or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Microsoft abandons Zune media players in iPod defeat
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Microsoft abandons Zune media players in iPod defeat - Page 3

post #81 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

Like you said, yet. What goes up must come down. I'm not saying iTunes/iPod will fall the way of the dodo, but it can drop like IE against its competitors. It's just that no one has figured it out.

One important distinction is that Apple has pushed and evolved the iPod since its introduction, morphing it into the current iOS-based iPod Touch. In fact, most of this evolution occurred during iPod's dominance.

IE is a different story: Microsoft beat Netscape and had IE installed in over 90% of computers, including the early versions of Mac OS X. Then they stopped at IE6, for several years. It looked like this was the end of browser innovation. It wasn't until new competitors like Firefox, Opera, Safari started to erode their browser dominance that Microsoft began upgrading IE.

Apple would have to complete stagnate like Microsoft did with IE6 before that kind of drop can take place. So far, they've stayed on top by staying on top. In other words, Apple is doing something right when people trade up from an iPod to a newer iPod.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #82 of 145
Hey at least iPod haters have the Dell DJ as an alter . . . err, wait.

Another one bites the dust.
post #83 of 145
"Windows Phone 7 Series"

"It seems the stunning Zune HD interface was something of a trial run for the new Windows Phone 7 Series software... It is also understood that Microsoft is stipulating all phones must also include an FM radio tuner."

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/paulspain/7095

Did HD Radio in the Zune HD leave you half-broke and with a bad taste in your mouth, MS? LOL!
post #84 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

It was (and still is) lipstick on a pig. The hardware was actually pretty good but the software as usual had much to be desired.

No love lost here. At least WP7 shoes some glimmer of promise. Maybe Microsoft is finally realizing the stupidity of its ways? Nah...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

"the company was going to remain in the market for the long haul"

Guess the long haul is over. Time now for the iPad killer - the Zune Tablet!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

Anyone got any idea on how well the Zune platform is doing on Xbox?

Quote:
Originally Posted by some internet dude View Post

MS mite as well give up on the phone 7 thing too. In the face of Android nothing stands a chance. You guys need to concentrate on the Windows OS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LuisDias View Post

We have to recognize that the current windows phone 7 series is at least a seriously rethinking of what a smartphone should be.

And that Kinect is really good.

What I wonder is what Microsoft will do with Kinect. We have seen its potential in hundreds of amazing hacks all over the internetz. We have even seen videos of Microsoft employees doing interesting stuff with it.

But I doubt they will bring this stuff to the PC, or anything else. Apple learned a lot from iOS and brought things "back to the mac", I seriously doubt Microsoft's ability to do the same with its exclusive product.

So we will have to wait to see what Apple will do with Kinect - type of technology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

My neighbor has a Zune and really likes it. I sent him this story link.

Really though, I completely agree. The Zune was good hardware with OK software at best. The marketing was terrible (an entire campaign based on the word "social?"--WTF?). It's funny...I just posted on this topic of "iPod Killers."

Originally posted by SDW2001:

Some of the Zune software's in WP7, but before this announcement - which I heard was coming some weeks ago - everything WP7 and Zune was placed under the group developing Windows 8. Apparently this had NOT been the plan until the alarm bells about Apple's phone success and tablet hegemony plus seeing Chrome and Android both stripping hardware partners away from MS began ringing too loudly.

The (derivative) idea is to emulate Apple, so that as iOS is based on the OS X kernel, Windows Phone 8 (WP8) and Win Tablet 8 (WT8) and the full Windows 8 (W8) are supposed to be built on a single (true Windows) modularized code base.

This is, of course, so that the 3 variants can then evolve synchronously and feed ideas into each other: "One Windows to rule them all" on three form factors. AND bits of stuff from XBox are also reportedly being incorporated so that Kinect should work in some fashion with W8. (Tho' I don't think X-Box is being totally Windowized at this point.)

Of course, MS is emulating in reverse - trying to cram the core of Windows into a phone - which is basically why MS OS's for phones and tablets have sucked so badly in the first place. But this time WP8 and to some extent WT8 are supposed to run on the tile interface from WP7 - which is being ripped off the top of whatever was on the bottom and shoehorned back into small devices.

Some work is also supposed to carry over to the Windows Live cloud stable, and the Zune Music Store (if that's the right name) is supposed to morph into a service also including, one guesses, apps and other iTunes Store like offerings.

