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The biggest threat to the global warming scaremongers - Reality - Page 3

post #81 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

It has been brought up, but not in this thread I don't think. It is interesting however beaming 20 watts between islands is a long ways from beaming enough electricity from space to make this worthwhile. I think we need to see this work in reality before we try to make it work from space. Beam a real amount of power that can make a difference over an appreciable distance for a long time.

Well the principle is fairly simple. Only the methodology needs to be worked out ( laser or microwave ). The real challenge is getting the stuff up there.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #82 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1618978 View Post

Well, you are wrong.

http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/detect/de..._anomalies.pdf

And you never answered my questions, also.

That's about what I said. .6 degrees (perhaps .8) over 120 years. And keep in mind two things: Record keeping and methods of measuring temperature across the globe were not as sophisticated in 1880 as they are today..not by far. Secondly, is that kind of a variance abnormal over time? When looking at a graph of that scale, a clear upward trend exists. But what about 10,000 years?

And I did answer your questions. There is no evidence C02 output causes global warming. That does not mean I argue for unfettered pollution, of course.
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post #83 of 111
Arctic scientist under investigation

Quote:
A federal wildlife biologist whose observation in 2004 of presumably drowned polar bears in the Arctic helped to galvanize the global warming movement has been placed on administrative leave and is being investigated for scientific misconduct, possibly over the veracity of that article.

Have you hugged a polar bear today?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #84 of 111
New NASA Data Blow Gaping Hole In Global Warming Alarmism

Quote:
NASA satellite data from the years 2000 through 2011 show the Earth's atmosphere is allowing far more heat to be released into space than alarmist computer models have predicted, reports a new study in the peer-reviewed science journal Remote Sensing. The study indicates far less future global warming will occur than United Nations computer models have predicted, and supports prior studies indicating increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide trap far less heat than alarmists have claimed.

But the polar bears are drowning!!! Oh wait...the "scientist" who told us that is probably a liar. Dang it.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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post #85 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

New NASA Data Blow Gaping Hole In Global Warming Alarmism



But the polar bears are drowning!!! Oh wait...the "scientist" who told us that is probably a liar. Dang it.

One positive thing about the global debt crisis is that nations don't want to commit resources to this nonsense. It's a farce. In 10-20 years, this will be regarded like Global Cooling in the 70's and the Spotted Owl in the 80's. One was junk science, the other was a hoax. Now we have something that's both.
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post #86 of 111
Yes people, their views really are what they want to believe rather than what is. Rich right wing American elites have an army of the most warped and misinformed minds on the planet.
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post #87 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Yes people, their views really are what they want to believe rather than what is. Rich right wing American elites have an army of the most warped and misinformed minds on the planet.

What about rich left wing American elites? How big is their army of warped and misinformed minds?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #88 of 111
A simple question, re. matter which is never mentioned in the "climate change debate":

If man-made, or human influenced global warming is a "huge hoax", as alleged by some, then why? Enormous efforts, involving such a large number of people/careers are never invested without some kind of return.

Which organizations and/or individuals stands to gain from promoting climate change, and the knock-on effects resulting from such change? What is the motivation for the widespread promotion of said "hoax"?

Just curious as to what "the panel" thinks.
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #89 of 111
Quite simply, it's a power grab. It's an attempt to give governments more control over the individual.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #90 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

A simple question, re. matter which is never mentioned in the "climate change debate":

If man-made, or human influenced global warming is a "huge hoax", as alleged by some, then why? Enormous efforts, involving such a large number of people/careers are never invested without some kind of return.

Which organizations and/or individuals stands to gain from promoting climate change, and the knock-on effects resulting from such change? What is the motivation for the widespread promotion of said "hoax"?

Just curious as to what "the panel" thinks.

Follow the money trail Sammi. Isn't that how it always works?
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #91 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Follow the money trail Sammi. Isn't that how it always works?

As in the money trail resulting from regulations to control emissions/pollutants from vehicles, industry etc.? The money trail from traditional fossil fuel based industry needing to reinvest a portion of profits in new plant and machinery, diversify their activities etc.?

The "money trail" from pursuing measures to combat climate change is not the short term fast earner that investors prefer.... its more an 'inverted money trail".

The question remains unanswered?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #92 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Quite simply, it's a power grab. It's an attempt to give governments more control over the individual.

Take it one step further: since governments of all stripes, all over the planet tend to answer to privileged, wealthy, unelected (highly influential) parties, rather than the people they supposedly represent... one could say that its a power grab to give elites (left, center and right) more control over the unwashed masses.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #93 of 111
I've made a list of the ten most important reasons we should fight against these Globalist Warmists of Death-


1) First global tax and paid to private banks. This is important because it facilities a world government that wants to eat Christians alive. This is perhaps doing more harm to Christianity than Muslimification is doing. See 9/11 for reference material.

