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Stay classy, Tea Party - Page 2

post #41 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

So says SDW here at the sand box!


That was a completely unprovoked and inappropriate personal attack for which you have been reported.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

A propos the violence and lack of all perspective of these dickheads in the Tea Party, after the assassination of Abraham Lincoln, the SF Chronicle commented on John Wilkes Booth:



They should grow the f*** up.

Perhaps you could clarify...you're comparing the Tea Party to those who wanted Lincoln dead?
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post #42 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Perhaps you could clarify...you're comparing the Tea Party to those who wanted Lincoln dead?

Oh, re-read the quote from the SF Chronicle and use your brain.



It's about language and violent rhetoric. You're not stupid.
post #43 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Oh, re-read the quote from the SF Chronicle and use your brain.



It's about language and violent rhetoric. You're not stupid.

"If They Bring a Knife to the Fight, We Bring a Gun." - President Barack Obama

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #44 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Oh, re-read the quote from the SF Chronicle and use your brain.



It's about language and violent rhetoric. You're not stupid.

After the Giffords shooting, liberals jumped on this "violent rhetoric" theme and ran with it. Calling the Tea Party racist and stupid wasn't working, so they decided to give this one a whirl. Dems decided to take a few exampled of wackadoos and make them the poster children of the movement. "Progressive" organizations even sent out "protestors" to join the group...quite literally a false flag organization.

Now of course, the new "non-violent" standards don't apply and have never applied to progressives. They can continue to use rhetoric that is actually violent, such as hoping that Rush Limaugh's kidney's fail, or stating that they think someone should put a bullet between Dick Cheney's eyes.

Come on, Mumbo...you haven't noticed? Any group with whom democrats, leftists and progressives disagree is racist, stupid, ignorant, sexest, bigoted, and even evil. This is why we have the new head of the DNC running around saying the GOP is "anti-women." Further she stated:

Quote:
"The pushback and the guttural reaction from women against the Republican's agenda out of the gate, the war on women that the Republicans have been waging since they took over the House, I think is going to not only restore but possibly helps us exceed the president's margin of victory in the next election," added the popular Florida congresswoman.

from here: http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/was...gop-anti-women

Wait, I thought we were done with violent rhetoric? \

Let me tell you about the real opposition to the Tea Party. It's liberals/progressives/leftists and socialists who actually believed they could change the fabric of America. They are in nuclear meltdown over the fact that much of the populace...the core of the country...has finally figured out what "remaking America" actually means. Everyday Americans in the lower, middle and upper-middle class have figured it out. And they are not happy with the direction their country is going. Sure, they argue about taxes and healthcare and wars and scandals and what have you...but they don't want our free enterprise system to be drastically altered. They don't wan to be told they can't drive their kids to soccer practice or have a BBQ because it's killing the environment. They don't want NASA to have "Muslim outreach" as one of its missions. They don't want the government spending double what it takes in. They don't want the government owning auto companies, banks, etc. They've woken up.

Once folks who think like you do realized there was actual resistance to their thinking, they decided it needed to be eliminated. Cue the -isms and slander against everyday people that disagree with policies. Welcome to America.
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post #45 of 85
Here's that quote from the SF Chronicle editorial on John Wilkes Booth following the assassination of Abraham Lincoln again.

Quote:
Booth has simply carried out what ... secession politicians and journalists have been expressing in words ... who have denounced the President as a 'tyrant', a 'despot', a 'usurper', hinted at, and virtually recommended.
post #46 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Here's that quote from the SF Chronicle editorial on John Wilkes Booth following the assassination of Abraham Lincoln again.

A used a word.

B used the same word.

Thus b = a.

Is that really your attempt at a logical argument?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #47 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Sure, they argue about taxes and healthcare and wars and scandals and what have you...but they don't want our free enterprise system to be drastically altered. They don't wan to be told they can't drive their kids to soccer practice or have a BBQ because it's killing the environment. They don't want NASA to have "Muslim outreach" as one of its missions. They don't want the government spending double what it takes in. They don't want the government owning auto companies, banks, etc. They've woken up.
.

