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Researchers raise privacy concerns over location tracking in Apple's iOS 4 - Page 2

post #41 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

This is not true based on all the reports I've read.

Apple disclosed that they were gathering real time location data, and what they were using it for. I don't believe they disclosed that the data was unencrypted (from what I've read).



To R Daneel Olivaw (ETO), let me just clarify that the reason this is news is not that iOS4 is tracking you. The reason it's news is that the data they're gathering wasn't encrypted.
post #42 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacadvocate View Post

What is it you think Jobs and Obama were talking about at that technology innovators' dinner? THEY WERE SITTING RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER!!

/cue string crescendo

Talking about the several visits Obama made to SJ personal residence.

/cue string crescendo
post #43 of 138
Uuuuuh, who the he'll cares? It doesn't record your actual location and it's hidden on your computer or phone. Physical access = all access. Besides, so what? What is there to hide? I don't care if people know *about* where I've been, I'll post my map on flickr... I would really just like to know why when somebody says 'iPhone recording location data' and suddenly it's this huge privacy concern and all this sh1t, so what? Why does everybody freak out when it's not even being sent to anyone? I would just like to know.
post #44 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode View Post

Do your homework before you make yourself look like more of a moron.

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...ps-monitoring/

So youre saying that consolidated.db was devised by the Obama administration and forced upon Apple for the sole purpose of tracking users? Where is the proof of this? Where is the proof that the file is used for anything other than network quality?
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #45 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by srathi View Post

Awesome! No more complaining from iFans about Privacy flaws in Android. It is unbelievable that Apple is doing such a thing intentionally. \

HUH? Every time you use your cell phone, its location is written to a usage log somewhere; why is this news to anyone?

Second, how many people go around synching their iOS device to more than one computer? Very few.

Third, who the he** cares where I've been; if you're going places that you think should be private, chances are you ought to be locked up anyway. Don't want someone knowing you go to strip clubs? Don't GO to them.

As someone wisely said, cue the Apple-haters and the Anroid fanbois.
post #46 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

You mean cue the Apple excuse makers?

This has nothing to do with Android, and your first comment here is a clear attempt to divert the topic off course into a flame war.

What the hell is wrong with you? jk i already know

And here we have him, the Android fanboy. Sad; he should go play in his own sandbox.
post #47 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode View Post

Can't apologize this one away - it is what it is... Government spying on its citizens.

Apple products are going to be re-branded by the public replacing the 'I' with 'spy'.

At least now there is some transparency on why Obama and SJ met. Obama has been pushing for more warrantlees domestic spying powers. What better way to get people to willfully, and unexpectedly, participate then to plant it in coveted technology.

Last straw for me. Sold.
I don't invest in unethical stocks.

I know this post is going to get trashed - I also know that regardless of what the usual apologists say, deep down it's bothering their conscious. There has to be a point where freedom and liberty are valued more then profit. Some cross that line before others I guess.

This is no random mistake. This is very intentional. As soon as Obama gets the go-ahead for warrantless wi-fi and cellular spying - this data will be collected and used.

You're right, your stupid post is definitely going to be trashed, because it's moronic.

To begin with: the huge privacy violations began after 9/11, long before President Obama took office. So that negates your first STUPID comment.

Second, if you don't invest in unethical stocks, then pray tell, what do you invest in? Answer: you don't, because you're a moron.

Third, what in the he** does this have to do with President Obama, anyway? The guy meets with thousands of people everyday, including heads of state; so if he meets with the prime minister of Great Britain, and then Britain has a riot one day, it's somehow his fault? You're on the wrong forum pal, you need to go back to watching (what's left of) Glenn Beck.

Fourth: yes, it's intentional. It's also not disseminated (look it up, it's in the dictionary).

Lastly, what are you doing on this forum if you hate Apple products? Are you one of those who has nothing better to do than to try to stir up arguments, thinking this somehow elevates you to more than the imbecile status to which you so vehemently cling?
post #48 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

Apple disclosed that they were gathering real time location data, and what they were using it for. I don't believe they disclosed that the data was unencrypted (from what I've read).



To R Daneel Olivaw (ETO), let me just clarify that the reason this is news is not that iOS4 is tracking you. The reason it's news is that the data they're gathering wasn't encrypted.

I agree that the issue is that it is unencrypted, but I also believe that people were jumping to incorrect conclusions about this data. This to me looks more like an oversight than a major violation of privacy that some people are trying to make it out to be.

From what I have read so far you set your setting correctly this data will no longer be gathered. You can also purge this information. (I know a rooted phone can and haven't attempted it on a non-rooted phone.)

On your computer your backups can already be encrypted which resolves the issue there.

Next you just bug Apple until they resolve the issue and encrypt the file.

