or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Apple shows off its networking savvy at WWDC
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Apple shows off its networking savvy at WWDC - Page 3

post #81 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatBug View Post

No, the App Store is the number one store for computer software, even though it only runs on Macs. More people buy from the Store than from Best Buy or Amazon, period. Much more impressive.

(At least, that's what Jobs said.)

I noticed that they only compared Mac App Store to physical retail stores. They did not mention anything about downloading software directly from the manufacturer.
post #82 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaperducer View Post

Be more specific, so I can prove you wrong.

Or, here's a solution for all those who would pay a premium for a disc -- spend $1.00 on a short coffee at one of the 4,000 Starbucks locations across America and use the free wifi. Or spend 49 cents on an ice cream cone at one of the 14,000 McDonald's locations across the country and use the wifi there.

And sit there for how long?
post #83 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haggar View Post

I noticed that they only compared Mac App Store to physical retail stores. They did not mention anything about downloading software directly from the manufacturer.

Schiller, "In the last 6 months the Mac App Store has become the number one PC software channel for buying software. That's incredible."

Source: WWDC 2011 keynote video, 16m:50s
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #84 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaperducer View Post

Be more specific, so I can prove you wrong.

Or, here's a solution for all those who would pay a premium for a disc -- spend $1.00 on a short coffee at one of the 4,000 Starbucks locations across America and use the free wifi. Or spend 49 cents on an ice cream cone at one of the 14,000 McDonald's locations across the country and use the wifi there.

If you won't pony up 49 cents, then enjoy your Altair.

I've been all around northeast Indiana. If you can't find a McDonald's, then you're blind.

Or go to an Apple Store where you might have picked it up anyway or tried to test it and DL it from there. I usually get about 16Mb/s so the 3.4GB file be done in under 30 minutes. With their content it seems to be faster. I think they may have a local server cache just for that contingency.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #85 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandor View Post

how so? im using it now...

Google "Snow Leopard internet sharing" and you'll see the top searches Google suggests are "not working, greyed out, fails, problems, issues, etc." Some people have wasted days and even weeks trying unsuccessfully to get it to work, and have posted such on the Apple Support forums.
post #86 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elijahg View Post

"There is no such thing as Free Public WiFi" is most likely a jab at Windows security... There was a virus going around on XP machines that created a network called "Free Public WiFi", any XP machine that connected to it would get the virus too.

Impressive wireless and wired network though. Having that many computers all chatting away on similar frequencies and not completely collapsing when everyone clicked "Download Lion Developer Preview" is quite an achievement. Shame Apple didn't use their own Airport hardware though, would have been a good thing to show off.

Apple has nice consumer equipment, but it cannot match a enterprise Cisco network.

Aggregated alarm notifications
Automated browser redirect
Simplified setup and configuration
Quick and advanced searches
Location tracking of client, Wi-Fi, and rogue devices
Inventory reports
Secure administrative access

Quote:
Originally Posted by noexpectations View Post

As a Network Engineer for over 15 years, these are standard views and reports from a major Wifi Vendor (not Apple). Apple did not create this. They are simply just another WiFi Vendor customer (like many thousands of other corporate customers).

Cisco is the vendor
Here are the components that make up the network Apple made.

Access Point
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10981/index.html

Wireless Controller
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps10315/index.html

Wireless Control System (WCS)
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps6305/index.html

Wireless Control System Navigator
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps7305/index.html


Quote:
Originally Posted by karmadave View Post

Anyone know what the networking equipment was/is for WWDC? I can guarantee it's not a bunch of APX routers. Maybe Cisco, Juniper, or perhaps Aruba?

Cisco
post #87 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) The fact that you'd download it 3x instead of once tells us you decided to react before thinking.

2) Then burn it to a DVD. This has been detailed since the first beta was released. Hell, it's the same routine of copying the previous DVD installs to a HDD's partition or USB flash drive that I've been using for years.

3) Time Machine isn't installing the OS, it's for your data and settings, and it's very handy. Even if you don't want your Library preferences copied to a new system having your data files restored and backed up with ease shouldn't make you too afraid.

4) Maybe I expect too much from posters on an Apple-based tech forum, but I do assume you understand how to use Disk Utility to create an bootable disc from a disk image.

5. could he not set up a DL before he goes to sleep ???

6/And sinceApple has changed the game i feel i mst inform the big damn babies here if you DOWNLOAD anything from app store <<even items 2 yrs ago >>> i counts on any of your machines and if you lose it App store gives it back to you ..
BOOTABLE DISC ?? would not the hardware test disc work just as well ??

just saying

its hot in nyc 100 degrees in the shade


90
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
post #88 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Schiller, "In the last 6 months the Mac App Store has become the number one PC software channel for buying software. That's incredible."

