or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPod + iTunes + AppleTV › Apple's cloud-based iTunes music streaming service is 'completed' - report
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple's cloud-based iTunes music streaming service is 'completed' - report - Page 2

post #41 of 68
It is too shortsighted to think that the NC facility will be used primarily as personal cloud-based library.

Apple already has the Apps -- iPhoto, Aperture, iMovie, GarageBand, Final Cut Pro, Pages, FaceTime, AirPlay, etc. as well as those from third party developers -- sold at modest prices. With these Apps and Apple products, Apple products users have become the major if not significant contributors to social sites including Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

With proper integration, Apple can unleash the creativity of Apple Products users to develop similar ecosystems that can rival the likes of Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

And, if there is a curated or premium site for the best creations, Apple might even develop a better alternative to Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

[Curation will drastically reduce the junk one sees in the likes of the aforementioned site. However, the curation must be more general and not too restrictive to avoid crippling creativity. The rules and policies must be spelled thoroughly from the start to avoid ambiguity.]

Such an alternative site would make the Apple Ecosystem even less dependent on current corporate sources of audio (music) and video and mass media (television, movies, etc.)

For more personal, group or corporate exclusive use, such a service, as outlined above may be integrated with MobileMe -- to allow exclusive use of certain creations for purposes like family sharing, lecture/seminar/conference presentations and other uses as the creator deems fit.

Apple Ecosystems
post #42 of 68
I will not purchase Apple's cloud service because there is a better cloud service available. You can get 5 GB of free storage or for the purchase of a music album you would receive 20 GB of space to play your music. Just click on the banner on the right.
post #43 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

OK... Sorry!

hahah, I totally just made that up on the spot and you fell for it that'll teach you to correct me aye!
post #44 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-ecosystems View Post

It is too shortsighted to think that the NC facility will be used primarily as personal cloud-based library.

Apple has already the Apps -- iPhoto, Aperture, iMovie, GarageBand, Final Cut Pro, Pages, etc. as well as those from third party developers -- sold at modest prices. With these Apps and Apple products, Apple products users have become the major if not significant contributors to social sites including Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

With proper integration, Apple can unleash the creativity of Apple Products users to develop similar ecosystems that can rival the likes of Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

And, if there is a curated or premium site for the best creations, Apple might even develop a better alternative to Flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc.

[Curation will drastically reduce the junk one sees in the likes of the aforementioned site. However, the curation must be more general and not too restrictive to avoid crippling creativity. The rules and policies must be spelled thoroughly from the start to avoid ambiguity.]

Such an alternative site would make the Apple Ecosystem even less dependent on current corporate sources of audio (music) and video and mass media (television, movies, etc.)

For more personal, group or corporate exclusive use, such a service, as outlined above may be integrated with MobileMe -- to allow exclusive use of certain creations for purposes like family sharing, lecture/seminar/conference presentations and other uses as the creator deems fit.

Apple Ecosystems


This is a very good post!.

I was recently reading a thread about the new FCPX (Final Cut Pro X) to be released in June.

One overriding theme was use of a service like iTMS to contain auditions, media, etc. for use by professional video editors. For example, when constructing a video, the editor will often include stills or b-rolls that aren't part of the original shoot (a train whizzing by in the background) -- or hire talent to provide a custom scene. The idea was that an iTMS-like facility would allow the pro editors to easily find, preview, buy and download all those necessary bits that contribute to a Pro video, music video, song, etc.

If one considers the possibilities -- there are similar needs for health care, publishing, education...
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #45 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

This is a very good post!.

I was recently reading a thread about the new FCPX (Final Cut Pro X) to be released in June.

One overriding theme was use of a service like iTMS to contain auditions, media, etc. for use by professional video editors. For example, when constructing a video, the editor will often include stills or b-rolls that aren't part of the original shoot (a train whizzing by in the background) -- or hire talent to provide a custom scene. The idea was that an iTMS-like facility would allow the pro editors to easily find, preview, buy and download all those necessary bits that contribute to a Pro video, music video, song, etc.

If one considers the possibilities -- there are similar needs for health care, publishing, education...

Indeed, and I hope this is the direction that Apple will take, if it is not already doing so.

The possibilities are almost limitless -- both for more general (or public) sharing, as well as for more exclusive use.

