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Preemptive LOTR: The Two Towers thread

post #1 of 82
Thread Starter 
I saw the latest preview last night, and it's got me excited again. The scenes of Saruman's army assembling before Sauron, and then massing at Helm's Deep; the return of Gandalf; will Aragorn let Arwen go?; Gollum assisting Frodo and Sam; Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli chasing the Uruk-Hai...

Okay, I know 99% of people here know what happens, but that preview has me drooling.

Only, um, 21 days(?) to wait...
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post #2 of 82
yeah, the previews were enough to get me to do some reading up on the subject, outside the books. turns out Tolkein did a lot of corresponding with people who had questions about his stories, and areas that weren't crystal clear.

really helps flesh things out.
post #3 of 82
What happened to the tolkien guy... ? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
How many problems have you modified or originated in the past 1 day?
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post #4 of 82
I was surprised that the trailer used that Kronos Quartet music from Requiem for a Dream. I can't hear that music without thinking about... uh, the stuff going on at the end of that movie.
<img src="graemlins/surprised.gif" border="0" alt="[Surprised]" />

POSSIBLE SPOILER!!!

I heard a rumor that they kill off Saruman in a dramatic but original ending for this movie rather than the third. Probably for the best. Two Towers is really all about the war with Saruman, and then he doesn't really come up until the end of the third movie.
post #5 of 82
Dead, in '77 iThink. Christopher now makes a nice living periodically editing dad's old papers.

Tolkien seemed genuinely happy about people's response to his work, and loved to talk to them. I had a couple of profs years ago (freshman undergrad, oh gawd, I'm starting to feel old) who met him, knew him from their student days. Even though they'd learned the unfortunate habit of poo-pooing the fantasy genre as a whole, the still liked him and his work very much.
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post #6 of 82
That's really fine actually, they played the departure of Boromir a bit early too. Tolkien himself only divided the books when he was pursuaded about the reality of publishing all those pages in one volume. That bit actually appears in the supplementary disc too, though it doesn't get at other good stuff, like his feud with CS Lewis.
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post #7 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:
<strong>That's really fine actually, they played the departure of Boromir a bit early too. Tolkien himself only divided the books when he was pursuaded about the reality of publishing all those pages in one volume.</strong><hr></blockquote>But that was different. Boromir still died in the proper sequence, they just cut the end of Fellowship the movie a few pages into Two Towers the book.

I've heard that they kill off Saruman in a totally different way, in Isengard, before the ring is destroyed.
post #8 of 82
Thread Starter 
[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:
<strong>...like his feud with CS Lewis.</strong><hr></blockquote>
What was the fee-udd about? I thought The Inklings all got along on some basis or another?
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post #9 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>
What was the fee-udd about? I thought The Inklings all got along on some basis or another?</strong><hr></blockquote>

I think one of the bigger Tolkein v. Lewis fueds was due to Tolkein's attitude toward Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia. He thought they were: 1) A rip-off of his stuff 2) too simplistic 3) too religious.

However, Lewis' encouragement kept Tolkein going on LOTR. It may have never been finished otherwise.
post #10 of 82
Fee-youhd, I like that intonation.

What about? Whether or not English should be taught in college literature programs. Big stakes -- English was previous only taught as a dramatic subject, not literature. Lots of academics in a huff... Bookish people squable over the strangest things, kinda like AI.

[ 11-27-2002: Message edited by: Matsu ]</p>
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post #11 of 82
Trailer got me going too. Saw it at Harry Potter. Not a bad movie BTW.


IMO The first movie could have had gollum stocking them a bit more. Reading the book you know that he follows for quite a while. It seems to me that they could have just added a short short scene where you see something in the river.

The story gets much more complex from here on. We'll see how they do. My wife couldn't follow everything in the first, not having read the book.

Ents? Where are they? Can't wait to see them.


