or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › Foxconn explosion won't greatly affect iPad 2 production for Apple
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Foxconn explosion won't greatly affect iPad 2 production for Apple - Page 2

post #41 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post

. When you see a clear cut case of human abuse and shear brutality, do what you can to stop it.

I'm never getting a haircut at SuperCuts again.
post #42 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

No just that magicj is a particularly annoying and not very bright troll.

I mean he doesn't even make sense. Foxconn workers have to endure ... "worse conditions than any American slaves endured?" WTF? Does he realise what an idiotic statement that is? Does he realise how many other, similarly idiotic statements he makes?

It's like arguing with a two year old. Insults, made up facts, and hyperbole.

Don't forget... you're trying to explain something to a guy who says moronic things like this:

"You and Solipsism would defend Apple if Steve Jobs was caught sneaking into the place with a fucking bomb. "

Nuff said...
na na na na na...
Reply
na na na na na...
Reply
post #43 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post

You don't need to tip your hat to me, solipsism. I am no one of importance.

But you do not turn your back on injustice. You do not excuse it. It makes no difference whether it's Chinese workers building iPads or American workers mining coal. When you see a clear cut case of human abuse and shear brutality, do what you can to stop it.

Do not be so worldly-wise and jaded and bush it off with a "That's just the way it has to be".

In you're above post the word "do" is key -- people pay attention to what you do rather than listen to what you say!

You, me or anyone on these forums -- can say anything, and do nothing!

What does that accomplish?
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #44 of 64
I probably don't spend enough time here to be fully aware of the cause of the friction between magicj and others on this forum but, just considering this isolated issue, I don't think he is being that unreasonable in wanting Apple to take some action.

If the reports of the extent of the dust problem at this factory are correct, and whether it was aluminum or magnesium (both are easily dispersed and explosive at small particle sizes), this is an obvious and serious hazard. In the US and elsewhere there are clear regulations regarding electrical equipment specifications for such environments to prevent explosions, if the presence of airborne dust cannot be mitigated.

Even though Foxconn is just a contractor, it would not seem unreasonable to expect Apple, as a major customer, at least to require them to adhere to basic infrastructure safety standards.

As for all the slavery analogies, I don't think there is any need to go there. Worker conditions are much more a locally defined and subjective standard than plant infrastructure and engineering safety.
post #45 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post


I'm glad Apple has at least acknowledged that problems exist at the Foxconn plant they use, but they need to do more to correct those problems. And they need to start now.

Yeah cause we all know that Apple owns Foxconn and they decide Chinese labor laws. Jobs himself decides everything that happens at the plants.

NOT!


Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post

I am not in any way trying to spare those other companies, but the fact is the explosion took place in a factory working on iPads as was probably due to the aluminum polishing process used on iPads.

Less than 20-30% of volume comes from that plant and we don't know that the ipads that are assembled there were done so in the area where the explosion took place.

For all we know it was a bunch of Sony TVs that created the dust and a faulty XBox that exploded and ignited it.
post #46 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Out of curiosity, why order from MacMall when they’re ship times are longer than Apple’s ship times?

Sales Tax, plus I'm not in a rush. I already have mine; this one's just for my wife's games.
post #47 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


3) I think Apple is their biggest customer,

Or not. But that is beside the point

Quote:
I bet even if the issue had nothing to do with an Apple product the media would phrase it as such to mention Apple.

That is the real point. If there is any kind of Apple connection it is hyped for hits.
post #48 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) magicj is going to vilify Apple no matter what they do.

I might have missed it but did he ever tell us what app he's developing/developed?
post #49 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

No of course not, it just seems like all the mishaps occur at Apple's production facilities. And why is that I wonder. Is it because someone's trying to vilify Apple or are Apple's production requests the cause of it?

they don't just happen at Apple related places. They happen everywhere.

But the media only cares to hype up the Apple incidents because they get tons of hits which means tons of ad revenue etc. Who cares about the facts, like Apple doesn't control Chinese labor law. Or that perhaps the area of the explosion was on the far end from any Apple related production. If they can slap Apple in the headline they will
post #50 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07 View Post

I might have missed it but did he ever tell us what app he's developing/developed?

His app is #2 on this list:

http://tnw.co/lNR2G
post #51 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetry View Post

I probably don't spend enough time here to be fully aware of the cause of the friction between magicj and others on this forum but, just considering this isolated issue, I don't think he is being that unreasonable in wanting Apple to take some action.

If the reports of the extent of the dust problem at this factory are correct, and whether it was aluminum or magnesium (both are easily dispersed and explosive at small particle sizes), this is an obvious and serious hazard. In the US and elsewhere there are clear regulations regarding electrical equipment specifications for such environments to prevent explosions, if the presence of airborne dust cannot be mitigated.

