or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Apple finalizing wireless e-wallet for iPhone 5, iPad 2 - report
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple finalizing wireless e-wallet for iPhone 5, iPad 2 - report

post #1 of 60
Thread Starter 
A new report claims Apple will add near-field communication technology to this year's anticipated iPad 2 and iPhone 5, giving users the ability to have their device serve as an electronic wallet for quick wireless transactions.

Richard Doherty, director of the consulting firm Envisioneering Group, told Bloomberg that the next-generation iPad and iPhone will both include near-field communication technology. In a report on Tuesday, Doherty cited engineers who he claimed are working on hardware for the project.

"Apple's service may be able to tap into user information already on file, including credit-card numbers, iTunes gift-card balance and bank data..." the report said, citing a financial industry adviser. It was speculated that the inclusion of an NFC chip could compete with services from Visa, MasterCard, eBay and PayPal.

A NFC chip already appears in the Google Nexus S, which debuted in the U.S. on Dec. 16. The chip allows for short-range wireless data transmissions for a variety of potential activities, including an "e-wallet."

Reports dating back to late 2009 have claimed that Apple is working to add radio-frequency identification, or RFID, to the iPhone. And last year, the company hired an expert on NFC, while another report claimed the company was already testing NFC-enabled iPhone prototypes.

Doherty reportedly said that Apple could start its own mobile payment service for use at retail stores as early as mid-2011, when the iPhone 5 is expected to launch. For such a service, iTunes could be revamped to include traditional credit card features like loyalty credits and points earned through transactions.

"Using the service, customers could walk into a store or restaurant and make payments straight from an iPad or iPhone," the report said. "They could also receive loyalty rewards and credits for purchases, such as when referring a friend, Doherty said."

He claimed that Apple has already built a prototype payment terminal intended for small businesses "such as hairdressers and mom-and-pop stores." He added that Apple may "heavily" subsidize the hardware, or even give it away to retailers, to encourage rapid adoption of NFC technology and boost sales of NFC-equipped iPhones and iPads.
post #2 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

He claimed that Apple has already built a prototype payment terminal intended for small businesses "such as hairdressers and mom-and-pop stores." He added that Apple may "heavily" subsidize the hardware, or even give it away to retailers, to encourage rapid adoption of NFC technology and boost sales of NFC-equipped iPhones and iPads.

Yaaayayyy Apple goes up against banks!! If anyone can make this work easily for the majority of small shops, it'll be Apple.
post #3 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomad411 View Post

Yaaayayyy Apple goes up against banks!! If anyone can make this work easily for the majority of small shops, it'll be Apple.

Surely this will simply be on behalf of the banks. However with $60B I guess Apple could become a bank
Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
Reply
Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
Reply
post #4 of 60
Don't see this on the iPad 2. iPhone 5 will probably get this first. Mobile payments makes more sense for smartphones.
post #5 of 60
This payment system still goes through credit cards. If anyone can do NFC-Payments right in Europe and the Americas it's probably Apple. Going out on a night with just your phone? Watch you don't drop it.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
post #6 of 60
The Starbucks app now allows you to use the app to pay for your purchase. You select to buy and it shows a QR code that is scanned by the cashier. This isn’t NFC but it’s a similar form of payment using the device. I’m not quite sold on the usefulness even though it updates my remaining balance almost instantly, which is quite handy.

I also use CardStar to store my reward/club card numbers for various retail shops. It’s handy in the sense that I don’t have to carry a stack of 20 cards with me and that I’m very likely to have my phone on my person at all times when leaving the house. It does, however, seem to take just as much time if not more to launch the app and get the number ready. NFC would surely make this a little easier as it wouldn’t have to be scanned or typed in manually.

I don’t mind carrying my credit/debit cards as I don’t have many of those. How long before credit/debit NFC scanners are commonplace to the point that carrying a physical card seems redundant? Perhaps I’m just being paranoid about this technology. What other uses does NFC have to offer?
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #7 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wurm5150 View Post

Don't see this on the iPad 2. iPhone 5 will probably get this first. Mobile payments makes more sense for smartphones.

I was thinking the same thing. But it's nice to have it in there and it doesn't really cost anything, so why not bundle it. Perhaps Apple can see uses for having it in an iPad that we can't. And the chip, once in there, can used for other things too.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
post #8 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wurm5150 View Post

Don't see this on the iPad 2. iPhone 5 will probably get this first. Mobile payments makes more sense for smartphones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

I was thinking the same thing. But it's nice to have it in there and it doesn't really cost anything, so why not bundle it. Perhaps Apple can see uses for having it in an iPad that we can't. And the chip, once in there, can used for other things too.

