Originally Posted by extremeskater
Quality as far as fit and finish compared to a Tier 1 vendor that is fine but I find it interesting that many Apple users tend to bring up only Dell and HP.
You have to choose examples that are understand to your audience. Using company and product that arent known or understood will hurt your argument. This is why the car analogy works so well, even if it is tired. Hell, its a tired argument because it works so well. Dell and HP are just well known companies that cover all a huge gamut of product types, even if most of all of their consumer products are poorly made.
I disagree 110% when it comes to Apple and drivers. I think Apple drives suck and what I hate the most is when Apple screws up their drivers you and I have to wait for Apple to fix them. Firmware is another good example. Apple has had more then one issue with iMac Gpu firmware that people have to wait months for Apple to fix.
In Windows if you have a driver problem you can simple go to the Nvidia or ATI site and download another driver. I have rarely if ever had driver issues in Windows and have never had the heat problems using a Windows system when Apple is known for heat issues.
Apple over they year has had more then its fair share of heat issues due to bad design and putting looks before function. To deny that is a joke.
Apple has plenty of aspects that arent the highest quality, the GPU drivers are a convenient example of that, but you stated that "Apple doesn't use anything
that is any higher quality them most other companies and thats what I responded to.
All CE has issues. There are dozens of companies involved with all CE these days. Anyone of these pieces can go bad and affect the entire product. Using quality components or have more QC can help avoid it, but its no guarantee. Even today we got word of Intels chipset with a fault. Thats just a single chipset, not an entire machine.
Seeing we can't pull any real data on things like Trackpads and I think Asus makes pretty good ones lets talk about CPU's because I assume you are talking about CPU Stepping.
Asus makes good quality machines. If I couldnt buy a Mac Id get something from Asus. Note they are a company that has been employed by Apple on several occasions to build the components they design.
They were one of the first to ship a MoBo with USB 3.0 using that Toshiba(?) USB 3.0 controller, which made me wonder if Apples next Mac releases would offer USB 3.0 MoBos designed by Apple, but built by Asus.
The point I was trying to make was people make it sound as if Apple is using some special hardware that makes their products last longer. That is untrue. A product of equal cost will last as long as an Apple system if not longer.
You wrote about quality, you didnt isolate it to only HW that is freely had by other vendors. Nearly all physical products can be had by other vendors, even the aluminium for the chassis.
What about the MBP batteries? Do most notebooks ship with Li-Poly-Ion batteries that can have 1000 charge cycle rating (before they get to 80%)? It seems to me most still use Li-Ion with less dense cells giving you a lower mAh for a giving volume.
This doesnt mean others cant offer these across the line like Apple does, its that they dont. Apples success really doesnt seem to be because they are smarter than the competition, instead it seems their success stems from Apple being focused on the long term, not quarter to quarter.
I have Velocity Micro systems that I had built to order that are five years old and run as well as the day I got them. People on these forums want to compare a 2800.00 MBP to a 800.00 HP.
I compared to the HP Envys, but not because they are considerably more expensive but because the horrible trackpad was a good example of quality. The Envy is also a good example of quality compared to an average priced HP notebook . HP spent a lot more money to create a quieter, thinner machine. This type of shrinking its cheap and is more likely to have issues, which costs even more for QC. You cant stuff more into less space and have it be easier and cheaper to do.
[My points were about hardware not overall user experience and custormer support. I am fairly sure I made that clear in one of my other posts.
I buy and Apple computer because of the overall product not because I think the harddrive or ram is going to last much longer.
I commented I posted on was about quality. It was ambiguous, but I think I covered all major areas of quality in my previous post. As for the longevity of Macs my experience is that they last longer, but anecdotal accounts arent going to be useful for this discussion.
There are also plenty of reports of resale value of Mac and that Macs are used longer than non-Mac PCs. The former is more about their desirability but also can be argued for their quality and the latter is likely an issue with Windows, vendor and 3rd-party apps making people think they need a new system when a clean system could resolve much of their woes, but that also points to quality or lack thereof from MS and vendors when it comes to coding.