Apple unveils subscriptions for iOS App Store, bans links to out-of-app purchases - Page 7

The pay what? They don't pay nothing to Amazon or B&N. And no, epub ADE DRM books can be read on any epub ADE compatible reader.

Apple hasn't said that you will need to get your subs from the store. From what it looks like from their statement, if you're getting your sub somewhere else now, you'll be able to continue doing that. They haven't mentioned taking away any abilities that are there now. I would imagine that we"ll have all of this cleared up some more shortly.

But it isn't really like this. We are talking about digital content, with no intrinsic value.
All that matters is that publishers can make $X via Amazon alone - and will make $X+$i if that content is available on the iPad Kindle store.

No publisher in the history of ever, has walked away from cash on the table.

If Amazon's business model is broken, it will just need to be mended.

C.

You're not actually answering anything here. You can't buy books for the Kindle from anyone else other than Amazon. You don't seem to realize that you're killing your own argument with this post, as you can buy books through Safari on the iPad as well. That doesn't mean you can read them on the iPad, though there's a much greater chance of that than being able to read books purchased through the Kindle browser on the Kindle. That should be: no chance at all.

This has nothing to do with the discussion here anyway. You're just reaching.

did you even read the article???


"Our philosophy is simple — when Apple brings a new subscriber to the app, Apple earns a 30 percent share; when the publisher brings an existing or new subscriber to the app, the publisher keeps 100 percent and Apple earns nothing," Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs said. "All we require is that, if a publisher is making a subscription offer outside of the app, the same (or better) offer be made inside the app, so that customers can easily subscribe with one-click right in the app."

So if you do any subscriptions out side the app. Like hulu, mog, people, netflix etc...
you will ALSO have to offer the same subscription at the Same or better price as an in app purchase. which apple will take 30% of

This is INSANE!

You're saying a lot of things in this thread, but so far, none of them have panned out. Can you show us the laws that would be used to in force that?

You forget this:

If the subscription is initiated outside the app (like your website) then Apple gets nothing.

Most slopes aren't slippery. While it's a great expression, it doesn't mean much.

Only if they are DRM free, which means, usually, copyright free as well. Apple allows that as well. It proves nothing.

Show where DRM'd books that Amazon is selling in their Kindle store are also available from Fictionwise. If you can, then they are paying Amazon for the privilege.

As someone brought up, the site has been bought by B&N, so it's an interesting situation. I didn't know they were bought, so this bears watching.

That's not what the post seemed to be saying. It looked as though you were saying that you could buy Nook books through Amazon,s Kindle, or kindle app, which as far as I know, can't be done. I've been using these reader apps since they first came out, and i've never seen anything like that happening. I feel that if it would happen, there would be plenty of articles written about it, so that we'd all know about it.

What you're saying now is correct.

You CAN buy books for the Kindle on other stores

Hulu and Netflix aren't publishers.

Ejem, DRM ebooks can be read on Nook or Sony, Borders and Sony store books can be read on Nook. They're standard Adobe Digital Edition DRM epubs.

And fictionwise had epub books before it was bought by B&N

My post (second) was a reply to the first post. He claimed that Kindle doesn't have an app store my reply "yes there is". The second sentence in my post was a reply to his statement that Kindle and Nook don't take a cut. My point is that Apple doesn't take a cut if you use the device store. I was implying that if you use the device (Kindle to buy Kindle ebooks or Nook to buy Nooks ebooks) then Apple doesn't take a cut and you can sync your account to iOS device and have all your purchased ebooks.

Sorry for not being clear but I think he understood what I was implying.

RTFA

Apple on Tuesday unveiled its new App Store subscription service, allowing publishers of content-based applications for iOS devices -- like newspapers, magazines, video and music

Has the ice melted yet up there in NY?

I think you're reading what a couple of other posters are saying here and regurgitating it. I just went to Fictionwise, and I can't find anything about any of their DRM'd books being available for the Kindle. They have books for a MultoFormat, about which they say:


And for Secure eReader ebooks, about which they say:


I could't find a reference to the Kindle, except for this:


So, no DRM'd books at all.

You should have looked this up first.