2) We're really heading into another ice age and they (the globalists) want to buy all the thick socks.

3) It's all a big distraction to turn people into mindless zombies. The shape shifting reptilians would like nothing better.

4) Communism.

5) not sure

6) Communism

7) Communism

8) they hate our way of life/freedoms and want to destroy it. What better way to destroy it than to promote clean energy, energy saving appliances and bicycles?

9) Communism

10) communism
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #94 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

I've made a list of the ten most important reasons we should fight against these Globalist Warmists of Death-


1) First global tax and paid to private banks. This is important because it facilities a world government that wants to eat Christians alive. This is perhaps doing more harm to Christianity than Muslimification is doing. See 9/11 for reference material.

2) We're really heading into another ice age and they (the globalists) want to buy all the thick socks.

3) It's all a big distraction to turn people into mindless zombies. The shape shifting reptilians would like nothing better.

4) Communism.

5) not sure

6) Communism

7) Communism

8) they hate our way of life/freedoms and want to destroy it. What better way to destroy it than to promote clean energy, energy saving appliances and bicycles?

9) Communism

10) communism



There is not much that is posted in P.O. that is laugh-worthy. That one almost made me spray my morning coffee all over a perfectly good MacBook Pro. Thank you!!

"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #95 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

As in the money trail resulting from regulations to control emissions/pollutants from vehicles, industry etc.? The money trail from traditional fossil fuel based industry needing to reinvest a portion of profits in new plant and machinery, diversify their activities etc.?

The "money trail" from pursuing measures to combat climate change is not the short term fast earner that investors prefer.... its more an 'inverted money trail".

The question remains unanswered?

sammi, you're making the point yourself. One side clearly tries to influence policy to meet its goal, which is making money. But no one ever questions those on the other side. What is their agenda? What is their motivation? Where does their funding come from? And who are "they?"

And I disagree...there many people making money in the short term.
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post #96 of 111
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Follow the money trail Sammi. Isn't that how it always works?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

And I disagree...there many people making money in the short term.

Here's an easy quiz: What multinational company writes off, every year, by far, the largest Congressional lobbying expenses (tens of millions of dollars every year)?

Hints:

1. It's the US's largest manufacturer of wind turbines and related equipment
2. It's planning the world's largest factory to manufacture solar panels
3. Despite having billions in US revenue, it's been widely criticized for paying zero US taxes

That's just one company. There are thousands of smaller ones capitalizing on the save-the-Earth hysteria.

Follow the money, indeed. It always works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Quite simply, it's a power grab. It's an attempt to give governments more control over the individual.

My friends who work in government all lament the fact they're surrounded by freaks driven by a motivation to control others... a mental defect they never ascribe to themselves of course...
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post #97 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by john galt View Post

here's an easy quiz: What multinational company writes off, every year, by far, the largest congressional lobbying expenses (tens of millions of dollars every year)?

Hints:

1. It's the us's largest manufacturer of wind turbines and related equipment
2. It's planning the world's largest factory to manufacture solar panels
3. Despite having billions in us revenue, it's been widely criticized for paying zero us taxes

that's just one company. There are thousands of smaller ones capitalizing on the save-the-earth hysteria.

Follow the money, indeed. It always works.



My friends who work in government all lament the fact they're surrounded by freaks driven by a motivation to control others... A mental defect they never ascribe to themselves of course...

ge?
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
Reply
post #98 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by john galt View Post

Here's an easy quiz: What multinational company writes off, every year, by far, the largest Congressional lobbying expenses (tens of millions of dollars every year)?

Hints:

1. It's the US's largest manufacturer of wind turbines and related equipment
2. It's planning the world's largest factory to manufacture solar panels
3. Despite having billions in US revenue, it's been widely criticized for paying zero US taxes

That's just one company. There are thousands of smaller ones capitalizing on the save-the-Earth hysteria.

Follow the money, indeed. It always works.

You never heard of PR? Good PR is good business, and good business often means higher profits. And since this company not only pays ZERO taxes, but receives $billions in corporate welfare from the government/taxpayers, its only logical that they do *SOMETHING* with that mountain-range of cash... so why not pay for a little extra popularity (despite the probable cringe-factor on the part of its senior executives) by undertaking a (relatively) token effort at green technology?

As already stated: follow the money, it always works.

And JohnGalt: There's no hysteria here. What planet do you live on? Earth. It's your home, its the only one we've got. We can't bail out and head somewhere else. WE're each here for our allotted 80 or so year lifespan, then we're done... but our offspring lives on, and has to deal with our criminal irresponsibility.... thats *their* problem. Whats so "wrong" with a little effort at cleaning up our act for future generations? Maybe the Ayn Randian religion of "profit maximization at any cost" is too embedded within our culture to prevent us from turning our only home into a toxic landfill?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #99 of 111

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #100 of 111
Aside from the debate about climate change, can we all agree that pollution makes people sick and can even cause death? Even if our efforts to reduce emissions have zero effect on climate change, this is still something well worthwhile to improve upon.
post #101 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Aside from the debate about climate change, can we all agree that pollution makes people sick and can even cause death? Even if our efforts to reduce emissions have zero effect on climate change, this is still something well worthwhile to improve upon.

