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With more than $70B in cash, Apple could buy Nokia, RIM, HTC & Motorola - Page 4

post #121 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by macinthe408 View Post

This is OT, but where does that $70 billion live? Is it at Bank of America, or multiple banks? Can Jobs walk up to an ATM and withdraw from the Apple account ($300 at a time, of course)? Can he write a check against that $70 billion? If he buys a company, is it an electronic debit? Is there an iMattress?


Their SEC 10-Q filing breaks it all down:

http://investor.apple.com/
post #122 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Inflation does not account for the dollar's fall in value thanks to the Fed printing like crazy and a currency no longer being backed by gold. Our dollar is devalued, not just suffering from the effects of inflation.

Actually...it mostly does.

Inflation, properly understood, is the increase in the supply of money (and credit). The effect is higher nominal prices which is just another way of saying a devalued monetary unit (dollar).

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #123 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by franksmith22 View Post

I would gladly pay $50-80 extra for a made in the usa iphone

Then I suggest you start a business to sell these products to the 20 other people who would also pay more money for these products.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #124 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Actually...it mostly does.

Inflation, properly understood, is the increase in the supply of money (and credit). The effect is higher nominal prices which is just another way of saying a devalued monetary unit (dollar).

Yes. Sorry, I changed my response.

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

 

Get the lowdown on the coming collapse:  http://www.cbo.gov/publication/45010

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post #125 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patranus View Post

... A common mistake by the "progressive" is that the "rich" gets "richer" at the expense of the other classes. This logic is fundamentally flawed. The "rich" create their wealth. ...

I try to stay away from these pinhead "American" threads, but it has to be at least noted that what you are pushing here is pure bullshit ideology.

Facts are facts.
The rich have been getting richer and the poor have been getting poorer.

That's how capitalism works.

Your other comments about the rich "creating wealth" have also been conclusively disproven many many times. It's basic 'trickle-down' economics. It has never been the case that it works and it never will work.

You can spout this right-wing ideological crap all day long but it won't magically become true at any time.
post #126 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patranus View Post


A common mistake by the "progressive" is that the "rich" gets "richer" at the expense of the other classes. This logic is fundamentally flawed. The "rich" create their wealth.

If you look at Forbes' annual list of rich people, you will discover that many of them became rich through an excellent choice of parents or spouses.
post #127 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

Or they could manufacture their products in the US and create some jobs.

Oh, please

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie View Post

Couldn't agree more. Be a real leader. Being jobs home. Period.

Talk about something you could brag about.


"Jobs bring jobs..." Does a headline get any better than this?

Oh, please

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Apple has created plenty of jobs in the US. Most of them are pretty high-paying, high-tech jobs. This fetish over manufacturing jobs baffles me.

Thank you

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumpmaster View Post

It would also reduce higher skilled jobs because Apple products would get even more expensive, and fewer people would buy them. Apple would then have to lay off people working in the US. It may be a net increase in job creation, but it's questionable whether the US would be better off for it (tax revenue, productivity value, etc)


BTW, there are lots of jobs out there. It's just that people are unwilling to do them. How many unemployed people are willing to be janitors or field workers because it is beneath them, or their skillset is too high?

Thank you

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooksT View Post

It's a noble sentiment, but can you walk me through how that would work? Would Apple accept a loss on every product sold where now they have a profit, and burn through their cash reserves that way? Or would they raise prices to some kind of breakeven point and lose sales and market share?

It seems like you're basically suggesting that they operate as a charity, accepting losses for social good. If that's what you're after, why all the complexity of moving production and losing money (and tanking the share price)? Why not just suggest they give money away outright?


All of these people that talk about bringing jobs to this country are the last ones in line for that type of employment. When Americans understand that they have to bust their ass and work just as hard as the Chinese do for the little money that is payed for those types of assembly jobs, that is when we will get that type of work. Problem is, most Americans think they should get paid $60,000 a year for an entry level, sitting-on-their-ass job.

Why does Apple bashing and trolling make people feel so good?

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Why does Apple bashing and trolling make people feel so good?

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post #128 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I try to stay away from these pinhead "American" threads, but it has to be at least noted that what you are pushing here is pure bullshit ideology.

