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Rumor: Initial sales of Apple's Verizon iPhone 4 disappoint - Page 3

post #81 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

The differences between the iPhone, iPad, Apple TV and how Apple has adapted iOS for their use is nothing close to what is happening with Android.

You can play the same games on the Verizon iPhone 4, AT&T iPhone 4, and iPad. You can plug a Verizon iPhone 4 and AT&T iPhone 4 into the same peripherals and they will work the exact same way.






Seriously? You are showing this as an example of fragmentation? Seriously?
post #82 of 118
The only thing Apple has made any attempt to dominate is its own platform. They never had any intention of dominating the mobile market in general.

Quote:
Originally Posted by os2baba View Post

Certainly the dominance was doomed. That happened last year as a matter of fact.
post #83 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimDreamworx View Post

Not everyone is going to cancel their contract in the first week.

Especially considering the well-publicized shortages of the iPhone 4 when it first came out.

If you have an iPhone 4 on AT&T, why get an iPhone 4 on Verizon right now. Makes zero sense even if you sell your phone for a good price then pay the ETF.

If you got a 3GS or older, maybe so.

We are looking at a little over four months until iPhone 5 hits most likely.

WWDC looks like it's around June 6 or so so we may see it there.

I don't think there were many switchers yet.
post #84 of 118
Absolutely. Can you play Sony Playstation games on the Motorola Atrix? Can you plug the Sony/Ericson Play into the Atrix docking station?

This is a prime example of why Android is not a congruent platform.

Quote:
Originally Posted by os2baba View Post

Seriously? You are showing this as an example of fragmentation? Seriously?
post #85 of 118
You feel that the success of Android is on its ability to adapt keyboards?

Quote:
Originally Posted by os2baba View Post

But I can tell you from anecdotal experience, one of the main reasons four teenage family friends bought an Android was because of keyboards.
post #86 of 118
Maybe... stay with me now, but just maybe... many people know the iPhone 5 will be out in a hand full of months and would rather sign a new 2-year contract for a new phone rather than one that's almost a year old. (As I am and told my friends to do, wait for June)
post #87 of 118
Any analyst worth their salt should have known this would be the case. People buy the iPhone for the product. Not the carrier. The product is currently more than halfway through it's lifecycle.

No prospective buyer wants it now, save those with itchy trigger fingers and there will always be those.

The real uptick for verizon will be the the iPhone 5. Then there will be smiles all around. The reason it will be big is because it will be a true launch. New product. Not a 6 month old one. Who wants to be stuck in a contract with a device that is already old when you begin?

What verizon is seeing now is the result of smart people in a struggling economy waiting for the best possible time to purchase a NEW product with associated service.
post #88 of 118
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post #89 of 118
Not surprised here. Verizon isn't offering incentives like AT&T had. Who is going to pay almost two hundred dollars for a phone, plus almost a four hundred dollar early termination fee. Verizon customers have to wait until their contracts expire. Same with AT&T people who want to switch. Further, people in the know who can afford to wait will wait until summer.
post #90 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

You really think in July Apple is going to leave money on the table because of concern about people who bought a phone back in February?

You have a very short memory. Back in 2007 they cut the price of the phone by $400, and ended up having to write a very large check to please the people who had already bought the phone. Same thing will happen again. I think Apple LOVES to have a release schedule that will allow them to have 2 large spikes in demand, half a year apart, rather than one EPIC spike in demand in summer.

Watch, it'll happen. Until the iPhone is 4G LTE, which won't happen this summer.
post #91 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

The only thing Apple has made any attempt to dominate is its own platform. They never had any intention of dominating the mobile market in general.

Exactly. And, dominance for the sake of dominance is not a value-creating strategy. Android is welcome to its profitless domination......
post #92 of 118
No my memory is good. I got one of those checks and used it to buy the iPhone 3G.

That is back when the iPhone was brand new and Apple wasn't so sure how well it would do. They cut the price because it was a monster hit. I don't understand how that relates to this situation at all.

