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Apple rumored to ditch glass back for aluminum with iPhone 5 - Page 2

post #41 of 121
Move on, nothing to see here. Not going to happen.

Scratches? FUD. There's not one scratch on any iPhone 4 I've ever seen. Not on the front or the back. Mine has never had a case on it in 9 months. Guess since I don't carry around pockets full of diamonds..
post #42 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

Anyway, I've had enough of glass, aluminum, and plastic. I want the backside of the next Apple product to be made of something else. Something that feels good in the hand.


5 ply birch? You could stain it to match your decor.
post #43 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

If [Verizon] had waited there would be even more of their subscribers jumping ship to ATT.

They did literally say Verizon "didn't want to wait" at the launch.

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post #44 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Scotty didn't invent that, he just mentioned and used it

Scotty gave the formula for transparent aluminum to Dr. Nichols who gets the credit. But who really invented it? Hmmm
post #45 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcoz

I think I'd rather start seeing the rumor mill churn on iOS 5, which is much more far-reaching for apple, and also not much is known yet.

Very true. We all know the iPhone 5 hardware will be great: it's going to be an update to the iPhone 4, which is already pretty awesome, with the negatives of the design fixed (easy to break, external antenna), but probably it will look a whole lot like the iPhone 4. As for specs, a dual-core CPU seems a no-brainer, NFC is very likely, maybe a somewhat bigger screen, maybe 4G, maybe double the RAM to 1 GB, maybe make the entry-level iPhone 5 have 32 GB Flash and introduce a 128 GB version, maybe a somewhat better front-facing camera and a back camera that shoots 1080p. But that's about it, not much more I can think of to make the iPhone 4 better.

iOS 5 on the other hand is still one big mystery, even for people like myself who are ADC members and usually get a heads up months before an official release. Not a single preview or hint about iOS 5 yet. I really think it's going to be a pretty major update that will add all the last bits that people on 'the other smartphone OS' have left to bitch about: better notifications, homescreen customization, and more. One of the possibilities I see happening is more integration with OS X, something like what Motorola tried with the Atrix, but much better, to allow writing applications that are universal for iPhone, iPad AND OS X, and let you work on exactly the same files on every device. Image taking your iPhone 5 to a random Mac, holding it in front of it, and bang! the mac automatically switches to exactly the same desktop and computer you have at home, with the same files, the same settings, the same background, the same everything. They could use the nfc chip for authentication and a cloud-based service for your applications. I've read speculation about this before, and it sounds pretty cool to me (as long as you also keep the option to install and use stuff strictly locally of course).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

Anyway, I've had enough of glass, aluminum, and plastic. I want the backside of the next Apple product to be made of something else. Something that feels good in the hand.

Know what feels good in my hand? Money. Yes, I think the back of the next iPhone should be made of money.

Yes, either from money, or from boobies.
post #46 of 121
I have liked each iPhone iteration having owned the first iPhone, a white 3Gs and now an iP4.

The iP4 is the best electronic device I've ever owned. Having said that, when the iP5 comes out I will sell my 4 and get the 5. That with an iPad2, an ATV and I'm good to go!
post #47 of 121
I guess they give it a cover just like the iPad!

A mix of aluminum and black glass could be really pretty. Something like the iMac would be awesome.

But I wonder how they can make it look just as good on pictures, cuz that's simply what makes people get sold to the product! Having pictures of a new iPhone everywhere should be prettier pictures than the iPhone 4 model. I'm not kidding here, cuz that's a way of making a new product more awesome than the old one - make it look "NEW!" in commercials to make people forget the already pretty iPhone 4.

They have a real issue here, if you ask me! Diamonds would do for the girls, but I'm no girl. A 4" screen would do for the boys I guess? Maybe some liquid metal?

Another problem, if I take off the bumper(!) I'm scared it get scratches or eventually breaks! No glass on the back would do!
post #48 of 121
How about a plastic back but with that sort of suede finish that I've seen on some dumb phones. Of all the models I owned the aluminum iPhone most felt like holding a bar of soap. Very slippery and I dropped it a lot. I do not use a case for my ip4 and have been lucky to have dropped only once. No damage. I got the free bumper but the silicon makes it hard slip in and out of my jeans. Plus it is thinner and prettier w/o the case...
post #49 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

As for your comment about gorilla glass on the back, that's what the iPhone 4 has now and I think that is the problem. Even though it looks and feels great, it is still proving to be a bit too brittle with no case. Likewise it has been scratching more than expected.