As for the Obama/Justice Department stuff that is just crazy talk and I'm no Obama fan. They sure as heck don't need this file from your iPhone. This information is already available via your cell phone service provider.
post #49 of 138
Great. Now Google knows. Expect the iOS Google App to stream that file to the mothership. You know, they can't help but violate your privacy...it's like a nervous tick.

I'll remember to turn off my phone before I commit the perfect crime

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #50 of 138
What does Obama have to do with this? #IJUSTCANT

Are they sure it isn't just people saying they don't want location based services yet they want to be able to locate their lost phone?
post #51 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

I'll remember to turn off my phone before I commit the perfect crime

That looks suspicious. Tie it to your dog or cat and let it roam around your home.

Buy a burner phone, have it forwarded to some other number so it doesn’t tie you to the area, call yourself at home and have it auto answer with an app you make so it can seem like you were home on the phone when the crime was committed. But don’t make the call happen exactly when the crime took place, just make it close enough that it would be impossible for you to have been in both places in that time frame.

Also, don’t commit crimes.
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post #52 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode View Post

Can't apologize this one away - it is what it is... Government spying on its citizens.

Apple products are going to be re-branded by the public replacing the 'I' with 'spy'.

At least now there is some transparency on why Obama and SJ met. Obama has been pushing for more warrantlees domestic spying powers. What better way to get people to willfully, and unexpectedly, participate then to plant it in coveted technology.

Last straw for me. Sold.
I don't invest in unethical stocks.

I know this post is going to get trashed - I also know that regardless of what the usual apologists say, deep down it's bothering their conscious. There has to be a point where freedom and liberty are valued more then profit. Some cross that line before others I guess.

This is no random mistake. This is very intentional. As soon as Obama gets the go-ahead for warrantless wi-fi and cellular spying - this data will be collected and used.

ROTFL!!! Sarcasm is fun. Most here won't get it but I do.
post #53 of 138
The apologist are amazing. Bottomline, if this data is no big deal, why collect it in he first place? Why store it at all? I just downloaded the app on my wife's Mac and showed her. She did not like it. Does she have anything to hide, no but the thought that anyone with access can see where she has been the last year is unsettling. It is garbage they are doing this and I am very anxious to see what the reasoning is. Oh, wait until the EU gets wind of this.
post #54 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

The apologist are amazing. Bottomline, if this data is no big deal, why collect it in he first place? Why store it at all? I just downloaded the app on my wife's Mac and showed her. She did not like it. Does she have anything to hide, no but the thought that anyone with access can see where she has been the last year is unsettling. It is garbage they are doing this and I am very anxious to see what the reasoning is. Oh, wait until the EU gets wind of this.

Apple will have to stop gathering data on users when the gathering is against the user's wishes.
post #55 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

Apple disclosed that they were gathering real time location data, and what they were using it for. I don't believe they disclosed that the data was unencrypted (from what I've read).



To R Daneel Olivaw (ETO), let me just clarify that the reason this is news is not that iOS4 is tracking you. The reason it's news is that the data they're gathering wasn't encrypted.

What is Apples reasoning for collecting the data?
post #56 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU;

Apple will have to stop gathering data on users when the gathering is against the user's wishes.

Well I thought turning off location data did that, guess not.
post #57 of 138
Man, what a gold mine this can be for private investigators and plaintiffs' attorneys in divorce cases! Almost as good as the Cheaters television reality series!

(Coincidental postscript. While writing this I saw a CNN report about Michigan state troopers extracting data from motorists' cell phones during traffic stops. The ACLU believes this may violate 4th Amendment protections against unreasonable searches and seizures.)

I admit to being a Fanatical Moderate. I Disdain the Inane. Vyizderzominymororzizazizdenderizorziz?

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I admit to being a Fanatical Moderate. I Disdain the Inane. Vyizderzominymororzizazizdenderizorziz?

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post #58 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

What is Apples reasoning for collecting the data?

Did you bother to read the article and comments? Or the article it referenced and the comments there? People have already linked the reasons that Apple gave. Which by the way happened last year.
post #59 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

Apple disclosed that they were gathering real time location data, and what they were using it for. I don't believe they disclosed that the data was unencrypted (from what I've read).



To R Daneel Olivaw (ETO), let me just clarify that the reason this is news is not that iOS4 is tracking you. The reason it's news is that the data they're gathering wasn't encrypted.

Can you tell me where apple disclosed that they are gathering real time location data and storing it on the phone?
post #60 of 138
Question is, does this logging STILL occur if you turn off the master Location Services switch?! Anyone tested this?
post #61 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

What is Apples reasoning for collecting the data?