I do not see the logic in staggering releases between AT&T and Verizon would result in two spikes. It just results in Verizon getting the same phone later, which would suck for them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

You have a very short memory. Back in 2007 they cut the price of the phone by $400, and ended up having to write a very large check to please the people who had already bought the phone. Same thing will happen again. I think Apple LOVES to have a release schedule that will allow them to have 2 large spikes in demand, half a year apart, rather than one EPIC spike in demand in summer.

Watch, it'll happen. Until the iPhone is 4G LTE, which won't happen this summer.
post #93 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by MOEW View Post

I love it when people try this game.

iOS has more fragmentation than ever. TV/streaming device, music player, iphone, ipad, etc..... The Itunes Operating System started as a music player, and it's been a stretch to adapt it to all of these devices.

In fact, the more that apple releases products, the more iOS fragmentation they will have. Now with a different IP4 on VZW, iOS just got more fragmented.

wtf is Itunes Operating System?
post #94 of 118
Obviously many are holding out for the iPhone 5 which will probably support LTE. If I were looking at getting an iPhone on Verizon I'd wait till June/July too.
post #95 of 118
The next iPhone, the 5 will just be a stop-gap until the real thing - A true LTE - phone is released as the iPhone 6. Buyers who hold out for the 5 will have even more buyers remorse than the buyers of the 4 - who by then will be ready for a subsidized upgrade to the 6. In addition, the $30 Unlimited VZ Data Plan probably won't be available to those who hold out for the iPhone 5. So, they will be doubly hosed.
post #96 of 118
Not necessarily. The current LTE deployment is a stop-gap for LTE Advanced.

At this point HSPA+ can match and exceed Verizon's LTE deployment. That is the reason AT&T isn't too worried about LTE yet.

If AT&T's iPhone 5 has an HSPA+ radio that can achieve the maximum speed. It will be faster than LTE at this point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenstee View Post

The next iPhone, the 5 will just be a stop-gap until the real thing - A true LTE - phone is released as the iPhone 6. Buyers who hold out for the 5 will have even more buyers remorse than the buyers of the 4 - who by then will be ready for a subsidized upgrade to the 6. In addition, the $30 Unlimited VZ Data Plan probably won't be available to those who hold out for the iPhone 5. So, they will be doubly hosed.
post #97 of 118
I don't need the iPhone 5. I waited long enough for the VZW iPhone. And now that I have it, I'll be getting the iPhone 6 next year. Atleast it'll take full advantage of VZW's 4G LTE network!
post #98 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by macinthe408 View Post

Apple needs to get its house in order, or else revenue is going to slip 0.43%.

But it will slip 0.43% vs. what they would have made had it hit expectations but we have no idea what that number should be (since it is all growing so fast).

Damn, my precision AAPL model will be slightly wrong
post #99 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacVicta View Post

Apple claimed they released the CDMA iPhone 4 because Verizon customers demanded it now and couldn't wait for the iPhone 5.

Looks like they were wrong.

Any halfwit can post on the internet - case in point above. How is "set a record in 2 hours" wrong? Or a million units in first week? Seriously, try to go back to sleep.
post #100 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastdoor View Post

Retail store lines and sales may be below expectations, but is that because fewer people are buying the Verizon iPhone than expected OR is it because fewer people are buying it through retail outlets? By all accounts, it has been far easier to buy the iPhone on-line than it was last summer when the iPhone 4 came out on AT&T.

Until we hear from Apple I think it will be very hard to get an accurate picture of what's going on.

Unless we hear from Apple tomorrow, it is unlikely they have sold a million in the first week.
post #101 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalG View Post

I think the point is that if Apple expected a massive amount of buyers (maybe not as much as an initial launch, but still a large number), then they failed. Hopefully this means they don't have an excess of inventory built up if weak sales are true

The rumor was that the initial CDMA build was for 2M units. Not really a problem as Apple will sell them as discounted devices once the next iPhone launches. Or they could get rid of them almost overnight by doing a deal with China Telecom.
post #102 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

You have a very short memory. Back in 2007 they cut the price of the phone by $400, and ended up having to write a very large check to please the people who had already bought the phone. Same thing will happen again. I think Apple LOVES to have a release schedule that will allow them to have 2 large spikes in demand, half a year apart, rather than one EPIC spike in demand in summer.