For more enterprise applications, such as those for healthcare, education, and for other corporate uses, Apple also has to improve data security. The licensing of FaceTime and AirPlay to third parties (TV, speakers, etc. product manufacturers) may make the Apple Ecosystem even more flexible and to an extent reduce cost for enterprise to avail of Apple's cloud computing services.

For the free public sharing version. Apple can offer incentives to improve quality. This may include monetary awards for the best creations (separately for popularity and judged competitions) and revenue sharing from well-placed, non-intrussive iAds. Currently, sites like Flickr, FaceBook do not offer revenue-sharing incentives. YouTube, to my knowledge only offer it to select more popular creators.

Apple Ecosystems
post #46 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post

Maybe I am in the dark here... But I can care less about this proposed service.
Enough music resides on my iDevices at all times for my listening pleasure. Why should consumers care about this product?

1_ Could be good for people (like me) who have large mp3 collections, well over what the iPhone and iPod touch will hold. With this you could still listen to those songs and playlist from work, at someone else's home or while traveling.

2_ if you have an iPad also useful, and you're traveling or over someone's house and you want to watch a movie on your iPad, over a relatives house and want to show your photos, or more (#1 above).

3_ My only hopes are it allows you to store all your ALL your music and not just iTunes purchased songs, because like others most my music is not from iTunes. Of no use to many if it's only iTunes purchases. Secondly, hopefully this won't be priced out of range for most and a reasonably priced service, or at least tiered so we can pick. Something like $5.00-15/mth depending on locker size.
post #47 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post

Maybe I am in the dark here... But I can care less about this proposed service.

So you do care a bit?
Quote:
Enough music resides on my iDevices at all times for my listening pleasure. Why should consumers care about this product?

Why do you care? You are a consumer.
post #48 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

FWIW, my macbook wakes up when i pull up my iTunes library on my ATV2. tell the machine to never sleep, just sleep the display. Power draw is relatively insignificant on a laptop with drives spun down, processor idle and screen off. Heck, my iTunes library is on an external HD connected to the laptop that's smart enough to wake up when it's needed and sleep when it's done, too.

also, @ cloud computing being used because it's too much effort to walk into the other room.

Laugh if you want, it is still my primary reason for wanting it. And I know there are others in the same boat. Let's not forget that Apple does like to provide elegant streamlined products and services. This would certainly fit into that category.
post #49 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by samlogo View Post

I will not purchase Apple's cloud service because there is a better cloud service available.

Since it has not been announced, how do you know there is anything better?
Quote:
You can get 5 GB of free storage or for the purchase of a music album you would receive 20 GB of space to play your music.

How much does this (not yet announced) Apple cloud service cost and what do you get?
post #50 of 68
really. f the cloud. thanks, but no thanks. while i do appreciate someone trying to sell me my own stuff, i am gonna draw the line. i am not willing to pay extra to listen to subpar copies of my music that i paid good money for. i am happy to have ditched the iphone, i am happy to have ditched android. now, i just load up my ipod classic with all my albums recorded at lossless and actually enjoy my music. as soon as itunes can sell me music in a lossless format, i might care. until then, f the cloud.
post #51 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple has allegedly achieved the milestone ahead of rival Google, which has seen its own efforts for a streaming music service stall.

Quote:
It also said that Apple does not yet have any new licensing agreements with the recording industry.

Quote:
While Apple is forging ahead, Google is allegedly stuck in negotiations with record labels.

I'm confused. They are saying Apple is ahead of Google as Google is still in negotiations with the record labels, but they also say that Apple doesn't have licensing agreements either.
post #52 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by yensid98 View Post

I agree 100%. Why rely on Wi-Fi access or cell phone data coverage to play back music? What happens when I'm driving and going in and out of coverage areas? What about data caps?

I don't see any benefits to streaming my content all the time.

What I want from Apple is the ability to re-download any file I bought from them at no additional charge. Music, Movies, and Videos. Just like I can with apps.

+1, plus then Id have less need of remembering to backup my purchases quite as rigourously.
post #53 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleStud View Post

personally I would love for my 20GB music library to be stored in the cloud, which would free up space on my 16GB iPhone for large apps (navigation, for example) or more video recording on-the-go without maxing out the memory. Plus all of my photos available, at all times, wherever i am, is a good thing.