When I read this sort of thing, about your moderate centrist President and his economic policies to the right of France of Germany, I can't help but wonder when right wing America became such a bunch of hysterical pants-wetting ideologues.

You can chill out. Your government's to the right of France and Germany and to the left of Britain. For god's sake, chill the fuck out.
post #48 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


I am intentionally misunderstanding something because Team Stupid is losing an argument on the internet.

I see. Well, I'll have to talk to you through the fearsomely difficult point that I am making, then.

People act on violent rhetoric. Like when there was a campaign to brand Abraham Lincoln a tyrant. They couldn't disagree with him; they called him a tyrant. And someone assassinated him. Before jumping on the stage and declaring 'death to tyrants'.

You see? Really very simple.
post #49 of 85
So let's start censoring free speech and brand anyone found to be expressing opposition to the Dear Leader in any form or fashion an enemy of the state. After all, it's "for our own good".

Actually, it's already happening:

Park Ranger Orders Visitor to Leave National Military Park, Citing Objection to Ron Paul Decals on Car

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #50 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

So let's start censoring free speech and brand anyone found to be expressing opposition to the Dear Leader in any form or fashion an enemy of the state. After all, it's "for our own good".

Actually, it's already happening:

Park Ranger Orders Visitor to Leave National Military Park, Citing Objection to Ron Paul Decals on Car

EXACTLY. That kind of thing—comparing Barack Obama to the tyrannical leader of North Korea and claiming there's a system of state censorship in operation, when in reality one park ranger was a bit of a dickhead over a bumper sticker that didn't even mention the president?

Why don't you just chill out and voice your objections like an adult instead of wetting your pants about tyranny that doesn't actually exist?
post #51 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

EXACTLY. That kind of thingcomparing Barack Obama to the tyrannical leader of North Korea and claiming there's a system of state censorship in operation, when in reality one park ranger was a bit of a dickhead.

Why don't you just chill out and voice your objections like an adult instead of wetting your pants about tyranny that doesn't actually exist?

One park ranger is an idiot, but the entire Tea Party Movement wants to assassinate Barack Obama.

How can you not see the inconsistency in your thinking?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #52 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

One park ranger is an idiot, but the entire Tea Party Movement wants to assassinate Barack Obama.

How can you not see the inconsistency in your thinking?

Sigh.

While you're looking for the place where I said that the entire Tea Party movement actually wants to assassinate Barack Obama, why not have a bath and unwind, telling yourself 'Barack Obama isn't a tyrant and I really can breathe out now, because he's not really like the leader of North Korea.'

Here's that quote from the SF Chronicle again, by the way, about John Wilkes Booth.

Quote:
Booth has simply carried out what ... secession politicians and journalists have been expressing in words ... who have denounced the President as a 'tyrant', a 'despot', a 'usurper', hinted at, and virtually recommended.
post #53 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

After the Giffords shooting, liberals jumped on this "violent rhetoric" theme and ran with it. Calling the Tea Party racist and stupid wasn't working, so they decided to give this one a whirl. Dems decided to take a few exampled of wackadoos and make them the poster children of the movement. "Progressive" organizations even sent out "protestors" to join the group...quite literally a false flag organization.

Now of course, the new "non-violent" standards don't apply and have never applied to progressives. They can continue to use rhetoric that is actually violent, such as hoping that Rush Limaugh's kidney's fail, or stating that they think someone should put a bullet between Dick Cheney's eyes.

Come on, Mumbo...you haven't noticed? Any group with whom democrats, leftists and progressives disagree is racist, stupid, ignorant, sexest, bigoted, and even evil. This is why we have the new head of the DNC running around saying the GOP is "anti-women." Further she stated:


from here: http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/was...gop-anti-women

Wait, I thought we were done with violent rhetoric? \

Let me tell you about the real opposition to the Tea Party. It's liberals/progressives/leftists and socialists who actually believed they could change the fabric of America. They are in nuclear meltdown over the fact that much of the populace...the core of the country...has finally figured out what "remaking America" actually means. Everyday Americans in the lower, middle and upper-middle class have figured it out. And they are not happy with the direction their country is going. Sure, they argue about taxes and healthcare and wars and scandals and what have you...but they don't want our free enterprise system to be drastically altered. They don't wan to be told they can't drive their kids to soccer practice or have a BBQ because it's killing the environment. They don't want NASA to have "Muslim outreach" as one of its missions. They don't want the government spending double what it takes in. They don't want the government owning auto companies, banks, etc. They've woken up.

Once folks who think like you do realized there was actual resistance to their thinking, they decided it needed to be eliminated. Cue the -isms and slander against everyday people that disagree with policies. Welcome to America.


Quote:
After the Giffords shooting, liberals jumped on this "violent rhetoric" theme and ran with it.

Which is of course totally different from the way conservatives operate huh?

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?t=107127

Oh God!

Morning Mumbo!
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post #54 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Sigh.

While you're looking for the place where I said that the entire Tea Party movement actually wants to assassinate Barack Obama, why not have a bath and unwind, telling yourself 'Barack Obama isn't a tyrant and I really can breathe out now, because he's not really like the leader of North Korea.'

One park ranger screwed up, and you're perfectly willing to hold him responsible for his actions.

A crazed lunatic with no confirmed political affiliation or motive injures and kills people at a political rally in Tucson and you blame the so-called "violent rhetoric" of Sarah Palin and the Tea Party for his actions.

It's a shameless attempt to demonize a political figure or group of people you disagree with.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #55 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

I see. Well, I'll have to talk to you through the fearsomely difficult point that I am making, then.

People act on violent rhetoric. Like when there was a campaign to brand Abraham Lincoln a tyrant. They couldn't disagree with him; they called him a tyrant. And someone assassinated him. Before jumping on the stage and declaring 'death to tyrants'.

You see? Really very simple.

People don't act on violent rhetoric. Violent people use violent rhetoric before and after committing violent acts. Non-violent people use violent rhetoric as analogies so they do not have to commit any such acts.

People who equate the two are stupid and illogical. They are also profoundly scary and authoritarian. Finally since they cannot distinguish between actions and speech, they are worrisome since they are most likely to commit actual violent acts against others for speech since in their mind the two are the same.

In the meantime we have the classy Ed Schulz calling a talk show host a SLUT.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #56 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

People don't act on violent rhetoric. Violent people use violent rhetoric before and after committing violent acts. Non-violent people use violent rhetoric as analogies so they do not have to commit any such acts.

People who equate the two are stupid and illogical. They are also profoundly scary and authoritarian. Finally since they cannot distinguish between actions and speech, they are worrisome since they are most likely to commit actual violent acts against others for speech since in their mind the two are the same.

In the meantime we have the classy Ed Schulz calling a talk show host a SLUT.

And some people egg their shall we say less focused followers into to doing violent acts by putting targets on a map of people.

http://www.torontomike.com/2011/01/p..._us_rep_g.html



Or how about this post from you in your rising tide etc. thread :
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton
One thing that needs to be considered is that Bishop was from Alabama, where any white person supporting Obama would seem like an extreme off-putting nutjob to most family and friends.

And your reply :

Really and you think the whole shooting her brother, sending bombs and finally going on a shooting spree didn't trigger the nutjob vibes.

It was just all those around her and their political views that actually put her (apparently incorrectly) in that group.

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post #57 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

People don't act on violent rhetoric. Violent people use violent rhetoric before and after committing violent acts. Non-violent people use violent rhetoric as analogies so they do not have to commit any such acts.

People who equate the two are stupid and illogical. They are also profoundly scary and authoritarian. Finally since they cannot distinguish between actions and speech, they are worrisome since they are most likely to commit actual violent acts against others for speech since in their mind the two are the same.