Watch, it'll happen. Until the iPhone is 4G LTE, which won't happen this summer.

I think Apple will release both versions at the same time - they want to be carrier agnostic. And I think this situation is substantially different than cutting the phone price by 2/3s.

Besides, you then are faced with the same situation you have today - selling a phone half-way through its product cycle.

Apple will likely address any supply issues by adjusting launches in other countries.
post #103 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadash View Post

Because Apple waited too long. If the 3GS would have been CDMA it would have been huge - before Android became a credible challenger. Talking with kids - 17-20 - today, its all about how Android lets you do more stuff and Apple keeps you locked down.

Funny thing - whenever I pass an Apple store, it seems there is always a throng of young people drooling over the iPhone.
post #104 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalG View Post

I'm not saying that Apple is doomed (longterm shareholder), but the point is that the expectations that weren't met were Apple's and Verizon's, not some analyst's. The fact that Apple is smart company with lots of resources, and all of the data from it's own research, Verizon's customer data (when contracts expire, trends of when people will pay ETFs, etc), it irks me that (if the article is true) that their expectations were too high.

That should bother any shareholder at least a little, no?

I am a shareholder. I'm mildly disappointed but not really concerned. More phones will be sold as people come out of contract.
post #105 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Not necessarily. The current LTE deployment is a stop-gap for LTE Advanced.

At this point HSPA+ can match and exceed Verizon's LTE deployment. That is the reason AT&T isn't too worried about LTE yet.

If AT&T's iPhone 5 has an HSPA+ radio that can achieve the maximum speed. It will be faster than LTE at this point.

Yeah but the iPhone 5 on Verizon will still be on slow as shit 3G. HSPA+ means nothing for the Verizon people who are probably 16+ months from seeing an LTE iPhone.
post #106 of 118
I was all set to get an iPhone on Verizon. I was fed up with the Bugs Google intorduced in Froyo. However, last week a ROM developer came up with a custom Gengerbread ROM ( SS 5.0 ) and it fixed all of the bugs that Google caused in the Froyo ROM's. Motorola finally released a good Sync app for the mac that seamlessly syncs my music, Playlists, Photos and videos between the droid and iTunes. It is actually a little easier to setup than iTunes's native sync...

I am kind of enjoying the old Droid again. It is smooth and has a lot of really nice features that the iPhone does not have. I really do not want to give them up. Also I would have to pay $700.00 to get an iPhone as I have a year left on my 2 year contract.

Here are the features I would miss:

1) Free Wifi & USB Tethering. I use it to connect my iPad to 3G when not in a AT&T 3G area which is quite often. I also use it to connect my laptop when necessary.

2) Voice commands. Google did a great job with voice inputs. I can sent text and email by simply telling the phone who I want to send it to and saying the message. Really cool.

3) Voice text input in ANY text field. When the keyboard pops up I simply hit the mic and say what I want typed. I rarely type a lot any more. The Voice to text in Google is excellent.

4) Google Maps. Google Maps are simply better don in Android that on the iPhone ( remember I have an iPad for comparison )

5) I like being able to actually mount the phone as a USB drive to copy a file or directory between computers. I work with high tech equipment and a hande USB drive is nice to have.

6) I also like having Flash capability in the browser. Like it or not there is still a huge part of the web that is goign to be Flash only for a long time. I like to read about Automobile news and almost all of the sites are flash based.
post #107 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by penchanted View Post

Besides, you then are faced with the same situation you have today - selling a phone half-way through its product cycle.

Really? And how is that different from trying to sell a GSM iPhone in February? By your logic shouldn't they just stop selling phones after December?
post #108 of 118
This may have more to do with low sales than anything. Before getting my iPhone I was a Verizon customer and frankly have found AT&T to be a far more professional organization. By a very long shot. AT&T might not have the coverage (certainly not a problem for me), but it also doesn't have all the crap associated with Verizon.

Examples of Verizons crap: Kiosks in the local malls where the reps act as if they work for a traveling carnival. In actual free standing Verizon stores whole teams if sales people with extrodinary bad attitudes which are magnified in proportion to the persons stupidity with respect to knowledge about what they are selling. Endless marketing crap being directed at you. Bills and charges that are a complete mystery.

