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Apple's iPhone is top-seller at 58% of AT&T, Verizon stores

post #1 of 106
Thread Starter 
A new survey has found Apple's iPhone is the top-selling handset at 58 percent of responding AT&T and Verizon stores.

According to BTIG Research (via AllThingsD), the iPhone is also tied for first with an Android device at an additional 20 percent of Verizon and AT&T locations. To conduct the survey, BTIG called 250 stores around the U.S. over the past three weeks.

The iPhone was most dominant at AT&T, where 65 percent of stores said the device was their strongest selling phone. 31 percent of stores responded that Android was their best selling phone, with an additional 2 percent indicating that the iPhone and Android were tied. BlackBerry was the top-seller at just 2 percent of stores and only 1 percent of stores said a Windows Phone device was their top seller.

At AT&T, there were actually a handful of stores that mentioned a BlackBerry and a Windows Phone as the top seller in their store. We never got that response from any of the Verizon stores, which have dated versions of the BlackBerry, said BTIG analyst Walter Piecyk.

At Verizon wireless, 51 percent of responding stores said their iPhone was the best-selling device. Another 38 percent said iPhone and Android were tied, and 11 percent said a 4G LTE Android phone performed better.



The iPhone 4 arrived on Verizon in February as the largest device launch in the carrier's history. Analysts suspect, however, that the launch was partially muted because customers hoping to switch are either locked in contracts or waiting for a new iPhone model.

According to a report earlier this month, HTC could briefly take the top spot on AT&T and Verizon this summer before Apple launches the iPhone 5. The handset manufacturer's Thunderbolt and Inspire 4G models are said to be the second most popular handsets at Verizon and AT&T respectively, behind only the iPhone 4. It has been suggested that Apple may have given the rival manufacturer a window of opportunity by not introducing a new iPhone in June as it has in years past.

Last month, retail checks by Canaccord Guenuity found that the iPhone 3GS and first-generation iPad continue to outsell some newer Android products. Some AT&T stores reported that the $49 Phone 3GS outsold newer handsets such as the HTC Inspire and Motorola Atrix.

Apple had record sales of 18.65 million iPhones last quarter, buoyed in part by 2.2 million iPhone sales on the Verizon network.
post #2 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

At AT&T, there were actually a handful of stores that mentioned a BlackBerry and a Windows Phone as the top seller in their store..."

They forgot to mention that the margin of error for the survey was "a handful of stores."

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #3 of 106
It's just something to read when we're bored. These numbers don't mean anything and won't affect ios or android's success. Ultimately, only apple, htc, samsung, etc., knows how many phones they've sold. Any report elsewhere is just for kicks.

As an apple share holder since they were below $100, I'm on the fence whether to sell and claim my winnings or continue to ride it just a bit longer. My gut feelings tell me to wait awhile longer.
post #4 of 106
The good thing here is we are not talking about iPhone v’s all android, we are talking about iPhone v’s a single phone from a single make (per comparison).

From allthingsd.com

Quote:
Of the Verizon stores surveyed, 51 percent said the iPhone was their top-seller and an additional 38 percent said it was tied for first with a rival Android device, typically the Samsung Droid Charge or the HTC Thunderbolt.

This is great news for HTC, Samsung and android in general. Just going from strength to strength.
post #5 of 106
As more and more people have their upgrade eligibility come up, they buy iPhones, then their friends see it and they do the same. RIM is losing more of a share than android, but at least those new converts go to iOS vs android. Enterprises too are replacing blackberries for iPhones around here.

....and since iPhones will be available on all carriers soon, the surge will be even higher.
post #6 of 106
I anticipate a steady drop in Android marketshare upon the release of iOS5 and iPhone 5, aided by the addition of Sprint and T-Mobile carrying the phone... until iPhone hits its saturation point.
post #7 of 106
It's interesting that the comparison is longer iOS vs. Android. In other words, the world is conceding that Android has won the OS war.

