Apple's iPad 2 prompts Samsung to improve 'inadequate' parts of Galaxy Tab 10.1 - Page 4

Because Honeycomb is buggy and still not ready for tablets.
Read the review at Neowin.net.
I guess that extra 1GB of RAM didnt make things so smooth for Honeycomb.

You sure are a happy kid
Your keyboard must be having issues as the autocorrect doesn't seem to work (as claimed) if you are using a xoom to watch all this.

Happy home screening

On the other note: Moto must be feeling lonely ..... at that price point.

Apple should do a fake keynote sometime!

Steve Jobs would get on stage and talk about an upcoming product which is due to ship in the future, and we all know as soon as he's done talking, the competitors will immediately get to work in copying the design and specs of the product. Like a bunch of monkeys, they copy, they don't innovate.

Then a couple of months later, Apple has another keynote, and Steve Jobs says that they were only kidding, and this is really what our product is going to look like. It would be hilarious and it would cost the competitors many millions of dollars of wasted money in their attempts to copy something that turns out to be not the actual product with bogus specs.

I am very concerned I just want to make sure everyone is practicing safe sex. I know Mouse might forget seeing is always in battle against the poor morals of companies like Google. I just want to make sure that when Mouse is flying around the world in his spandex suit he is well protected from the evils of the world.

Every time Skater hears the phrase, "race to the bottom", he gets excited... it means an entirely different thing to him...

I think they accomplish the same effect through leaks and certain patent applications.

Yeah but unlike most of the guys on this forum I do that to women that don't need to be blown up.

yea but can you not answer how flash-based input interactivity on .swfs can work on touch-based systems

What gets me about commentary like this is this: why aren't you banging your spoon against your tin pan and screaming 'xoom is just a big droid'?

There is precious little intellectual honestly in arguments like 'it's just a bigger <x>' - all that really tells us is you've found a convenient way to dismiss something that you'd rather not acknowledge. But if truth be told, sometimes the entire experience is changed because the device affordances have changed. And guess what? Size is an affordance.

The absurdity of your argument is really clear if you start applying it to other products. "Hey, an SUV is just a bigger hatchback." "Hey, a 737 is just a bigger Cessna". "Hey, a 52 inch TV is just a bigger 25 inch TV" - you can go on and on and on, and there will be one commonality among every example: each is utterly banal and carries within it not even the hint of a thoughtful examination.

Even if these devices really were just 'bigger iPod touches' (which is factually incorrect to begin with), that analysis would still not form the basis of a reasonable argument.

And there are still about 2x more apps for the iPhone than there are for Android. In fact, since the droid was released, there have been more new apps released for the iPhone than Android by a rate of about 300,000 to 200,000. Android isn't closing the gap in number of apps, Apple is expanding the lead in total number of apps available.

Easy tiger - 4G seems to be very competitive upgrade when it gets more widely rolled out. And you'll only have to wait one week for your Xoom to return with the 4G upgrade.

Analyst say that the Xoom is the first true competitor for the iPad and it will truly shine someday when apps get written for it. Some geeks will buy it now because they're geeks and can wait for someday. The only danger i see is that the non-geeks who do not know any better will buy it and have a sub-par experience, especially when they use it next to their friends or families ipad running garageband, imovie, etc.

Those non-geeks will remember their crappy experience and here-in lies the biggest problem that not many are talking about - > All these companies flooding the market with half-baked andriod products are causing harm to their brand. I guess they know that and are making a conscious choice to get in the market as soon as possible and at all costs.

There may be a significant backlash and drop over the longer haul for these brands. Time will tell how it all shakes out and whether or not Xoom will cause their client base to go boom as in blowed up and tattered, or boom as in booming success.

Yeah, that's probably true.

The CEO's of the competitors probably visit Apple rumor sites more often than we do. It's the first bookmark in their browser.

Anything else you're willing to compromise on? Build quality? Display quality? OS that works?

I concur. You got it absolutely right.

Dude really thats the best comeback you have? Maybe something with a bit more humor?

I mean really Shock Wave Flash. Yeah thats really high tech. Glad your mom finally got you that copy of CS5.

Xoom is a big Droid. No arguement here.

Good lord people... leave skater alone... he's still thinks AAPL will never reach $270 ferchrissakes!

Smooth.

