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Apple rumored to release 'iPhone 4S' with T-Mobile, Sprint support in Sept. - Page 3

post #81 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

I don't think Apple deals in Plans B.

Can anyone really imagine Steve Jobs saying, "Well, OK, maybe it's just to hard to make a great new iPhone, so why don't you guys just take it easy and go with Plan B."

of course they have a plan B. they have a plan C.
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post #82 of 118
they have a plan D.
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post #83 of 118
Theres a plan E
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post #84 of 118
there is no plan F.
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post #85 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

there is no plan F.

The next iPhone will be a hardcore G just to hold us over until Preparation H, but some think that’s just until we can get to ‘i’, but I think that might be imaginary.
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post #86 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

Yes there are.
But you forgot to list them.
Here are some of them:

Android Rules:
1) You must give your personal information to Google.
2) You cannot upgrade the OS on your Android device.
3) You must deal with fragmentation.
4) You must deal with the crapware the carrier puts on your phone.
5) the list goes on and on.... lots of Android rules.

These jabs at Google are just wrong. One, you must give personal info to Apple to download any app. Case in point, you must give credit card to have an iTunes acc. My dad has yet to giv Google his credit card to be able to download apps. Two, you can upgrade your OS. My dad has done this too. Of course the updates can be slow because each OEM has its own customizations which slow the process (Google updates its OS more frequently than Apple however). Yes, you can call Anndroid fragmeentd BC of the multiple GUI's and different hardware, but then you could call iOS old because its notification system is by far the worst. And crapware ... Yes, that's true on some Android phones. Not true on Google Nexus series. And since the Nexus is pure Google, updates com to you as soon as the carrier allows it (since its OTA) and is not fragmented considering its pure Google.

And before someone says it, I am not a Google Android fan. I own an HTC Arrive on Sprint and believe its the best phone currently on Sprint. Of course that will change when iPhone 4S and Pre 3 comes to Sprint.
post #87 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

You forgot another one: the build quality of HTC and Motorola stink (maybe Samsung is better). Seriously, my friend had both the Nexus One, and then the G2 (which she upgraded when T-Mobile gave all its smart phones away for free on Valentine's Day). HTC made both phones, and they are made out of cheap flimsy plastics. Motorola phones not only are made of cheap materials, but they aren't designed well either. Before the iPhone, I have owned three Motorola phones. All have died before the end of the contract. Usually it is because of the poorly designed power cords that eventually cause the casing to crack and stop working. My step brother has a Motorola Droid and it suffers the same issues.

Some of HTC phones might be "cheap" but my HTC Arrive is very Nice build quality. Probably the best I have seen, other than the iPhone 4 of course.
post #88 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Why do you think anyone here would know that?

I don't. But I still want to know!

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #89 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

PS: If they really are going to alter the size of the display they will need an updated SDK and it will take time for devs to submit to the App Store. If this happens at WWDC that time frame between the June announcement and September launch with a new iPhone HW would make since.

I'm assuming that they will slightly increase the size of the display but retain the same resolution. This then won't require a new SDK or for Apps to be reworked yeah?
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post #90 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

What are the odds that this data center, their voice recognition, and/or their mapping software is the primary reason this is getting held back until September?*


* I know its not confirmed but Im saying there is enough circumstantial evidence to say that it probably is September.

The more I think about it, the more I suspect that Apple has big plans for OS 5 and that might indeed be the cause of the delay. This will be the first big OS release since Android really started eating up market share, and you'd have to figure that Apple wants to make sure they can continue to claim best phone status-- and at the moment there are a few areas that really need work.

So here's hoping: in September Apple will release a phone on more carriers, with a bigger screen, dual core processor, more ram, better camera, but most importantly running iOS 5, which will have overhauled notification services, better utilization of the home screen, and ties to new services contingent on that data center-- be it CloudTunes, voice commands or whatever.
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post #91 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by ameldrum1 View Post

I'm assuming that they will slightly increase the size of the display but retain the same resolution. This then won't require a new SDK or for Apps to be reworked yeah?

