based on the Cortex A9?

The naming is confusing, but perhaps they are striking back at all the bloggers that spent the last few years calling the iPhone 3G, "2G" (for second gen), and the 3Gs, "3G."

Yes. Cortex A8 is a single core CPU, 65nm fab and 32 bit. The Cortex A9 is 1-4 cores, 64 bit and fabricated down to a 45nm die.

http://www.arm.com/files/pdf/ARMCortexA-9Processors.pdf
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post #47 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Apple's SOC is fully optimized for its specific software and hardware needs. While everyone else is using generic off the shelf SOC.

Apple's CPU is akin to AMD's Fusion. The GPU is on the Chip with the CPU.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_A4
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post #48 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Apple's SOC is fully optimized for its specific software and hardware needs. While everyone else is using generic off the shelf SOC.

Which means no unwanted silicon. That results in smaller size, better performance, and better battery life.

It's like a custom made shirt versus something you pick up off the rack at the department store.
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post #49 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLL View Post

Perhaps that's why Apple doesn't mention the CPU in the specs? (or GPU, RAM and other things for that matter).

It's on the design page at the very least.

http://www.apple.com/iphone/design/

You're right, they try to keep the specs hidden on the iPhone so that they don't become a major purchasing consideration for most people.

I'm not going to argue this point anymore. Even if it doesn't affect too many people, it's best to avoid unnecessary mis-perceptions. I wish they didn't choose to start the name with "A" at all but I guess "I" was already taken and would have been even more confusing.
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post #50 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by OllieWallieWhiskers View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bregalad

I really don't think the next iPhone will be called iPhone 5 because it would look like a real backwards move to go from iPhone 5 in 2011 to iPhone 4G in 2012.

the should stick with the number. iPhone 4, 5, 6... the 3G really messed it up. and now the original is also called the 2G which confuses people as well.

iPhone (2007), iPhone 3G (2008), iPhone 3GS (2009), iPhone 4 (2010), iPhone 4S (2011), iPhone 4G (2012)?


Quote:
Originally Posted by macinthe408 View Post

What about a combo CDMA/GSM chip/phone? Possible? Why not? (Keep in mind that a computer smaller than the size of a room was impossible at one point in time. And it's not like it would be a quantum leap, but more like a x.x.1 update.)

its technically possible. Qualcomm recently demoed a reference model phone using Snapdragon and having GSM/HS*PA|CDMA/EVDO about the size of the iPhone. That doesnt mean all the necessary bands can be supported or the size or power efficiency is small enough for Apple.

The fact that the iPhone 4 CDMA isnt a world mode phone does show that its not the best option for Apple. Eventually, like with WiFi and Bluetooth chips, these disparate wireless chips will get small and power efficient enough to be included on one tiny chip, but its not usually the smallest devices on the market that are setting this trend. Its larger devices with more internal space and bigger batteries.

Id say that this years new iPhone will not be world mode, but I hope Im wrong.
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post #51 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

Which means no unwanted silicon. That results in smaller size, better performance, and better battery life.

It's like a custom made shirt versus something you pick up off the rack at the department store.

Which means that Apple took out the second LCD screen output on the CPU --- as Apple will never have flip phone format.
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post #52 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Don't forget the impending iPad 2.0 rumors.

Impending? Have you been in a cave the last couple of months?
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post #53 of 90
1/14/11 at 12:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

The problem here is that people are adding to the confusion by misinterpreting and shortening the actual name of the ARM product... ARM sells application processors called "Cortex-A" There are currently four versions in the series; Cortex-A5, Cortex-A8, Cortex-A9 and Cortex-A15. They are not known as the A5, A8, A9 or A15 they are in fact "Cortex-A" models 5,8,9, and 15.

Please educate yourselves and others, and stop the spread of confusion.


My original post had the term "Cortex" in it (missed the hyphen though). It's just time consuming to keep repeating that through every post.

At least try to be polite.
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post #54 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

its technically possible. Qualcomm recently demoed a reference model phone using Snapdragon and having GSM/HS*PA|CDMA/EVDO about the size of the iPhone. That doesnt mean all the necessary bands can be supported or the size or power efficiency is small enough for Apple.

The fact that the iPhone 4 CDMA isnt a world mode phone does show that its not the best option for Apple. Eventually, like with WiFi and Bluetooth chips, these disparate wireless chips will get small and power efficient enough to be included on one tiny chip, but its not usually the smallest devices on the market that are setting this trend. Its larger devices with more internal space and bigger batteries.