So at some unannounced and unknown time in the future, you send your xoom back so they can finish building it (if you buy it with a 2 year data contract that gives you a $200 discount, but has a $350 early termination fee)?

AirSharing Pro on the iPhone works pretty well as a file manager, including linking to DropBox.com and other storage services like that as well as printing (limited). I've heard the AirSharing HD for the iPad is a bit buggy though.

I would love Apple to release something similar, either as an App or something built into iOS 5 that all Apps can access. AirSharing works ok, but it can be painfully slow, even over WiFi.

In this economy I didn't think it would hit above that. I never feel bad about saying I was wrong. Only difference its hard to use that against me seeing I am heavily invested in AAPL.

So really who is the fool, Quadra who said it would and doesn't own a single share or me that owns a shit load. I'll be wrong like that all day long.

Good try though.

Well if they use citrix to show them since the ipad doesn't have flash, they can still do that on the ipad. Citrix is available in the app store.

For somebody who thinks that the ipad is only a toy, you sure do seem to spend a lot time discussing that toy.

Yap. That's it.

Now that AT&T's rolling out WiFi hotspotting, the need for 3G/4G in the tablet itself is declining. I currently have an iPad 64GB WiFi 3G, but am seriously considering the WiFi-only model if I upgrade to the iPad 2.

Use the phone's hotspot feature when I need it, and as soon as Apple releases a 4G iPhone, everything else upgrades automatically.

But hey. If you like paying for a 4G data plan for your phone AND for your Xoom, go for it.

I'm not sure I can agree with you on that. They did have a "coming soon" badge for iOS on the iPad web page which described the coming capabilities. I don't recall what was said at launch time, but it was there after they introduced the iOS upgrade so maybe that came in June? Either way, based on their track records, I have much more faith in Apple than in Motorola. I knew iPad was very new in the market (as others here have said), and I expected the types of changes we've seen in the past 6 months with iOS and iPad 2, so I held off buying. Was the first iPad as rough around the edges as the Xoom and Tab[s] sound? Absolutely not. (Come on, a hardware upgrade that requires you shipping your device to the manufacturer to support LTE? Really Motorola?!) As a consumer voting with dollars I would still take the original iPad over any of the other currently shipping products, and even most of the one's not shipping yet. There is more substance when you consider the full ecosystem. I don't doubt others will catch up, but I'm not willing to be an early adopter any more.

Off topic... I have a bad taste in my mouth regarding my experience with HP as well, only in my case it was a scanner issue and how they dragged their feet on the related software upgrades, among other things. In general, I recommend avoiding HP to my friends these days, depending on their needs.

Perhaps back on topic... I have very high hopes that Palm (now a part of HP--for better or for worse) will do GREAT things. WebOS has great potential, and if HP, with all of their management shake ups and changes really wants to become a "cool" company (as they've compared themselves to Apple), maybe they'll get there. However, until they start shipping product (TouchPad, Veer, Pre 3) and building a different track record I'll be trading over to an iPhone when the contract on my Palm Pre+ runs out (but still keeping an eye on them).

For you, it's a toy ... for the doctor who uses it to help heal the sick and dying, for the teacher who uses it to help educate our future generations, for the musician, both amateur and professional who "make music on it with Garageband, for the movie makers who use it to plot storyboards and the like, for the salesmen at the Mercedes dealership we read about, who use it to help close the sale and for the 100s of others I have yet to hear about .... it most certainly is not a toy, but rather a very, dare I say it, "magical" device that is adding to the quality of their lives. It is saddening to me that you have yet to discover that "magic" in your life. My wish for you is that you someday will experience the sheer joy of that "magic".

How arrogant to just "assume the title of spokesperson" for .... most people.
When are you ever going to learn that just because something applies to you that it must automatically apply to "most people". .... It does not. It is this arrogant style of posting an opinion as fact that makes me and others think of you as a troll.

Productivity means different things to different people. When you finally learn this you will then realize just how great a productivity device the iPad really is.

First of all, it's 'biased' not bias. Secondly, accusing people of it doesn't help your position. Thirdly, your post is utterly ridiculous, asinine, and self congratulating- while feeling the need to constantly throw out childishly lewd personal insults.