Now it's device against device. It's great the iPhone is mostly tops. But the fact that it's neck-and-neck against Samsung Charge or HTC Thunderbolt is a sign to rejoice for the latter two, not for Apple.

I think this survey is the harbinger of trouble for the iPhone line. IPhone 5 has to be a major renewal and not just a faster phone with iOS 5 as the killer feature. While software should be what counts, most consumers will not buy based on that because they cannot fully appreciate the software while comparing one phone against another. Furthermore, Android can outpace iOS 5 with their next release. So, the hardware of iP5 must be compelling. Must. http://bit.ly/kNsy4V
post #8 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

It's interesting that the comparison is longer iOS vs. Android. In other words, the world is conceding that Android has won the OS war.

Now it's device against device. It's great the iPhone is mostly tops. But the fact that it's neck-and-neck against Samsung Charge or HTC Thunderbolt is a sign to rejoice for the latter two, not for Apple.

I think this survey is the harbinger of trouble for the iPhone line. IPhone 5 has to be a major renewal and not just a faster phone with iOS 5 as the killer feature. While software should be what counts, most consumers will not buy based on that because they cannot fully appreciate the software while comparing one phone against another. Furthermore, Android can outpace iOS 5 with their next release. So, the hardware of iP5 must be compelling. Must. http://bit.ly/kNsy4V

IMO iPhone 5 will surge like all past releases, then lose big time to android. What apple need is a cheaper alternative. If rumours of two iPhones are true, then we may see some very interesting changes in the next 12 months. There are a lot of people who are put off iPhone because of price. With android they can go for a high end, mid range and low end phone (personally cant imagine apple ever releasing a low end phone)

Further good news for Android is most java patent claims by oracle have been thrown out, and the judge in the Amazon "appstore" case indicated that apple will "probably" lose the case.
post #9 of 106
The headline should read "Samsung and HTC outselling iPhones in 1/3 of the stores" http://bit.ly/j93Lfk
post #10 of 106
Amazing any year old device is outselling any new device coming to market .The next iPhone will likely wipe the floor with its competitors, especially on Verizon.
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post #11 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

It's interesting that the comparison is longer iOS vs. Android. In other words, the world is conceding that Android has won the OS war.

Now it's device against device. It's great the iPhone is mostly tops. But the fact that it's neck-and-neck against Samsung Charge or HTC Thunderbolt is a sign to rejoice for the latter two, not for Apple.

I think this survey is the harbinger of trouble for the iPhone line. IPhone 5 has to be a major renewal and not just a faster phone with iOS 5 as the killer feature. While software should be what counts, most consumers will not buy based on that because they cannot fully appreciate the software while comparing one phone against another. Furthermore, Android can outpace iOS 5 with their next release. So, the hardware of iP5 must be compelling. Must. http://bit.ly/kNsy4V

No one makes money off Android (except perhaps the carriers). The chase for market share is a fool's game.
post #12 of 106
Initially there was a degree of notoriety in owning an iPhone. Now it seems everyone has one. Not because they are seeking notoriety, but because the iPhone is among the greatest products ever brought to market.
post #13 of 106
This is a SINGLE device we are talking about. A single android device vs. iPhone 4. And 38% of Verizon stores and 31% of AT&T stores said a SINGLE Android device is outselling the iPhone 4. WOW. That would have been unheard of a year ago. And when you add the many android devices for sale at these stores, it is no wonder that Android is outselling the iPhone by 3 to 1.
post #14 of 106
When did the comparison become a SINGLE Android device vs. the iPhone 4. Everyone knows that the Android ecosystem has MANY devices. So it would have been better to ask the stores not what is their best SINGLE selling phone, but in totality, which ecosystem is selling best. But then again we already know that answer from IDN and Canalys and Gartner and Nielsen and Comscore as they all show Android is outselling iOS by more than 2:1 and close to 3:1
post #15 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

When did the comparison become a SINGLE Android device vs. the iPhone 4. Everyone knows that the Android ecosystem has MANY devices. So it would have been better to ask the stores not what is their best SINGLE selling phone, but in totality, which ecosystem is selling best. But then again we already know that answer from IDN and Canalys and Gartner and Nielsen and Comscore as they all show Android is outselling iOS by more than 2:1 and close to 3:1

Sure, of course if we compare the iOS ecosystem with the android ecosystem rather than comparing it to just the phones, then iOS is ahead.