Even though Foxconn is just a contractor, it would not seem unreasonable to expect Apple, as a major customer, at least to require them to adhere to basic infrastructure safety standards.

As for all the slavery analogies, I don't think there is any need to go there. Worker conditions are much more a locally defined and subjective standard than plant infrastructure and engineering safety.

How do we know that Apple isn't taking action. I suspect that Apple is investigating the cause and possible solutions -- rather than making a meaningless knee-jerk PR reply.

Apple is usually quiet about assistance it provides to others -- for obvious reasons!

Sometimes, though, it will publicize its assistance in order to encourage others to do the same.

Just because Apple isn't talking about something doesn't mean that Apple isn't doing something!

Many corporations act the same -- and it's driven by the morals, ethics, and business acumen of their leadership.
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
Reply
post #52 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post

His app is #2 on this list:

http://tnw.co/lNR2G

I doubt he has that kind of humor.
post #53 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

How do we know that Apple isn't taking action. I suspect that Apple is investigating the cause and possible solutions -- rather than making a meaningless knee-jerk PR reply.

Apple is usually quiet about assistance it provides to others -- for obvious reasons!

Sometimes, though, it will publicize its assistance in order to encourage others to do the same.

Just because Apple isn't talking about something doesn't mean that Apple isn't doing something!

Many corporations act the same -- and it's driven by the morals, ethics, and business acumen of their leadership.

I agree - I think it is likely that Apple is working on this. I was really questioning why the widespread response to magicj's post seemed to be to suggest that this was not something that Apple had any responsibility to address.
post #54 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

How do we know that Apple isn't taking action. I suspect that Apple is investigating the cause and possible solutions -- rather than making a meaningless knee-jerk PR reply.

Apple is usually quiet about assistance it provides to others -- for obvious reasons!

Sometimes, though, it will publicize its assistance in order to encourage others to do the same.

Just because Apple isn't talking about something doesn't mean that Apple isn't doing something!

Many corporations act the same -- and it's driven by the morals, ethics, and business acumen of their leadership.

Apple is:

Apple Says Working With Foxconn to Explore Cause of China Explosion http://allthingsd.com/20110520/apple...ina-explosion/

Apple: Supplier Code of Conduct http://images.apple.com/supplierresp...nduct_V3_3.pdf

Apple: Supplier Responsibility http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/

Apple: Auditing for Compliance http://www.apple.com/supplierrespons...ompliance.html

Apple: Beyond Compliance http://www.apple.com/supplierrespons...ompliance.html

Apple: Supplier Responsibility 2011 Progress Report http://images.apple.com/supplierresp...ess_Report.pdf


And has been doing so for some time now:
post #55 of 64
Apple insider writes a report about iPad 2's production forecasts but nothing about the 3rd worker who died from injuries?

Yeah, because workers who die in the factories are a normal business expense right?

Pathetic.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/22/f...r-watchdog-re/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

Apple is:

Apple Says Working With Foxconn to Explore Cause of China Explosion http://allthingsd.com/20110520/apple...ina-explosion/

Apple: Supplier Code of Conduct http://images.apple.com/supplierresp...nduct_V3_3.pdf

Apple: Supplier Responsibility http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/

Apple: Auditing for Compliance http://www.apple.com/supplierrespons...ompliance.html

Apple: Beyond Compliance http://www.apple.com/supplierrespons...ompliance.html

Apple: Supplier Responsibility 2011 Progress Report http://images.apple.com/supplierresp...ess_Report.pdf


And has been doing so for some time now:

Simply writing a report about a third parties status is one thing, actually doing something about it is something completely different.

Law makers and scientists always write reports about the status of Global Warming in their reports to congress and other institutions. You think they are doing anything about it? The answer is no.

The only way that Apple will have a vested interest in its third party OEM's affair would be if the factories are based in USA and are Apple owned. Only then will Apple (due to strict labor laws and occupational health and hazards standards in the US) act upon its responsibilities.

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

Reply

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

Reply
post #56 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotWake View Post

What amazes me is "Apple" needs to do something. Because this is part of Foxconn's customer list.

Apple Inc.
Acer
Amazon
Asus
Intel
Cisco
Hewlett-Packard
Dell
Nintendo
Nokia
Microsoft
Sony
Sony Ericsson
Samsung
Vizio

That list is from Wikipedia, a user editable online encyclopedia of "knowledge" or so they say.

The problem is they are USER EDITABLE, as in false representation or facts are bound to happen. Some of the companies on that list arent even Foxconn customer. If they are, the link doesnt provide unquestionable proof of its status.

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

Reply

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

Reply
post #57 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

That list is from Wikipedia, a user editable online encyclopedia of "knowledge" or so they say.

The problem is they are USER EDITABLE, as in false representation or facts are bound to happen. Some of the companies on that list arent even Foxconn customer. If they are, the link doesnt provide unquestionable proof of its status.