From your definition of a 'toy', I was wondering if that term got redefined recently. Because the iPad plays videos, it's a toy? I've never heard a DVD player classified as such. Is a TV a toy? Afterall, its 100% consumption of content, but again, never heard it categorized as such. Because you use your iPad to play games- you feel the need to define it simply as you use it- a toy- and dismiss what others may be using it for. The fact that it is used by so many in a non-toy manner is just that- a FACT- and not a theory or an assumption. So why are you desperately banging you hand on the table, desperately insisting that it be called a toy?

You may call yourself 'as honest as they get' (I doubt it) but that doesn't mean your arguments are even the least bit thoughtful, logical, or have any kind of merit. True, the fact that its sold millions doesn't mean its a great productivity device. The fact that people are using it as a productivity device means that it can be used as a productivity device. Crazy concept, eh?

I'm personally good friends with a restaurant owner who has switched from desktops to iPads to manage orders/status of supplies coming in/payment processing/seating/etc, and according to him, it has greatly streamlined his workflow, his flexibility, and is saving his tons of money in misc costs and maintenance. Should I go correct him and tell him he's doing it all wrong, cause he's using a toy? The design agency I used to work at switched almost exclusively to showing many types design work to clients on iPads instead of laptops- which provided so many advantages that I don't have the energy to list here, improved feedback and interaction mechanisms, and the client response was phenomenal. Anecdotal, but I'm sure hundreds of thousands of other example exist. The iPad (and tablets in general) WILL become more prevalent in business and in such a multitude of industries, regardless of what you choose to call it. Yes, some tasks will be better suited to a traditional laptop/desktop for some time to come. Others are currently and will become more suited to tablets. And there will also be overlap. Just because the iPad may never be as ideal for EVERY SINGLE TASK that doesn't mean it shouldn't exist. That's why Apple still sells their other products, if you haven't noticed. The iPad can be ANYTHING- it's a bank canvas, a very flexible canvas, which is the whole point.

Not sure why I wasted my time on this post, as I've never seen anyone in the history of message-boards admit they were wrong or concede a point.

First of all, there's a big difference between being biased and dishonest. Being biased is simply a matter of having your opinions skewed in a particular direction. Being dishonest is misrepresenting yourself and your posting history, and simply making stuff up to suit your argument. So, whether I am biased or not is irrelevant to calling you out for your blatant dishonesty. You lied, you got caught, you were called out for it.

As to whether the iPad is a toy, maybe to you it is, that's fine, you haven't found anything productive to do with it. But, frankly, that says more about you than about the iPad. Anyone who's been paying attention over the past year knows that iPads are being used as something other than toys by millions of people. So, honestly, it's just a really dumb comment on your part.

Why doesn't it get an educational discount? Assuming that it actually doesn't (since I don't have access to educational pricing) it's probably because of lower margins. But, your argument seems to be that if it isn't offered with an educational discount, it can't be an educational tool. Again, a pretty flimsy argument on your part. The measure of whether it's an educational tool is whether it's used as one or not, not how much it sells for. And the answer to that seems to increasingly contradict your position on the matter.

I am really hoping Steve Ballmer has to announce some change to Microsoft's tablet strategy so I can observe that the lummox was flummoxed.

My point is that it actually does make a difference. I'm sure all the sophomores around here are snickering because I am essentially arguing that size DOES matter.

But look, it does - that's just obvious. The fact that the device offers a bigger display makes it suited to a whole class of uses that a smaller device is not suited for... just as a smaller size makes the smaller device suited to a whole class of uses for which the larger device is not. Dismissive arguments like 'it's just a bigger<x>' come from a very dishonest place because they in essence argue that this fact alone is irrelevant, and it isn't.

More than that, though, the comment just isn't true. An iPad is NOT just a bigger touch. Apple did a lot more work than just giving the touch a bigger display, so making that sort of analysis is just untruthful.

Here's a true story: 3 or four years ago I was on a conference call with some guys from our company's east coast offices, and one of them mentioned that one of our investors was wondering what we thought about how successful a tablet device from Apple might be, and would we be interested in developing for it. I mentioned that any such device would need to have insane battery life, because that is the number one failing of tablet devices of the time, and the biggest thing that precluded them from serious use in most settings. See, the problem with tablets has never been that they are a bad idea, it was the affordances of the devices were off - their implementation was flawed.

