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China iPad 2 frenzy causes Apple Store scuffle in Beijing - Page 2

post #41 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20 View Post

I'm gonna try to beat that record. Next story that goes up where I see I'd be first to post, I'm just gonna write "Hitler!"

Gotta say though, Godwin's Law does need a reciprocal, after all balance is fundamental to physics. In the US anything left of right wing in sentiment immediately invokes cries of socialism and communism. So, the second we see Hitler mentioned we should cry Stalin just to balance things.
Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
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Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
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post #42 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlink View Post

Anybody who claims to remember the '70s obviously didn't live through them. Or was that the '60s? I forget.

I'm told it was a bit of both. I do remember wonderful colors ...
Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
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Enjoying the new Mac Pro ... it's smokin'
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini.
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post #43 of 127
As a Chinese myself, this is embarrassing news.

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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post #44 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by pit5000 View Post

Scalpers make me sick..
I'm Chinese so I happen to know a whole lot about these folks..
Their culture puts "money worship" above all else; public safety, health, dignity, respect, rule of law..., nobody really cares about any of that, making money is all that seems to matter.

In my time in China, most the people i came across have absolutely no pride in the jobs they work, they just do it for the sake of the money.

Sad to say, that trait is not at all unique to the Chinese.
post #45 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post

Sad to say, that trait is not at all unique to the Chinese.

I know but I find it very disturbing how wide spread it is in China compared to other places and I've been to over 15 countries.
post #46 of 127
i have said it for the past 2 years.
apple does not adequately manage a supply chain that includes china, yet

this is not the first time violence has flared at apple stores in china. in both beijing and shanghai apple stores have had to close for a day or two before in order to get control of crowds.

is this the chinese fault? no. apple doesnt have the resources in china who have been smart enough to put in place ways to manage launches. i place the blame squarely on apple for not handling these events better. each time a new product launches in china, during the past 12 months, additional security is in place. but it is poorly done and not coordinated with local police.

but this time there is definitely strange reporting coming out of the events at sanlitun:
1/ the stories say that an apple employee, foreign, came out and violently struck these people with a stick. obviously this did not take place yet apple is officially silent on exactly what did take place
2/ the photos of the "injured" show unusually similar looking bruises

i think all this means an organised group orchestrated the event to embarrass apple. obviously not apple at fault for that.

but china has an underside that works outside of laws and apple doesnt have the people operating on the ground in china to manage the result of that. for this apple is at fault. orchestrated events that are made to embarrass apple is one thing, but it can clearly escalate to innocent people getting hurt.

if apple cant manage including china in its supply chain better, then apple needs to focus on other markets first, in which brand potential can be grown.

suggestions for apple:

1/ delay product launches in china until adequate stocks are available
2/ no more launches of products at stores
3/ launches only handled through the web stores
4/ 1 item per order
5/ five or six months after web store launch, after the world-wide supply chain is coming into balance, allow sales at physical stores in china

no one gets hurt.
apple wont be playing into hands of organised crime.
orderliness is restored.
apple gets no bad publicity.
apple grows brand by getting product into hands of people just the same.

store launches at apple have become media events. apple needs to take responsibility for events that happen at them.

and get some people in china who know what they are doing.
post #47 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by pit5000 View Post

Scalpers make me sick..
I'm Chinese so I happen to know a whole lot about these folks..
Their culture puts "money worship" above all else; public safety, health, dignity, respect, rule of law..., nobody really cares about any of that, making money is all that seems to matter.

In my time in China, most the people i came across have absolutely no pride in the jobs they work, they just do it for the sake of the money.

So they're big fans of Ayn Rand, I take it

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #48 of 127
Jeez... the iPad is great but it's not worth fighting over.
post #49 of 127
Well, the Apple stores in the US were robbed several times before.
So this incident is just small.
post #50 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by pit5000 View Post

Scalpers make me sick..
I'm Chinese so I happen to know a whole lot about these folks..
Their culture puts "money worship" above all else; public safety, health, dignity, respect, rule of law..., nobody really cares about any of that, making money is all that seems to matter.