I don't think anyone has said that pollution is not harmful or should not be reduced.

But there seems to be controversy as to the definition of the word "pollutant".

For example, CO2 - a naturally occurring substance absorbed and emitted by plants and oceans - has been deemed a "pollutant" by the EPA.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #102 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I don't think anyone has said that pollution is not harmful or should not be reduced.

But there seems to be controversy as to the definition of the word "pollutant".

For example, CO2 - a naturally occurring substance absorbed and emitted by plants and oceans - has been deemed a "pollutant" by the EPA.

According to observation, atmospheric CO2 has been increasing, especially since the industrial revolution, and a further acceleration since automobiles etc. became ubiquitous.



The current proportion of CO2 relative to the other gases present in the atmosphere is about 0.039% (average globally). With the increasing quantity of atmospheric CO2, at some point, it will warrant the description of "an agent of pollution", as opposed a "naturally occurring material", (if it hasn't already). What might this proportion be?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #103 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Aside from the debate about climate change, can we all agree that pollution makes people sick and can even cause death? Even if our efforts to reduce emissions have zero effect on climate change, this is still something well worthwhile to improve upon.

I agree with that. The question is what we do, and how we do it.
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post #104 of 111
Thread Starter 
Wow. Al Gore, confronted by those stubbornly inconvenient facts, loses control. Listen for yourself (you may wish to keep school-age children and others out of range).

When zealots of all stripes are confronted with irrefutable reason, they often revert to type. In this case, a hysterical rant.
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post #105 of 111
The emperor has no clothes.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #106 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by john galt View Post

Wow. Al Gore, confronted by those stubbornly inconvenient facts, loses control. [URL="http://aspenjournalism.org/2011/08/05/al-gore-calls-bullshit-on-climate-propaganda/"]

It's not about losing control. It's about having dealt with this bullshit politically motivated snake-oil pseudoscience from the right wing for so long that he finally had the balls to call it like it is. I respect Al Gore more than ever after what he said.

 

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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #107 of 111
If I thought Al Gore had two brain cell capable of understanding the science behind global warming I might agree with you.
post #108 of 111
Willful ignorance is still on full display around here. Awesome!!!!
"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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"The selfishness of Ayn Rand capitalism is the equivalent of intellectual masturbation -- satisfying in an ego-stroking way, but an ethical void when it comes to our commonly shared humanity."
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post #109 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northgate View Post

Willful ignorance is still on full display around here. Awesome!!!!

Yeah, but at least they're paying for it through higher taxes-

"The United States has already tied its yearly record for billion-dollar weather disasters and the cumulative tab from floods, tornadoes and heat waves has hit $35 billion, the National Weather Service said on Wednesday."
~ http://thinkprogress.org/romm/2011/0...her-disasters/
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #110 of 111
"Brazil’s national electric company just wrapped up an auction for contracts with wind, biomass, hydro and natural gas developers. And for the first time ever, the price per megawatt-hour from the wind plants came in below the price for natural gas.

The auctions covered 44 new wind projects worth 2 GW of capacity. The owners of those wind farms signed contracts to sell electricity for 99.58 reais ($61.93) a megawatt-hour — about 6.2 cents per kilowatt-hour. The prices for natural gas projects came in at 103 reais per MWh ($64.48). The price difference isn’t staggering, but it marks a major downward pricing trend for wind, which was priced 19% higher on average in auctions last year.

~ http://thinkprogress.org/romm/2011/0...s/#more-302008
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #111 of 111
Feds Raid Homes of Solyndra CEO, Execs

Quote:
The raid and visits come amid increasing evidence the Justice Department and Inspector General are exploring whether Solyndra mislead the government in securing its $535 million loan in 2009 -- and landing a vital refinancing of that loan earlier this year. Beginning in March, ABC News, in partnership with iWatch News/the Center for Public Integrity, was first to report on simmering questions about the role political influence may have played Solyndra's selection as the Obama administration's first loan guarantee recipient.

Quote:
One of the lead private investors in Solyndra was an Oklahoma billionaire who served as an Obama "bundler," raising money during the 2008 presidential campaign.

Quote:
Energy officials have repeatedly denied allegations that Solyndra received special treatment, saying the selection process was even handed. Until two weeks ago, the Obama administration held out Solyndra as a model for its green energy program, which was devised to create jobs and spur investment in cleaner sources of energy. President Obama personally visited the Solyndra plant last year, and his Energy Department made it the first to win approval of a federal loan guarantee.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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