Apple hit 200mil iOS device (iPhone/iPad/iPod Touch) in Jun, Google hit 100mil in Mayl
post #16 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nairb View Post

What apple need is a cheaper alternative.

It has one, the 3GS.
post #17 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

When did the comparison become a SINGLE Android device vs. the iPhone 4. Everyone knows that the Android ecosystem has MANY devices.

For as long as I can remember.

If you want to compare the 'ecosystem' then the fair comparison would be to iOS. Even though not relevant to this survey, we know what those numbers are like..... And, Apple actually makes a ton of money off those things too, which you can't say for Android.
post #18 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

No one makes money off Android (except perhaps the carriers). The chase for market share is a fool's game.

Really? Someone should tell the HTC and Samsung accountants they have got their numbers all wrong. HTC made a profit of $0.5B in the Q4 of 2010 alone. I'd love to be a fool in that game. Many, many companies are making money off Android, although not as nearly as much as Apple making money off iDevices.
post #19 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

For as long as I can remember.

If you want to compare the 'ecosystem' then the fair comparison would be to iOS. Even though not relevant to this survey, we know what those numbers are like..... And, Apple actually makes a ton of money off those things too, which you can't say for Android.

Will people stop saying Android is not making money? Just because Apple is making the most profits does not mean everyone is losing their shirts. Gawd, get your facts right and I'm not talking about reading each other's comments, or Gruber's "somewhat" biased blog.
post #20 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

It has one, the 3GS.

That's not enough. If they are serious about competition and not just owning the high end sector (which of course is quite profitable), they need to have two different phones, with different but equally compelling feature sets, released at different times of the year. Once upon a time, the iPod and the Nano were released at different times. But they wrapped up that market and could simplify product release schedules, particularly to make room in the calendar for other products. The iPhone is in a far more competitive market. So they don't just need more than one phone, they need to release them at different times so that the iPhone line is constantly in people's mind. Even if iOS is truly superior in every way (which it is not), one phone will be beat them all.
post #21 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Really? Someone should tell the HTC and Samsung accountants they have got their numbers all wrong. HTC made a profit of $0.5B in the Q4 of 2010 alone. I'd love to be a fool in that game. Many, many companies are making money off Android, although not as nearly as much as Apple making money off iDevices.

I wouldn't say "Many, many", I would say "Some"...are making good profits from Android.

Of course, pending royalties that will very likely be owed to Nokia will cut into that, and if Oracle wins vs Android then we may end up seeing a much reduced profitiability for those manufacturers.

This leaves out the possibilities of Apples iphone patents requiring additional royalties on top of these cases, as I am unsure of how realistic those are of being upheld.

Either way, I think the chances that profits for android phone manufacturers are going to take a significant hit are very high.
post #22 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

Sure, of course if we compare the iOS ecosystem with the android ecosystem rather than comparing it to just the phones, then iOS is ahead.

Apple hit 200mil iOS device (iPhone/iPad/iPod Touch) in Jun, Google hit 100mil in Mayl

Is iPod Touch a phone??? Is iPad a phone??? Try to stick to SMARTPHONES ecosystems... you know iPhone, iPhone3G, iPhone3gs, iPhone4. When the iPad and iPod can be classified as a phone, you welcome to add them.
post #23 of 106
A year ago, and with the 3GS no less, you would have been called crazy to have said that a SINGLE Android phone was outselling the iPhone in 31% of AT&T stores. 100% complete loon. And it goes to show you that Android growth is actually accelerating... was outselling the iPhone by 2:1 and now is outselling it by close to 3:1... Android growth is simply amazing...
post #24 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Really? Someone should tell the HTC and Samsung accountants they have got their numbers all wrong. HTC made a profit of $0.5B in the Q4 of 2010 alone. I'd love to be a fool in that game. Many, many companies are making money off Android, although not as nearly as much as Apple making money off iDevices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Will people stop saying Android is not making money? Just because Apple is making the most profits does not mean everyone is losing their shirts. Gawd, get your facts right and I'm not talking about reading each other's comments, or Gruber's "somewhat" biased blog.