No, the iPhone 4 has 'gorilla' glass on the FRONT only, the back is not made from 'gorilla' glass.



As pointed out by Ireland, it is not 'Gorilla' glass.

It is aluminosilicate glass (similar to gorillas products) this is a chemically strengthened glass product and is expensive, which is why the back panel is made from cheaper glass and is more prone to scratches. I have an iPhone 4 and have had no issues with either the front or rear glass scratching but did get a couple of marks on the steel band caused by the rubber bumper case.
post #50 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

A new rumor claims that Apple will abandon the glass back design it introduced with the iPhone 4, and replace it with a new aluminum back, similar to the very first iPhone, with its next model due out this summer....

The only thing I can't decide is if this whole thread is an April fools joke, or if the original "leak" was an April Fools joke played on Apple Insider.

Anyone who believes this nonsense for a second deserves a slap.
post #51 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by eswinson View Post

Maybe we will finally see an application of the transparent aluminum that Scotty invented

Scotty didn't invent transparent aluminum. He only showed somebody else how to make it.
post #52 of 121
Aluminium oxynitride

Thats what they want to be using. Its ceramic material made from Aluminium and can stop a .50 cal round. Its a wee bitty expensive but should do the trick.
post #53 of 121
Seriously, if Apple thought putting 3G in the Apple logo was a good idea, they would have done it with the iPad, which has a much larger Apple logo.
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post #54 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

Aluminium oxynitride

Thats what they want to be using. Its ceramic material made from Aluminium and can stop a .50 cal round. Its a wee bitty expensive but should do the trick.

Put it on iPad, then the soldiers can insert an iPad into their bullet vest and it doubles as armor plating.
post #55 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Responding to BAD PUBLICITY about POOR RECEPTION, Apple decide to make their next phone out of RADIO OPAQUE METAL!

Sorry, but this story maketh sense not.

C.

Antenna is outside of the case. So it doesn't matter what material the back is made out of.
post #56 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by xsu View Post

Put it on iPad, then the soldiers can insert an iPad into their bullet vest and it doubles as armor plating.

Genius !

post #57 of 121
pretty much everything apple makes is from machined aluminum. we know apple wants to save weight and cost. we pretty much know what is going to be in the phone. its the over all design of the phone which people are going to wonder about. I would look to the ipad to see where apple is going. I know my ipad has been very durable. hopefully someone will leave their iphone 5 in a bar
post #58 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by xsu View Post

Put it on iPad, then the soldiers can insert an iPad into their bullet vest and it doubles as armor plating.

Yeah but then people will be trying to shoot thru the Apple since that would not be of the same material most likely "Aim for the center, it's where their weaker Apple logo is!" heh
post #59 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Instead, the report claims that Apple will use a special resin for the Apple logo on the back of the device. Cellular and Wi-Fi data will reportedly travel through the logo, just like Wi-Fi does on the iPad.

I find that hard to believe. The iPad has a big logo on the back, and it wasn't good enough for cellular reception, they had to add another hole at the top.
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post #60 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

No, the iPhone 4 has 'gorilla' glass on the FRONT only, the back is not made from 'gorilla' glass.



As pointed out by Ireland, it is not 'Gorilla' glass.

It is aluminosilicate glass (similar to gorillas products) this is a chemically strengthened glass product and is expensive, which is why the back panel is made from cheaper glass and is more prone to scratches. I have an iPhone 4 and have had no issues with either the front or rear glass scratching but did get a couple of marks on the steel band caused by the rubber bumper case.

This is completely false.
post #61 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Yeah, through the logo AND around the bezel.

And by special resin they mean plastic. "Special resin" ?

Did you know that there are at least two thousand different specialty resins used in in plastic injection molding?

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post #62 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

No, the iPhone 4 has 'gorilla' glass on the FRONT only, the back is not made from 'gorilla' glass.



As pointed out by Ireland, it is not 'Gorilla' glass.

It is aluminosilicate glass (similar to gorillas products) this is a chemically strengthened glass product and is expensive, which is why the back panel is made from cheaper glass and is more prone to scratches. I have an iPhone 4 and have had no issues with either the front or rear glass scratching but did get a couple of marks on the steel band caused by the rubber bumper case.