Facts are facts.
The rich have been getting richer and the poor have been getting poorer.

That's how capitalism works.

Your other comments about the rich "creating wealth" have also been conclusively disproven many many times. It's basic 'trickle-down' economics. It has never been the case that it works and it never will work.

You can spout this right-wing ideological crap all day long but it won't magically become true at any time.

You are wrong sir.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #129 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by z3r0 View Post

Buy Microsoft and fire the other Steve!

Apple hopes Balmer never gets fired.
2011 13" 2.3 MBP, 2006 15" 2.16 MBP, iPhone 4, iPod Shuffle, AEBS, AppleTV2 with XBMC.
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2011 13" 2.3 MBP, 2006 15" 2.16 MBP, iPhone 4, iPod Shuffle, AEBS, AppleTV2 with XBMC.
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post #130 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie View Post

Couldn't agree more. Be a real leader. Being jobs home. Period.

Talk about something you could brag about.

"Jobs bring jobs..." Does a headline get any better than this?

Do you think every single Android, Motorola etc American user base would dump their phones and buy iPhone just because it is made in the USA? I don't think so. That ship (local manufacturing) has sailed decades ago when capitalism rises and many third world countries were suppresses by IMF, world bank etc. Get a grip!
post #131 of 281
BTW, $70 billion is not a really big deal. GE has $120 billion in the bank, mostly overseas.
post #132 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

Or they could manufacture their products in the US and create some jobs.

There is only One Jobs at Apple

Of course The hypothetical scenario would never be allowed for antitrust reasons, but it illustrates the benefits of Apple's high margin strategy. They won't build something unless they can do it profitably, otherwise, it's back to 1996 for Apple.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #133 of 281
Apple could buy them all out, fire all their employees, demolish the buildings and plant trees in their stead. Hypothetically, of course.

Really, AI, if you're going to hypothesize, why limit yourself?
post #134 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronTed View Post

BTW, $70 billion is not a really big deal. GE has $120 billion in the bank, mostly overseas.

Totally different industry. For the tech industry, it's HUGE.
post #135 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Apple has created plenty of jobs in the US. Most of them are pretty high-paying, high-tech jobs. This fetish over manufacturing jobs baffles me.

Why not bring some manufacturing jobs to the US? Not everyone is equipped to be in a high tech job. Some people are better at doing manual labor. If China can do both, why can't we?
post #136 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by EGlasheen View Post

Would like to see Apple develop applications so I can dump Adobe i.e. Photoshop and Illustrator.

Hear! Hear!
post #137 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Then I suggest you start a business to sell these products to the 20 other people who would also pay more money for these products.

Tough luck! BTW, why stop at twenty? The most they can sell is once. Then, down the line they (consumer) realise they could not sustain it, they will be back to what they know best. Buy them cheap and buy them plenty, hence WalMart.
post #138 of 281
Apple should be spending more on research and development.
post #139 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronTed View Post

BTW, $70 billion is not a really big deal. GE has $120 billion in the bank, mostly overseas.

Not to mention GE has been on corporate welfare due to republican policies for the past 12 years, they pay no tax and get over a billion in tax return. So I suppose you are proud of such things huh mr tea bagger.
post #140 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

Or they could manufacture their products in the US and create some jobs.

I agree 100%.

2011 13" Core i5 Macbook Pro | Intel 520 SSD | 8GB Corsair DDR3 1333 | OSX 10.7
iPhone 4S - AT&T

iPad 3 Wi-Fi

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2011 13" Core i5 Macbook Pro | Intel 520 SSD | 8GB Corsair DDR3 1333 | OSX 10.7
iPhone 4S - AT&T

iPad 3 Wi-Fi

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post #141 of 281
If Apple needs to buy another company it's Vodafone. Killer vertical integration and the means to make iCloud actually usable.
post #142 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Apple has created plenty of jobs in the US. Most of them are pretty high-paying, high-tech jobs. This fetish over manufacturing jobs baffles me.

the problem isnt manufacturing jobs per se, its that there used to be two ways to climb the ladder in this country, university education and hard work...the latter option is all but dead - no company is loyal to its people and no people are loyal to their companies so there is little chance that a 18 year old kid will start on the loading dock and work his way into the corner office by his 30 or 40s is all but gone - we now have those with BS begrees and those without...

I personally think the university system as well as corporate HR theory is messed up in this country...When I was out of work some time ago I was told many times something like "you have better skills than most other candidates but you dont have a BS in computers so we cant interview you for our IT department..."so now I am almost finished with the 4 year scam to drain my savings in exchange for a bullshit certificate that will allow me to make 70k for what I do now for half that...


University is the problem in many ways, not the lack of manufacturing, the lack of a path to work your way off the shop floor and progress in a career path...
You can't quantify how much I don't care -- Bob Kevoian of the Bob and Tom Show.
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You can't quantify how much I don't care -- Bob Kevoian of the Bob and Tom Show.
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post #143 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Apple doesn't need to buy any of those companies because they aren't any threat. It would be a waste of money.

The next step will be creating their own processor architectures or buying Intel.


buying AMD, its cheaper and they get better preformance/dollar, so they can make more profit lol... not to mention graphics *IGPU or GPU*

but, er wouldn't this be "anti competitive"

i think eventually they should just buy a state of the US government lol... probably can get them dirt cheap soon....

PC means personal computer.  

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PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

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post #144 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeCorsaire View Post

Why? Do the Americans work harder? or better? or cheaper? Or you want Apple be run like a charity?

One thing is certain - everyone who thinks moving jobs to where you get less output per dollar has NEVER created a job themselves.
post #145 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

Or they could manufacture their products in the US and create some jobs.

i prefer child labour be done outside the US
post #146 of 281
I have read this site for a long time (amongst many others) but this is the first time I have felt like signing up to say anything. I am baffled by many of the posts on this thread but I learnt some time ago browsing here that many have inflexible views, refuse to keep an open mind and are really quite aggressive with those who do not share their viewpoints.

To quote Robert Quillen “Discussion is an exchange of knowledge; an argument an exchange of ignorance.”

Thus I will stick to a few thoughts that popped into my head instead.

1) ARM does have other benefits beyond those mentioned. Unlikely Apple would buy ARM but they are ramping up their development of mobile graphics & SoCs for Internet connected televisions (and other devices).

ARM are also based in Cambridge, England and have a strong talent pool and ties with the University. They are in the primary position for talent coming out of the University of Cambridge and the very latest in computer science research.

2) It is possible to start from scratch in a country.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-13058866

As you will all know Foxconn plan to do exactly that in Brazil, lack of manufacturing infrastructure or expertise is not the reason they choose not to manufacture in the US. That is down primarily to wages. (I hope the BBC link works in your country of residence, apologies if not).

3) Wages are rising quite fast in China, pre-suicides the reported rate for a Foxconn worker was 900 RMB and is now 2000 RMB ($310 a month). You will appreciate that is quite the rise. Indeed the average rise in the minimum wage levels across China in 2010 was 22.5%.

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/wag...m-salary-hikes

With inflation at 5.5% and food inflation at 11.7% in China this pressure will only accelerate further in the next year or two.

In addition to this to combat food inflation (and under pressure from the US) China is relaxing its hold of the value of the Yuan. This year alone it has gained about 10% on the dollar (last time I checked, may not be current) and is said to be undervalued by at least 40%. This would make the current value of Foxconn wages $434 a month. Considering the current low interest rates in the developed world driving investment to China the undervaluation estimate on the Yuan may be conservative.

Recently in the Chinese apparel making factories there has already been a shortage of workers and when the domestic market catches light in China (and it will) this problem could well send wages rocketing as factories struggle to meet demand.

This over a period of time will make manufacturing in America more appealing but initially will drive factories to Latin America, India and then the last source of cheap labour Africa. People in Nigeria for example earn about $330 Per year.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_th...ome_in_Nigeria

So in short low tech assembly will probably shift around the world a bit until China & India become huge consumers. At that point in time the US could see a resurgence in this area or we could see rapid development of further automation.