In my time in China, most the people i came across have absolutely no pride in the jobs they work, they just do it for the sake of the money.

In my time in China, most of the people I met, have a lot of pride in the jobs they do.

There are greedy scalpers in the US and other countries, selling sports event tickets, concert tickets etc. Scalpers are in every country.
post #51 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingKuei View Post

Not surprising. China may be modernizing very rapidly, but the people have yet to catch up. I was sickened by some of the stuff I saw in Shanghai when I was spending time there a year ago. It's a First World infrastructure clashing with a just recently Third World people that are racing so fast into the modern era.

Mainland Chinese make me ashamed sometimes that I am half ethnic-Chinese (born and raised in South East Asia and Australia).
post #52 of 127
While I don't think this was orchestrated to embarrass Apple, the rest of your post is highly pertinent.

Apple is facing two challenges colliding to form the "perfect sh*tstorm". One is insatiable demand for products. The other is doing increased business in Asia.

US, Europe and Japan is a walk in the park compared to dealing with all levels of business in Asia... From rampant government, customs and immigration corruption through to greedy and/or disorganised suppliers, distributors and retailers in Asia.

In the developed world waiting 1 month or more before your iPhone 4 would even be looked at for service would make the national news. Here in Malaysia people have to just swallow it like the rest of the nonsense we deal with. China is probably even worse in several ways. But the thing is I've lived in Australia and the US, which is the curse that now I know better than those who have never left Asia for long.

The problem is compounded by the fact that since the iPhone 3G launch, even Europe was not handled that well. For example O2 in the UK having major launch day server issues (I was there at the Regent St store)... and virtually no iPhone 3G in Belgium for months and months, etc.

Remember that through this all Apple has ceded a lot of control over to the telcos and large-chain electronics retail as well. Which I believe has helped propel the iPhone and iPad to stellar heights but not without a price for certain people in certain countries.

If there is a "war" between iOS and Android, iPad and the rest, this is only the start of the collateral damage we are going to see. Microsoft and related businesses have built a trillion-dollar environment around the fact that it is just barely good enough and works just most of the time, and no real alternatives exist. While Apple may not sink so low, there will be sacrifices made for market share, as has already happened.

Quote:
Originally Posted by niji View Post

i have said it for the past 2 years.
apple does not adequately manage a supply chain that includes china, yet..

but china has an underside that works outside of laws and apple doesnt have the people operating on the ground in china to manage the result of that. for this apple is at fault. orchestrated events that are made to embarrass apple is one thing, but it can clearly escalate to innocent people getting hurt.

if apple cant manage including china in its supply chain better, then apple needs to focus on other markets first, in which brand potential can be grown.

suggestions for apple:

1/ delay product launches in china until adequate stocks are available
2/ no more launches of products at stores
3/ launches only handled through the web stores
4/ 1 item per order
5/ five or six months after web store launch, after the world-wide supply chain is coming into balance, allow sales at physical stores in china

no one gets hurt.
apple wont be playing into hands of organised crime.
orderliness is restored.
apple gets no bad publicity.
apple grows brand by getting product into hands of people just the same.

store launches at apple have become media events. apple needs to take responsibility for events that happen at them.

and get some people in china who know what they are doing.
post #53 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by pit5000 View Post

In my time in China, most the people i came across have absolutely no pride in the jobs they work, they just do it for the sake of the money.