The process is being called "componentizing" Windows and creating nested sets and supersets of functions, so that touch can be incorporated at all level of devices, e.g.

This is what the Windows on ARM demo and announcements were all about a month or two back. And the Nokia Alliance is somehow part of it as well. Of course this means there won't be a WP8 until the end of 2012 and no Win Tab 8's until mid-'12 at the earliest. (And that timeline's been officially announced.)

Which makes you wonder, even if they pull it off cleanly right out the gate, if it will really matter by then. They'll be releasing into the by then very well-entrenched teeth of iOS 6 (or 5.x at least), iPhone 6, iPad 3 (or 4 according to the still not totally dead "iPad 3 this fall" rumor) - plus multiple new iterations of Android for phones and tabs.

There will be what amounts to a WP7 SP1 release later this year ("Mango,") but since it's on the to be discarded base, how much love and effort will it get?

Anyway, friends and neighbors, that's what I hear the plan is.

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply
post #85 of 145
post #86 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbordelon View Post


What Microsoft should do is QUIT trying to catch up with everyone else and start focusing on something new and different like they did 20 years ago. That's the only chance they have of ever being as good as they once were.

At least that's the opinion of a 25 year Microsoft developer

In their entire history of existence, what has Microsoft done that was something new and different?
post #87 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcallows View Post

In their entire history of existence, what has Microsoft done that was something new and different?

Ummmmm... the answer would be nothing!
Use duckduckgo.com with Safari, not Google Search
Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
Reply
Use duckduckgo.com with Safari, not Google Search
Been using Apples since 1978 and Macs since 1984
Long on AAPL so biased. Strong advocate for separation of technology and politics on AI.
Reply
post #88 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

Anyway, friends and neighbors, that's what I hear the plan is.

Interesting - thanks.

Perhaps we can reflect again on brentbordelon's words:

Originally Posted by brentbordelon

What Microsoft should do is QUIT trying to catch up with everyone else and start focusing on something new and different like they did 20 years ago. That's the only chance they have of ever being as good as they once were.

At least that's the opinion of a 25 year Microsoft developer


All the best.
Where are we on the curve? We'll know once it goes asymptotic!
Reply
Where are we on the curve? We'll know once it goes asymptotic!
Reply
post #89 of 145
I saw a Verizon branch just a few blocks from the Boylston Apple store. I tried my Sandbox website at the Apple Store and it loaded fasi. The iPad sample in the Verizon branch did not work. It gave an error about connection. Oddly enough, the website loaded in the Samsung tablet (what a bargain, $199 with a keyboard). The website though was slow compared with the loading in the iPad (Boylston Apple Store).

The Xoom, felt so foreign and heavy, and the place was so dark (this was past 7 pm), I did not recognize the icons at all. Then, a couple came wanting to see Xoom (sorry Apple fans, there are Xoom buyers).

The salesman was reciting all these specs of the Xoom, and keep on comparing it with the iPad. In between, he claimed he has an iPad but is trying to get rid of it because he preferred the Xoom.

"The iPad does not run Flash, the Xoom does... The iPad does not have 4G. supposedly the Xoom does" -- conveniently omitting that both are not existing features of the shipped Xoom. [Or, were there new developments about these features in the Xoom?] I was tempted to enter the conversation to correct the misinformation, but decided, "Who cares, if some people buys the Xoom?" The older guy was telling his daughter/gf/wife??? (who was with him) that he liked the Xoom better.

They might have come from the Apple Store because they did not try the Apple iPad, also on display but "not working". The salesman never even bothered to show the iPad.

Then, an African American guy came in and he zoomed in to the Xoom. He was playing some games. [Yes Apple diehards, there are potential Xoom buyers.] He stated he did not want to buy the Xoom with the contract. The salesman responded, he might be better off waiting for the Wifi only.

"When is it coming out?". "In a couple of months," the salesman responded. He did not show the iPad either.

If this was typical, and a Verizon policy (and not just the salesman's preference and dislike of the iPad), no wonder the Verizon iPad is not selling well.

CGC
post #90 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertMorein View Post


Microsoft will be gone as an entity by the end of 2012. It's just too bad it takes so long for thieving bastards to get their due.

Don't get too carried away.

CGC
post #91 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by _Hawkeye_ View Post

That's its natural color, as it comes out the end of the assembly line.

Does that mean aluminium iDevices are coming out of the end of Droid assembly line? I'm lucky-guessing here Droids don't do brown
post #92 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

It was (and still is) lipstick on a pig. The hardware was actually pretty good but the software as usual had much to be desired.