4) The US actually has a shortage of workers!

http://www.britannica.com/blogs/2010...kill-shortage/

So despite many many people being out of work, there are potentially jobs for some of them but no one has the right skills set. How much growth is this stalling in these businesses?, how many other low skill jobs would that growth have created?.

The US (and UK for that matter) has under invested in education and the future of its economy. It has workers with low skills or the wrong ones. The economy has moved to hi tech and the education system has not caught up. Despite a growing debt unless there is significant investment and realignment to upskill then other countries will continue to catch up.

People who are better educated have better health, commit less crimes, are less of a burden on the state and they create jobs. Short term investment pain for long term gain but unfortunately most Governments do not think further than making sure they are voted in at the next election. Why go for long term when they won't be in office to reap the glory, so they go for short term populist wins instead.


Anyhow less of my ramble! Enjoy your weekend.
post #147 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

"The rich could be less rich"? That is a very slippery slope. How rich is rich? How much must you, via the force of government, steal from the rich in order to "right" all of society's problems?

When you start enacting more socialistic policies and so-called "wealth redistribution" suddenly the rich become less so, the power of government grows, the incentives for creating wealth disappear and you become Cold War Russia.

Yeah I figured people would immediately scream socialism, communism, or some other bull.

We are already living with wealth distribution, it's called working and taxes and it's good for everyone. The problem is that the separation of rich and poor and balance of equality is off
post #148 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie View Post

Yeah I figured people would immediately scream socialism, communism, or some other bull.

Well...if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...


Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie View Post

We are already living with wealth distribution, it's called working and taxes and it's good for everyone.

What do you mean by "wealth distribution?" Because when most people refer to wealth redistribution" they are talking about the state taking $ from one group and giving to another. Working does not fit under that definition, but taxes do.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #149 of 281
They could spend a little bit of it developing a XMac. Just a suggestion.
post #150 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTac View Post

They could spend a little bit of it developing a XMac. Just a suggestion.

Thanks for bringing some levity to the thread.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #151 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie View Post

Yeah I figured people would immediately scream socialism, communism, or some other bull.

We are already living with wealth distribution, it's called working and taxes and it's good for everyone. The problem is that the separation of rich and poor and balance of equality is off

The problem with wealth equality is that the super rich get most of their income from capital gains and dividends, not cash. These are taxed differently, and especially during the bush years were dramatically lower. The 400 richest americans routinely during the bush era had tax rates of around 20%.
http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesam...er/wealth.html
post #152 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

If you really want more manufacturing in the US, then lobby for more employment deregulation, including any special legal privileges granted to unions.

But, in the end, this is the dynamic that happens. There are a wide array of jobs in the US that don't fall into the categories of "flipping burgers" (which are entry level jobs for teenagers) and high-tech doctorate jobs in hi-tech and bio-tech. Most of the people I work with are all pretty middle class. We all earn middle class wage and live in middle class homes. None of us manufacture anything. There are also tons of people working in manufacturing in the US, they are just manufacturing much higher value things than the stuff we outsource to places like China and Malaysia.

What we need is for the government to get out of the way of business and the economy will grow and create tons of jobs. But most of these will not be the jobs from yesteryear...and that's probably going to be okay.

What a bunch of BS.

The Effective Corporate Tax Rate is the lowest in the world, here in the States. If you can't seem to hire more staff than either you choose not to or you have incompetent Accounting working for you, or you don't own a business and should keep your mouth quiet and research more about how pathetic it is that the US eroded it's own base to allow off-shoring of trillions for short-term profits.

Here is the real kicker: China has to raise its own rates sooner rather than later. The same with Brasil and South America. The offshore attitude to every where but the US is coming full circle.

The biggest consumption base in the globe is the US. The best action the Congress could take would be to draft law that overturns the mid-1930's Supreme Court ruling that Corporations are due the right to petition the government for a redress of grievances and with none of the responsibilities inherent in doing so. Lobbying will then be illegal and real competition can begin. You want effective change and competition, you'll have to realize that yes, the second wave of Manufacturing will come, but on a global scale. The second wave of the industrial revolution will happen and the US will be on the forefront, once again.