The potential for the iPad 2 is not as an electronic wallet -- rather as the other side of the transaction:

Quote:
I can very much see this as happening -- and it can be incremental instead of disruptive.

For those who currently have POST (Point Of Sale Terminals -- to differentiate from POS), for cc transactions -- they need not be modified, updated or replaced.

An device can be added to handle the NFC transactions -- that device can be something as inexpensive as (in Apple's case) an iPod Touch, iPhone or an iPad.

The iPad offers a great potential because it can evolve, through hardware and software additions, to handle all traditional POST transactions:
-- cc swiping and processing (through existing systems)
-- scanner data entry
-- keypad/touchpad data capture
-- cash register/cash drawer functions
-- signature capture
-- receipt printing
-- NFC transactions - electronic payment bump and receipt exchange

Apple could subsidize the POST setup and cost by offering a monthly tiered fee system based on transaction volume (similar to, but less than cc systems).

iPay anyone?

The above post was made to another forum:

http://techcrunch.com/2011/01/25/iphone-5-nfc/
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #9 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I don’t mind carrying my credit/debit cards as I don’t have many of those. How long before credit/debit NFC scanners are commonplace to the point that carrying a physical card seems redundant? Perhaps I’m just being paranoid about this technology. What other uses does NFC have to offer?

Actually, an electronic wallet with NFC should be more secure than credit cards:

-- can't be used if stolen lost
-- never leaves your sight
-- no visible receipts
-- max $ limit per transaction

NFC could be used as a quick trigger to launch an app and/or a more robust communication connection (BT, WiFi)

Or, it could unlock your front door or start your car.
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #10 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

The potential for the iPad 2 is not as an electronic wallet -- rather as rthe other side of the transaction:

True. iPhone pays, iPad receives. Many people modified iPad to be cash register already. With NFC, they just communicate directly without a need of a scanner.
I think it'll work together pretty well.
post #11 of 60
Hmm this is the same article I posted earlier this morning.
post #12 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Surely this will simply be on behalf of the banks. However with $60B I guess Apple could become a bank

What you say is true.

At first I see merchants [iwth existing cc systems] installing a NFC POST system along side the existing system -- to handle high-volume, low-dollar-amount transactions as efficiently as possible.

If the NFC POST is robust enough (an iPad 2), it can assume the cc processing using the existing bank/processor infrastructure.

At some point it would subsume the entire POST transaction within the Apple iPay infrastructure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

This payment system still goes through credit cards. If anyone can do NFC-Payments right in Europe and the Americas it's probably Apple. Going out on a night with just your phone? Watch you don't drop it.

See above.

As to losing your eWallet -- that's one of the advantages of a well-designed system. You provide, in advance, for the loss. The iPay merchant provides you access to to the online system to validate your authenticity.

So, you have more access to credit than with a cc -- as there is no provision for cc transactions w/o a cc.
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #13 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Actually, an electronic wallet with NFC should be more secure than credit cards

I don't see two as mutually exclusive. Visa and Mastercard creditcards can be (and in a lot of cases are) NFC enabled.

I suspect they will be accepted in a lot more places as well
post #14 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I dont mind carrying my credit/debit cards as I dont have many of those. How long before credit/debit NFC scanners are commonplace to the point that carrying a physical card seems redundant? Perhaps Im just being paranoid about this technology. What other uses does NFC have to offer?

You'll always need at least one other form of payment since some places won't accept NFC contactless transactions.

This does eliminate a stack of loyalty/membership cards. Also, it can be used for event tickets.

However, the main reason why this system took off in Japan six years ago is they got it to work as a Mobile Suica card (which supports one of the major transit systems in greater Tokyo).

Clipper Card is the NFC transit card in the SF Bay Area. I can easily keep BART, Muni, and Caltrain passes plus cash, all loaded up on one card. No more ticket vending machines, no more paper tickets. Just wave over the terminal and go.

The Japanese figured out how to secure this technology, so if you want to be paranoid go ahead, knowing that tens of millions of Japanese use this system every day.
post #15 of 60
Quote:
"Apple's service may be able to tap into user information already on file, including credit-card numbers, iTunes gift-card balance and bank data..." the report said, citing a financial industry adviser. It was speculated that the inclusion of an NFC chip could compete with services from Visa, MasterCard, eBay and PayPal.