Not so much. Let's try again.

No, lightknight pulled the logical equivalent of saying 1 == 2 via indirection. In reality C+P+A != O.

C+P+A+AdditionalSales == O. Apple is charging (A) 30% for processing and increased impulse buy opportunities.

How much do you think US, People and the Enquirer pay grocery stores to be placed right at the checkout line??? Same principle, drive tons of impulse buys for content that would far sell less otherwise. Premium shelf space (sometimes just regular shelf space) -- wait for it -- COSTS the manufacturer! Standard everyday retail operating procedure. And no, it wasn't the grocery store that chose what goes there to increase grocery store sales, it was the manufacturers that bought those positions because it maximized their sell through, with the grocer effectively making money twice on every transaction.

I am amazed by how shallow and ignorant of business many of the posters are. Not that I would expect a bunch of MBA's to debate things. But to equivocally state things as above and miss such basic business retail principles is laughably sad.

Corollary -- if you don't have knowledge, training or education and therefore don't "know", and then have limited ability to analyze a situation, don't make absolute pronouncements.

I doubt they make $100M but that's the whole point. Apple have been very clever. They knew a lot of people would buy the iPad as an ebook reader but for whatever reason they couldn't secure distribution deals with all the publishers hence the relative lack of content in iBooks. So Apple approves the Kindle App knowing it contravenes the App Store rules so Apple can say buy the iPad and you can read eBooks, no need to buy a Kindle Reader. So Apple sells millions of iPads. Now Christmas is over Apple enforces the rules and Kindle leaves. However with the installed base to use as a bargaining chip Apple can go back to the book publishers and say hey guys we have millions of users who want to read ebooks, do distribution deals with iBooks or you will loose out on lots of sales. The publishers will agree because sales of ebooks have accelerated much quicker than anyone expected to the point were the publishers have to play ball now. Very clever. Don't get me wrong I don't blame them, Apple wants that $100M for themselves not to give it away to Amazon. It should be a level playing field though, each ebook reader should have their own internal book store and the publishers should sell their books to all the readers at a fair price.

What is your reading comprehension level? What does that quote say?

"when the publisher brings an existing or new subscriber to the app, the publisher keeps 100 percent and Apple earns nothing,"

I've also been saying that the details of all this needs to be worked out, and a quick news blurb isn't enough to do that. There will be contracts that need to be looked into, and they will be longer than the few lines we're seeing so far.

My God, I'm talking about Nook, Sony, Borders and others readers not Kindle, it has been clear that there is NO DRM Kindle compatible books, only no DRM books.

mel, don't ask them to read. They don't want to because reality doesn't fit their internal bias.

True, but the problem is they have to also offer the subscription @ the same price in the app so apple gets it cut. and you cant link to the out of app store inside of the app.
So 1) there is no instinctive for the user to purchase outside of the app. 2)Who knows if they will even know the can buy a subscription out side of the app.

Im all for apple getting something but 30% of subscriptions is ridiculous. maybe they should have required apps that have subscriptions have to be a paid apps.

That's a bit of a conspiracy theory!
For Apple it's better that Amazon stay. And Apple make money on whoever is selling books.

C.

wheres yours?

"All we require is that, if a publisher is making a subscription offer outside of the app, the same (or better) offer be made inside the app, so that customers can easily subscribe with one-click right in the app."

Ye gods! Do you listen? Yes, you can get DRM free books elsewhere, mostly for free. But you cannot buy an Amazon DRM'd book elsewhere. This is what we're talking about. I doubt that Amazon, or anyone cares about DRM free books, because almost all are free. A few aren't, and those are from small publishers with very small circulation. No one worries much about that. But Amazon doesn't allow B&N to sell books on the Kindle. Amazon knows very well that people won't do that because they won't be able to use them there. That's not an issue. Nor is buying books through a website. People aren't going to use their Kindles to buy books for a Nook, because it's VERY unlikely they will have both.

The iPad, so far, is the only contrivance where major multiple sellers will be able to have a market. When real Android tablets come out, it will be true there as well. It will be interesting to see whether Google Books, which I also have, will be a big part of Android tablet sales or not, as Google has a very different way of working this.