No love lost here. At least WP7 shoes some glimmer of promise. Maybe Microsoft is finally realizing the stupidity of its ways? Nah...

except hte hardware is gone, and the software lives on in WP7...
Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, coming iPhone 5S, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x1, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod classic...
Reply
Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, coming iPhone 5S, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x1, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod classic...
Reply
post #93 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by megatrick View Post

Microsoft has been giving it to us in the brown for years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

... and steaming!

Like this?
post #94 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by donarb View Post


LOL. More like "feeling stupid his whole life."
When was Zune ever...rad?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #95 of 145
It was a valiant attempt. They were way to late. That brown color was a huge mistake. The Zune HD looked kinda cool tho.
post #96 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

Of all the dumbass things Microsoft have done over the years, I would vote releasing a Zune in brown as the second dumbest thing.

The dumbest obviously is Balmer being appointed CEO.

What do you think second dumbest is?


Well squirt!

The second dumbasst thing Microsoft has done is RETAIN Balmer.
OMG here we go again...
Reply
OMG here we go again...
Reply
post #97 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

LOL. More like "feeling stupid his whole life."
When was Zune ever...rad?

Perhaps not! Over time:

° To the Zune initiated, the tat will symbolise that it was great while it lasted. (Even though it probably wasn't.)

° To the uninitiated and unknowledgeable, it will be just a pretty tattoo. (Doesn't look too bad.)

° To the uninitiated though knowledgeable, well... just leave the sleeve rolled down!

Does Bill Gates ever comment on developments in public, anyone know of any interviews?
Where are we on the curve? We'll know once it goes asymptotic!
Reply
Where are we on the curve? We'll know once it goes asymptotic!
Reply
post #98 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeRange View Post

It is only compete morons who have no clue about basic business principles that call Apple's margin for sales on their system a "subscription tax". What retailer do you know that says "oh, I'll build a store and just let suppliers stock their inventory there while I do all the marketing, logistics, inventory, provide the sales and delivery platform, and take no cut of the sale"?

Simmer down internet tough guy, did someone piss in your cheerios?

You forgot to mention the fact that Apple gives ISV's no choice about using an alternative to most of the items you mentioned and that it's upending companies and businesses that helped build Apple's great platform. If it's such a non-issue, why have the US + EU kicked off an inquiry?

Replace Apple with Microsoft in the story and I'm sure many would be singing a different tune.
post #99 of 145
What a bad idea. Releasing the Zune yeah, but more importantly killing it so soon. Soon? Yeah, soon. After killing Plays-For-Sure with the Zune, and then killing the Kin within months of its release, and now killing the Zune after just a few revisions. It's hard to believe any vendors will take Microsoft seriously with future endeavors that don't involve already well-established products.
post #100 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by IQatEdo View Post

Interesting - thanks.

Perhaps we can reflect again on brentbordelon's words:

Originally Posted by brentbordelon

What Microsoft should do is QUIT trying to catch up with everyone else and start focusing on something new and different like they did 20 years ago. That's the only chance they have of ever being as good as they once were.

At least that's the opinion of a 25 year Microsoft developer


All the best.

I forgot one thing and you just made me realize another:

1. The new "Win 8 Family" is a "bet the farm" moment for MS. Fail, and they're stuck with 90% of a fading commodity market which won't integrate as well with other makers' tabs and phones as Apple's do with Macs. Result: A still huge base, but one that becomes a relatively static niche, even if a great big niche, i.e., a grey commodity. Or to extend SJ's idiom, mostly a truck (software) maker rather than a sexy car manufacturer.

And with Apple and HP making not only cool cars and scooters and bikes, but with both also in the hot Pickup Truck biz, MS would basically find itself walled in. And for good measure, if netbooks maintain a meaningful presence, Google's Chrome-powered "Netties" will be attacking on another flank.

Result: Irrelevance in the hottest sectors of computing. Like I said, it's cinch up the belt time up in Oregon. Get tough or die. (As any kind of a trend maker in personal [post-PC] computing, at least.)

(RIM's in a big pickle too. They have no computing arm [like Apple and HP], no relevance on the web [like Google and MS], no native apps to speak of - and the BB phones and the new PlayBook have, I believe, very different code bases. Time for a Molson, ehh?)