Apple will not get in to payment business and I am sure you will not be able to use your iTunes account at Walmart. The way I think Apple will do it is that they will include NFC chip and provide the developers with the necessary APIs so they can use it. Visa, MasterCard, eBay, and PayPal can all develop their own iOS apps and maybe those apps will have background processes so you don't have to launch it every time you want to pay for something.
post #16 of 60

deleted


Edited by kellya74u - 7/24/13 at 10:21am
post #17 of 60
Interesting, but paying with my phone is still kinda scary to me. I would rather use those blink enabled credit cards. I hope apple does not link you itunes credit card to this by default.

However if I can share contacts, apps or something like that using NFC I would be more inclined to use it. (of course we already have blutooth for that)
--SHEFFmachine out
Da Bears!
Reply
--SHEFFmachine out
Da Bears!
Reply
post #18 of 60
Wow are people ignorant. You do NOT want NFC/RFID spychips! aka "little brother" They are insecure and are not in your interests of privacy.

These are insecure, watch this video -- this guy who easily COPIES the info on RFID/NFCs from unsuspecting passers-by, which means it's even easier for companies, employers, government to do the same!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AfhqY5lbOQ

See the free documentary movie covering this topic: America: Freedom to Fascism:
http://freedomtofascism.com

Also read Spychips:
http://spychips.com
post #19 of 60
The fact that Apple will place a NFC device into the iPad/iPhone isn't surprising; Google is doing it as well. What will set Apple apart is that they'll actually make a software front-end that will make the hardware useful. Most other companies throw hardware into their product just to say they have said hardware, although they're virtually useless because the user is left to figure out its intended use on their own.

See FaceTime for the proper way to introduce new hardware with the proper software front-end.
post #20 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

Wow are people ignorant. You do NOT want NFC/RFID spychips! aka "little brother" They are insecure and are not in your interests of privacy.

So that'd be stopping using a VISA card or current chip and pin then eh, what with their insecurities?


Apple has been pretty tight, and locked down with Bluetooth - if they do NFC, will they be laser focused on this? I'd love to see low power BT4, and a wideranging NFC so it can be used for lots of things - but we'll see.
Surely they need an infrastructure, but we haven't sniffed out the NDA'd companies yet? Not likely that there are many that could actually roll out NFC, unless they're going to test market it with a few specific customers (we're looking at you, Starbucks).
post #21 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

Wow are people ignorant. You do NOT want NFC/RFID spychips! aka "little brother" They are insecure and are not in your interests of privacy.

These are insecure, watch this video -- this guy who easily COPIES the info on RFID/NFCs from unsuspecting passers-by, which means it's even easier for companies, employers, government to do the same!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AfhqY5lbOQ

See the free documentary movie covering this topic: America: Freedom to Fascism:
http://americafreedomtofascism.com

Also read Spychips:
http://spychips.com

The extreme (to put it lightly) nature of your post makes me think there is no issue with NFC. At least not as unsecured as any other networking option used to connect to other devices.

Thank you for putting me at ease. That is not sarcasm!
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #22 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The extreme (to put it lightly) nature of your post makes me think there is no issue with NFC. At least not as unsecured as any other networking option used to connect to other devices.

Interesting to consider yesterday's announcement of another security specialist.
post #23 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheff View Post

Interesting, but paying with my phone is still kinda scary to me. I would rather use those blink enabled credit cards. I hope apple does not link you itunes credit card to this by default.

However if I can share contacts, apps or something like that using NFC I would be more inclined to use it. (of course we already have blutooth for that)

It will have security. My guess:

Bascially you will have 15 minutes since last login, or have to login every time. Still faster than typing. For people who want to use it in Londons tube, sign into the NFC login before going in, or out.

If your iPhone is stolen it will work for 15 minutes max.

As for contacts - yes, that is a potential feature ( NFC is just another near field transport, like bluetooth, how it is used is up to the devs).
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #24 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellya74u View Post

Can a crook, using a stolen iPhone (jail-broken or no), on a spoofed account using someone else's id, load the phone up with 50 or so stolen credit card numbers, & use this technology to make several transactions rapidly before the individual card number is shut down? Even if the spoofed account is compromised, can't they could just set up another, & start the process again? If your account number is used, you will see all kinds of transactions on your account that you will have to dispute; getting the money credited to your account can take several weeks. Hopefully it be reported to the credit bureaus. It appears that more transactions can occur in less time with no "evidence" of collecting a signature or other verification at point of sale.

Are their safeguards in the technology to prevent this from happening?