Saruman can't die. He's needed in the last act <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

[ 11-27-2002: Message edited by: Scott ]</p>
post #12 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Scott:
<strong>It seems to me that they could have just added a short short scene where you see something in the river.
[ 11-27-2002: Message edited by: Scott ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Methinks you need to invest in the Extended DVD Edition, Scott.
post #13 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Jellytussle:
<strong>

Methinks you need to invest in the Extended DVD Edition, Scott. </strong><hr></blockquote>

For $90. <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
post #14 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Scott:
<strong>

For $90. <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Woah! It was £24.99 over here, and i'm sure i've seen US pricing at around $25, with a $10 coupon for the cost of movie tickets for TT. You're not thinking of the Special Special Edition, which comes on 12 DVD's in a mithril box, with complimentary lembas and a signed scroll of authenticity from the Dark Lord himself?

[ 11-28-2002: Message edited by: Jellytussle ]</p>
post #15 of 82
Spoiler alert
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I'm betting Return of the King ends shortly after the destruction of the One Ring, with narration describing the passing of the Ring Bearers over the sea.
I've always thought the Scourging of the Shire would be aniticlimatic in a movie after the Ring is destroyed.

Jeff
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post #16 of 82
I've seen the toys of the Ents and must say that I'm a little alarmed if ALL of the Ents look like the toy for Treebeard. The Huorns should be leafy and dark and shaggy shouldn't they?

Even if it is anticlimactic I hope that they find a way to return to the Shire. I know it's not a Hollywood tradition, and I can live it they change it, but seeing it done "right" would be very satisfying.

About six years ago at a bookstore in Charleston, SC I found a copy of the Tolkien book with his sheet music for some of the songs from the book. It's in storage now, but I checked the going price for it on Alibris and it was selling for double what I paid for it back then.

D

[ 11-28-2002: Message edited by: drewprops ]</p>
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post #17 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Jellytussle:
<strong>

Woah! It was £24.99 over here, and i'm sure i've seen US pricing at around $25, with a $10 coupon for the cost of movie tickets for TT. You're not thinking of the Special Special Edition, which comes on 12 DVD's in a mithril box, with complimentary lembas and a signed scroll of authenticity from the Dark Lord himself?

</strong><hr></blockquote>

I got the price wrong. It's $70 for the five DVD set. Plus it comes with bookends of those kings with the hands up. From the movie poster.

I guess you're saying the two DVD version has the extra 30 min in it.
post #18 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>I saw the latest preview last night...</strong><hr></blockquote>

I haven't been to the movies lately so I downloaded the trailer. Yeah, it does look great. I'm psyched too. I planned to reread the first book this past summer and I still haven't. I need to get cracking.
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post #19 of 82
You should read the books. I'm glad I got the book before seeing the first one. I got that super thick paper back that has the three books in one. I think it's the cheapest you can pay for the three books. I got into it and ripped through it in like two weeks.
post #20 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Scott:
<strong>

I got the price wrong. It's $70 for the five DVD set. Plus it comes with bookends of those kings with the hands up. From the movie poster.

I guess you're saying the two DVD version has the extra 30 min in it.</strong><hr></blockquote>

No, the one i've got is the four DVD set, with the extended film on 2 discs, and two discs of SFX ,interviews etc. The pricey one just comes with bookends.

try here

<a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000067DNF/qid=1038505563/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/002-8478189-4468025" target="_blank">http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000067DNF/qid=1038505563/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/002-8478189-4468025</a>
post #21 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Jellytussle:
<strong>No, the one i've got is the four DVD set, with the extended film on 2 discs, and two discs of SFX ,interviews etc. The pricey one just comes with bookends.</strong><hr></blockquote>The gift set does also have a fifth DVD with more "making of" type footage.
post #22 of 82
How many different way can they figgure out to make money on this <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />


You know, you just KNOW, there's a good number of shlubs out there that buy every set and two the 5 DVD box, one to open and one to store away.

Big waste of money IMO.
post #23 of 82
Here's the 5 dvd set. Amazon has it for $60.