When Apple built this device they did more than just scale an iPod touch - that's just a snarky, dismissive attitude. They took a very serious look at both the promise held by this class of devices, and the issues and failings in their existing implementations. Then they cleared the slate, took what they could bring to the table, and created something that eliminated most of the barriers to use that were baked into the existing devices. Competitors were left slack-jawed because they could not differentiate between the promise of the device and the implementation of it, so they were left flat footed.

When you make comments like 'its just a bigger iPod touch', all you are really doing is demonstrating your own flat feet - you are showing us that you cannot grasp how seemingly small or insignificant changes can make massive differences in how well or how badly a device fits for certain kinds of uses.

Now that's funny, right there. Sorry extreme .... but it really is.

And that's the easy part. Next, he'll need to lower his component costs with high volume purchases, which will require large sales volumes. That's doubtful, since he himself admitted that Galaxy Tab sales to end users have been "quite small" (plus or minus some subtleties of Korean-English translation.)

Then he'll need to wait for Google to bring Android up to par with iOS, then wait for Google to fix their malware-infested Android Market, then wait for Google to grow a massive software infrastructure like Apple's, then wait for Google to amass 200 million paying customers.

Or, on the other hand, maybe Mr. Lee is happy to be just another sucker. A sucker who took the free-OS bait and is now locked in. A sucker who is totally at the mercy of Google's whims. A sucker whose goals (hardware profits) are orthogonal to Google's goals (AdMob profits.) A sucker whose customers (end user consumers) are not the same as Google's (AdMob advertisers.)

Every single Android manufacturer wants to make money selling their devices. Google doesn't care. Google only wants to spread Android like a virus, whether or not any of their hardware partners make any money or survive in the mobile consumer electronics market. And that's the biggest problem Mr. Lee faces. His company and Google have completely different long-term goals. And it shows in their mashed-up products.

Well, from that perspective, no computing device is ever released with its full potential realized on launch day, unless the software on it can't be updated.

But, not implementing a feature that could possibly be implemented is not the same as "slipping". For it to "slip", it has to first be planned for implementation in the version you are saying it slipped in. So, multitasking didn't "slip" with the release of the first iPad, it was never scheduled to ship with the first release. Also, just because something is technically possible, doesn't mean it must be implemented. (Something many don't seem to understand.) It may be decided that it's simply a useless feature (my opinion of 1080p playback from an iPad, or any tablet), it may be decided that it would be a nice feature, but it's simply not worth investing the engineering effort in it, or, it may be decided that it's a worthwhile feature, and it may even be on the roadmap, but it hasn't slipped until the version it was scheduled for has come or gone. So, unless you are privy to the roadmap, or it has been publicly announced that feature x will be available in version y, and version y comes without feature x, one is just making stuff up to say that a feature has "slipped".

But, according to your half baked logic, you should never buy any product because there will always be a better next version of that product. In reality, there was nothing half baked about the original iPad, iPad 2 is simply a different cake.

You make many pood goints, Sock.

Have to second that about Ministry Of Transport's summary.


Hah! Maybe his company will give him a Xoom this time, so we can get an honest report on what that feels like.

Calling the iPad -- this insanely useful tool -- a toy, at this stage of the paradigm shift, is obscenely nearsighted. (But then look at the response to "Mouse's" calling him out. I'd say it was reptilian, but I happen to like reptiles.)

Just like some people are tone deaf, there are those who are numb to the tactile and blind to the visual. Ol' DaHard fits in here too, along with Extreme. I kind of hope they stick around, not just for comic relief, but becaue this turns out to be one of the most useful/informative threads I've seen in the year or so I've been following. So many good explanations, too many to quote. Many in debate with the Extreme dieHards.

About honesty and Samsung, by the way, it may be that it is a Korean thing to cop to shortcomings, and part of the process of resolving to improve. Courageous, in other words. I am ready to be corrected by those more familiar with Korean culture . . .

The last resort of the pilloried is to accuse the accuser, in this case all the slavish AI readers who hate anything non Apple. I for one hope Samsung can come up with something good, or Motorola, RiM, etc., because we want to see people keep their jobs, unless they're working for companies who are actually doing damage. Google and Adobe are on the Watch List because of the sleazy way they were ragging on Apple last year for being against the open web. Jobs's letter on Flash sounded very rational by comparison.