2. If MS intends for this new codebase to be lean in any meaningful way and truly pointed at future devices rather than at past OS's and devices, they're gonna have a helluva' time doing that if they continue complete legacy support of multiple old versions of Win in deference to their huge installed corporate base (and their cheaper consumers) who hate having to change.

Any parts of that in the core, though, really have to go before they try to get it zip along on a Tegra chip.

So in many ways IMO the code will to be a fairly large break that's at least likely to make at least a big hunk of software and maybe all drivers that currently work on Win 7 and Vista (and often, still, XP) incompatible. And create a kernel (if that's the lowest level of an OS that directly faces hardware, excuse my ignorance if it isn't) which will support multiple processor families equally (something they tried but never really achieved with NT on the DEC Alpha chip in the mid-90's).

Not as big a break as OS9 with OS X and not as huge as Apple's whole shift to X86 from PPC, but in some ways, a bit of both combined. And a big challenge to an elephant that hasn't tap-danced well in a long time.

One possible approach might be to mostly virtualize Win 7 and Vista in ways that lets older programs operate mostly in a sandbox - on the level of Win 8 only (not Win Tab 8 or Win Phone 8). And/or to provide ISV's and peripheral makers tons of support to make their code and drivers functional on Win 8. In kind of a combo Cocoa/Carbon, Rosetta and/or Parallels Coherence way. Or something like that.

That might tide them over until native W8 programs come along. And MS does know a thing or two about virtualization.

Finally, it also means partially rearchitecting all of their own own PC and Server programs over a relatively short period. And they gotta lotta programs.

And that's a pretty challenging To-Do list. For something that might be too late to matter enough in the first place.

Man, how the shoe's moved to the other foot! Now all the pressure's on the one time school bully who's looking more and more like Mickey Rourke's face in The Wrestler. MS is getting beaten up by multiple opponents and they're wobbly on their feet.

So are they gonna suck it up off the mat or are they goin' down??

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply
post #101 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

  1. Tho' I don't think X-Box is being totally Windowized at this point.
  2. trying to cram the core of Windows into a phone - which is basically why MS OS's for phones and tablets have sucked so badly in the first place.
  3. But this time WP8 and to some extent WT8 are supposed to run on the tile interface from WP7
  4. Zune Music Store (if that's the right name) is supposed to morph into a service also including, one guesses, apps and other iTunes Store like offerings.
  5. Which makes you wonder, even if they pull it off cleanly right out the gate, if it will really matter by then.

  1. Job listings have already popped up for Xbox Next which means perhaps a Christmas 2012 or 2013 release.
    If that's the case I wouldn't be surprised if it did end up "Windowized" and running x86 or ARM (a custom Tegra SoC perhaps?)
    I also remember a project to get Silverlight (i.e. potentially the W8 App Store) running on the Xbox.
  2. For tablets yes, for mobile...
    Windows Mobile ran a custom designed mobile OS and it was still pretty crap. I think persisting with a poorly supported, bastardized, spaghetti coded OS (i.e. as opposed to a modular OS like W7/W8 or OSX) and trying to cram a Windows-like UI onto a phone screen added to the poor Windows Mobile performance (among other factors).
  3. That's what I'm hearing as well
  4. Almost certainly.
    • The concept of a "marketplace" for Windows 8 was leaked about 12 months ago.
    • There is a current project to improved Zune media integration across MS devices.
    • There is a current project to bring cable TV across all MS devices.
    • Windows Live will be baked into the W8 core, which means when you sign into a Windows PC (or phone, tablet, car or Xbox) you get access to your account and data, sync'd or stream
  5. I think it will be relevant to business. With Office 365 and Azure it's really looking like Microsoft will successfully extend their Server/Windows/Office "stack" to the cloud. Microsoft won't maintain their monopoly in the enterprise sector as Google and Apple continue to chip away at them, but they will continue to be a dominant force.
    By 2012 they may have lost the consumer sector though, and I think this is what you may have been referring to.
post #102 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mynameisjoe View Post

That stupid paper clip they put in word trumps all.

The paperclip is the ultimate.

Followed by Windows ME? I dunno...
you only have freedom in choice when you know you have no choice
Reply
you only have freedom in choice when you know you have no choice
Reply
post #103 of 145
All those folks who extolled the Zune are going to look really stupid. Oh, wait. They already did.

Philip Machanick creator of Opinionations and Green Grahamstown
Department of Computer Science, Rhodes University, South Africa

Reply

Philip Machanick creator of Opinionations and Green Grahamstown
Department of Computer Science, Rhodes University, South Africa

Reply
post #104 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by afreemanmd View Post

I never have seen a Zune in the wild. I have seen them in stores, but never in the hands of a consumer.