Advertising mainly, just like most other companies. They actually have a pretty standard contract for it. Personal data is anonymized and/or aggregated before being used to provide locally relevant ads and information to you (that the user opts in for).

Their reasoning for collecting the data is largely harmless (as long as this file is related to that, which I think it is)
post #62 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That looks suspicious. Tie it to your dog or cat and let it roam around your home.

Buy a burner phone, have it forwarded to some other number so it doesnt tie you to the area, call yourself at home and have it auto answer with an app you make so it can seem like you were home on the phone when the crime was committed. But dont make the call happen exactly when the crime took place, just make it close enough that it would be impossible for you to have been in both places in that time frame.

Also, dont commit crimes.

Or better yet, teleport yourself into another dimension. It's the only place where the thought police and the black helicopters can't find you.

BTW, I stayed away from these boards for a month or so, hoping that the level of discourse might magically improve. Is it my imagination, or has it only grown worse?
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #63 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDemerzel View Post

Did you bother to read the article and comments? Or the article it referenced and the comments there? People have already linked the reasons that Apple gave. Which by the way happened last year.

I agree with you, I tend to believe this was an oversite and not malicious on Apples part, however, can you give me the reasons Apple gave. And can you tell me what happened last year, I can find no credible reference?
post #64 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Can you tell me where apple disclosed that they are gathering real time location data and storing it on the phone?

I've already linked to it. Two different locations in fact. I'm not going to link it again to you personally.
post #65 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

Advertising mainly, just like most other companies. They actually have a pretty standard contract for it. Personal data is anonymized and/or aggregated before being used to provide locally relevant ads and information to you (that the user opts in for).

Their reasoning for collecting the data is largely harmless (as long as this file is related to that, which I think it is)

Since the authors of the article do not think the data is being transmitted to apple I doubt that they are tracking for ad purposes. I can believe it is for testing purposes.
post #66 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

ROTFL!!! Sarcasm is fun. Most here won't get it but I do.

Yeah, youre right. Im one of those who didnt catch the sarcasm. Still dont.

I think Mode is either a Republican or a moron. Of course, its getting harder and harder these days to tell the difference. (Not that Democrats are any better, mind you.)
post #67 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Security researchers have discovered that Apple's iOS 4 mobile operating system, found on both the iPhone and iPad, keeps a log of user's locations and saves the data to a hidden file on the device.

... which Google then email to the NSA.

Anyone missing any relatives? Hope they like watersports.

Many of the most important software concepts were invented in the 70s and forgotten in the 80s.

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Many of the most important software concepts were invented in the 70s and forgotten in the 80s.

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post #68 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDemerzel;

Did you bother to read the article and comments? Or the article it referenced and the comments there? People have already linked the reasons that Apple gave. Which by the way happened last year.

Did you? I'm not seeing it? I guess if I have to link from this article to another article to another it may be in there but based on THIS article and THESE comments I only see a blurb about contacting Apple security with no response.
post #69 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno;

I've already linked to it. Two different locations in fact. I'm not going to link it again to you personally.

I looked at the links. Nowhere does it say this data would be stored, un-encrypted and go back a whole year. Also to say anonymous is a stretch. Loaded the app and it instantly ID my wife's phone as hers. They simply are saying they will gather data but nowhere do I see them admitting to what extent and how it truly is being used and how easily accessible it is.
post #70 of 138
Does anyone know how the location data is actually calculated? I looked at my traces with the app mentioned and there are some approximate location points stored when I was in another country with data roaming off and out of wifi range. Does it store the cell tower data and look up the location the next time it has a data connection?
post #71 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menno View Post

I've already linked to it. Two different locations in fact. I'm not going to link it again to you personally.

Those articles really don't answer the question for me. If this file is resident on a phone, then according to your article links apple is in violation of it's own security policy because it would be very easy for me to grab your phone and see where you have been. I can get your personal info and i can get your geo log. Apples security policies that you are linking to clearly state that there is no way for anyone to link personal information to the geo tracking. So do you see the difference? Do you see why many would have a problem with this? All i have to do is grab your phone and I can tell you dates and times of where you have been for at least a year.
post #72 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

... What the hell is wrong with you? jk i already know

My "problem" is that I use reason and research to try to figure things out instead of just reacting rabidly to what I read on some blog. I can remember things from longer ago than last year, and I generally don't fall for a lot of claptrap from idiots with no knowledge of what they speak.

This means I don't fit in on teh internets at all!
post #73 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode View Post

Can't apologize this one away - it is what it is... Government spying on its citizens.

Apple products are going to be re-branded by the public replacing the 'I' with 'spy'.

At least now there is some transparency on why Obama and SJ met. Obama has been pushing for more warrantlees domestic spying powers. What better way to get people to willfully, and unexpectedly, participate then to plant it in coveted technology.