I don't think the added traffic on the cell network will make the carriers happy either...

Im sure they would rather let facetime on the network before we have this cloud service.
post #54 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by sportytoes View Post

I don't think the added traffic on the cell network will make the carriers happy either...

Im sure they would rather let facetime on the network before we have this cloud service.

This assumes the cloud will be available over a cell network.
post #55 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by yensid98 View Post

I agree 100%. Why rely on Wi-Fi access or cell phone data coverage to play back music? What happens when I'm driving and going in and out of coverage areas? What about data caps?

I don't see any benefits to streaming my content all the time.

What I want from Apple is the ability to re-download any file I bought from them at no additional charge. Music, Movies, and Videos. Just like I can with apps.

If it works anything like the Amazon cloud music player then the songs will be cached locally so you only need to stream them the first time. You could repeatedly listen to the same playlist without worrying about data coverage or caps.
post #56 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by dayvancowboy View Post

really. f the cloud. thanks, but no thanks. while i do appreciate someone trying to sell me my own stuff, i am gonna draw the line. i am not willing to pay extra to listen to subpar copies of my music that i paid good money for. i am happy to have ditched the iphone, i am happy to have ditched android. now, i just load up my ipod classic with all my albums recorded at lossless and actually enjoy my music. as soon as itunes can sell me music in a lossless format, i might care. until then, f the cloud.

That assumes any music you upload to the cloud will be re-encoded at a lower bit rate. It is quite possible the songs will be stored intact so if you upload them in a lossless format then that is how they will be in the stored cloud and be played on your device.
post #57 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by dish View Post

I think it will allow media that hasnt been purchased via itunes.

I think they will allow it also. Provided that the song is in their collection. At least if this is a free service. The paid version will be for you to get Mobile Me and you can put whatever you want in your idisk. then what they might do is link the two together so the system doesn't care if it is in your 'streaming library' or out of your music folder on your idisk it will play, can be put in personal playlists (but not imixes, ping playlists etc unless it is a catalog song) and so on


Quote:
Originally Posted by dish View Post

mobileme is nolonger for sale...will you still have to pay for the renewal? It might be free for you now until they release the new mobileme service.


They cut the boxes and the codes. But you can sign up for a free trial and then pay to extend it, or renew an account. I suspect that now that all the channels are hopefully cleared out they will go to online only and leave it at that. Hopefully with a price drop in the near future.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply
post #58 of 68
I have 23,000 tracks on an external Drobo drive. I would like to access those thracks from work, on the road and from my holiday location in Paris, France. This service makes sense to me. Alternatives such as Orb are spottily performing stopgaps on the road to getting full access in an interfCe that makes sense ti iTunes users.
post #59 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

FWIW, my macbook wakes up when i pull up my iTunes library on my ATV2. tell the machine to never sleep, just sleep the display. Power draw is relatively insignificant on a laptop with drives spun down, processor idle and screen off. Heck, my iTunes library is on an external HD connected to the laptop that's smart enough to wake up when it's needed and sleep when it's done, too.

also, @ cloud computing being used because it's too much effort to walk into the other room.

Originally Posted by DJinTX
I hate having to walk back to my office to wake my MacBook and launch iTunes in order to stream something to the living room. But with cloud streaming, I can just stream it all directly from Apple's cloud servers. Yeah, I like this idea alot.

You guys obviously never heard of the Magic Packet used by Wake On LAN technology, which is built into most modern PC's. Rather than taking even the minuscule energy hit leaving your MacBook on while Apple TV is operational, you can let both devices go to sleep and wake up when you require them to.

And yes, there's an app for that. Actually several, my favourite in the App Store being Scany

The cool thing about MacBooks is that you don't require an Ethernet connection to use Wake On LAN, like most PCs - it will work with both Wired and Wireless networks.
post #60 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

Laugh if you want, it is still my primary reason for wanting it. And I know there are others in the same boat. Let's not forget that Apple does like to provide elegant streamlined products and services. This would certainly fit into that category.

There's an App for that. See my Magic Packet entry in the thread above.
post #61 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

That assumes any music you upload to the cloud will be re-encoded at a lower bit rate. It is quite possible the songs will be stored intact so if you upload them in a lossless format then that is how they will be in the stored cloud and be played on your device.