<a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000069F5H/qid=1038514413/sr=2-1/103-6366954-9695065?v=glance&s=dvd" target="_blank">The Lord of the Rings - The Fellowship of the Ring (Platinum Series Extended Edition Collector's Gift Set)</a>

[ 11-28-2002: Message edited by: Scott ]</p>
post #24 of 82
Thread Starter 
[quote]Originally posted by Simple Ranger:
<strong>I think one of the bigger Tolkein v. Lewis fueds was due to Tolkein's attitude toward Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia. He thought they were: 1) A rip-off of his stuff 2) too simplistic 3) too religious.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ah. The Narnia books certainly don't try terribly hard to hide their Christian message. I do find it interesting that so many people note a Christian message in LOTR. Tolkien was a religious man, a Christian, but his intent in writing LOTR was to provide England with a mythology along the lines of the Scandinavian pagan mythologies, something it never had due to historical events (i.e. it got invaded a lot ). Anyway, enough of that else this'll end up in Fireside Chat.
[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:
<strong>Whether or not English should be taught in college literature programs. Big stakes -- English was previous only taught as a dramatic subject, not literature. Lots of academics in a huff... Bookish people squable over the strangest things, kinda like AI.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Interesting. Thank you. I'm kind of jealous that simple events - Lewis and Tolkien going for a walk and discussing things - in some people's lives can become part of known history. I don't think any of my discussions while walking with friends will ever be recorded in the annals of history. Or any discussions at AI.
[quote]Originally posted by Scott:
<strong>Trailer got me going too. Saw it at Harry Potter. Not a bad movie BTW.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Harry Potter was fun! I particularly liked Kenneth Branagh's hamming. And little Ginny Weasley's as cute as a button. I saw an interview with the girl that plays Hermione, and she was mortified at having to shoot the scene at the end where she runs up and hugs Harry. She demanded that it only be shot once.
[quote]<strong>IMO The first movie could have had gollum stocking them a bit more. Reading the book you know that he follows for quite a while. It seems to me that they could have just added a short short scene where you see something in the river.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't know if it's true or not, but apparently if you look very closely at the left eye of the right hand king sculpture thing, you can see Gollum sitting on his lower eyelid.
[quote]Originally posted by spaceman_spiff:
<strong>I planned to reread the first book this past summer and I still haven't. I need to get cracking.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Betcha can't finish The Two Towers before the movie opens.
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post #25 of 82
We have the trailer running on a 22" Cinema display where I work. Major droolage. Got two free tickets and I'm ready to wield them at a moments notice. I'm all over that flick.... can't wait.
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post #26 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>
Betcha can't finish The Two Towers before the movie opens. </strong><hr></blockquote>

I don't plan to. It's been so long since I read The Two Towers that there's a lot of detail that I've forgotten. I'm afraid that it would take away from my enjoyment of the movie if the story's too fresh in my mind. I'll just reread the trilogy as each part of the movie is released and kibbitz from there.
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post #27 of 82
Thread Starter 
In the place of a dark lord, you would have a QUEEN!

NOT DARK, BUT BEAUTIFUL AND TERRIBLE AS THE DAWN! TREACHEROUS AS THE SEA! STRONGER THAN THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH! ALL SHALL LOVE ME AND DESPAIR!

Because I'm going to the premiere on Thursday!

[ 11-30-2002: Message edited by: Belle ]</p>
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post #28 of 82
CS Lewis was a pretty strong Christian. A lot of his 'non-fiction' works were theological. So i guess it's inevitable that a Christian theme should appear in his work.

But he also wrote on other mythologies, like in 'Till We Have Faces' which is an extremely beautiful book.

-robo
post #29 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>In the place of a dark lord, you would have a QUEEN!

NOT DARK, BUT BEAUTIFUL AND TERRIBLE AS THE DAWN! TREACHEROUS AS THE SEA! STRONGER THAN THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH! ALL SHALL LOVE ME AND DESPAIR!

Because I'm going to the premiere on Thursday!</strong><hr></blockquote>Nice. This Thursday Dec. 5 is the premiere?