When I said gorilla glass, I was using that as a catch-all term for any synthetically engineered strengthened glass product. I was under the impression that while Apple did go with a strengthened glass product for iP4, that they did not use the actual Gorilla brand. So are you saying that the front glass of IP4 is actual Gorilla Glass, and the back is not? I thought I remembered from the launch video for iP4 that the front and back were the same type of glass.
post #63 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKpro View Post

I find that hard to believe. The iPad has a big logo on the back, and it wasn't good enough for cellular reception, they had to add another hole at the top.

Probably that had something to do with the WiFi antenna already being behind the Apple logo on the iPad, and the iPad case not having the external antenna band around it. For the iPhone 5, the 3G/CDMA antenna's could be placed behind the logo, and the WiFi antenna in an antenna band similar to the iPhone 4. That would fix the risk of dropping calls when touching the antenna. Attenuating the WiFi signal should be much less of an issue since you don't use it to make calls, your usually closer to the access point, and if I understand correctly, WiFi can use much signal higher energy anyway to compensate for a weak connection. So I'd say it is possible.
post #64 of 121
I'd rather have plastic back. Anything else I probably would have to put on a case and I never like the idea of using a case.
post #65 of 121
"the report claims that the weight of the glass has prompted Apple to reconsider..."

i don't understand. something must have been lost in transalation.

do they mean "light weight" as in durability (in regards to shattering)?
post #66 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

Seriously, if Apple thought putting 3G in the Apple logo was a good idea, they would have done it with the iPad, which has a much larger Apple logo.

Yeah, it's one of the clues telling you that this whole report is bogus nonsense.

Apple is not going to replace the giant steel antenna they currently have on the outside of the device for a smaller antenna with poorer reception located inside the device. Even if they did, encasing that smaller antenna inside an aluminium shell is just doubling-down on the stupidity.

The Wi-Fi antenna on the iPad already has problems and it has literally 8 times the surface area of the logo on the iPhone. Additionally, talk of a "special resin" that conducts Wi-Fi is pure garbage and whomever uttered the words knows sweet f*ck-all about science, eletro-magnetics, design or probably anything at all. Plastic is plastic, they are pretty much all radio-transparent.

The iPhone 4 is the best design they've come out with for a while, significantly changing it up after the very first time they use it is the stupidest thing Apple could do (at least without a clear reason to do so). I would expect the next two or three iPhones will use this same basic design of the annular metal ring and the two radio-transparent cover plates. It's a fabulous design and it works really well in practice.

Another way to look at it is if you look at each of Apple's products, the first model is usually quite different from the rest and by the time they get to the second or perhaps third model, they usually have the design kind of "set in stone" and the only things that change from there on in are details. It was the same with the iPod, and the Air and lots of other stuff too.

iPhone 4 is the reference design IMO and it won't change significantly for a while. Thinner and smaller perhaps, different materials for the back plate maybe (but not aluminium), but I wouldn't expect any real design changes.
post #67 of 121
This is hilarious. When the glass sandwich design was leaked around this time a year ago everyone was up in arms... "that's so ugly... the curved back is so much nicer" and now a curved back design is leaked and everyone is up in arms... "that's so ugly... the glass back is so much nicer"
post #68 of 121
Glass lends itself to immense new possibilities -

- embedding Solar Panel under the glass, so phone can get charged from Ambient light. A panel the size of the iPhone4, would generate decent bit of electricity.

- Apple now allows engraving for customizing phones. Glass could be used to embed photos internally. Apple could allow you to upload a photo, print it out, and embed it behind the glass.

I think there is also a question to be asked, why not use gorilla glass for the back, like the front. If it works for the front panel, should definitely work for the back panel! In terms of cost, I am sure it will cost more, but can't be more than a dollar or two more, for each iPhone. It is worth it for Apple to use Gorilla Glass, considering how the margins Apple has on this device.

I guess Gorilla glass might be marginally heavier than the normal glass Apple uses on the iPhone4 - but again, this is a small price to pay. Apple can easily get the weight reduced by reducing the battery size, and using an embedded solar panel to get better battery life. This is the sort of innovation one would expect from Apple.