I cant imagine that will happen. ALAC lossless files are about 1Mbps. Thats just not feasible.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #62 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post

Since it has not been announced, how do you know there is anything better?

How much does this (not yet announced) Apple cloud service cost and what do you get?

This cloud service is not provided by Apple. It is provided by another big tech corporation. Click on samlogo (my registered user name), then click on Visit samlogo's homepage. The banner that mentions cloud player is on the right.
post #63 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by samlogo View Post

This cloud service is not provided by Apple. It is provided by another big tech corporation. Click on samlogo (my registered user name), then click on Visit samlogo's homepage. The banner that mentions cloud player is on the right.

This is not what I asked.
What exactly does Apple's yet-to-be announced cloud service cost and what exactly does it provide?
You have no idea so you cannot say the cloud service you are referring to is better.
post #64 of 68
I'm just wondering about any agreements that lala.com might've had when it comes to the whole iTunes digital music locker thing. I haven't heard much of anything related to Apple's purchase of lala.com in a while with regards to this topic.
post #65 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by xamian View Post

I'm just wondering about any agreements that lala.com might've had when it comes to the whole iTunes digital music locker thing. I haven't heard much of anything related to Apple's purchase of lala.com in a while with regards to this topic.

I can’t imagine they had any IP that was worth what they paid and if you want the people behind it you can usually siphon them off for a huge raise and benefits that is much smaller than buying a company and paid in 2 week installments.

It makes me wonder if their licensing agreements are a major reason here. But if so, then why the new licensing agreements and how long was Lala’s agreements since Apple bought them 1.5 years ago. I understand their secrecy but it’s still annoying.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #66 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

Data caps are on the order of 250GB/month. 20GB shouldn't seriously cut into that unless you stream a lot of video (in which case the 20GB would probably the the least of your worries).

I do believe you're off by a decimal point or three on your estimate of data caps, guy. ATT starts selling 3G service for the iPad at 250 MB not GB, monthly phone caps are closer to 2GB than 250 where they exist and your friendly neighborhood cableco is likely to start throttling you down at or before 5 GB according to most forum lore at least.

Ergo, in our "Cloud, ho!" approach to our data (which is clearly the wave of the near- to mid-future) - i.e., all our "stuff" everywhere, on any device, all the time - the pipe IS gonna be a (or the) significant bottleneck - and unless I'm wrong, a more costly component for most users than the cost of external storage.

At least I'm paying SugarSync $20.83/month ($250/yr) for for 250 GB of storage and sync - and it works on every geegaw I own or am considering owning - replicating some data to some devices as well as the cloud, but not to others, as I specify - and automatically moving phone pix to a computer while keeping them available over all devices. It also stores the last five versions of each file I'm working on, and keeps at least some of my deleted files around for a period I'm hazy on - and neither of these services counts against my cap I think. And if I'm on someone else's computer/device, I still have access to all that stuff - plus can work on it, change it and resync it - via the browser client. (PS - it did take weeks to upload it all at background rates, but per file access on the down is speedy.)

To me that's a hell of a value - backup + sync between PC's, Macs, iDevices (from all major companies, btw, not just Apple's) no more fear of losing all my years of writing, personal pics and music collecting (i.e., offsite, encrypted, multi-copied at multi-sites with "5 9's" reliability) - plus versioning plus not worrying or even caring which device which files were created on or originally stored on.

And it WILL stream MY music to any of my devices as well (altho' I"m not sure how it works since I haven't done it, and don't think it handles video). It further allows one to choose which parts of their library to sync to a phone or pod or pad for off-line access (and change 'em whenever you choose).

PS: I looked into many services - since I do move from computer to computer through the year (maintaining heavy duty desktops in two states, plus a notebook plus a phone) and found big differences. The two most hyped services, Carbonite and Mozy, are both much less flexible than this, and while the first thing I did was get a free DropBox account to play with, and it works as advertised, I didn't like that I had to put the files IN my DropBox rather than into the file structures I've built, whereas with SugarSync, I save my files where I usually do on both my Win and Mac machines, tell SS to archive those folders, and it then takes care of replicating them to and propagating them from the web with no further thought on my part whatsoever.