I would think that the end user would have to put in their Apple ID and password before it would allow them to do the transaction. Besides, I think you can only have one card on file with it.
-- Mike Eggleston
-- Mac Finatic since 1984.
-- Proud Member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals
-- Wii #: 8913 3004 4519 2027
Reply
-- Mike Eggleston
-- Mac Finatic since 1984.
-- Proud Member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals
-- Wii #: 8913 3004 4519 2027
Reply
post #25 of 60
Unnecessary crap that will take electronic identity theft to a new level. Be prepared. This is the first thing Apple will do very very wrong with the iPhone.

I've owned every iPhone. If this makes it way to iPhone 5 and beyond, then the iPhone 4 is the last iPhone I own. Period.
post #26 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Eggleston View Post

I would think that the end user would have to put in their Apple ID and password before it would allow them to do the transaction. Besides, I think you can only have one card on file with it.

Id think a PIN would be sufficient, just like at an ATM.
  • Wouldnt that be faster and more secure than using a swiped CC for you which you sign your name?
  • Wouldnt a lost phone that had a PIN to access encrypted card info be more secure than just an CC or an ATM card?
  • Wouldnt it be easier to wipe a card number tied to a device than wiping a card number that is tied to a static piece of plastic?
  • Couldnt this also lower retail clerk thefts by keeping CC numbers, the 3 digit security code and zip code from these oft low wage employees (or am I off base in thinking these employees are prone to theft)?
  • Doesnt the NFC loop limit the data path to only a few inches, while looking or listening can be done over a much longer distance and even recorded?

With all the insurance that banks offer with cards I certainly dont ever feel like my money is in jeopardy, though I do have a special CC for certain retail outlets.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #27 of 60
You have to wonder about and question Apple's NFC/RFID agenda, when Steve Jobs is too connected to people with new world order motivations and pseudo science like Global Warming (Al Gore), and Jobs donates $50k to Rahm Emanuel (running for Chicago Mayor, despite not living here for the required last year) who profited from the scandalous Freddie Mac housing boondoggle.

I love Apple technology as much as anyone, but you have to watch what is going on behind the scenes -- not all technology is desirable. RFID/NFC spychips are another tyranny-enabler, due to many flaws, and psychopaths in government and banking.

Think about it, the government cannot get the people to accept NFC/RFID spychips, but they engage a company -- Apple to do so behind the scenes, and people willingly buy devices with NFC/RFID spychips because they think Apple products are cool and hip and love the convenience of paying with a phone, while enabling unprecedented new privacy implications -- being tracked like a dog.

Today it is about the intersection of politics, culture and technology -- they have become closely interlinked -- Declan McCullagh covers many of these issue very well from a perspective of liberty.

Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Doesn't anyone think for themselves anymore and ask questions?
post #28 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The extreme (to put it lightly) nature of your post makes me think there is no issue with NFC. At least not as unsecured as any other networking option used to connect to other devices.

Thank you for putting me at ease. That is not sarcasm!

You are so irresponsibly ignorant, it defies description.

Here's another beautiful example:
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

With all the insurance that banks offer with cards I certainly don’t ever feel like my money is in jeopardy, though I do have a special CC for certain retail outlets.

You really, really scare me. Blind trust of technologies you know nothing about. Don't worry, Steve loves you and would never capitulate to anything the federal government has on the back burner.
post #29 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post


Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Doesn't anyone think for themselves anymore and ask questions?

The last time NFC was introduced there was an American revolution. But things have changed.

I have an idea. For you: cash. For the rest of us. Cards, or NFC enabled devices.

Priceless.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #30 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Unnecessary crap that will take electronic identity theft to a new level. Be prepared. This is the first thing Apple will do very very wrong with the iPhone.

I've owned every iPhone. If this makes it way to iPhone 5 and beyond, then the iPhone 4 is the last iPhone I own. Period.

I talked to the ghost of Jefferson, as I do, and he said it's ok to buy the iPhone 5 if the NFC can be turned off.

So, thats ok then.


Probably.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #31 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Unnecessary crap that will take electronic identity theft to a new level. Be prepared. This is the first thing Apple will do very very wrong with the iPhone.

I've owned every iPhone. If this makes it way to iPhone 5 and beyond, then the iPhone 4 is the last iPhone I own. Period.

Right, because its only the iphone 5 that will incorperate this tech.

It maybe the last SMARTPHONE you own under those terms......Or maybe you could just disable the feature, or say, not connect any cc/dc to the function.