Yes, of course, trumptman, words have no power to persuade anyone to action, and the context of public rhetoric in which John Wilkes Booth assassinated Abraham Lincoln and the nationalistic speeches of Radovan Karadic, or Rwandan public radio, are entirely irrelevant to the violence that followed.

Quote:
Booth has simply carried out what ... secession politicians and journalists have been expressing in words ... who have denounced the President as a 'tyrant', a 'despot', a 'usurper', hinted at, and virtually recommended.

What a desperate, useless argument you've made, trumptman.
post #58 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

And some people egg their shall we say less focused followers into to doing violent acts by putting targets on a map of people.

http://www.torontomike.com/2011/01/p..._us_rep_g.html


It's pretty clear that Jared Lee Loughner wasn't a follower of Palin. He was a hard leftist upset that Gifford's was acting like a centrist.

But let's run with your crazy logic. Clearly you're trying to cover for Barack Obama who incited Loughner into shooting people. I mean he said to bring a gun to any disagreement. Loughner disagreed and remedied that disagreement in the manner Barack Obama prescribed.

I mean how can you not follow my reasoning when Barack Obama is a Patriot Act extending, torture camp operating, bombing the whole middle east through endless wars, won't even seek the sanction of Congress kind of President?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #59 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Yes, of course, trumptman, words have no power to persuade anyone to action, and the context of public rhetoric in which John Wilkes Booth assassinated Abraham Lincoln and the nationalistic speeches of Radovan Karadic, or Rwandan public radio, are entirely irrelevant to the violence that followed.



What a desperate, useless argument you've made, trumptman.

From a person as irrational as yourself MJ, that's a compliment.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #60 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

From a person as irrational as yourself MJ, that's a compliment.

That's the worst comeback I've ever read.
post #61 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

That's the worst comeback I've ever read.

You really ought to stop giving him compliments. He might think you like him or something.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #62 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

It's pretty clear that Jared Lee Loughner wasn't a follower of Palin. He was a hard leftist upset that Gifford's was acting like a centrist.

But let's run with your crazy logic. Clearly you're trying to cover for Barack Obama who incited Loughner into shooting people. I mean he said to bring a gun to any disagreement. Loughner disagreed and remedied that disagreement in the manner Barack Obama prescribed.

I mean how can you not follow my reasoning when Barack Obama is a Patriot Act extending, torture camp operating, bombing the whole middle east through endless wars, won't even seek the sanction of Congress kind of President?

Lets see :
Quote:
Health at the Arizona Department of Health Services, said the state has no record of Loughner seeking mental health treatment in the public system. "I truly believe that it could have [helped]," Nelson said.[9]

Views

In the initial aftermath of the 2011 Tucson shooting, people speculated that Loughner's political views had been fueled by extremist rhetoric. Records show that Loughner was registered as an independent voter and voted in 2006 and 2008, but not in 2010.[21][22] A YouTube channel under an account called "Classitup10" was linked to Loughner.[23][24] Loughner had also posted a video on YouTube in which he described his school, Pima Community College, as "one of the biggest scams in America". This video led to Loughner being suspended from the school.[25] One classmate stated that that Loughner had laughed at a young woman and likened her to a terrorist after she read a poem about getting an abortion.[26][27] They also recall Loughner as an theist and a nihilist.[16][20][26][28] An old friend, Bryce Tierney, discussed several of Loughner's views. According to him, Loughner had exhibited a longstanding dislike for Gabrielle Giffords, a Blue Dog Democrat, and he repeatedly derided her as a "fake." This grudge intensified when he attended her August 25, 2007, event and she did not, in his view, sufficiently answer his question: "What is government if words have no meaning?"[20] Loughner kept Giffords' form letter, which thanked him for attending the 2007 event. An envelope in the same box as the letter was scrawled with phrases like "die bitch" and "assassination plans have been made."[29] Loughner was known to believe, and to say, that women should not hold positions of power.[30][31] Loughner's best friend, Zach Osler, disputed speculation by media commentators that Loughner's actions were fueled by partisan politics and rhetoric, insisting, "He did not watch TV, he disliked the news, he didn't listen to political radio, he didn't take sides, he wasn't on the Left, he wasn't on the Right," and instead conspiracy theories had a profound effect on him.[10] Another friend, Zane Gutierrez, later told the New York Times that Loughner's anger would also "well up at the sight of President George W. Bush or in discussing what he considered to be the nefarious designs of government".[31]