Id say that this years new iPhone will not be world mode, but I hope Im wrong.

Sprint has an announcement on 2/7 where they claim they will unveil an industry first and show that "the impossible is possible". I think they will be announcing CDMA2000 upgrades are complete on their network, allowing voice/data simultaneously. They could also announce an iPhone the same day, but probably not. If that Qualcomm chip works for Apple tho, imagine the iPhone 5 being announced for all 4 carriers this summer with CDMA/GSM both. One assembly line, cover all the US carriers. Verizon should be done w/their CDMA2000 upgrade by then as well.
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post #55 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

Sprint has an announcement on 2/7 where they claim they will unveil an industry first and show that "the impossible is possible". I think they will be announcing CDMA2000 upgrades are complete on their network, allowing voice/data simultaneously. They could also announce an iPhone the same day, but probably not. If that Qualcomm chip works for Apple tho, imagine the iPhone 5 being announced for all 4 carriers this summer with CDMA/GSM both. One assembly line, cover all the US carriers. Verizon should be done w/their CDMA2000 upgrade by then as well.

1) Is Sprint rumoured to have VoRA (VoIP on EV-DO Rev. A) or EV-DO Rev. B?

2) I doubt that Qualcomm chip will work for Apple as its Snapdragon CPU and Adeno GPU. Im sure Apple will stick with Samsung and Imagination. However, that is just a reference model and the tech can be licensed from Qualcomm.

If the iPad 2, with its additional room and mini-PCIe GSM/UMTS that is larger than the Gobi cards you can buy now that are pretty much true world mode chips with 4x GSm bands, 5x UMTS bands, and 2x CDMA\\EVDO bands then we might be able to consider this for the next iPhone. But note the 3 HW models for the next iPad are listed in iOS 4.3.
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post #56 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:11pm
Most consumers really could care less whether a phone has a dual-core, or single-core setup. C'mon people, I think we're beyond that now.

Apple has shown that it can provide a better overall experience using less "horsepower" compared the the other folks with higher-clocked CPU's, and whatever else is under the hood.

When I see other manufacturers advertising CPU cores, or Ghz ratings, etc.. that's just to get the tech-heads wet, because no one else really cares anymore.
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post #57 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

I really don't understand why this matters. In what way would it improve the iOS products?

With a dual-core 1GHz CCPU, OpenCL-capable GPU, 1 GB RAM they would have a real powerhouse capable of running OpenCL, CGD, and the latest OpenGL...

What that could mean to the end user is things like:

-- quickly creating iMovies on an iPad
-- AirPlay HD from an iDevice to an ATV or to another iDevice
-- See the AirPlay video on both the sending and receiving devices
-- Keynote presos from the iPad to ATV/HDTV -- multiple mirrored displays
-- Screen Sharing / BackToMyMac to/from iPad
-- collaboration among multiple iPads
-- more robust bg task postings - similar to widgets home screen on JailBroken or Android
-- CAD, Pro Apps on the iPad
-- "bettery battery"

The iPad is underpowered for it's screen size -- it could do much more with the above hardware.

The smaller screen would limit the need for this on an iPhone or Touch.
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post #58 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:23pm
Its possible Apple could be working with Qualcomm secretly on a world radio that will be exclusive to Apple for some short amount of time. Apple has done things like this before.

It would be much more Apple's style to create one iPad and one iPhone that works on all networks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

it’s technically possible. Qualcomm recently demoed a reference model phone using Snapdragon and having GSM/HS*PA|CDMA/EVDO about the size of the iPhone. That doesn’t mean all the necessary bands can be supported or the size or power efficiency is small enough for Apple.
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post #59 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:25pm
Awesome, the A4 is feeling the pinch so it'll be good see the specs on it (the A8 that is).
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post #60 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

iPhone (2007), iPhone 3G (2008), iPhone 3GS (2009), iPhone 4 (2010), iPhone 4S (2011), iPhone 4G (2012)?

Not a chance. In case everyone missed it, AT&T and everyone else have given in to T-Mobiles branding of HSPA+ as 4G. The next iPhone will be marketed as a 4G iPhone, not necessarily named the iPhone 4G, but it will be sold as a 4G capable iPhone. Whether it has LTE or just HSPA+ is still an open question, but I am guessing the latter. Whenever the LTE iPhone appears, it will be marketed as somethign ohter than plain old 4G, like 4G-LTE.

Most people don't know what is and is not 4G, but they think 4G is newer and faster than 3G and the use of that designation will impact sales and perception.
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post #61 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Its possible Apple could be working with Qualcomm secretly on a world radio that will be exclusive to Apple for some short amount of time. Apple has done things like this before.

It would be much more Apple's style to create one iPad and one iPhone that works on all networks.

Carriers are already paying $400 for iphone subsidies --- they are not going to pay for the extra $20 for a world iphone which their own subscribers never going to use.
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post #62 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:36pm
What makes you think Apple would charge the carriers for world phones?

Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

Carriers are already paying $400 for iphone subsidies --- they are not going to pay for the extra $20 for a world iphone which their own subscribers never going to use.
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post #63 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIaddict View Post

Not a chance. In case everyone missed it, AT&T and everyone else have given in to T-Mobiles branding of HSPA+ as 4G. The next iPhone will be marketed as a 4G iPhone, not necessarily named the iPhone 4G, but it will be sold as a 4G capable iPhone. Whether it has LTE or just HSPA+ is still an open question, but I am guessing the latter. Whenever the LTE iPhone appears, it will be marketed as somethign ohter than plain old 4G, like 4G-LTE.

Most people don't know what is and is not 4G, but they think 4G is newer and faster than 3G and the use of that designation will impact sales and perception.

The marketing on this is pretty slippery. AT&T is claiming their network is 4G -and- stating that HSPA+ is what they mean by 4G. For any phone to be HSPA+ it has to be at least HSDPA Category 13, which means a 21.1Mbps capable chip. Ive only seen one of these, maybe at CES, but most devices being called 4G as part of their name are still not HSPA+ even with HSDPA Category 10 at 14.4Mbps.

Its one thing to invent a marketing term and another to abuse it. Will Apple call an iPhone with a 14.4Mbps HSDPA chip 4G? How will that affect the next iPhone on Verizon if they both use the same naming convention or will Apple do a staggered release and have the 5th iPhone generation actually be CDMA/EVDO/LTE for Verizon with the name iPhone 4G?
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post #64 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

What makes you think Apple would charge the carriers for world phones?

Because Apple can.
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post #65 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:39pm
I doubt Apple is going to follow T-Mobile's inaccurate marketing scheme.

The next iPhone will absolutely not use LTE. There is little advantage to it at this point. They would do better to keep riding HSPA+ into faster speeds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIaddict View Post

Whether it has LTE or just HSPA+ is still an open question, but I am guessing the latter. Whenever the LTE iPhone appears, it will be marketed as somethign ohter than plain old 4G, like 4G-LTE.
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post #66 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:40pm
Your line of logic makes no sense. It would cost Apple more to make separate CDMA - HSPA phones than to have both in one phone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

Because Apple can.
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post #67 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

What makes you think Apple would charge the carriers for world phones?

Economy of scale doesnt work for world mode phones with Qualcomms history of licensing. They charge a lot for the current iPhone and they charge even more for CDMA/EVDO. To put it all into one phone may mean Apple pay a huge percentage of each phone to Qualcomm. With most of the world on GSM/UMTS and no need or interest in using CDMA/EVDO it would likely be a waste of money.

Right now, Apple pays 5% for each iPhone to Qualcomm. Correction, Foxconn pays 5% of the price they sell the iPhone to Apple. This lowers the price Apple pays to Qualcomm by half. Qualcomm isnt too happy about this workaround and Apple is clearly trying to pay Qualcomm as little as possible.
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post #68 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

I doubt Apple is going to follow T-Mobile's inaccurate marketing scheme.

I dont know what Apple will do, but I seem to recall Verizon getting upset with Sprint when they called their WiMAX 4G and AT&T getting upset with T-Mobile USA when they called HSPA+ 4G, yet both Verizon and AT&T are calling LTE and HSPA+ 4G, respectively.

Its not an ITU definition, but it doesnt matter. I suppose well see in a few months how powerful this silly marketing term is.
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post #69 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Your line of logic makes no sense. It would cost Apple more to make separate CDMA - HSPA phones than to have both in one phone.