Sure it will. The UI isnt just about resolution, but about the entire environment.

Consider this, if what you say is correct then any size display using 960x480 resolution would not affect the way the UI looks and feels. Now image that on a 10 display. Now imagine it on a 1 display.

The elements get larger or smaller as you increase or decrease the pixel size. You can argue that it wont matter too much if they only increase it a little, but dont forget what company were talking about. This is Apple! I dont see them just releasing a half assed update to the SDK despite the display size change.

Then there are apps that do use the physical dimensions of the display for rendering images. Most notably apps that create rulers. But its not just those apps. Consider a game with on-screen controls. If Apple increases the display size the buttons could be too large for comfortable game play and also too far in from the sides to press the center. The developer may want to reduce their physical size back to what they were previously, which means a reduction in the number of pixels they use, as well as shift them to the edge slightly for easier use which also results in more screen real estate for the game window.
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post #92 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

The more I think about it, the more I suspect that Apple has big plans for OS 5 and that might indeed be the cause of the delay. This will be the first big OS release since Android really started eating up market share, and you'd have to figure that Apple wants to make sure they can continue to claim best phone status-- and at the moment there are a few areas that really need work.

So here's hoping: in September Apple will release a phone on more carriers, with a bigger screen, dual core processor, more ram, better camera, but most importantly running iOS 5, which will have overhauled notification services, better utilization of the home screen, and ties to new services contingent on that data center-- be it CloudTunes, voice commands or whatever.

1) If Apple really cared so much about market share Id think they would have released the iPhone to the other US carriers already, including the MNVOs.

2) I will be flabbergasted if iOS 5.0 doesnt come out with the most intuitive and industry leading notification system. The idea that they let what was an issue in iPhone OS 1.0 languish for so many years tell me they want this to be right, not just an incremental changes until they figure it out. Hopefully the WeBOS guy they hired last year has set them straight. If they dont update I may have to jump ship.

3) I wish Apple would release major iOS updates separate from new iPhones. Much like they do with the iPad, which may overtake the iPhone in revenue and profit in a couple years. I think it helps boost sales of the devices at more points and helps to focus on potential issues along the way without failing into the iOS 2.0/iPhone 3G/MobileMe debacle of 2008.
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post #93 of 118
They don't couple OS and phone releases.
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post #94 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

They don't couple OS and phone releases.

4 years in a row now iOS came out the same week as the new iPhone went on sale.
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post #95 of 118
They were just using the wwdc as a platform. And the original iPhone was not coupled to any software conference.
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post #96 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

They were just using the wwdc as a platform. And the original iPhone was not coupled to any software conference.

But major point releases definitely more or less coincide with hardware iterations.
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post #97 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

They were just using the wwdc as a platform. And the original iPhone was not coupled to any software conference.

I never mentioned WWDC or a software conference. I mentioned an OS release and the iPhone HW release.
  • iPhone OS 1.0 June 29, 2007
  • iPhone June 29, 2007

  • iPhone OS 2.0 July 11, 2008
  • iPhone 3G July 11, 2008

  • iPhone OS 3.0 June 17, 2009
  • iPhone 3GS June 19, 2009

  • iOS 4.0 June 21, 2010
  • iPhone 4 June 24, 2010
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post #98 of 118
Which was because of the WWDC. Mostly. This debate is , as usual on this forum , Americancentric.

I bought the 1G on the first day if it's release in one of the first countries outside the US to have it, and I got it in November 2007. The other release dates were staggered as well.

In any case I have never seen them as coupled. And this year we see the decoupling proper. I bet iOS 5 is not just announced at WWDC but released soon after.
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post #99 of 118
But I agree that decoupling is a good idea.
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post #100 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

Which was because of the WWDC. Mostly. This debate is , as usual on this forum , Americancentric.

I bought the 1G on the first day if it's release in one of the first countries outside the US to have it, and I got it in November 2007. The other release dates were staggered as well.

In any case I have never seen them as coupled. And this year we see the decoupling proper. I bet iOS 5 is not just announced at WWDC but released soon after.