Whichever.
post #32 of 60
You don't get it, the agenda is to eliminate cash. In the near term, they are trying to embed tracking devices in cash too, so you would get taxed for the time you are in possession of the cash.

We need to get rid of the Federal Reserve -- all it has done is destroy the American currency -- you have to wonder if there really is really any gold in Fort Knox -- we need to audit the Federal Reserve.

This country needs a new gold and silver backed currency -- we need competition in money, the Federal Reserve is a monopoly and is no more Federal than Federal Express!

Those NFC/RFID spychip lovers -- why don't you just get chipped like a dog -- implant it under your skin. WOW. Mark of the beast.


Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

The last time NFC was introduced there was an American revolution. But things have changed.

I have an idea. For you: cash. For the rest of us. Cards, or NFC enabled devices.

Priceless.
post #33 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcoz View Post

Right, because its only the iphone 5 that will incorperate this tech.

It maybe the last SMARTPHONE you own under those terms......Or maybe you could just disable the feature, or say, not connect any cc/dc to the function.

Whichever.

I wonder why he isnt concerned about his cellphone always reporting his position. Big Brother is watching...
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #34 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

You don't get it, the agenda is to eliminate cash. In the near term, they are trying to embed tracking devices in cash too, so you would get taxed for the time you are in possession of the cash.

We need to get rid of the Federal Reserve -- all it has done is destroy the American currency -- you have to wonder if there really is really any gold in Fort Knox -- we need to audit the Federal Reserve.

This country needs a new gold and silver backed currency -- we need competition in money, the Federal Reserve is a monopoly and is no more Federal than Federal Express!

Those NFC/RFID spychip lovers -- why don't you just get chipped like a dog -- implant it under your skin. WOW. Mark of the beast.

How is this "spy chip" so different than CC usage as it stands?

And what the heck are you talking about with that tax for holding money? Where has that been reported?
post #35 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I wonder why he isnt concerned about his cellphone always reporting his position. Big Brother is watching...

Right, same as libertyforall....

There is so much already that big brother can tap into....

Freakin google can give big brother 10x more dirt on you than any NFC theories...
post #36 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

You have to wonder about and question Apple's NFC/RFID agenda, when Steve Jobs is too connected to people with new world order motivations and pseudo science like Global Warming (Al Gore), and Jobs donates $50k to Rahm Emanuel (running for Chicago Mayor, despite not living here for the required last year) who profited from the scandalous Freddie Mac housing boondoggle.

I love Apple technology as much as anyone, but you have to watch what is going on behind the scenes -- not all technology is desirable. RFID/NFC spychips are another tyranny-enabler, due to many flaws, and psychopaths in government and banking.

Think about it, the government cannot get the people to accept NFC/RFID spychips, but they engage a company -- Apple to do so behind the scenes, and people willingly buy devices with NFC/RFID spychips because they think Apple products are cool and hip and love the convenience of paying with a phone, while enabling unprecedented new privacy implications -- being tracked like a dog.

Today it is about the intersection of politics, culture and technology -- they have become closely interlinked -- Declan McCullagh covers many of these issue very well from a perspective of liberty.

Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Doesn't anyone think for themselves anymore and ask questions?

Not me. I have voices in my head.
post #37 of 60
If Apple starts investigating banking functions, I wonder if Campbell will have to step down from the BOD, since Intuit does banking.
post #38 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

As to losing your eWallet -- that's one of the advantages of a well-designed system.

I never mentioned losing. I mentioned dropping. I you drop your real wallet on a night out, you pick it up and carry on. If we all move to e-wallet via iPhone, if we drop our "wallet" it smashes. Then you have no money and could be stuck somewhere.

I think this technology will be great, but will be more for going to the supermarket, but you will need to have your real wallet with you just in case, perhaps.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
post #39 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

Wow are people ignorant. You do NOT want NFC/RFID spychips! aka "little brother" They are insecure and are not in your interests of privacy.

These are insecure, watch this video -- this guy who easily COPIES the info on RFID/NFCs from unsuspecting passers-by, which means it's even easier for companies, employers, government to do the same!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AfhqY5lbOQ

You don't have to wear a tinfoil hat (or sound like you do) to have concerns for the death from thousands of cuts that personal privacy's enduring in the connected age. Your phone's already broadcasting a unique identifier about you as you travel. If you live in urban areas, your picture's likely being taken 100's of times a day, and your license plate at intersections if you're driving in NYC (and even if you loan your car, you get the red light ticket and the points on your license), and in London, add another zero to the number of photos of you.