You better go to these sites and show some information from them, because right now, you're just wasting everyone's time.

Mostly. But only on the slopes.

Subscriptions are recurring until you cancel them. While I have other options, is Apple really entitled to 30% of my subscription fee forever because I used the iPhone app to sign up for the service? The recurring subscription could still be going through iTunes even if I switched to an Android phone at some point, or used the service on my computer most of the time.

That was the point I was trying to make. I understand them charging that kind of money for iOS only subscriptions as that's the going rate for anything iOS, but they seem to be extending the policy to cross platform subscriptions and putting rules in place that make it extremely likely that customers will go through the App Store to activate those subscriptions. I have a major issue with that.

I showed you were wrong about Fictionwise and the Kindle, now it's up to you to show some actual information instead of just making statements, which, so far, have been wrong.

So, go to those sites, and post quotes showing what can be read where. Believe me, if you can show that, I will agree with you.

The Sony reader has a bit of a different business model.
Sony launched it as a reader only. No content store. And no way of buying content on the device.

Consequently, it has always been able to load books from multiple vendors, because initially, Sony had no intention of selling content.

Now, Sony do have a bookstore. But amazingly, still no store on the device!

C.

Why is it insane? Most publishers make money from advertising, not subscription fees. It seems that a lot of people think that the only money publishers stand to make a profit from is subscription fees, which is absolutely not true. This is why it costs so much to buy a single copy of a publication versus subscribing to it. And this is also why the longer the plan, the cheaper the price. Subscription plans allow the publishers to charge more for ad space, because they can guarantee/project distribution numbers (eyeballs). Publishers would much rather have people sign up for subscriptions than buy the magazine from a retailer or news stand.

So Apple takes 30% of a $40 yearly subscription plan to the Daily. They make $12. The Daily rakes in advertising dollars for that sale for the next year. The bigger the audience (iOS users) the more potential to make more on advertising. Plus they get valuable user data, if the user agrees to share it.

I don't see how any of this isn't fair?

that would likely run afoul of the 'same or better' rules.

In the end Apple could have simply banned all outside purchases and even yanked all apps that aren't in compliance right away. And been 100% within their legal rights. After all, when you sign up to develop apps you agree to give Apple 30% of all sales, so by that agreement, outside sales are not in compliance.

Of course they should get 30% of each recurring payment, it's called a commission. The initial sale was made through Apple's sales channel. It doesn't matter that you move to another platform to view the content. Apple's not being unfair in this, they said if the subscription was made outside of Apple's platform, then publishers could offer access for free. Apple isn't forcing them to move the recurring payments to Apple's purchasing system. It is just saying when the initial subscription was made from Apple's devices. If a customer is truly concerned, they could cancel the Apple recurring subscription, and start it up again using some other payment method. Chances are, customers aren't going to care.



How is that? I subscribed to Netflix through their website, and I use my iPad to access and watch Netflix content. Apple will NEVER see any of that money. I don't understand how this forces me to subscribe through Apple at any point in the future?


I could understand the complete meltdown people are having if Apple said, "The only way iOS users will EVER view your content, is if they cancel current subscriptions and resubscribe through AIP." But they aren't saying, and they're not requiring anything that isn't done elsewhere. Anytime a subscription is made through an agent of publisher, the agent gets a commission for as long as that subscription is active. For each recurring payment the agent will get a percentage. This is normal. It doesn't matter if the user switches from print to digital, from Android to iOS. That initial subscription only exists because of the agent.

How dumb do you think Apple is *******?

http://www.fictionwise.com/help/adob...l_editions.htm

On the other hand, if that's the way they've been subscribing for a while, they may just keep subscribing that way.

"Apple today announced a new subscription service available to all publishers of content-based apps on the App Store, including magazines, newspapers, video, music, etc."

I only see SUBSCRIPTION SERVICE, nothing in the press release said anything about a la carte (one-off) purchases. It only makes reference to subscriptions throughout the entire press release.

So, I'm kinda bewildered as to why people are having issues regarding the Kindle app and buying books from Amazon?

No one is arguing that. It's the other point that's in contention here.

New app store review guidelines: