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May 21st. Still here. - Page 3

post #81 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Creationists & IDers form the only groups of people that make a big fuss in distinguishing micro from macro evolution.

Microevolution + time = macroevolution.

It's that simple.

You are simply mistaken on a grand scale.
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
Reply
post #82 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

You are simply mistaken on a grand scale.

Respond to the other posts. Also, do a little research on the origin of those terms and who actually makes a big fuss about said terms.

Notice that I answered all your questions.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #83 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Respond to the other posts. Also, do a little research on the origin of those terms and who actually makes a big fuss about said terms.

Notice that I answered all your questions.

I think it is to be expected who are the people who "make a fuss" as you say...

hint:

Not the ones pushing the evolution hoax.

That was easy and I am not pushing a staples round red button.

Bed time once again.

Peace Bro.
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
Reply
May the peace of the Lord be with you always

Share your smile, Have respect for others, and be loving to all peoples

Paul in Athens: Acts 17 : 16-34
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post #84 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

I would never presume to make such a stupid statement. You are aware of micro-evolution facts surely?

If even just some of evolutionary science is "scientific", then this is a falsehood:

"Evolution is not science."

Would you please correct yourself, Fellowship, and use more specific language in the future? Thanks.
post #85 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

I think it is to be expected who are the people who "make a fuss" as you say...

hint:

Not the ones pushing the evolution hoax.

That was easy and I am not pushing a staples round red button.

Bed time once again.

Peace Bro.

So I answer your other questions. I get no feedback on those responses. You only pick the other post you really don't like, make a glib response, and go to sleep. Got it.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #86 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Creationists & IDers form the only groups of people that make a big fuss in distinguishing micro from macro evolution.

Microevolution + time = macroevolution.

It's that simple.

I usually stay out of the creation vs. evolution threads, but this one is too good to pass up.

Your post above is precisely what Christians try their best to make evolutionists admit.

Time is the magic elixir for evolutionists. Given enough time, they say, one thing will turn into another entirely different thing.
That's really all the theory of evolution boils down to.

Such nonsense might have passed for science when Darwin was alive, which is why I generally don't berate him for this the way others do. But modern science has discovered that life is infinitely more complex than Darwin ever conceived. DNA and the entire field of micro-biology have shown that the basic structure of creation is so incredibly complex that the design and function of humanity cannot have happened by accidental means.

No matter how much time passes, no tornado can assemble a 747 by passing through an aerospace parts warehouse.
No matter how much time passes, throwing paint against a wall will never end with the Mona Lisa.

If you are walking through miles of desert and suddenly come upon a Lexus CT200h hidden in a cave, you should not assume that years of wind, rocks and dirt have spontaneously combined to form painted sheet metal, halogen headlights and rubber tires.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #87 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

I usually stay out of the creation vs. evolution threads, but this one is too good to pass up.

Your post above is precisely what Christians try their best to make evolutionists admit.

Time is the magic elixir for evolutionists. Given enough time, they say, one thing will turn into another entirely different thing.
That's really all the theory of evolution boils down to.

Such nonsense might have passed for science when Darwin was alive, which is why I generally don't berate him for this the way others do. But modern science has discovered that life is infinitely more complex than Darwin ever conceived. DNA and the entire field of micro-biology have shown that the basic structure of creation is so incredibly complex that the design and function of humanity cannot have happened by accidental means.

No matter how much time passes, no tornado can assemble a 747 by passing through an aerospace parts warehouse.
No matter how much time passes, throwing paint against a wall will never end with the Mona Lisa.

If you are walking through miles of desert and suddenly come upon a Lexus CT200h hidden in a cave, you should not assume that years of wind, rocks and dirt have spontaneously combined to form painted sheet metal, halogen headlights and rubber tires.

Likewise, ignorance such as this requires a response. Are you saying that humans are perfect from a design perspective? We couldn't have been designed with an immunity to AIDS... or the common cold, for that matter? We wouldn't have been as successful as a species if we had had six fingers instead of five, or the aural sensitivity of a dog? Why are our cells able to mutate and become cancerous?

The fact is that we're the way we are because that's the way we evolved. Dogs are the way they are because that's how they evolved. Bananas... likewise. And somewhere on one of those infinite other worlds out there is an advanced life form with scales not like a lizard's or those of a fish, but of their own kind, and eyes perhaps akin to those of an eagle, but which see only in infrared frequencies. And they would be that way because of a combination of environmental and random factors.
post #88 of 338
Thread Starter 
Frank, You clearly haven't studied evolution. Your counterexamples about planes and paint are ridiculous. You honestly don't establish that you even understand what evolution is, what it tries to explain, and how it works.

Edit: Tonton beat me to it.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #89 of 338
Thread Starter 
And I'll just leave this here again because Fellowship refused to continue this line of questioning once he found it to be a dead end with regard to his agenda.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

Since you are so well versed with the scientific fact of evolution let me ask you a few questions.

What was the cow before it was a cow? What evolved into a cow?

Aurochs

Quote:
What created the first life form?

That question is not in the scope of the science of evolution. Also, you are using the loaded term "created" in your question. A better question would be phrased "How did life first arise on this planet?"

Answer: We don't know. Let's find out. Let's not imagine sky daddy did it because uncertainty is bothersome.

Quote:
What was that first life form? And do you believe that this first life form was equipped to replicate or reproduce itself? Because as you know if this first life did not have the "design" to reproduce itself it would have been a one time event.

All of this stuff is not covered in the field of evolution. The study of the origin of life--how inorganic matter turned into organic matter--is called "abiogenesis." Do not conflate that topic with evolution. They are not the same field of science.

Quote:
What is your evidence for all of these answers?

Fossil record, DNA sequencing, RNA sequencing, et cetera. The works cited on the wikipedia page for Aurochs is very thorough and goes back to scholarly papers. Any encyclopedia or dictionary can tell you the difference between evolution and abiogenesis.

Quote:
I am waiting.

Not very long a wait.

Now, please for fuck's sake go look up endogenous retroviruses.

Here's an introduction: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comd...l#retroviruses

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #90 of 338
So now let's get back to the topic of the thread. A bunch of people calling themselves Christians looked at the Bible, studied it, interpreted it, prayed for truth in it, ignored contradictory parts of it, and came to a conclusion that was proved false.

It's not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last.
post #91 of 338
Quote:
So he was a nice man who was crucified by the Romans for what exactly? Or was that "added in" too?

No I doubt that part would have been made up. He was executed for the same reason that all such empires execute: because they can. Jesus was a bit of a rabble rouser, causing trouble at the temple, talking about how the Roman empire would be replaced by God's. Why do you think he was executed?

Quote:
If first century doctors were capable of miraculously healing the sick, medical care has taken a serious step back since. Maybe that's the rationale behind bringing in Obamacare.

Funny! That would explain why all the conservatives supported Obamacare a few years before Obama supported it!

I dont know if they were actually capable of healing, but from what I've read, Israel was filled with faith healers during that time.

Quote:
How is it clear that the Virgin Birth was made up by others?

Mainly because the whole birth story makes no sense. Why is there almost no information about Jesus again for 30 years? Because that's when people first heard of him. Why is he from Nazareth, but the gospels take great pains to have him born in Bethlehem, the city of David? Because that's what they believed the prophecy said, and they were going to make it fit. Even if that meant coming up with different stories in different gospels - Herod killing all the babies (a reference to Moses), or the census, or some other story that's easy to see through.

I certainly don't expect that a person who starts with the premise that the Bible must be true will buy any of this. But I think that fairly represents most scholars who study this without bias.
post #92 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

I have seen the billboards and wondered if it was a publicity stunt or if someone was actually stupid enough to try to predict the Rapture.

If you don't believe or if you do, these people were experiencing nothing more than wishful thinking.

Now BR can continue his bashing of people he does not agree with.

Another line of crap from an old fool who has followers believe this nonsense.
post #93 of 338
I've got an underlying suspicion about this May 21st Rapture news cycle. I think it's very much like the old saying about watching a train-wreck or some-such horrible accident. You can't take your eyes away from it. It was implicit in the news cycle that these folks where on the bad side of crazy and people were all curious about what the followers were going to do on May 22nd.

For the most part, that part of the news cycle is boring, but I'm curious to read up on how the followers are reacting.
post #94 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post


If you read the book of John, you'll see that Jesus' healing of a man born blind drove the religious elite crazy, and is the only time a miracle of Jesus (of which there were thousands) was tried in a religious court.

.

Well this man wasn't 'literally' blind was he. Obviously it means something allegorical, else the religious elite wouldn't have gave a shit.

Of course, it didn't really happen at all, in any literal sense of the word did it.
post #95 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fellowship View Post

I actually do believe Jesus is Lord and at the right hand of the Father.

I will soon have Jesus in my right hand too.
post #96 of 338
FYI,

The generation of Jesus would last about 2100 years, that is probably why the fundies are expecting Jesus to return in their lifetime.
post #97 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

So now let's get back to the topic of the thread. A bunch of people calling themselves Christians looked at the Bible, studied it, interpreted it, prayed for truth in it, ignored contradictory parts of it, and came to a conclusion that was proved false.

It's not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last.

No it isn't. But there have been murmurs of profiteering from this. If so, fraud charges should be laid ASAP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

No I doubt that part would have been made up. He was executed for the same reason that all such empires execute: because they can. Jesus was a bit of a rabble rouser, causing trouble at the temple, talking about how the Roman empire would be replaced by God's. Why do you think he was executed?

I think that a careful examination of the New Testament writings leads to the conclusion that Jesus claimed, in both word and deed, to be Israel's promised Messiah. I don't mean this to be insulting, but from your responses here I think you're approaching this from an honest position but lacking in the study of both the Biblical records and the history of the time.

To make a long story short, the religious elite went nuts after healing of the blind man because it was THE messianic sign. As the text says, no one - priest or prophet - had ever opened the eyes of a blind man before. In the history of the world. (There is speculation as to why this miracle was reserved for the Messiah alone. I believe it is a message to all generations that only God can open one's eyes to the truth of our existence.)

Jesus did many other things that demonstrated clearly who He was claiming to be. For example, walking down the path of the sacrificial lamb on what we call Palm Sunday. A great book that delves into the cultural implications of Jesus' actions is Understanding Jesus (by my fellow Torontonian Joe Amaral.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Funny! That would explain why all the conservatives supported Obamacare a few years before Obama supported it!

Was just trying to be humourous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

I dont know if they were actually capable of healing, but from what I've read, Israel was filled with faith healers during that time.

Israel was expecting the Messiah to rise during that particular time, because of the prophecies surrounding Daniel's 70 weeks. A number of people did attempt to claim messianic status (or were purported to be the Messiah by their followers) but none met all (or even some) of the prophecies concerning the Messiah.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

Mainly because the whole birth story makes no sense. Why is there almost no information about Jesus again for 30 years? Because that's when people first heard of him. Why is he from Nazareth, but the gospels take great pains to have him born in Bethlehem, the city of David? Because that's what they believed the prophecy said, and they were going to make it fit. Even if that meant coming up with different stories in different gospels - Herod killing all the babies (a reference to Moses), or the census, or some other story that's easy to see through.

Jesus was obligated to begin his ministry at 30 because that's the age the Torah demands of a religious leader. The Old Testament takes pains to point out that Joseph began to rule over Egypt at 30. The laws of Rosh Hashana demands that leaders on the High Holy Days be at least 30 years old. Even in our modern day, you have to be 30 years old to run for the U.S. Senate or be appointed to the Canadian Senate.

Regarding the nativity, there's certainly no way to verify the Virgin Birth scientifically (that I know of anyway.) However, the texts say that the religious right and left of the day were out to get Him, and if there were discrepancies surrounding His place of birth that's where they would have started.

Text-tampering was the standard charge with liberals back in the day when the Gospels were said to have been compiled hundreds of years after the events they describe. Now that modern scholarship has largely erased that idea, it's very unlikely that this kind of tampering could have happened within the lifetimes to those that knew Jesus personally. Even if you discount the Bible and look purely at secular records, it's unlikely that such a dynamic, new belief system could have been founded upon pure fraud. Especially with almost all of the fraudsters willingly paying for their new beliefs with their lives.

I don't mind people claiming the Bible texts are fraudulent. It's just that when you do so, you need to say when and where the tampering occurred. Islam has largely the same problem with the Bible. Muslims go around saying the scriptures have been tampered with, but can't say when.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRussell View Post

I certainly don't expect that a person who starts with the premise that the Bible must be true will buy any of this. But I think that fairly represents most scholars who study this without bias.

I don't think it does. Plenty of scholars in the world both affirm and deny the Biblical accounts.
At some point, you just have to do the work yourself.
The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #98 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

no one - priest or prophet - had ever opened the eyes of a blind man before.

Israel was expecting the Messiah to rise.

Jesus was obligated to begin his ministry at 30

it's unlikely that such a dynamic, new belief system could have been founded upon pure fraud.

Nothing to do with physical blindness. Its a spiritual revelation. Thats why the orthodoxy were pissed off.

Israel (biblical) is a code word for the womb of a woman. It sure expects its Messiah to rise.

Jesus started his ministry at 30 because 1/12 of a circle is 30 degrees.

Christianity bought nothing new to the table that hadn't already been demonstrated by the mystery religions.
post #99 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcUK View Post

Nothing to do with physical blindness. Its a spiritual revelation. Thats why the orthodoxy were pissed off.

Israel (biblical) is a code word for the womb of a woman. It sure expects its Messiah to rise.

Jesus started his ministry at 30 because 1/12 of a circle is 30 degrees.

Christianity bought nothing new to the table that hadn't already been demonstrated by the mystery religions.

And you, sadly, have brought nothing new or worthwhile to this discussion. \
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #100 of 338
Thread Starter 
You don't find possible origins to the Jesus myth interesting?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #101 of 338
Thread Starter 
Also, found this. Don't you just love Venn Diagrams? I sure do.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #102 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You don't find possible origins to the Jesus myth interesting?

I have no problems with possible looks into the origins of Jesus. I have no issue with people providing opinions. However, reading some of the provided opinions I am of the opinion myself that some are less about actually finding truth and more about taking the piss...
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #103 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Also, found this. Don't you just love Venn Diagrams? I sure do.

I know you love overly simplistic and inaccurate diagrams that prove to nobody but you that you are correct.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #104 of 338
Thread Starter 
Mainstream Christians took the piss on Harold Camping. Also, you know damn well that you and Harold Camping share the fundamental beliefs of Christianity but mainly differ on the date. Stop trying to distance yourself from him. You two are much more alike than you are different.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #105 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Mainstream Christians took the piss on Harold Camping. Also, you know damn well that you and Harold Camping share the fundamental beliefs of Christianity but mainly differ on the date. Stop trying to distance yourself from him. You two are much more alike than you are different.

I actually don't have any idea what he believes and how it is or is not like what I believe. Apparently unlike you, I don't assume that simply because someone says they are a Christian that they believe what I do. The word has come to mean many things to many people. Perhaps you should add it to your definition list.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
Reply
post #106 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

I actually don't have any idea what he believes and how it is or is not like what I believe. Apparently unlike you, I don't assume that simply because someone says they are a Christian that they believe what I do. The word has come to mean many things to many people. Perhaps you should add it to your definition list.

Do you believe Jesus will return?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #107 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Do you believe Jesus will return?

I do.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #108 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

I do.

Then you fundamentally believe the same thing Harold Camping does. You mainly differ on the date.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #109 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Then you fundamentally believe the same thing Harold Camping does. You mainly differ on the date.