That will require manufacturing, but it will not be the same. Without the Government R&D Grants into Biotech, Nanoscience, Advanced Materials, Smart Grids, etc., the corporations wouldn't know their head from their rear end.

The Public/Private partnerships of major US Universities with LLCs started by these same universities is what scares the hell out of the Biotech industries--they don't have the IP owned by these Universities who finally woke up and decided to leverage what they educate and research.

BioMass energy is beginning it's clinical Trials at WSU/PNNL/ and the Department of Energy where any biomass is used to generate gasoline, diesel and jet fuel. It was just announced and they expect distribution and refinement ready for world-wide use by 2013. You wanna see how fast the US Oil Industry is going to cry foul when that happens?

It's a Public/Private partnership. The pure private approach has advanced the world on a time frame they decide leaving Science waiting decades for research already verified to see the light of day.

The only industry with this exception has been the IT Industry, but then again the IT Industry exists purely because of Government R&D.

Keep writing about what you surely know little about. History has a way of exposing ignorance and you seem to be swimming in it.
post #153 of 281
they could put them out of business entirely by building better products than they can.
post #154 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

What a bunch of BS.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Keep writing about what you surely know little about. History has a way of exposing ignorance and you seem to be swimming in it.

Interesting how well these two statements framed your entire post.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #155 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph L View Post


How do Gemany and Japan do it?

We'll have a chance again with the way the dollar is going. I think eventually manufacturing will be attractive here once the dollar has depreciated enough and the yuan has appreciated. Either that or chinese factories will have to move to the rural inland areas.
post #156 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph L View Post


Why does manufacturing output as a percentage of GDP matter?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #157 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Inflation as it relates to the dollar's fall in value thanks to the Fed printing like crazy and A CURRENCY NO LONGER BEING BACKED BY GOLD... our dollar is devalued.

which currencies use the GOLD STANDARD still?

if u can find any (major currencies) plesae tell me

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply
post #158 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

They need to find something to do with that cash.

MARS, Bitches!
"Don't be a dick!"Wil Wheaton
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post #159 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

which currencies use the GOLD STANDARD still?

if u can find any (major currencies) plesae tell me

None. That's part of the problem.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #160 of 281
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

What a bunch of BS.

The Effective Corporate Tax Rate is the lowest in the world, here in the States. If you can't seem to hire more staff than either you choose not to or you have incompetent Accounting working for you, or you don't own a business and should keep your mouth quiet and research more about how pathetic it is that the US eroded it's own base to allow off-shoring of trillions for short-term profits.

Here is the real kicker: China has to raise its own rates sooner rather than later. The same with Brasil and South America. The offshore attitude to every where but the US is coming full circle.

The biggest consumption base in the globe is the US. The best action the Congress could take would be to draft law that overturns the mid-1930's Supreme Court ruling that Corporations are due the right to petition the government for a redress of grievances and with none of the responsibilities inherent in doing so. Lobbying will then be illegal and real competition can begin. You want effective change and competition, you'll have to realize that yes, the second wave of Manufacturing will come, but on a global scale. The second wave of the industrial revolution will happen and the US will be on the forefront, once again.

That will require manufacturing, but it will not be the same. Without the Government R&D Grants into Biotech, Nanoscience, Advanced Materials, Smart Grids, etc., the corporations wouldn't know their head from their rear end.

The Public/Private partnerships of major US Universities with LLCs started by these same universities is what scares the hell out of the Biotech industries--they don't have the IP owned by these Universities who finally woke up and decided to leverage what they educate and research.

BioMass energy is beginning it's clinical Trials at WSU/PNNL/ and the Department of Energy where any biomass is used to generate gasoline, diesel and jet fuel. It was just announced and they expect distribution and refinement ready for world-wide use by 2013. You wanna see how fast the US Oil Industry is going to cry foul when that happens?

It's a Public/Private partnership. The pure private approach has advanced the world on a time frame they decide leaving Science waiting decades for research already verified to see the light of day.

The only industry with this exception has been the IT Industry, but then again the IT Industry exists purely because of Government R&D.

Keep writing about what you surely know little about. History has a way of exposing ignorance and you seem to be swimming in it.

Totally agree.
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