After you get back from seeing it, we'll judge if you pass the test and diminish. [quote]Originally posted by spaceman_spiff:
<strong>I'm afraid that it would take away from my enjoyment of the movie if the story's too fresh in my mind. I'll just reread the trilogy as each part of the movie is released and kibbitz from there.</strong><hr></blockquote>I'd read it before seeing it.
post #30 of 82
Thread Starter 
[quote]Originally posted by robo:
<strong>But he also wrote on other mythologies, like in 'Till We Have Faces' which is an extremely beautiful book.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I've not read it, but I've added it to my book list. I'm willing to give any book that can be described as "beautiful" a go.
[quote]Originally posted by BRussell:
<strong>Nice. This Thursday Dec. 5 is the premiere?
After you get back from seeing it, we'll judge if you pass the test and diminish.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Apparently so. I had to sell my soul to the devil to get tickets, though.

I will diminish, and go into the West, and remain Belle. However, I intend to stop here awhile and gloat.
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post #31 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Belle:
<strong>
Apparently so. I had to sell my soul to the devil to get tickets, though.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Oh do tell.
post #32 of 82
Thread Starter 
[quote]Originally posted by Scott:
<strong>Oh do tell.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Let's just say I'll be spending the evening with people I wouldn't normally spend time with. I'm such a bitch. Would it be uncouth to get a large popcorn and soda at a premiere?
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post #33 of 82
I've heard rumours that Shelob won't appear until the third film, apparantly to give it more action (as if it needs it).

If Shelob had appeared at the end of the second they could have kept an excellent cliffhanger with what happens to Frodo and all.
post #34 of 82
Spoilers
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Actualy Shelob was moved to the third film becuase they simply couldnt fit it into TTT. Plus that would have been the cliffhanger from hell. I wonder where they are going to end it now.

Also the razing of the Shire has been cut out completely. Becuase it really didnt fit into the flow of the story.
When I was reading ROTK the razing of the shire seemed to really jump out at me as well. It was a poor way to end the story, and seemed to be more of Tolkiens outburst against industrialization than an integral part of the story.
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post #35 of 82
No Belle, I think it's exactly what Hollywood deserves, it's what they want, your money. Or we supposed to switch from money to respect on cue? F 'em. Get your popcorn, they're pretty good films, enjoy them and chow down. But get the popcorn only because it's a premier -- on any other night you're obliged to sneak food into the theatre. It's fun, especially on dates, like grazing the aisles of your local bulk barn!
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post #36 of 82
[quote]Originally posted by Falcon:
<strong>Also the razing of the Shire has been cut out completely. Becuase it really didnt fit into the flow of the story.
When I was reading ROTK the razing of the shire seemed to really jump out at me as well. It was a poor way to end the story, and seemed to be more of Tolkiens outburst against industrialization than an integral part of the story.</strong><hr></blockquote>I thought it was great in the book. It showed how the war had touched even the shire and how the hobbits had changed and grown (pun intended in the case of Merry and Pippin). It brought the novel back home. Industrialization? :confused:

But I understand the decision for a movie.
post #37 of 82
Man, it looks awesome,,,i am inclined to invest in the special internet edition of the two towers soundtrack (I love the music from the first movie...and man....oh man.... <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> )
post #38 of 82
Thread Starter 
[quote]Originally posted by Matsu:
<strong>No Belle, I think it's exactly what Hollywood deserves, it's what they want, your money. Or we supposed to switch from money to respect on cue? F 'em. Get your popcorn, they're pretty good films, enjoy them and chow down. But get the popcorn only because it's a premier -- on any other night you're obliged to sneak food into the theatre. It's fun, especially on dates, like grazing the aisles of your local bulk barn!</strong><hr></blockquote>
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

I'm a bit of an expert at sneaking stuff into theaters. I went to see Phantom Menace with my then boyfriend on an anniversary, and smuggled in a bottle of wine and two wine glasses. We timed the cork with a loud moment in one of the previews.

A movie just isn't the same without popcorn (drowned in butter) and a bucket of soda you could drown in.
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post #39 of 82
i just purchased tickets to the 12:05am on the 18th showing at the boston common theatre for jack and i... the 12:00am showing was already sold out! thank god i have no finals that day.
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post #40 of 82
In the trailer as far as I could tell, I'm going to be dissapointed: I can't help but see a very distinct difference between the real-action characters and even the very fast flashes of Golem . . . . why oh why didn't he use a scrawny actor with make up!?!?!?!
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