Same here, although I did see some girls at a Target store once weighing the benefits of iPod vs. Zune and they settled on Zune. I shed a tear for them now.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

Reply

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

Reply
post #105 of 145
Remember this? The Zune team's iPod amnesty bin:
http://labnol.blogspot.com/2007/05/i...-get-zune.html

Do you think those employees will be allowed their iPods back now?
post #106 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

Of all the dumbass things Microsoft have done over the years, I would vote releasing a Zune in brown as the second dumbest thing.

The dumbest obviously is Balmer being appointed CEO.

What do you think second dumbest is?

The dumbest thing Microsoft ever did? I think it is obvious now: not creating a decent, modern portable operating system. Windows Mobile was unusable and they knew it yet did nothing until iOS and Android forced them to wake up.

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply

Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

Reply
post #107 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

So in many ways IMO the code will to be a fairly large break that's at least likely to make at least a big hunk of software and maybe all drivers that currently work on Win 7 and Vista (and often, still, XP) incompatible.

Although Microsoft are moving toward "Dot Net" as a platform rather than "Windows" I still don't think they will break backwards compatibility with old versions of Windows. I do think we'll see multiple versions though.
  • WP8 - ARM/x86. All applications written to Silverlight/XNA.
  • WT8/ARM - Metro UI. Only supports Silverlight/XNA via Marketplace (although Office will have to be ARM native). The "consumer" tablet. IMO they should brand it with Xbox, but they won't.
  • WT8/x86 - Dual UI. Standard Windows and Metro. Legacy as well as Silverlight/XNA support. Dock-able. The "business" tablet.
  • W8 - Standard Windows UI. Legacy as well as Silverlight/XNA support.
  • Xbox Next - I don't know, although support for Silverlight and the Marketplace was rumored.
  • Car/Sync - I don't know.

Each Windows login will also be attached to a Windows Live account. I won't go as far as saying a Windows Live account will be a requirement to login to Windows, but I do think W8 variants will be severely limited without one. The Windows Live account will be used to sync user data, media, apps and purchases across all platforms.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

One possible approach might be to mostly virtualize Win 7 and Vista in ways that lets older programs operate mostly in a sandbox - on the level of Win 8 only (not Win Tab 8 or Win Phone 8).

Maybe, but maybe not. Although it's possible I just can't see Microsoft breaking legacy support. Certainly not on the desktop variant of Windows 8.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if we never see an ARM version of "desktop" Windows.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

Finally, it also means partially rearchitecting all of their own own PC and Server programs over a relatively short period. And they gotta lotta programs.

This one is tricky.

On one hand... again I can't see Microsoft breaking legacy support with Windows Server (2012?). Even if it meant losing their entire consumer business it wouldn't be worth pissing off their enterprise customers.

On the other hand... with Office 365 and Azure you can see Microsoft are shifting Windows Server and everything it supports to the cloud, so maybe the hardware architecture or OS won't matter so much to business.
post #108 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

The dumbest thing Microsoft ever did? I think it is obvious now: not creating a decent, modern portable operating system. Windows Mobile was unusable and they knew it yet did nothing until iOS and Android forced them to wake up.

This is probably the best answer I've seen, although I think it's far to easy to underestimate the effort involved in getting the Windows code base to that stage.

It's not like Microsoft had thousands of developers sitting on their hands with nothing to do.

The release schedule for W8 is probably quite good for the resources Microsoft have available.

This brings us to the real issue which is wasted man-hours (or rather person-hours ) which can probably mostly be attributed to bad decisions by management.

Vista is probably the key culprit here. It was written, hacked at and re-written again and ended up years overdue. If better decisions were made early in the Vista life-cycle we may have seen a fully modular, mobile supporting Windows 8 in Christmas 2009.

That's just one example. You could also look at Windows Mobile, KIN, or one of a bunch of other time-wasting projects.
post #109 of 145
We are the Champions, We are the Champions, No time for losers Because we are the champions "Queen"
post #110 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by brentbordelon View Post

What Microsoft should do is QUIT trying to catch up with everyone else and start focusing on something new and different like they did 20 years ago. That's the only chance they have of ever being as good as they once were.