I don't think that list was posted as a complete, verifiable, unquestionable work of reference, just as an indication that Foxconn has a number of large customers besides Apple.
post #58 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post

LOL! Three dead, many seriously injured, but we will still have our shiny gizmos.

I'm glad Apple has at least acknowledged that problems exist at the Foxconn plant they use, but they need to do more to correct those problems. And they need to start now.

I agree. I guess money is more important?
post #59 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Law makers and scientists always write reports about the status of Global Warming in their reports to congress and other institutions. You think they are doing anything about it? The answer is no.

Nice to put something completely off-topic into the mix. The big difference is that global warming is still unproven beyond a shadow of a doubt and still debated heavily. Human life is not. People are dying and working in unthinkable conditions so we can enjoy cheap gadgets. It's nice how we can just look past that thought.
post #60 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Apple insider writes a report about iPad 2's production forecasts but nothing about the 3rd worker who died from injuries?

Yeah, because workers who die in the factories are a normal business expense right?

Pathetic.

What is pathetic is having to see your name appear.

Read the friggin reports or at least a qualified reviewers take on it, i.e., Apple's 2011 supplier report: child workers, bribes, "involuntary labor" http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/20...d-business.ars
post #61 of 64
Wilt Chamberlain had it right: "No one roots for Goliath."

Back in the day, everyone hated on Microsoft. Microsoft was Goliath. It threw its weight around. Everybody else was a little guy trying his hardest to take down the big, bad Goliath. Apple has become that company now. It has gotten so big and successful that everything it does is "mean, unfair, and anticompetitive," never mind that everybody else is doing the same stuff.

Foxconn has plenty of customers besides Apple. Yet, any article criticizing Foxconn business practices is always linked to Apple. Look on Yahoo!. The news story is titled "Explosion at China iPad factory shows supply risks." The article does not make a single mention of other Foxconn customers. Readers get the impression that Foxconn is an Apple subsidiary. That's why every thing that goes wrong at Foxconn gets blamed on Apple.

At the end of the day, these news sites wants hits. As long as that is the case, accurate reporting is not going to matter. When journalists publish news stories about Apple's suppliers, or Apple in general, they don't care if they are applying a double-standard. The reason is simple. Stories that criticize Apple get hits but stories that criticize other companies don't.

As long as there are rational individuals who care to calmly analyze the situation before passing judgment, these kinds of sensationalist stories don't bother me much. I know that some people are going to call me an Apple apologist. I have been called that before, saying that I "gloss over" every little thing that Apple does because it's Apple. But I can say with my head held high that I don't apply double standards. I don't apply one set of rules for Apple and another set of rules for everybody else. If I defend something that Apple does which others criticize, I will be the first one to do the same for any other company.
post #62 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj View Post

Hardly true. I only vilify them when they don't inform customers that their private data has been stolen, when they sell developers access to APIs that can't be used due to patent disputes, and when they financially reward manufactures with a long history of serious abuses against their employees. And for their 800+ fart apps.

You, on the other hand, will defend Apple in the face of these abuses, which are so bad that even American slaves never had to tolerate anything like it. And before you argue this point with me, show me a reference where American slaves were exposed to hazardous chemicals and forced to breathe aluminum every day.

I think you've been listening a little too much to Cave Johnson.

Seriously though, Apple needs to quit taking on this burden with Foxconn themselves. They should use their might and influence to form some sort of alliance with the other major clients eg HP and so on to negotiate and audit what's happening in the factories.

What is magic is the lack of mention of all of the other Foxconn customers... I bet you they're just happy there's very little mention of them. As they continue to churn out massive amounts of plastic crap.

Yes, hold Apple accountable... But to be fair let's not forget the other major companies involved.
post #63 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

No Apple isn't the only company Foxconn does business with but I'm sure Apple is its biggest customer. Btw who's anyone? And how do you know there's problems at EVERY plant? Are you assuming that because one factory is f'd up to work in then they all must be?

This is what makes it fun. I guess I don't know if EVERY plant has troubles, BUT I guess you haven't been seeing articles about suicides last year or work conditions in China. Do a google search sometime.
post #64 of 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

That list is from Wikipedia, a user editable online encyclopedia of "knowledge" or so they say.

The problem is they are USER EDITABLE, as in false representation or facts are bound to happen. Some of the companies on that list arent even Foxconn customer. If they are, the link doesnt provide unquestionable proof of its status.

Absolutely, but

Sony and Nokia
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31021_3-20006316-260.html

Acer
http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...s-quarter.html

Apple, Dell and HP
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31021_3-20006010-260.html

My point is Foxconn has many big name customers besides Apple.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPad
  • Foxconn explosion won't greatly affect iPad 2 production for Apple
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › Foxconn explosion won't greatly affect iPad 2 production for Apple