It was funny. I found the original iPad 2 marketing video today. They knew this would really pulling in users like Mouse and Quadra.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USPz-EEpEVw

I can't rationalize Samsungs behavior here, they would be far better off getting something to market than engaging in constant delays. It would be most interesting to see what they believe is the problem with their tablet.

Honestly nobody knows what the A5 is now!!! This is one extremely frustrating part of Apples keeping secretes from the buying public.

In any event the A5 does not appear to be all that impressive when put up against already released dual core Cortex A9 based chips. By the way chips aren't really the problem at all. The issue is with how you put them together. The XRay photo that floats about, of iPad 2, clearly shows a minimal of board size for the iPad2. if Samsung or XYZ company wants to compete with iPad they need to carefully consider what they stuff into the machine. That doesn't mean they drop things that many want just that they evaluate the value of everything they build onto the PC board.

Well lets not go over board here, Steve said up to and did not specify where the 9X improvement was obtained. I wouldn't be surprised if we find out the over all improvement averages someplace between 2 and 4X. Besides thee is the question of NVidia and their chips which strongly leverage the GPU component.

These new devices twist that around as the volume on ARM chips is massive. Chips that go into cell phones have a greater volume than the the X86 market. The fact is ARM is significantly below Intel cost wise. It isn't just the CPU either, ARM hardware these days are fully functional SoC. Those SoC effectively replace the standard logic boards of the past so in some ways it is easier for the competition.

Apples investments are significant. There is great leverage in owing entire production lines. However that being said the issue isn't that the competition can't keep up, the problem is nobody is in the drivers seat. Nothing from Microsoft and Android is crap, so the world is still waiting on a significant competitor to appear. It will be very interesting to see if HP has the nuts to push its platform. HP would need to realize that success depends a great deal on things outside the hardware platform. RIM is a longer shot and frankly it looks like they lost it and are getting desperate, I did have great hopes for RIM and Playbook.

In any event there is a lot more to competing with Apple and iPad than price. The word often thrown about is infrastructure, which Apple has fleshed out fairly well. Now Apple is aggressively filling gaps and adding advanced apps. Garage Band is one example here and ought to work very nicely on iPad 2 with its enhanced performance. They literally have the freedom now to entice specific niches with software that will take the competition years to match.

Samsung's 10.1 tab weighs the same and is just one-tenth" thicker than iPad 2. so that can't be what is "inadequate." the camera is fancier too.

the processor/graphics? Samsung manufactures Apple's A5 chip, right? so they would certainly already have known about its performance for some time. the new Tegras that Android tabs are using are all there is for them now, so that can't be it either. maybe the grpahics chip? but video mirroring is hardly a big enough reason to delay product launch.

of course the Honeycomb software is not quite finished yet - Xoom is essentially running on a beta - and waiting a few months for that to be cleaned up would be smart. but he seemed to be talking about hardware, not softwear.

of course, the real reason might be the huge losses - well over $100 million ($250 million? more?) - on the 2 million shipped-but-few-sold ill-conceived DOA 7" Galaxy tab. which means he knows if he screws this one up too, he's fired! so he is being very cautious and wants to see how the market reacts to the Xoom and iPad 2 before placing that big factory order.

that actually is the only thing that makes sense to me.

I would not count on that. The unibody technology is a lot more than what you see in the videos. If Apple really machined the entire slab of Aluminium away to create the thin shell, their costs would be prohibitively high. They use a secret process to first create the basic shell from the slab, and then machine that basic shell to the finished shell.

The crucial part is in how they create the basic shell out - this is done without destroying the remaining part of the slab, so that other smaller components can be created out if the remaining slab. How do we know Apple does this? There is a video where Jon Ive shows how a slab of Aluminium creates an iMac case and two keyboards. If Apple used a destructive machining process how can they get two keyboard cases as well?

Just think of what is required here. If you have a block of wood that is 6x6x6 inches, and you want to cut out a 5x5x5 block from it, and be left with a 6x6x6 block having a 5x5x5 hole, how would you do it? It is this part of the unibody process that stops others from coming out with unibody design.

If it was just a simple machining process, there would be dozens of other companies that have unibody designs, right?

Believe me, Apple is not really exploiting the unibody texhnology fully - simply because they have more lucrative things to do. If they license unibody technology, just that will get them billions in revenues. This is a technology that can revolutionize several industries.