I could go on but at this point AT&T has my respect as a business. At least locally you actually feel like a customer. Verizon simply isn't all it is cracked up to be and has the feel of a slightly sleazy business. So unless you are in a class of people that don't have a choice, jumping ship to go with Verizon doesn't make a lot of sense.
post #109 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalG View Post

well then let me elaborate:
-Apple had expectations that they would be a certain number of handsets sold at launch
-expectations would be based on the current generation device and what they perceive as the market demand for it
-this article theorizes that initial sales numbers did not meet those expectations or those of Verizon either
-if the article is in fact true, then it means that what Apple thinks about itself and its products doesn't actually represent where customers are willing to put their money

from that, I'm trying to say:
-Apple should bring their A game to all product releases and stop holding back features. They'll have to work harder to win over the customer whether because of competition, or because their product cycle timelines are becoming more predictable
-Apple does have a lot of sway. But I think they should realize that they shouldn't always use their influence especially when the outcomes don't always meet their expectations. This refers to the tough line they stood on the Verizon deal for years, the current subscription policy, cost of songs on iTunes, Flash (maaaybe not =p)

really



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post #110 of 118
I honestly think the only reason young kids may like some Android phones better is texting. I know two teenagers who love all Apple products EXCEPT the iPhone. The reason is they text a lot and prefer an actual keyboard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadash View Post

Because Apple waited too long. If the 3GS would have been CDMA it would have been huge - before Android became a credible challenger. Talking with kids - 17-20 - today, its all about how Android lets you do more stuff and Apple keeps you locked down.
post #111 of 118
That's true. For the iPhone on Verizon WiFi will be your friend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AIaddict View Post

Yeah but the iPhone 5 on Verizon will still be on slow as shit 3G. HSPA+ means nothing for the Verizon people who are probably 16+ months from seeing an LTE iPhone.
post #112 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenstee View Post

The next iPhone, the 5 will just be a stop-gap until the real thing - A true LTE - phone is released as the iPhone 6. Buyers who hold out for the 5 will have even more buyers remorse than the buyers of the 4 - who by then will be ready for a subsidized upgrade to the 6. In addition, the $30 Unlimited VZ Data Plan probably won't be available to those who hold out for the iPhone 5. So, they will be doubly hosed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacHead75 View Post

I don't need the iPhone 5. I waited long enough for the VZW iPhone. And now that I have it, I'll be getting the iPhone 6 next year. Atleast it'll take full advantage of VZW's 4G LTE network!

Yep. This is why I bought an iPhone 4. By the time my contract reaches it's end date, the 6 should be good to go, and then LTE will be in the picture.
post #113 of 118
Iphone5 is a hold out for many people. Others are on a wait &see status as to how Verizon handles the load.
Perhaps the Verizon Iphone4 wasn't a blowout, however it certainly was a winner according to the COO of Verizon.
post #114 of 118
1) New iPhone less than six months away
2) Verizon has horrible terms for length of time to get new phone subsidies making getting the iPhone 4 that much of a worse proposition vs. waiting for the iPhone 5
3) AT&T doesn't suck nearly as bad as many would have you believe
4) All of the above means people are probably going to wait until their current contracts are up before moving

<sarcasm>What a complete shock that there wasn't a mass uptake of the iPhone on Verizon! </sarcasm>

However, I have no doubt there will be plenty spinning this as an Apple failure or some other such nonsense.
post #115 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Really? And how is that different from trying to sell a GSM iPhone in February? By your logic shouldn't they just stop selling phones after December?

The attraction is highest at product introduction and, I believe, Apple has every intention of being carrier agnostic. No, they don't stop selling phones but I think Apple will want a unified launch in the US.
post #116 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnyc View Post

as much as I don't know you, I hope this serves as a wake up call that despite all of what you might think of yourself, you shouldn't think that you had anything of substance to say.

Best post in the thread...
post #117 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Yeah. Apple is Doomed.

Beleaguered...
post #118 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by MOEW View Post

iOS has more fragmentation than ever.

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."
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