Last straw for me. Sold.
I don't invest in unethical stocks.

I know this post is going to get trashed - I also know that regardless of what the usual apologists say, deep down it's bothering their conscious. There has to be a point where freedom and liberty are valued more then profit. Some cross that line before others I guess.

This is no random mistake. This is very intentional. As soon as Obama gets the go-ahead for warrantless wi-fi and cellular spying - this data will be collected and used.

You really need some help (assuming this wasn't 'sarcasm'). Maybe you should take off your tin hat.

I'm not claiming that this file is a good thing, but there is absolutely no evidence that this file is being sent or stored anywhere except locally. Furthermore, do you really think Obama personally asked Steve Jobs to create a location file on the iPhone so that if they arrested anyone, they could track their movements? Give me a break.
post #74 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb View Post

You really need some help (assuming this wasn't 'sarcasm'). Maybe you should take off your tin hat.

I'm not claiming that this file is a good thing, but there is absolutely no evidence that this file is being sent or stored anywhere except locally. Furthermore, do you really think Obama personally asked Steve Jobs to create a location file on the iPhone so that if they arrested anyone, they could track their movements? Give me a break.

Yeah, and yesterday there was no evidence that this file even existed, let alone un-encrypted on your Mac/PC and phone. Only time will tell how far this rabbit hole goes.
post #75 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

I agree with you, I tend to believe this was an oversite and not malicious on Apples part, however, can you give me the reasons Apple gave. And can you tell me what happened last year, I can find no credible reference?

If it is a nefarious endeavor then I'd have expected them to encrypt the file so they wouldn't get caught tracking their flock.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #76 of 138
These two obviously have to much time on their hands.
post #77 of 138
This is spelled out in Apples policy in iTunes and the iPhone updates as far as I know. This doesn't bother me at all because of two things.

1. AT&T service is so bad where I live, and the towers are so far apart that I can't get a reliable cell signal or a reliable GPS signal. Good luck tracking me with that data, it'll be so bad it wot matter.

2. I have an out of state area code, my address isn't listed correctly on any mapping service and all they would know is I drive back and forth to work 5 days a week. It doesn't affect me in the least that anyone could find out where I go, if they obtained that info yet are already in that area anyway.

What I'm more concerned about is AT&T willingly handing over any and all access to the US Government to monitor my phone calls and texts. But with the amount of illegal monitoring by the US Government these days, and the uneducated masses either ignoring it or blaming the end action on a political party that's no different from it's competition this isn't going to change any time soon. I'm not happy about that but I'm even more happy that I'm treated like a criminal whenever I feel the need to exercise my right to travel unhindered. This is nothing compared to that and is spelled out every time you agree to update your phone. I don't see why everyone is getting upset over this, there are much worse things going on in your local airports than this, get angry about that instead.
post #78 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMacadvocate View Post

What is it you think Jobs and Obama were talking about at that technology innovators' dinner? THEY WERE SITTING RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER!!

/cue string crescendo

Boehner's location tracker list:

strip club
bar
lesbian bondage strip club
bar
liquor store
bar
bar
liquor store
strip club
strip club
strip club
liquor store
bar
bar
bar
gay biker bar
bar
bar
bar
bar
liquor store
Bob's Fake Tan Emporium
bar
post #79 of 138
That Apple might enable tracking of users' travels by request of the Government cannot be ruled out. And if Apple is cooperating with a tracking program designed and run by the US, they would most certainly be prohibited by law from commenting or acknowledging such a program anyway. But if that were the case, said program probably wouldn't be specific to Apple, instead involving most/all phone manufacturers and mobile providers.

This isn't one of those "tin hat" stories, with several reliable and mainsteam sources noting the existence of location-mining programs run by the US and other governments. One of the most visible commenters is CNET.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13739_3-10030134-46.html
melior diabolus quem scies
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melior diabolus quem scies
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post #80 of 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevetim View Post

Those articles really don't answer the question for me. If this file is resident on a phone, then according to your article links apple is in violation of it's own security policy because it would be very easy for me to grab your phone and see where you have been. I can get your personal info and i can get your geo log. Apples security policies that you are linking to clearly state that there is no way for anyone to link personal information to the geo tracking. So do you see the difference? Do you see why many would have a problem with this? All i have to do is grab your phone and I can tell you dates and times of where you have been for at least a year.

You asked where it disclosed that they were gathering specific location data for users. That article explained it.

I had no idea if this file is part of that system of that.

And if you actually, you know, read what I've wrote on this topic, you would see that I DO have a problem with the data not being encrypted and that people SHOULDN'T be writing it off.

Seriously, don't the teach "Context" to people anymore?

And you can't grab my phone and get that information. I have an Android device running non-stock software.
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