Loughner believed in numerous conspiracy theories and espoused views such as: the United States Government was responsible for the September 11 attacks;[31] a New World Order would bring about a one world currency; there would be a 2012 apocalypse; NASA had faked spaceflights; and the government was using mind control to brainwash people by controlling grammar. He was a member of the message board Above Top Secret though members of the site did not respond warmly to his posts.[28][32][33][34] Reports appearing after the shooting noted similarities between the statements made by Loughner concerning grammar and mind control and the views of conspiracy theorist David Wynn Miller.[35] Miller stated, "He's just repeating things I've had up on my site the past 11 years."[36][37] According to Zach Osler, the online conspiracy theory film Zeitgeist: The Movie affected Loughner's view of the world. Loughner believed that most people in the country are brainwashed and are unaware that nothing is real. Loughner became obsessed with controlling what he perceived to be lucid dreams.[10][38][39][40]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner

So there's no direct connection to Palin but that doesn't mean he didn't see the poster and take it to heart.

Yes, yes, of course trumpy hard left!
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post #63 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Lets see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner

Yes, yes, of course trumpy hard left!

Quote:
In the initial aftermath of the 2011 Tucson shooting, people speculated that Loughner's political views had been fueled by extremist rhetoric. Records show that Loughner was registered as an independent voter and voted in 2006 and 2008, but not in 2010.[21][22] A YouTube channel under an account called "Classitup10" was linked to Loughner.[23][24] Loughner had also posted a video on YouTube in which he described his school, Pima Community College, as "one of the biggest scams in America". This video led to Loughner being suspended from the school.[25] One classmate stated that that Loughner had laughed at a young woman and likened her to a terrorist after she read a poem about getting an abortion.[26][27] They also recall Loughner as an theist and a nihilist.[16][20][26][28] An old friend, Bryce Tierney, discussed several of Loughner's views. According to him, Loughner had exhibited a longstanding dislike for Gabrielle Giffords, a Blue Dog Democrat, and he repeatedly derided her as a "fake." This grudge intensified when he attended her August 25, 2007, event and she did not, in his view, sufficiently answer his question: "What is government if words have no meaning?"[20] Loughner kept Giffords' form letter, which thanked him for attending the 2007 event. An envelope in the same box as the letter was scrawled with phrases like "die bitch" and "assassination plans have been made."[29] Loughner was known to believe, and to say, that women should not hold positions of power.[30][31] Loughner's best friend, Zach Osler, disputed speculation by media commentators that Loughner's actions were fueled by partisan politics and rhetoric, insisting, "He did not watch TV, he disliked the news, he didn't listen to political radio, he didn't take sides, he wasn't on the Left, he wasn't on the Right," and instead conspiracy theories had a profound effect on him.[10] Another friend, Zane Gutierrez, later told the New York Times that Loughner's anger would also "well up at the sight of President George W. Bush or in discussing what he considered to be the nefarious designs of government".[31]

Loughner believed in numerous conspiracy theories and espoused views such as: the United States Government was responsible for the September 11 attacks;[31] a New World Order would bring about a one world currency; there would be a 2012 apocalypse; NASA had faked spaceflights; and the government was using mind control to brainwash people by controlling grammar. He was a member of the message board Above Top Secret though members of the site did not respond warmly to his posts.[28][32][33][34] Reports appearing after the shooting noted similarities between the statements made by Loughner concerning grammar and mind control and the views of conspiracy theorist David Wynn Miller.[35] Miller stated, "He's just repeating things I've had up on my site the past 11 years."[36][37] According to Zach Osler, the online conspiracy theory film Zeitgeist: The Movie affected Loughner's view of the world. Loughner believed that most people in the country are brainwashed and are unaware that nothing is real. Loughner became obsessed with controlling what he perceived to be lucid dreams.[10][38][39][40]

You ignored the parts I bolded above.