Source: WWDC 2011 keynote video, 16m:50s

it took 34 days
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
post #89 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

I'm so over optical media for software distribution. It just means it's out of date the moment the DVD is pressed. I installed Snow Leopard using a bootable USB memory stick...and I've never looked back.

The benefit of having the DVD media is that it is bootable, and provides standalone installation. If Apple distributed full retail copies of Lion on a read-only USB flash drive, that would probably satisfy most of the DVD crowd.

As for DVDs being out of date, perhaps Apple should take a look at Microsoft's "slipstreaming" technique, where you can apply the latest updates to a Windows install disk, thereby creating an up-to-date installation disk.

The questions I have about App Store-only distribution of Lion:

Will the file you download from the Mac App Store allow you to create a standalone USB or Firewire boot disk that you can run the Lion installer from, without having to first install previous versions of Mac OS?

And would it provide all the options typically available from the bootable DVD installer, such as "Archive and Install" and "Erase and Install"?

What about companies that have not yet upgraded their older Intel Macs to Snow Leopard due to issues such as compatibility with older software. Would there be a way for them to upgrade those Macs directly to Lion without having to first upgrade to 10.5, then 10.6?

Can IT departments copy the Lion installer and run it on a Snow Leopard Mac that is not signed in to the App Store?

How does Mac App Store authorization affect companies that use disk images for setting up dozens or hundreds of Macs? Does every Mac in the company need to be signed in to a Mac App Store account with credit card info?
post #90 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Why? It makes no sense. Might as well just download it. It will take less time than a disc, anyway.

Not everyone has bandwidth time to waste on downloading > 4GB of data over the net, and no that won't take less time than slot loading a disc and installing it.
post #91 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

When iCloud is released to the general public, and when the initial novelty wears off, then I suspect we'll see a Local-iCloud Server announcement.

For enterprise and SMB adoption, a local iCloud server has to happen.
post #92 of 120
This has been stated ad naeusem for months now. It takes less than 5 minutes to create a bootable backup of Lion. If you want to this to be a DVD and not a HDD or NAND, then add a couple more minutes for your optical burner and even more for it to check the burn. It's not a big fucking deal.

If you are still using Leopard 2 years after Snow Leopard shipped you're unlikely to be wanting to get the latest OS right when it comes out. No company should have to work around so many niggling requests by a few fringe users.


PS: Anyone who wants Lion on a DVD can send me $129 plus S&H. All proceeds will be donated to The Halfwit House on your behalf.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Not everyone has bandwidth time to waste on downloading > 4GB of data over the net, and no that won't take less time than slot loading a disc and installing it.

It would likely take less time and effort from the time that you'd order them online, with one being DLed and the other shipped.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #93 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandelay Industries View Post

(I'm not interested in cloning or TM backups. I prefer clean installs.)

This has to be one of the most ludicrous things I have read in theses forums in a LONG time.

So if you prefer clean installs, how many times do you boot up before you consider your install dirty and start over again?



I suspect you are dismissing TM or cloning since it negates your "objection" about download only - nice attempt but pretty lame.
post #94 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obama View Post

I think they should give you a choice of optical media for a fee. I wonder if you buy a new iMac truck after lion is out if it will come with any restore disc or repair tools?

It will be like 99% of all Windows's PCs that ship - a recovery partition that it's your responsibility to back up.

I expect they will provide a facility to do so - but I wouldn't expect it to be optical. You can see where Apple is going with the MacBook Air - I expect you will be able to back it up to a flash drive. Since you can get a 2GB flash drive for 25 slurpees I doubt that will be a hardship for anyone. No harder than picking up a couple of blank DVDs.

Quote:
Of course no one buys iMacs anymore.

post #95 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Agreed! And there is the positive effect on the environment, too. No water to bleach the cardboard for the boxes, no trees used, no toxic colored inks, no fossil fuel used to make the plastic, no manufacturing waste and no fossil fuel used to ship or go to the store to pick it up.

Electrons are easier to recycle too!
post #96 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandelay Industries View Post

Perhaps there should be an asterisk on the $29.99* cost.

*does not include DVD. That cost is now passed to you

Are you for real? PC users haven't gotten DVD media in years and MS raised the price of Windows!

Apple cut it by $100 and your whining you don't get a DVD that the vast majority of people use once, maybe twice? Yup, that's the kind of convenience that the expense and waist of materials is entirely justified for. Bravo!
post #97 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Northeast Indiana.

They don't have McDonalds in Indiana? Fascinating!

Quote:
Carry on!

indeed
post #98 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaperducer View Post

But... but... but... Britons on the internet (see Slashdot, Fark, et.al.) have been crowing for years that their internet is faster, cheaper, and more ubiquitous than in the United States. Do you mean that your country is really as backwards as the actual statistics indicate?