You cant go by your country, you have to go by the country or countries its released in first. Its been tied to the release of the new iPhone HW. The fact that not all countries get the same release date doesnt discount that fact.
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post #101 of 118
Ok. I cede the point for America. Since I bought a 1G which I updated later, and a 3GS which I updated to 4.x I didn't notice the coupling. Nevertheless a decoupling would be a good idea, it would show that maybe Apple can increase sales with both a major update in software and hardware.
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post #102 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splinemodel View Post

Jobs won't be around in a year. I will probably wait for the iPhone 5, nonetheless.

That is a stupid thing to say.
post #103 of 118
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post #104 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury99 View Post

... here is my wish list for a new iPhone in order of importance:

1. Screen aprox. 4.5"
2. 4G data
3. World phone


Apple won't do 4G data until you can leave it on all day without destroying your battery. It's just not technically possible at the moment by all accounts.

my wish list for a fifth gen iPhone is simpler:

1. off-contract price of < $500
2. better than last years model in some (even minor) way

all my beefs with the iPhone or things that I'd like it to do that it currently doesn't revolve around software not hardware. the camera will get better year by year and that will be nice, it's a bit faster year by year and that's nice, but all that's expected now and hardly revolutionary. as long as each year's model is better than the last and reasonably affordable I will buy it and so will most other folks IMO.

IMO what's really missing is some compelling software. it's especially noticeable with the iPad. all the basic apps are in need of an overhaul and the whole OS needs to be more 'serious' (by which I mean the user has to get a bit more control over the OS and have a bit more power to actually do things with the device besides play games and read the news.)

I'd like to see the settings app balloon to double it's current size. I'd like to see some serious work done on Pages and document/file management. I'd like to see a decent email client for the iPad and an integrated home screen for the iPhone. I'd like to see those five finger multi-touch settings added back at a minimum.
post #105 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Apple won't do 4G data until you can leave it on all day without destroying your battery. It's just not technically possible at the moment by all accounts.

my wish list for a fifth gen iPhone is simpler:

1. off-contract price of < $500
2. better than last years model in some (even minor) way

A $499 or less price point is interesting, which would mean $100 less from vendors on contract. The question isnt can they do it, but should they do it. Sure, theyll sell more, but they seem to be barely keeping ahead of demand as it is with a nearly 1 year old product.

There is an argument to be made that if they ramp up production enough for the anticipated need they could make increase economy of scale to a point that could increase their profit margin while simultaneously suffocating any competitor who tries to make a profit at or above their price point.

Android-based handset would still very likely outsell the iPhone but wed see them be cheaper, simpler devices that are made poorly by companies that can barely keep the lights on. Essentially Apple start doing what theyve done by aggressively pricing the iPad.

They would have to worry about weakening the brand since they cant easily jump back up after they drop down in price. Still, I think it could be a reasonable shift for increased profits and dominance in the handset market, even though they are already killing it without any such change. Hell, just adding Sprint, T-Mobile and China Mobile would do plenty of damage.

Outside of sourcing components there are few things to consider. We have both Samsung and LG talking about HiDPI displays. The smaller the display the more likely it will come first so smartphones matching or exceeding the iPhones Retina Display are imminent. On top of that, it will likely make Apples Retina Display considerably cheaper over the next couple years. Then there is NAND which is likely to see a capacity doubling this Autumn (which might be a reason Apple delayed the G5 iPhone) making 32GB and 64GB the new standard, so a 16GB iPhone which would have a NAND price of the current 8GB NAND as another likely way to reduce costs to get to a sub-$500 device.
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post #106 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by mesomorphicman View Post

1_ I'm a little tired of every new product or upgrade there's some story of how Apple wanted to do this or that but due to this or that reason they couldn't do it. I understand things happen out of ones control, but this is ALL the time. Why can't Apple manage these better or plan far enough ahead? Next iPad 3 will have something that was planned but due to something it won't happen and people will need to wait for iPad 4. Every other maker can squeeze in a 4G/LTE or whatever thingamabob why can't Cupertino?