At least that's the opinion of a 25 year Microsoft developer

Microsoft hardly ever produced something themselves. The original MS-Basic was the product that started MS, but for the rest, most of it was boughth. MS-DOS was bought from SCP, DOS-emulation in Windows NT was bought, IE was bought. Kinect was bought. Word/Excel was bought (I think). Windows NT (2000, XP) was built, Windows 1-3 was insipired by Apple but built by Microsoft (and having once developed for it: the API is a disaster zone). OS/2 was built (together with IBM).

I don't know how much on the enterprise side (Exchange, Outlook, SharePoint was built and not bought).

None of their built products were ever particularly good. Gates in his Microsoft years never was a great engineer (given for instance how little he understood of the limits of AI and how many billions were wasted in that direction), but he was a great strategist (read his book "The Road Ahead" which is very interesting when it talks about "the road travelled")

I think, also, you meant 30 years (MS-Basic) and not 20 years.

Jobs did something new 30 years ago (NeXT) and the results (iOS, OS X) are a foundation for their success (industrial design is another one)
post #111 of 145
The good news is we don't have to hear about any laughable "iPod killers" anymore. Now we're going to have to hear about a whole bunch of laughable "iPad killers", for a while to come.

post #112 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Then go buy a Zune. I'm sure there's few left for cheap.

Thanks, I have two.
post #113 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by gctwnl View Post

Microsoft hardly ever produced something themselves. The original MS-Basic was the product that started MS, but for the rest, most of it was bought

Perhaps. Off the top of my head i would say a handful of products were totally purchased, some were originally spawned from a purchased product and developed, some incorporate purchased components and others were totally developed in house.

I think there is a lot of effort involved in taking some raw components and making it into a successful product (like Kinect or the MacBook Air)

iTunes was spawned from SoundJam but looking at iTunes now I would say it is an Apple creation, even though it was originally started by another company.
post #114 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

Of all the dumbass things Microsoft have done over the years, I would vote releasing a Zune in brown as the second dumbest thing.

The dumbest obviously is Balmer being appointed CEO.

What do you think second dumbest is?

Windows ME, without doubt
post #115 of 145
It's sad as I've wanted one for a while, but they never came to the UK. But they were never going to beat Apple, it didn't matter how much better than the iPod they made it, people would still buy iPods. People know they want an iPod even before they know what they look like or anything other than the fact it plays music and that's hard to compete with.

Another underlying reason though could be more to do with Windows Phone 7. Any new version would need to be updated to support WP7 apps, but they could start to cause issues with the mobile manufacturers who were previously unhappy with Google releasing their own phone. Who knows maybe we could see a return of Zune but as a software platform for other hardware vendors like WP7.
post #116 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by phalanx View Post

Thanks, I have two.

I'm sorry.
post #117 of 145
post #118 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by stokessd View Post

The cut off text drives me nuts. I hate that, and I'm glad it's off the market. Such horrible gui design.

Sheldon

I agree!!

All the positive press about the Zune HD when it came out got me to go to the store and try one. I thought it was an incredibly horrible piece of junk, largely because of that stupid cut off text business. I've never understood how anybody can like those silly things.
Apparently not many people did.
post #119 of 145
.

1 - Good Thread by 'bigpics' et al ... ty

Would have to study it deeply to fully digest, but first need to make sure my 'foundation of understanding' is firm ...

Microsoft was stuck with DOS for years. Was ok as calculator/adding machine, but that's about it, and would always be limited cause it was based on algebra x/y axis, not the geometry/vectors needed for Graphics. Then they tried to invent a new code with NT, but didn't work, and been trying/re-trying ever since in hopes of moving into the 21st Century.

But OSX/Unix/et al ... are taking over the World with their 'simplicity and elegance', plus are 'open' and designed for the 'Net - so will always have that added advantage.

And unless Microsoft succeeds in writing that 'New Code' ? Then eventually they will become an Historical Oddity like Roman Numerals are to Hindu/Arabic Base 10.

That fairly accurate in 'poetic terms' ?

.

B - to all you AppInsider Snarky Wannabes

Yea, yea ... some pretty good Zune Jokes, but from few years back - The Best

Craig Ferguson - you know, The Scottish Conan Guy

He gave a simple reason why it failed

"The Zune Zucked"

.



.
post #120 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

Lol now that's the dumbest suggestion ever. MSFT gave apple money because it didn't want to be broken up.

Actually MSFT been broken up could have turned out to be a blessing in disguise. It would have allowed the pieces to be more nimble with what they do.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Mac OS X
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Microsoft abandons Zune media players in iPod defeat