I lol'd!
post #99 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph L View Post

They wired a building for Ethernet, and that's news? Is this 1985?

This may come as a shock to some (who seem to have ignorance for the laws of physics but I digress) - wired is faster than wireless and has significantly more capacity which is important when you are, say, tossing around 4GB installations of OS's and Development platforms.

That's the difference between Apple and smart a$$ forum posters - Apple = Professionals. Forum posters - well, you get the idea...
post #100 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Agreed! And there is the positive effect on the environment, too. No water to bleach the cardboard for the boxes, no trees used, no toxic colored inks, no fossil fuel used to make the plastic, no manufacturing waste and no fossil fuel used to ship or go to the store to pick it up.

To insist on an optical disc is short sighted, to say the least. Good for Apple!

What about the negative effect on the environment in producing all the electricity needed for the download method?
post #101 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Are you for real? PC users haven't gotten DVD media in years and MS raised the price of Windows!


That's funny, because the copy of Windows 7 I got came with a DVD
post #102 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post






Notice anything(s) missing?


We call that progress!

This?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #103 of 120
"...posted over 1,000 wired Ethernet jacks..." Very impressive, but why no Thunderbolt ports? Installing Thunderbolt would be a great marketing tool, right?
post #104 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandelay Industries View Post

I want a disc. No lion for me.

You want a disc, make one. In fact if you want to be really clever you could

1. make a separate partition on your system
2. Install SL then upgrade to Lion
3. install all your apps, register etc as appropriate
4. Update everything for all patches etc
5. Clone it to a bootable emergency disk

Then install your data from the other partition. Now giving you a working Lion partion, a SL partion in case something is boinked under Lion and a back up disk that will put all your apps back in place if something goes south. Just add in a constant back up of your data and you are set.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply
post #105 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaperducer View Post

it's also the "green" solution, so we can save the dying gay baby whales. Or something.

Hmmm - irrelevant, ecologically illiterate and homophobic all in one small post.
post #106 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by dualie View Post

Yet, I can get Cyberduck for free from Macupdate.com, but it costs $23 at the App Store. So much for lowering costs. And still no mention of a solution for corporate firewalls that block the App Store.

Apple doesn't set the software prices for developers but App Store prices are supposed to be the best price the developer offers, as per Apple's developer agreement. If a corporation chooses to block the App Store, how is that Apple's problem?

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

Reply

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

Reply
post #107 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

You want a disc, make one. In fact if you want to be really clever you could

1. make a separate partition on your system
2. Install SL then upgrade to Lion
3. install all your apps, register etc as appropriate
4. Update everything for all patches etc
5. Clone it to a bootable emergency disk

Then install your data from the other partition. Now giving you a working Lion partion, a SL partion in case something is boinked under Lion and a back up disk that will put all your apps back in place if something goes south. Just add in a constant back up of your data and you are set.

Or you can get even more clever and create a bootable install disc, either as a DVD or a separate partition. I've been doing the latter for years, even before Disk Utility in Snow Leopard made it cake walk to set up.

1) Show Package Contents of Install Mac OS X Lion.app in /Applications, then Mount /Content/Shared Support/InstallESD.dmg.

2) Open Disk Utility. Click on Restore on any tab. Drag InstallESD.dmg as source and drag any free ≥ 8GB partition or blank DL-DVD as source.

3) Click Restore button.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #108 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DOSbox-gamer View Post

"...posted over 1,000 wired Ethernet jacks..." Very impressive, but why no Thunderbolt ports? Installing Thunderbolt would be a great marketing tool, right?

Except for the very very few people who actually have Thunderbolt still.

Pretty embarrassing when your developers come up to you to get new software and you can't give it to them because you don't support their computer.
post #109 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Applecation View Post

This will work for me, but I wonder:
When a hard drive crashes, how do people load the OS to a new drive?

And the answer is not necessarily "use your backup". I use a double backup, with TimeMachine and SuperDuper, but I know many people with NO backup at all. While I agree that is foolish, it does happen a lot.

Maybe - just maybe - Apple has considered that and devised a solution. Maybe - just maybe - they have placed a boot ROM in every machine that can at least fire up the machine and bring you to a screen where you can re-download the OS from the cloud, along with your other apps and documents.
post #110 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheinside View Post

DVD install is painfully slow. Praise be to the sense to get rid of them.

Do you expect a network based install to be faster?
post #111 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

Maybe - just maybe - Apple has considered that and devised a solution. Maybe - just maybe - they have placed a boot ROM in every machine that can at least fire up the machine and bring you to a screen where you can re-download the OS from the cloud, along with your other apps and documents.