2_ Guess I'm holding onto my 3GS for another year, I refuse to buy another .5 item like the 3GS as much as I like it, but for once I want a fully new product. This "4S" is VERY disappointing to me. Oh well, I guess another 15-16 months of waiting won't kill me (I hope, knock on wood).

Assuming the iPhone 4S goes to ATT, it is as much of a 4G device as the Atrix 4G, Infuze 4G and Veer 4G on ATT. All those phones have no LTE but HSPA+. And there is currently only too phones that have LTE and you know what? I doubt any of thm will sell as much as the iPhone 4S will. And ATT, T Mobile and Sprint don't even have a LTE network yet ... So why should you care about something you can't use?
post #107 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macintosh_Next View Post

Assuming the iPhone 4S goes to ATT, it is as much of a 4G device as the Atrix 4G, Infuze 4G and Veer 4G on ATT. All those phones have no LTE but HSPA+. And there is currently only too phones that have LTE and you know what? I doubt any of thm will sell as much as the iPhone 4S will. And ATT, T Mobile and Sprint don't even have a LTE network yet ... So why should you care about something you can't use?

1) I think HSPA+ 14.4Mbps and HSUPA 5.78Mbps is likely for the next iPhone. The efficiency of those chips seem to be great according to battery tests.

2) As much as some want LTE and Verizon is pushing it because they have no choice* its still only being included on large smartphones with more space for the larger chips and even larger battery and its still not lasting long enough for the average users day.

3) Verizon finally has a speed advantage over AT&T with LTE but the cost is far too high at the moment. Well soon see 200-40Mbps from HSPA+ with efficient HW. For Verizons sake I hope the LTE vendors can reduce the power usage by then.
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post #108 of 118
I'm not looking forward to the day when the iPhone comes to Sprint. Right now I'm enjoying my awesome unlimited deal on Sprint as a second line to my iPhone -- it's the deserted HOV lane of the cellular superhighway.
post #109 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) I think HSPA+ 14.4Mbps and HSUPA 5.78Mbps is likely for the next iPhone. The efficiency of those chips seem to be great according to battery tests.

2) As much as some want LTE and Verizon is pushing it because they have no choice* its still only being included on large smartphones with more space for the larger chips and even larger battery and its still not lasting long enough for the average users day.

3) Verizon finally has a speed advantage over AT&T with LTE but the cost is far too high at the moment. Well soon see 200-40Mbps from HSPA+ with efficient HW. For Verizons sake I hope the LTE vendors can reduce the power usage by then.

LTE is the future of cell phone technology -- all cell phone companies are going that way, and even Sprint who is backing WiMAX is considering adding LTE as its 4G along with WiMAX (and battery life is surely going to get fixed). However with that said, its early and not everyone has it built yet so why support it?
post #110 of 118
The big question is what will Apple do to address security concerns like this:

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...l-phone-calls/

Sim cards disable the GSM standard of warning of no encryption on a cell site -- who's bright idea was that?
post #111 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macintosh_Next View Post

LTE is the future of cell phone technology -- all cell phone companies are going that way, and even Sprint who is backing WiMAX is considering adding LTE as its 4G along with WiMAX (and battery life is surely going to get fixed). However with that said, its early and not everyone has it built yet so why support it?

You acknowledge that LTE is the fuure but then ask why component makers, handset vendors and carriers should support it? Um.. technology is a process. You cant get from A to Z in one step. There will be intermediate achievements along the way. Right now, we have some carriers offering support for LTE in some markets, and large handiest offering some level of LTE despite the lowered consumer experience. Thats how this works! It will improve, but it wont improve if no one is ever supporting it. I can name plenty of failed technologies that prove it.
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post #112 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loungepop View Post

There's no way Apple would break with their update cycle and replace a one year old complete refresh... New models come every other model at the very most. A larger screen and form-factor update seems more important/relevant than an even better camera a slight speed upgrade for an already lightning fast model... I feel the aesthetics are farther behind the times than the hardware, but Apple will of course release a 4S and give us the modern iPhone in 2012.