Today it is actually possible to have a Solar Film PRINTED on the Gorilla glass - so there will not be any increase in thickness/weight because of this panel.
post #69 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

iPhone 4 is the reference design IMO and it won't change significantly for a while. Thinner and smaller perhaps, different materials for the back plate maybe (but not aluminium), but I wouldn't expect any real design changes.

You make some good points. And I agree that it is weird for Apple to completely start over and throw out the iP4 playbook design after only one product cycle. But, they do have to make it clear that they have addressed the major design concerns in order to convince users to upgrade.

Even if the Antenna problem didn't turn out to be as huge as some detractors had hoped, it was still an issue. And I think Apple really wants that monkey off their back once and for all. They don't have to come out with a complete redesign, but it has to appear that they eliminated the antenna issue, or greatly minimized it. Whether the antenna is internal or external is anyone's guess. I like the idea of external, if it works. A coating perhaps?

Likewise, the back glass panel, while pretty and industrial, is just too fragile. They definitely need to change this up. I'm okay with plastic (resin) as long as it doesn;t feel as cheap as my 3Gs. I'm very curious to see what happens in June as I am ready to upgrade.
post #70 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by d-range View Post

Probably that had something to do with the WiFi antenna already being behind the Apple logo on the iPad, and the iPad case not having the external antenna band around it. For the iPhone 5, the 3G/CDMA antenna's could be placed behind the logo, and the WiFi antenna in an antenna band similar to the iPhone 4. That would fix the risk of dropping calls when touching the antenna. Attenuating the WiFi signal should be much less of an issue since you don't use it to make calls, your usually closer to the access point, and if I understand correctly, WiFi can use much signal higher energy anyway to compensate for a weak connection. So I'd say it is possible.

If they were keeping the same design, why would they go with an aluminum back in the first place? Furthermore, the rumor is that Apple will abandon the steel bands and run 3G and WiFi thorough the logo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple is also rumored to be looking to abandon the steel outer frame of the iPhone 4, which doubles as the device's antennas. That design decision led to bad publicity when it was discovered that covering a section of the antenna could degrade a wireless signal.

Instead, the report claims that Apple will use a special resin for the Apple logo on the back of the device. Cellular and Wi-Fi data will reportedly travel through the logo, just like Wi-Fi does on the iPad.
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post #71 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by macarena View Post

Glass lends itself to immense new possibilities -....
- Apple now allows engraving for customizing phones. Glass could be used to embed photos internally. Apple could allow you to upload a photo, print it out, and embed it behind the glass.

If Apple goes with a glass back again, then your thoughts on it having a solar panel is an excellent idea. However, no offense to you personally, but having a physical photo printed and embedded behind the glass back sounds like an awful idea. I can't imagine Apple ever doing something like this.

As far as customization is concerned, it would be nice if Apple could figure out a way to come up with a way to deliver different colors of metal. And I don't mean a way to color the outside of the metal, because this always ends up scratching or flaking off. From there it looks like they delivered a crap product and the class action lawsuits start to fly. What I would like is a way for them to have the aluminum (or whatever metal) actually be a different color throughout. Then having some custom colors (black, gunmetal gray, midnight blue, etc.) could look really cool.
post #72 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by autism109201 View Post

Aluminum? Really? Look, I don't know of a single aluminum-backed iPod that is free of scratches. I do know iPhone 4s that are free of scratches. But yeah, these rumors…>_>

Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

I had an original iPhone and the aluminium scratched incredibly easily. They should just do the back in gorilla glass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OllieWallieWhiskers View Post

i think you've confused your metals.

my aluminum 2nd gen iPod nano is pretty scratch free... there are dings and dents from the several times i've dropped it... but very few scratches.

i really wish Apple would turn to aluminum on the iPod touch... the current stainless steel back scratches way to easily.

The iPod touches have polished stainless steel, like Ollie says, and it is impossible to keep scratch-free. The first time you wipe off a fingerprint, you get a scratch, even with the softest cloth. That's the way stainless is, very soft, scratchable by dust particles when they are wiped off.

The aluminium (Ive's pronounciation) on the iPod nanos I have -- the video version, don't remember the gen. number -- are coated with some glossy finish that doesn't seem to scratch at all easily, but it is shiny-cold, and would not be a pleasant finish for a flat slab such as an iPhone would have. I wonder if it's an anodizing. It seems like a clear plastic, though. Not very slippery.