I'm not seeing any evidence of a boot ROM but I wouldn't expect to. They have the Recovery HD in case something goes wrong with your volume/partition. That is the most likely situation and that can access your networking HW.

If the physical drive goes bad and needs to be replaced that Recovery HD volume is not applicable but savvy users would have not only copied the "Install Mac OS X Lion.app" file to another drive, but would have also used Disk Utility to make a bootable disk from the InstallESD.dmg hidden inside it.

Furthermore, this problem of your physical drive going bad is becoming less of an issue of users as Apple will move more of their devices to NAND-based boot partitions. What percentage of Mac HDDs die? What percentage of those are likely to be replaced by the owner, not fixed via Apple or a 3rd-party's repair shop in or out of warranty? I'd like the primary Lion installer to offer a "Create Lion Restore Disc" option but it's easy enough that I will not have a problem walking my parents through it's few steps.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #112 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Google "Snow Leopard internet sharing" and you'll see the top searches Google suggests are "not working, greyed out, fails, problems, issues, etc." Some people have wasted days and even weeks trying unsuccessfully to get it to work, and have posted such on the Apple Support forums.

The internet is a big place with lots of users. You can "Google" for problems with ANYTHING, and even if that thing has a super low problem rate (you know, fraction of people with problems vice those with none) you're going to get a whole bunch of hits.

In other words, "Googling" for a problem and observing how many hits you get is NOT a way to prove that something is a major problem.

Thompson
post #113 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

If the physical drive goes bad and needs to be replaced that Recovery HD volume is not applicable but savvy users would have not only copied the "Install Mac OS X Lion.app" file to another drive, but would have also used Disk Utility to make a bootable disk from the InstallESD.dmg hidden inside it.

And hence my point: Apple can't just design to "savvy users", because that is probably less than 25% of their customer base. They must have a solution that "just works". I bet they have one, whether it is apparent right now or not. (Don't take my particular example of a "Boot ROM" too seriously.)

Thompson
post #114 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandelay Industries View Post

I want a disc. No lion for me.

Interpretation: I want a horse. No mechanized buggy for me.

NOTE: Nothing personal :-)
post #115 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatBug View Post

No, the App Store is the number one store for computer software, even though it only runs on Macs. More people buy from the Store than from Best Buy or Amazon, period. Much more impressive.

(At least, that's what Jobs said.)

Thats because users of Ipad, Ipod and Iphone don't have a choice!!
post #116 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by ispyed View Post

Thats because users of Ipad, Ipod and Iphone don't have a choice!!

This has absolutely nothing to do with the App Store on iOS devices. This is talking about the Mac App Store.
post #117 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaperducer View Post

I'm with him, and also a shareholder. If Apple can ship a Lion install for 50 cents worth of bandwidth instead of $4.00 worth of packaging and material, then screw the edge cases.

I'm sure that Apple's volumes would cost less than a dollar a disc including silk screen and packaging. Seems to be about the same as the cost of bandwidth with many services.
post #118 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

Maybe - just maybe - Apple has considered that and devised a solution. Maybe - just maybe - they have placed a boot ROM in every machine that can at least fire up the machine and bring you to a screen where you can re-download the OS from the cloud, along with your other apps and documents.

I find this of interest - Apple's expanded view of Recovery Mode. It not only includes the reinstallation of OS X, but also the Safari app to access the Apple Support site, plus restoring from Time Machine.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/whats-ne...nternetrestore

Nullis in verba -- "on the word of no one"

 

 

 

Reply

Nullis in verba -- "on the word of no one"

 

 

 

Reply
post #119 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

For enterprise and SMB adoption, a local iCloud server has to happen.

Yeah, because that's really keeping enterprise and SMB from using Amazon's cloud.

Oh, wait...

SMB doesn't want another damned box to worry about. It wants the cloud to make everything magical fairy go away. Apple's interest in SMB is only passing anyway. Maybe some day there will be iCloud for enterprise, but with only 5GB of storage, it's not enough even for small businesses like the ones I own.
post #120 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post

Google "Snow Leopard internet sharing" and you'll see the top searches Google suggests are "not working, greyed out, fails, problems, issues, etc." Some people have wasted days and even weeks trying unsuccessfully to get it to work, and have posted such on the Apple Support forums.

Internet sharing works great here. Probably once a week I share my Clear signal over wifi. Occasionally I'll share my wifi signal over Firewire. Everything works perfectly.

Sorry you're having problems, but maybe try to go beat that dead horse in the appropriate thread, instead of bringing it up everywhere you go. People might respect your opinion on the matter more, and not automatically think you're a lunatic looking for attention.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Mac OS X
AppleInsider › Forums › Software › Mac OS X › Apple shows off its networking savvy at WWDC