If that makes you feel better. Ok. In that particular case I differ on the fact that anyone can or will know the date. It is not like it is a hidden part of the prophecy that he could have skipped accidentally. I am willing to bet that even you have read that and understood that to be a fundamental difference between what is written and what he was pushing. Whether you believed it or not.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #110 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

If that makes you feel better. Ok. In that particular case I differ on the fact that anyone can or will know the date. It is not like it is a hidden part of the prophecy that he could have skipped accidentally. I am willing to bet that even you have read that and understood that to be a fundamental difference between what is written and what he was pushing. Whether you believed it or not.

You both believe that a supernatural being will fly down from heaven, the rapture will happen, and unbelievers will be left on Earth as the final battle between good and evil is fought. Do you know how fucking insane that sounds from the outside looking in? Imagine how you view Scientology's beliefs and apply that same level of incredulity to your own.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #111 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Do you know how fucking insane that sounds from the outside looking in?

Yes it does sound insane. It is very bizarre. It is very out of whack with our understanding of the world. It's true that a lot of things about God have this characteristic. They sound weird or crazy to our finite human minds.

Do you realize that just because it seems crazy doesn't mean it isn't true?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #112 of 338
Thread Starter 
What makes your brand of crazy the truth? There have been thousands of gods, each with their own associated crazy, that have been worshiped throughout the ages. Why your crazy?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #113 of 338
So you're not going to answer the question?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #114 of 338
Thread Starter 
I feel like I did address your question. But, if you want me to clarify...I first need you to clarify your question.

Were you asking me if crazy things in general can possibly turn out to be true?

Or...

Were you asking me if I specifically leave room for your christian mythology to be true?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #115 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I feel like I did address your question.

Yes, you did address the question, but you didn't answer it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Were you asking me if crazy things in general can possibly turn out to be true?

Or...

Were you asking me if I specifically leave room for your christian mythology to be true?

I was asking the first, and I think I know the answer to the second...and it would be great if you answer both, but feel free to answer which ever one you wish.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #116 of 338
Thread Starter 
Some things that initially appear to be crazy can turn out to be true, sure. But the crazier the claim, the greater the burden of proof is on the claimant. The world record longest running game of telephone, the Bible, does not come anywhere near to meeting that burden of proof from the second question.

Now, you answer me:

What makes your brand of crazy the truth? There have been thousands of gods, each with their own associated crazy, that have been worshiped throughout the ages. Why your crazy?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #117 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You both believe that a supernatural being will fly down from heaven, the rapture will happen, and unbelievers will be left on Earth as the final battle between good and evil is fought. Do you know how fucking insane that sounds from the outside looking in? Imagine how you view Scientology's beliefs and apply that same level of incredulity to your own.

Yeah, I know where you are coming from. I am not asking you to care or believe it yourself. If you were actually interested in why someone believes something rather than belittling their beliefs

Thanks for not answering my very basic question at all and simply ignoring it while asking more questions and belittling my beliefs. Makes me look forward to continuing our conversations in the future where I answer all your questions and you don't return the favor. \
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
Reply
post #118 of 338
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Yeah, I know where you are coming from. I am not asking you to care or believe it yourself. If you were actually interested in why someone believes something rather than belittling their beliefs

Thanks for not answering my very basic question at all and simply ignoring it while asking more questions and belittling my beliefs. Makes me look forward to continuing our conversations in the future where I answer all your questions and you don't return the favor. \

What question of yours did I not answer?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #119 of 338
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Some things that initially appear to be crazy can turn out to be true, sure.

Good. Thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

the Bible, does not come anywhere near to meeting that burden of proof from the second question.

Thanks for sharing your opinion.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

What makes your brand of crazy the truth? There have been thousands of gods, each with their own associated crazy, that have been worshiped throughout the ages. Why your crazy?

Do you want to ask politely?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #120 of 338
Thread Starter 
Oh give it a rest MJ. Stop looking for any fucking flimsy excuse to dodge a question.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
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