Price is determined by supply and demand --- not by input cost.
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post #70 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:53pm
OK, I didn't know about that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Right now, Apple pays 5% for each iPhone to Qualcomm. Correction, Foxconn pays 5% of the price they sell the iPhone to Apple. This lowers the price Apple pays to Qualcomm by half. Qualcomm isnt too happy about this workaround and Apple is clearly trying to pay Qualcomm as little as possible.
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post #71 of 90
1/14/11 at 1:56pm
Because its not worth the effort to try to fight Sprint and T-Mobile's efforts. Its easier to go with the flow than try to explain the finer details.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I dont know what Apple will do, but I seem to recall Verizon getting upset with Sprint when they called their WiMAX 4G and AT&T getting upset with T-Mobile USA when they called HSPA+ 4G, yet both Verizon and AT&T are calling LTE and HSPA+ 4G, respectively.
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post #72 of 90
1/14/11 at 2:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by longliveapple View Post

And it begins...no longer able to inundate us with Verizon rumors, we will now have a year of iPhone 5 rumors.

Hey, I'm looking forward to 2011.

Mac App Store
Verizon iPhone
MacBook, MacBook Pro updates
iOS 4.3
2nd-Generation iPad
-sharper display
-better battery life
-FaceTime, rear cameras
-thinner, lighter
-improved speakers
-A8 processor
-price drop
iOS 5.0?
iPhone 4 with slight improvements
OS X 10.7 Lion!!!
New iPods?
Maybe even a new Apple TV...

Man...if only it weren't so hard to get a job
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post #73 of 90
1/14/11 at 2:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by acslater017 View Post

Hey, I'm looking forward to 2011.

Mac App Store
Verizon iPhone
MacBook, MacBook Pro updates
iOS 4.3
2nd-Generation iPad
-sharper display
-better battery life
-FaceTime, rear cameras
-thinner, lighter
-improved speakers
-A8 processor
-price drop
iOS 5.0?
iPhone 4 with slight improvements
OS X 10.7 Lion!!!
New iPods?
Maybe even a new Apple TV...

Man...if only it weren't so hard to get a job

I admit I am as excited as the next one, but rumors rumors rumors...
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post #74 of 90
1/14/11 at 3:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by longliveapple View Post

And it begins...no longer able to inundate us with Verizon rumors, we will now have a year of iPhone 5 rumors.

Make dat 6 months.
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post #75 of 90
1/14/11 at 3:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Don't forget the impending iPad 2.0 rumors.

Understand their coming out with the Newton ...soon
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post #76 of 90
1/14/11 at 3:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

Price is determined by supply and demand --- not by input cost.

Your view of Economics is simplistic and reminiscent of first year Macroeconomics. Price is determined well beyond 2 variables.
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post #77 of 90
1/14/11 at 4:30pm
I wonder if it will have Widgets. I must say, since I returned my iphone4 for SGS, I have fallen in love with widgets for facebook, calendar events, google tasks, weather etc... just so nice to have this info immediately visible and available rather than "leaving one room and entering another".

I also like NOT using quicktime/itunes and using drag and drop of a folder directly from my library to the phone, and then from my phone to anyone's computer, no syncing nonsense necessary. I LOVE that!

It would be nice if iphone 5 gave this kind of freedom, but somehow I doubt it... sadly.

Mark.
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post #78 of 90
1/14/11 at 6:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Is Apple stealing Audi's car names for their chips? What follows the A8... the A8 Convertible?

Cabriolet ... Please!
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post #79 of 90
1/14/11 at 6:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIaddict View Post

Not a chance. In case everyone missed it, AT&T and everyone else have given in to T-Mobiles branding of HSPA+ as 4G. The next iPhone will be marketed as a 4G iPhone, not necessarily named the iPhone 4G, but it will be sold as a 4G capable iPhone. Whether it has LTE or just HSPA+ is still an open question, but I am guessing the latter. Whenever the LTE iPhone appears, it will be marketed as somethign ohter than plain old 4G, like 4G-LTE.

Most people don't know what is and is not 4G, but they think 4G is newer and faster than 3G and the use of that designation will impact sales and perception.

4GTX might impress those same 'most people'.
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post #80 of 90
1/14/11 at 11:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

4GTX might impress those same 'most people'.

Sadly Sprint started this whole mess by advertising a "4G" network that's slower than many 3G networks. In Canada they're staying a little closer to the truth by referring to the improved 3G networks as 3G+.
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