SS is also notably cheaper for mass storage than DBox for the record.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mesomorphicman View Post

1_ Could be good for people (like me) who have large mp3 collections, well over what the iPhone and iPod touch will hold. With this you could still listen to those songs and playlist from work, at someone else's home or while traveling.

2_ if you have an iPad also useful, and you're traveling or over someone's house and you want to watch a movie on your iPad, over a relatives house and want to show your photos, or more (#1 above).

3_ My only hopes are it allows you to store all your ALL your music and not just iTunes purchased songs, because like others most my music is not from iTunes. Of no use to many if it's only iTunes purchases. Secondly, hopefully this won't be priced out of range for most and a reasonably priced service, or at least tiered so we can pick. Something like $5.00-15/mth depending on locker size.

If Apple gets too cute with this - and the entire history of iDisk/MobileMe shows it to be one of the few areas of operation where they've never really gotten it - the new services could range from somewhat underwhelming to being a "Ping" level epic fail. (Yeah, yeah, Ping coulda' been a big deal IF it had integrated with fbook as Apple planned - but it didn't and it wasn't and it's not.)

And we don't really know whether they're positioning themselves to compete more/mostly/solely on the content serving side (like the Amazon digital music locker) and/or, since Mobile Me includes apps (or something resembling 'em), against the Google Docs/Windows Live type products and/or the big Time Machine in the Sky services like SugarSync, JungleDisk, DropBox, etc. - or some hybrid of two or three of these. That is, most people here are assuming it's the first of these three, but I''m not so certain. Apple's well aware of our desires to be able to get at all our junk in the "post-PC" era without thinking too hard about how or where, since they're the ones primarily responsible for helping to create the era so far.

If for example, this is primarily a music service and they're just going to put a marker on only songs I've bought from them, and then just redirect my play request to a single copy of the song on their server farm, first, there'll be holes all over my collection, and second, since my playlists are built largely on harmonizing the multiplicity and inaccuracies of genre names in the metadata, what is there will break the rest of my playlists to bits (so to speak!). So there's two deal breakers if this isn't about my files. (PS: and what if I've bought songs from iTunes and remixed/mashed-'em-up in say GarageBand? Again, no go.)

And if it's "all my stuff" backup, but only all my Apple-branded device stuff backup, since I already have a perfectly good version of that (as noted above) that's totally agnostic about Windows, Mac, Android, Blackberry, etc., I wouldn't even consider getting locked in, even tho' my main daily machine is always going to be a Mac.

And if it's "all my media content anywhere" we're back to where this post started - not only what Apple's going to charge and their stance toward DRM - but how constricted and costly the pipe to get it to us is going to be.

So I can see why this has been taking awhile. Plenty of variables and options and players to consider. And no lead-pipe cinch win this time, whatever they go with, simply because they put a "magical brand" on it. No way - the value add has to be clear and at least fairly compelling to get big user uptake given the competition and immaturity of the whole area.

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply
post #67 of 68
Simplify Music did exactly what apple is proposing for free.
post #68 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

This is a very good question. I think my library is about 50/50, so I am in a similar boat. Unfortunately my guess is that it will only work with purchased content. The way I envision it, is that we won't actually upload anything to the servers really. Apple will just do a scan of our libraries, and see what all we have purchased. We will then have access to stream this from Apple, like an unlimited rental model. But only for music they know we purchased.

Again, this is just my guess.

That's my guess too, but Apple doesn't need to scan your library for purchased content; Apple sold it to you, so Apple already knows what tracks you would (presumably) have the license right to stream.

Physically uploading your personal copy of a downloaded track doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Apple doesn't need MY copy to be able to stream that track to me; Apple just needs to know that I have the license right to stream a particular track and that I'm specifying that track to stream. A playlist would essentially be a combination of markers that tell the cloud server what tracks to stream and tracks that are actually stored on the device.

The streaming function would also makes it very easy for Apple to roll out an all-you-can-eat music subscription. I probably spend $5-$8 a month on music tracks, but I would gladly pay $10-$12 for an iTunes streaming subscription.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPod + iTunes + AppleTV
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPod + iTunes + AppleTV › Apple's cloud-based iTunes music streaming service is 'completed' - report