And you also ignored the fact that taking everything into account he really can't fit into the carefully contrived Right or Left molds.

He is an anomaly. A loner. He is a crazed lunatic who probably never saw Sarah Palin's map.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #64 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

You ignored the parts I bolded above.

And you also ignored the fact that taking everything into account he really can't fit into the carefully contrived Right or Left molds.

He is an anomaly. A loner. He is a crazed lunatic who probably never saw Sarah Palin's map.

Quote:
He is an anomaly. A loner

And a registered Independent!

Seriously I didn't ignore anything and I still maintain political figures shouldn't be making posters with targets on people's names for obvious reasons.

Quote:
who probably never saw Sarah Palin's map.

You have no way of knowing that.
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post #65 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

You have no way of knowing that.

Neither do the people claiming Palin's map has had ANYTHING to do with the Giffords shooting or any other violent act.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #66 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Neither do the people claiming Palin's map has had ANYTHING to do with the Giffords shooting or any other violent act.

I knew you'd say that so at best we have no way of knowing either way but the graphic was on the news so lots of people did see it.
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post #67 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

When I read this sort of thing, about your moderate centrist President and his economic policies to the right of France of Germany, I can't help but wonder when right wing America became such a bunch of hysterical pants-wetting ideologues.

You can chill out. Your government's to the right of France and Germany and to the left of Britain. For god's sake, chill the fuck out.

And what you fail to understand is that we're not France, nor Germany. We became the economic power of the world because our policies were different. And our President is the most liberal President we've ever had. He is at odds with the vast majority of the country. This is the guy who was recorded saying "people in small towns cling to their guns and their religion." He's an elitist, progressive-socialist. The media worked to cover his true beliefs, associations and backstory...instead focusing on "Hope and Change." Is it really any surprise people don't like the guy?

And as for the SF Chronicle: That has got to be one of the weakest "points" I have ever seen.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #68 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

And what you fail to understand is that we're not France, nor Germany. We became the economic power of the world because our policies were different. And our President is the most liberal President we've ever had. He is at odds with the vast majority of the country. This is the guy who was recorded saying "people in small towns cling to their guns and their religion." He's an elitist, progressive-socialist. The media worked to cover his true beliefs, associations and backstory...instead focusing on "Hope and Change." Is it really any surprise people don't like the guy?

And as for the SF Chronicle: That has got to be one of the weakest "points" I have ever seen.

Quote:
Is it really any surprise people don't like the guy?

Quote:
Poll: Obama's Approval Rating Hits Two-Year High

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2....php?ref=fpblg

Translation you don't like that guy.

And : http://articles.philly.com/2011-05-1...g-big-majority


Here SDW you can jump on this one : http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43080973

Quote:
Gallup poll shows Obama's post-Bin Laden numbers fading

However that's still 46 %.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #69 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2....php?ref=fpblg

Translation you don't like that guy.

And : http://articles.philly.com/2011-05-1...g-big-majority


Here SDW you can jump on this one : http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43080973



However that's still 46 %.

He got a bump from the capture of bin laden. Prior to getting bin Laden, his approval was down to 41 percent according the Gallup. It's now hovering in the high 40s. That's according to pollingreport.com.

And honestly, this is one time I don't trust the polls. I think Obama (and you, apparently) have grossly underestimated the wake-up call the electorate has had in the past two years. And you're ignoring the fact that Obama in alienating voters at the center and the left. Given a strong GOP candidate, he's got a tough road.
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post #70 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

He's an elitist, progressive-socialist. The media worked to cover his true beliefs, associations and backstory...instead focusing on "Hope and Change." Is it really any surprise people don't like the guy?
.