In E-Z Pass states you can be mailed a speeding ticket for passing thru two consecutive toll points too quickly. And as noted below, the RFID tags for merch today are generally removable, but many would like them embedded so that every purchased item on your person (also including your driver's license, CC's, Passport, etc.) and in your home can continue to chatter away as you move about and furnish your digs.

And apparently receivers for many of the signals we're talking about are already quite available as the youtube link above notes (as do many others which are "NOT-FOX").

And then we could get started on how much privacy your ID has anywhere on the net, your search and surf histories, facebook apps, cloud storage, etc., etc.

"Familial" DNA's certainly interesting as well. If you're a possible suspect, hope your children or parents don't discard half-eaten junk food with saliva traces in a trash can - which is how a serial killer was recently caught by his son's spit on a piece of pizza. I.e., there are a whole family of technologies which make it easier for people - both those we want to and those we don't, and those we're aware of and those we're not - to know much about us, our habits, wanderings, purchases and locations.

Essentially it becomes harder and harder to "go off the grid" at all every day in many evolving ways - a fact which, if gov't falls into totalitarian hands (or never leaves them, e.g., in China), carries numerous ominous implications.

I await the introduction of convenient injectable under the skin RFID licenses, passports and banking with interest. Perfect for the "well-behaved" nudist, scary for many of the rest of us.

And as for the first person to riposte, "yeah, but if you follow all the rules, why should you worry?" please keep your distance for your own well-being, because I'll retch. We're spoiled in this country, but history shows liberty is always fragile and that you only have to piss off untrammeled authority in the most minor of ways to end up in a sea of trouble.

Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

See the free documentary movie covering this topic: America: Freedom to Fascism:
http://americafreedomtofascism.com

This is actually not a conventional right or left-leaning film altho' the link provided is broken. The man who made it was a Hollywood type who got interested in how the Federal Reserve System & IRS came into being and how their constitutionality was vetted or perhaps not fully vetted. Actually a provocative watch, as so many of the interviewees he got to sit down totally hem and haw at his questions, and the film was shown at the Cannes Film Festival. And altho' it settles nothing, it should leave you with some interesting questions in your mind.

http://freedomtofascism.com/

Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

Also read Spychips:
http://spychips.com

For context, from the 7/23/10 WSJ article referenced in the last above:

Quote:
[Walmart's] latest attempt to use its influence—executives call it the start of a "next-generation Wal-Mart"—has privacy advocates raising questions.

While the tags can be removed from clothing and packages, they can't be turned off, and they are trackable. Some privacy advocates hypothesize that unscrupulous marketers or criminals will be able to drive by consumers' homes and scan their garbage to discover what they have recently bought.

They also worry that retailers will be able to scan customers who carry new types of personal ID cards as they walk through a store, without their knowledge. Several states, including Washington and New York, have begun issuing enhanced driver's licenses that contain radio- frequency tags with unique ID numbers, to make border crossings easier for frequent travelers.

Some privacy advocates contend that retailers could theoretically scan people with such licenses as they make purchases, combine the info with their credit card data, and then know the person's identity the next time they stepped into the store.

"There are two things you really don't want to tag, clothing and identity documents, and ironically that's where we are seeing adoption," said Katherine Albrecht, founder of a group called Consumers Against Supermarket Privacy Invasion and Numbering and author of a book called "Spychips" that argues against RFID technology. "The inventory guys may be in the dark about this, but there are a lot of corporate marketers who are interested in tracking people as they walk sales floors."

Smart-tag experts dismiss Big Brother concerns as breathless conjecture, but activists have pressured companies. Ms. Albrecht and others launched a boycott of Benetton Group SpA last decade after an RFID maker announced it was planning to supply the company with 15 million RFID chips.

Benetton later clarified that it was just evaluating the technology and never embedded a single sensor in clothing.

Wal-Mart is demanding that suppliers add the tags to removable labels or packaging instead of embedding them in clothes, to minimize fears that they could be used to track people's movements. It also is posting signs informing customers about the tags.
"Concerns about privacy are valid, but in this instance, the benefits far outweigh any concerns," says Sanjay Sarma, a professor at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...#ixzz1C4NKbaan

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply
post #40 of 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertyforall View Post

Wow are people ignorant. You do NOT want NFC/RFID spychips! aka "little brother" They are insecure and are not in your interests of privacy.

Remove that tinfoil hat.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Apple finalizing wireless e-wallet for iPhone 5, iPad 2 - report