Best-looking metal finish yet IMO is the brushed and/or bead-blasted plain, uncoated (but anodized?) aluminium of the iPad and iMac, but I don't know its scratch resistence, since mine's been in a case since day one last April. It shows some polishing from the case flap, so it's probably pretty scratchable. And it is a lot slippier than glass or the coated nano, oddly.

I have no experience with the first iPhone. What was that like?
post #73 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

You make some good points. And I agree that it is weird for Apple to completely start over and throw out the iP4 playbook design after only one product cycle. But, they do have to make it clear that they have addressed the major design concerns in order to convince users to upgrade. ...

I agree with you but we disagree on the bolded part which makes all the difference in the world.

IMO, there are no "major design concerns" that's all just media hype. So yes, I would agree if they do change the design, that would be a good reason, but on the other hand, I don't think that reason exists in the real world.

So that takes me back to thinking they won't redesign it because there aren't any real design problems with the current one.
post #74 of 121
Why the fuss over wear-marks on a tool that you carry and handle daily? If it's a work for art for you, put it in a case, wear cotton gloves, or just keep it framed on the wall.
post #75 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I agree with you but we disagree on the bolded part which makes all the difference in the world.

IMO, there are no "major design concerns" that's all just media hype. So yes, I would agree if they do change the design, that would be a good reason, but on the other hand, I don't think that reason exists in the real world.

So that takes me back to thinking they won't redesign it because there aren't any real design problems with the current one.

I purposely said concerns as opposed to flaws to lessen the severity. I don't think they are flaws per se, I just think improvement is needed. They are at least concerns that I have. And even if it is a perception issue with antennas, it is still a concern for a good number of people. I don't think the iP4 antennas are inferior by any means. In fact, I think they are great in most ways. I just think Apple needs to find a process to tweak them, either giving them a coating, or attaching them differently, or maybe even having multiple antennas for each purpose to add redundancy. And likely there are other cool engineering tricks that I am unaware of. This is all I would need, just an effort to improve it.

As for the glass back, I definitely have concerns here. The glass back is gorgeous and feels really really good. But I don't want to have to use a case. And if the back glass is not strong enough to withstand a drop or two without cracking, then they have to make a change.
post #76 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcoz View Post

There isn't much left to guess about though is there?

I think I'd rather start seeing the rumor mill churn on iOS 5, which is much more far-reaching for apple, and also not much is known yet.

Yes, I agree. At last week's event, I was looking forward to seeing a preview of iOS 5 more than the hardware of iPad 2. The smartphone space underwent enormous hardware jumps from 2007-2010 but I feel like it is getting mature now. The real differentiation is in the software.

I'm curious when iOS 5 will debut/arrive! Usually they preview it in March and release it in June. But a big ol March event (iPad 2) just came and went with no word. I suspect that they need some extra time to reconcile the different form factors that iOS runs on (iPhone vs. iPad). Knowing Apple, they want any/all differences to be minimal and super elegant. I hope it isn't pushed back to a June preview + September launch timeline - I plan on getting an iPad 2!

I do admire Apple though, for their patience. They're not always the first to bring something, but when they do it's 100% thought out and beautiful. Here's hoping that they'll bring the same magic to notifications and other iOS upgrades.

iPad 2 + iOS 5 = dream
post #77 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by acslater017 View Post

iPad 2 + iOS 5 = dream

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post #78 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonkin View Post

Why the fuss over wear-marks on a tool that you carry and handle daily? If it's a work for art for you, put it in a case, wear cotton gloves, or just keep it framed on the wall.

Ya got a point. I went on at length because some were confusing polished stainless steel with aluminium, and nobody has talked about the coating on the nanos, that I know of. But the scratch level on the stainless touches would be completely unacceptable on the Phone, which is supposed to be an art piece. Matte aluminium would be ok with usage marks (has character, after all) but it's way too slippery in its iPad form for a phone.

Edit: In fact, the original report seems to conflate stainless and aluminium, according to AI, but it's hard for me to tell from the Chinese (!).
post #79 of 121
Is zirconium an option for the back?
post #80 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by copeland View Post

The only real pro for aluminum on the back of the iP5 is weight.
Getting rid of the glass on the back could save Apple quite some weight.
And yes I like the design of the iP4 as it is now.

What? Do You even realize how light the back cover is?

Aluminum will only make It heavier.
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