Why are you acting out like this, SDW2001?

No, Barack Obama is not a "progressive-socialist" (to use a term invented by Fox News pundits.)

If you think Barack Obama's a socialist, you really, truly don't know what socialism means. You don't know what it is. He's a big private capital-protecting tax-cutting capitalist, which is why your taxes have gone down, SDW, and he's nowhere near as "progressive" economically as FDR. Go and make some herbal tea and put some whale sounds on and thank god you don't have the tax thresholds you had before the war.

And his poll figures are excellent. They're much better than Reagan's or Clinton's were at this point in their presidencies.
post #71 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

He got a bump from the capture of bin laden. Prior to getting bin Laden, his approval was down to 41 percent according the Gallup. It's now hovering in the high 40s. That's according to pollingreport.com.

And honestly, this is one time I don't trust the polls. I think Obama (and you, apparently) have grossly underestimated the wake-up call the electorate has had in the past two years. And you're ignoring the fact that Obama in alienating voters at the center and the left. Given a strong GOP candidate, he's got a tough road.

I think it most likely at this point that he'll see a second term. Anyone who doesn't see that is practicing wishful thinking.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #72 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Why are you acting out like this, SDW2001?

No, Barack Obama is not a "progressive-socialist" (to use a term invented by Fox News pundits.)

If you think Barack Obama's a socialist, you really, truly don't know what socialism means. You don't know what it is. He's a big private capital-protecting tax-cutting capitalist, which is why your taxes have gone down, SDW, and he's nowhere near as "progressive" economically as FDR. Go and make some herbal tea and put some whale sounds on and thank god you don't have the tax thresholds you had before the war.

And his poll figures are excellent. They're much better than Reagan's or Clinton's were at this point in their presidencies.

He always acts like this.
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #73 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

That's the worst comeback I've ever read.



Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I knew you'd say that so at best we have no way of knowing either way but the graphic was on the news so lots of people did see it.

Is this a serious reply? The map wasn't on the news. It was on her website for her political action committee.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #74 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post





Is this a serious reply? The map wasn't on the news It was on her website for her political action committee.

trumpy because of it's controversial nature yes it was on the news ( I mean painting targets on people isn't very nice ). I'd heard of it before the shooting.

Plus this guy was fairly political he may have gone to her website or linked there from some other political website. It's the 21rst century trumpy wake up!
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post #75 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Why are you acting out like this, SDW2001?

I'm sorry, I didn't know disagreeing with you was forbidden.

Quote:

No, Barack Obama is not a "progressive-socialist" (to use a term invented by Fox News pundits.)

He is. He's a progressive with socialist leanings....at least he is in our political spectrum.

Quote:

If you think Barack Obama's a socialist, you really, truly don't know what socialism means. You don't know what it is. He's a big private capital-protecting tax-cutting capitalist, which is why your taxes have gone down, SDW, and he's nowhere near as "progressive" economically as FDR. Go and make some herbal tea and put some whale sounds on and thank god you don't have the tax thresholds you had before the war.

Funny, because I agree with most of that. Obama is not a socialist like say, Chavez is a socialist. But for our system, he's about as progressive as it gets. I will grant you two or three exceptions: Teddy Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson and FDR. That said, those men were presiding over a very different system. Social Security didn't even exist when FDR took over. Much of the spending he did was on direct infrastructure and jobs. I don't agree with much of what he did, but comparing our nation's policy spectrum today to that time is a bit silly.

Obama believes in things many Americans simply don't. He believes in "redistributive change." He believes the Bill of Rights is a "charter of negative liberties...it says what the government can't do, but not what it must do on your behalf." He says "I think when we spread the wealth around, everyone's better off." He had associations with the former radical, Bill Ayers...associations the media covered up (they were close). He had a radical, anti-American pastor. And he had people like Van Jones (former member of STORM). These are all facts. They are not rumors, lies, innuendo, etc. Obama is one of, if not the most radical Presidents we've ever had.