Not only in China, you'll come across a lot of people like that too in where i live.
post #54 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnorth View Post

Check few pics here: http://micgadget.com/12431/the-ipad-...ness-in-china/

Check this out too:
http://micgadget.com/12040/how-the-m...does-business/

Just the tip of the iceberg of the grey market.
post #55 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter236 View Post

Well, the Apple stores in the US were robbed several times before.
So this incident is just small.

and people here seemed to forget the violence sparked by Sony's PS3 launch in the US.
post #56 of 127
Not to mention the infamous Tickle Me Elmo riots of the mid nineties and the Furby Genocide barely two years later. It seems we never learn. Hitler.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #57 of 127
As bad PR as this may be for Apple, I don't see this kind of thing happening at a Blackberry store any time soon
I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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post #58 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter236 View Post

In my time in China, most of the people I met, have a lot of pride in the jobs they do.

There are greedy scalpers in the US and other countries, selling sports event tickets, concert tickets etc. Scalpers are in every country.

I remember when I first came to japan in 1997, there was this new "Tamagotchi" virtual-pet toy, and rumor had it that the Yakuza were scalping the sh*t out of them all and reselling them at a very high price.
I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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post #59 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

It's the first time I've seen consumerism posited as a precursor to Naziism too.

Hitler was consumer whore.
post #60 of 127
I would rather have scalpers do what they do since its only the fools that buy them that create scalpers in the first place. Better this type of dodgy business than the ones making fake food for the sake of money that poison and kill babies, adults and pets in the past. Who knows what else is out there that are fake and a chance it'll end up on our dinner plate one day.

Poisonous dog food
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/18/bu...1.5765820.html
Plastic Rice
http://www.naturalnews.com/031344_plastic_rice.html
General
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_sa...ublic_of_China
Fake eggs, noodles and milk
http://forum.koreansentry.com/a/fake..._post4213.html
post #61 of 127
True, there's far worse practices happening in China than scalping iPads. The fake egg stuff is pretty scary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moustache View Post

I would rather have scalpers do what they do since its only the fools that buy them that create scalpers in the first place. Better this type of dodgy business than the ones making fake food for the sake of money that poison and kill babies, adults and pets in the past. Who knows what else is out there that are fake and a chance it'll end up on our dinner plate one day.

Poisonous dog food
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/18/bu...1.5765820.html
Plastic Rice
http://www.naturalnews.com/031344_plastic_rice.html
General
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_sa...ublic_of_China
Fake eggs, noodles and milk
http://forum.koreansentry.com/a/fake..._post4213.html
post #62 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by moustache View Post

I would rather have scalpers do what they do since its only the fools that buy them that create scalpers in the first place. Better this type of dodgy business than the ones making fake food for the sake of money that poison and kill babies, adults and pets in the past. Who knows what else is out there that are fake and a chance it'll end up on our dinner plate one day.

Poisonous dog food
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/18/bu...1.5765820.html
Plastic Rice
http://www.naturalnews.com/031344_plastic_rice.html
General
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_sa...ublic_of_China
Fake eggs, noodles and milk
http://forum.koreansentry.com/a/fake..._post4213.html

Unfortunately it's not an either/or situation. Alot of dodginess going on over there for the sake of money.
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post #63 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

It seems we never learn. Hitler.

I agree. Stalin.
Progress is a comfortable disease
--e.e.c.
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Progress is a comfortable disease
--e.e.c.
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post #64 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ochyming View Post

What being a Fascist has to do with having money?
Have you been paying attention to the cradle of fascists/nationalist parties raising to power in Europe?

Have you paid attention to the rise of fascist ideologies in America? Are you aware the DMCA is still active, among other things? It's a worldwide issue.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

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post #65 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bageljoey View Post

I agree. Stalin.

Very true. Mickey Mouse.

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

Reply

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

 

http://m.ign.com/articles/2014/07/16/7-high-school-girls-are-kickstarting-their-awa...

Reply
post #66 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I'm told it was a bit of both. I do remember wonderful colors ...

I think I used to listen to those.
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #67 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by tania View Post

and people here seemed to forget the violence sparked by Sony's PS3 launch in the US.

Amazing how small minded we have become.