I think Apple has to delay the release of their phone in large part due to the earthquake. The whole dynamic of manufacturing in Japan is changing dramatically to reduce power consumption during peak hours & rebuilding its infrastructure.
post #113 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

1. off-contract price of < $500
2. better than last years model in some (even minor) way

1. If Apple would start playing price game, it would not be typical of Apple.

2. "Better than last year" would not do it for me. Apple must continue to innovate and lead otherwise it will fall behind, there is so much going on in industry. Samsung, for instance, demoed recetly some fascinating AMOLEDs, including 4.5-inch flexible display.

HTC EVO 3D comes with 4.3" screen, HDMI out, 4G Mobile Hotspot supporting up to 8 Wi-Fi devices, integrated Google Voice, dual 5mp 3-D camera, 1080p video recording, 1730 mAh battery, 1.2 GHz Snapdragon dual-core, 1GB RAM, heptic feedback input, Swype, digital compass, proximity sensor, ambient light sensor, FM radio, etc. And HTC makes 19 phone models. If Apple makes just one, it should really make the difference to compete.

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post #114 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You acknowledge that LTE is the fuure but then ask why component makers, handset vendors and carriers should support it? Um.. technology is a process. You can’t get from A to Z in one step. There will be intermediate achievements along the way. Right now, we have some carriers offering support for LTE in some markets, and large handiest offering some level of LTE despite the lowered consumer experience. That’s how this works! It will improve, but it won’t improve if no one is ever supporting it. I can name plenty of failed technologies that prove it.

I don't think I made myself clear. Let me try one more time. As a consumer, why should you care about LTE when its not in your area? Sure it might be in two years, but chances are if your In a small town you won't get till your next upgrade. I agree that phone companies like Apple and Samsung should make LTE and WiMAX phones. But in Apples case, if you see possible shortages of a product that will mean you can't supply demand -- then why put it in this product?

And to drive this point more, the original person I replied to was talking about upgrading his 3GS to an 4S and was upset it. Doesn't have LTE in it. ATT doesn't even have LTE yet and probably won't until Nov or Dec, T Mobile doesn't have an LTE network yet and Sprint has WiMAX right now and might be getting LTE next year. So if only one company has LTE right now, why make a iPhone 4S on all carriers and only have one being able to use the 4G technology? I mean Sprint didn't launch the Evo without a 4G network right? So why should ATT, T Mobile and Sprint LTE phones without an LTE network to support that phone?
post #115 of 118
Digitimes posted more evidence of the next iPhone model release as early as September.

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20110517PD214.html

An interesting statement was the number of iPhones sitting on store shelves was pegged between 1.5 and 2 million.
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post #116 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Digitimes posted more evidence of the next iPhone model release as early as September.

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20110517PD214.html

An interesting statement was the number of iPhones sitting on store shelves was pegged between 1.5 and 2 million.

Is a week or so of inventory really that interesting? Are you suggesting that 7-10 days of inventory is excessive?
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post #117 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Is a week or so of inventory really that interesting? Are you suggesting that 7-10 days of inventory is excessive?

No. I would think even you would be interested in knowing what the inventory levels might be. I've never seen it mentioned before, but apparently you have?
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post #118 of 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

No. I would think even you would be interested in knowing what the inventory levels might be. I've never seen it mentioned before, but apparently you have?

To an extent, as a shareholder and customer, Im concerned. My query was about your perception of their channel inventory. The phrasing "sitting on store shelves is oft used as a pejorative, and you only mentioned the quantity which does seem quite high when not qualified.

I bet the production cycles of their other products (not to mention their competitors) lead to considerably longer durations in the channel. For instance, I cant imagine the Mac Pro production is on full tilt the way the iPhone and iPads are. Its sale volume could push it to only be produced in short busts throughout the year.

PS: I think they occasionally mention channel numbers in their earning calls but I cant seem to find any proof of that.
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