Quote:

And his poll figures are excellent. They're much better than Reagan's or Clinton's were at this point in their presidencies.

Eh...not really. Averages show he's about equal...in the low forties (where he will soon be again unless the economy improves dramatically or an unforeseen geopolitical event occurs). Clinton and Reagan both had 35 percents ratings at one point, of course. But I really think the numbers are not telling the whole story. This is purely anecdotal, but I have never seen such negativity amongst people I speak with. I know many people from various walks of life who are now completely opposed to Obama's policies and decisions. These include liberals, moderates, conservatives, and formerly non-political types. One of my uncles is in the latter category. Prior to Obama, he was very nonpolitical with, I would say, liberal leanings. He's now a staunch opponent. I've seen lifelong Democrats state they can't vote for the man again. Why is this happening? It's because Obama doesn't view the country as other Presidents have. I'll say it...he doesn't love the country. I'm not saying he hates it, but he doesn't love it, or maybe even like it. Coupled with obscene spending and government intervention, moderates are turning from him in droves.

Like the President, I think you're grossly misjudging the character of mainstream America. And you're ignoring those factors that are not shown in the polls. He was elected by moderates and good liberal turnout. But he's upsetting many on the Left with the continuation of the wars, Gitmo, extension of the Bush tax cuts, etc. The result? Liberals will still vote for him, but they won't be energized. It will much like conservatives with McCain. Worse still, he's losing moderates over deficit spending, his Israel policy, government intervention, and arrogant/aloof demeanor. Obviously conservatives aren't going to vote for him. The result is a vastly weakened political base and an energized Republican Party.

One last point: I've stated this before, but it's worth repeating. I did not vote for Obama, but I had high hopes for him. I hoped that he governed like he campaigned. That campaign was based on competence, level-headedness, efficiency, transparency, pragmatism, bipartisanship and fiscal responsibility. But he has governed in the exact opposite way. He's been incompetent (see BP oil spill), defensive/arrogant/aloof (see almost every interview), inefficient, more secretive than ever, ideological, viciously partisan and unbelievably reckless from a fiscal standpoint. In fact, I don't believe ever seen a politican on either side that has governed in the polar opposite way he campaigned.
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post #76 of 85
Thread Starter 
SDW, you don't get to arbitrarily redefine words because over the last decade Republicans have moved sooooooooooooooooooooooo faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar to the right that even Reagan would be a liberal hippie douche under your system.

Words have meanings. Obama is NOT a socialist in our system or any other.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #77 of 85
So to sum up the thread we've got an allegation. One photo that was an attempt to prove it with claims of many more. the one was disproven and the many more not provided. We've got a claim that because the Lincoln assassin and Obama critics used the same word that.... well it never even attempted to draw a conclusion. Then we've got Giffords was shot because someone on the internet put a graphic on their website and we don't know that it was seen but surely must have been the cause as reasoning and proof.

Oh and of course a dozen replies from anyone that noted the crap allegations and proof alleging and calling them half a dozen things.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #78 of 85
Thread Starter 
Now take off the standard issue American Conservative Blinders & RDF Headgear and rewrite that summation. Oh wait. I forgot they surgically attached all that when they also surgically removed your logic and empathy.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #79 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Now take off the standard issue American Conservative Blinders & RDF Headgear and rewrite that summation. Oh wait. I forgot they surgically attached all that when they also surgically removed your logic and empathy.

So you contend the summation is factually wrong because you want to call names. Nice reasoning there. Where's the proof for the claim?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #80 of 85
Thread Starter 
As soon as you provide me detailed proof for your religious beliefs, I'll be happy to provide proof for this. I will not play your game in which you arbitrarily demand proof whenever it suits you but rarely support your own arguments.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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