AI posts a story of a couple of exuberant guys in line get in a tussle during the launch of an Apple product and all it does is drive out underlying racism, ignorance and stupidity of some posting here?

So nobody has heard of the fighting that breaks out every year over wedding dresses?* How about the fights during Black Friday or Boxing Day sales? XBox launch? Or for Justin Bieber concert tickets?

Or seen a scalper getting punched?†

Not just in China, but right in our own back yards.

* http://www.google.com/search?q=fight...c68342ca884eee
http://www.google.com/search?q=scalp...utf-8&oe=utf-8
post #68 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by moustache View Post

I would rather have scalpers do what they do since its only the fools that buy them that create scalpers in the first place. Better this type of dodgy business than the ones making fake food for the sake of money that poison and kill babies, adults and pets in the past. Who knows what else is out there that are fake and a chance it'll end up on our dinner plate one day.

Poisonous dog food
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/18/bu...1.5765820.html
Plastic Rice
http://www.naturalnews.com/031344_plastic_rice.html
General
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_sa...ublic_of_China
Fake eggs, noodles and milk
http://forum.koreansentry.com/a/fake..._post4213.html

As the adage goes, "People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
US Food
http://www.politicolnews.com/us-food-unsafe/
FDA Product Recalls
http://www.fda.gov/Safety/Recalls/
Auto
http://www.autorecalls.us/aut-10/rec...011/index.html
Toys
http://www.recallowl.com/RecallIndex/Toys/2011
Drugs
http://www.recallowl.com/Drug+and+Medical+Recalls/Drugs
post #69 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by moustache View Post

I would rather have scalpers do what they do since its only the fools that buy them that create scalpers in the first place. Better this type of dodgy business than the ones making fake food for the sake of money that poison and kill babies, adults and pets in the past. Who knows what else is out there that are fake and a chance it'll end up on our dinner plate one day.

Poisonous dog food
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/18/bu...1.5765820.html
Plastic Rice
http://www.naturalnews.com/031344_plastic_rice.html
General
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_sa...ublic_of_China
Fake eggs, noodles and milk
http://forum.koreansentry.com/a/fake..._post4213.html

It doesn't only happen in China, as well as producing Adolf Hitler Austria also produced the antifreeze in wine scandal of 1985.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wine_fraud
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #70 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Amazing how small minded we have become.

AI posts a story of a couple of exuberant guys in line get in a tussle during the launch of an Apple product and all it does is drive out underlying racism, ignorance and stupidity of some posting here?

So nobody has heard of the fighting that breaks out every year over wedding dresses?* How about the fights during Black Friday or Boxing Day sales? XBox launch? Or for Justin Bieber concert tickets?

Or seen a scalper getting punched?

Not just in China, but right in our own back yards.

* http://www.google.com/search?q=fight...c68342ca884eee
http://www.google.com/search?q=scalp...utf-8&oe=utf-8

Excellent post. Thank you.
post #71 of 127

Every country has it's share. If you look at history of product safety issues in countries like the UK, Japan, and France, you'll be shocked. Just google with some key words, and you'd be stunned at what you come up with.
post #72 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Excellent post. Thank you.

You're welcome.

On a happier note, congratulations to all those Moms who are fortunate to have sons and daughters who were considerate enough/could afford to give them an iPad.

Or in our case, a hand-me-down (1) from our son who kept the new 2 for himself. Little did/does he know that Mom had/has planned on getting him a 2 as soon as the 3 comes out.

Now I am the luckiest/unluckiest guy in the world. I now have two iPads to drawn from; after all, I paid/going to pay for both/all 3 of them.
post #73 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Amazing how small minded we have become.

AI posts a story of a couple of exuberant guys in line get in a tussle during the launch of an Apple product and all it does is drive out underlying racism, ignorance and stupidity of some posting here?

So nobody has heard of the fighting that breaks out every year over wedding dresses?* How about the fights during Black Friday or Boxing Day sales? XBox launch? Or for Justin Bieber concert tickets?

Or seen a scalper getting punched?

Not just in China, but right in our own back yards.

* http://www.google.com/search?q=fight...c68342ca884eee
http://www.google.com/search?q=scalp...utf-8&oe=utf-8

Not only was Godwin's law invoked so soon but this may be a first where a thread begins in chaos and slowly rises to reason and logic.
na na na na na...
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na na na na na...
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post #74 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightknight View Post

Very true. Mickey Mouse.

Very, very true. Osama bin Laden.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #75 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Snitch View Post

Not to be left out, a scuffle with employees broke out in a Microsoft store when a customer tried to leave without buying anything.

That was me.

I was walking around South Coast Plaza yesterday just killing time waiting for tires to be but on my car, when I came upon the Microsoft Store. It was really big and there were a surprising number of people there. They had three Surfaces, which was the first I'd seen one and also several "Slate" PCs. There was a large Samsung TV where they were playing a bowling game with the Kinect. Also on display was the Win Phone 7. First time I'd seen one.

The sales people were nice and dressed not unlike Apple Store employees with their lanyard badges. One very attractive female sales associate tried to start a conversation, she surmised quickly that it was the first time I'd ever been in the store, sort of like you recognize someone from out of town because they just keep staring at everything.

She wanted to demonstrate the Win Phone for me. I was feeling a little uncomfortable about it when suddenly my iPhone rang with that distinctive 'Old Phone" tone. Having been discovered I rushed out of the store thus causing the commotion.

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

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post #76 of 127
Quote:

what does this have to do with anything...?
post #77 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingKuei View Post

Not surprising. China may be modernizing very rapidly, but the people have yet to catch up. I was sickened by some of the stuff I saw in Shanghai when I was spending time there a year ago. It's a First World infrastructure clashing with a just recently Third World people that are racing so fast into the modern era.

Unlike, say, Americans, who are so "modern."

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2008...dimytai-damour
post #78 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Unlike, say, Americans, who are so "modern."

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2008...dimytai-damour

It's been down hill ever since the Cabbage Patch doll was introduced...
na na na na na...
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na na na na na...
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post #79 of 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter236 View Post

Well, the Apple stores in the US were robbed several times before.
So this incident is just small.

I was thinking the same thing.

Memo to Steve: Make less desirable products. Your store in downtown Naperville, Illinois, was hit by overnight smash-and-grabs - twice.

I admit to being a Fanatical Moderate. I Disdain the Inane. Vyizderzominymororzizazizdenderizorziz?

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I admit to being a Fanatical Moderate. I Disdain the Inane. Vyizderzominymororzizazizdenderizorziz?

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post #80 of 127
I did some research on the issue. There were a huge crowd there on iPad 2 release day. Most people were in line for long hours. Only a few people(scalpers) behaviour badly, including a Western. It looks like that fight was cause by this Western. He wears Apple uniform. He came out to smash some customers and then went back. There are some Westerns in China who think they are superior than Chinese people and they tread Chinese really rude. I have seen such kind of cases in Beijing and Shanghai. They should learn to be civilized!

Here are some reports in Chinese. I found this report from sina web site (IT section): http://tech.sina.com.cn/it/2011-05-07/19085493568.shtml and this video post with a title of "Foreigner beating Chinese and Security guards not allowing people taking photos. http://video.sina.com.cn/v/b/51851850-1214341274.html. There are many posts and comments there about the event. Some say those scalpers deserve the beat, most are fiercely about foreigner's behaviour, and some are very angry about Apple's management about the release. Many people are asking for explanation from police and Apple. This may lead exploded events.

In addition to that, a lots of twitter posts on sina weibo (Chinese version of twitter) on this issue as well. It is unclear who is to blame. So I think comments here are unfair if they don't know the truth, just based on media news about China (most are negative).
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