Would love to see a link to an original data source (i.e., not some news story, especially in a tech outlet) to Android profits for HTC and Samsung.

Otherwise, it's all speculation. Which is what it's mostly been, except for the iPhone (for which you can easily look up Apple's segment data).
post #25 of 106
Let me get this out of the way: I believe that something on the order of 80% of all Android sales are not because the user wants an Android, but could not get an iPhone. Those users then upgraded to newer Android models due to lock-in.

Thus, had Apple shipped CDMA on Verizon from the start, I believe they would utterly dominate smartphone sales in the US.

How do I support this bold claim? It's very simple. Simply read the Canadian numbers:

http://www.mobileattack.com/general/...osite-from-us/

In Canada, every carrier had the iPhone once the 3GS came out. This was before Android had managed to garner any market share, so before there could be any lock-in issues. The first smartphone they could buy was RIM, so they continue to lead, followed closely by Apple, followed at a very very distant third by Android.

I cannot see any reason that the same numbers would not hold in the US had the market developed the same way. My feeling is that 15% of the market simply will not by Apple under any circumstances, and everyone else will if given the chance.

Apple blew it, no matter how much AT&T gave them.
post #26 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

It's interesting that the comparison is longer iOS vs. Android. In other words, the world is conceding that Android has won the OS war.

Now it's device against device. It's great the iPhone is mostly tops. But the fact that it's neck-and-neck against Samsung Charge or HTC Thunderbolt is a sign to rejoice for the latter two, not for Apple.

I think this survey is the harbinger of trouble for the iPhone line. IPhone 5 has to be a major renewal and not just a faster phone with iOS 5 as the killer feature. While software should be what counts, most consumers will not buy based on that because they cannot fully appreciate the software while comparing one phone against another. Furthermore, Android can outpace iOS 5 with their next release. So, the hardware of iP5 must be compelling. Must. http://bit.ly/kNsy4V

I dont think this is the case. Say what you want, but the iPhone 5 actually doesn't have to be all that compelling. On specs alone there are already SEVERAL phones on every carriers that "should" = a better phone than the iphone.

Yet the iPhone, at around a year old, is still the top selling phone. Apple has likely lost the smartphone OS marketshare lead forever (did it ever lead BTW? ) but to think they are in danger at this point is ludicrous.

The Iphone 5 will have a huge surge, and the iP4 will continue to sell extremely well along side it. If Apple also releases a cheap iPhone for prepaid and $0 on contract, they will hit a sector they haven't touched yet as well.

The Iphone is firmly entrenched at this point. The iPhone 5 doesn't need LTE, and doesn't need to be a radical redesign either.

It's already a hit. They will probably sell between 70-80 million of them, while seilling another 20-30 million iphone 4's. Thats the reality.
post #27 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz View Post

Let me get this out of the way: I believe that something on the order of 80% of all Android sales are not because the user wants an Android, but could not get an iPhone. Those users then upgraded to newer Android models due to lock-in.

Thus, had Apple shipped CDMA on Verizon from the start, I believe they would utterly dominate smartphone sales in the US.

How do I support this bold claim? It's very simple. Simply read the Canadian numbers:

http://www.mobileattack.com/general/...osite-from-us/

In Canada, every carrier had the iPhone once the 3GS came out. This was before Android had managed to garner any market share, so before there could be any lock-in issues. The first smartphone they could buy was RIM, so they continue to lead, followed closely by Apple, followed at a very very distant third by Android.

I cannot see any reason that the same numbers would not hold in the US had the market developed the same way. My feeling is that 15% of the market simply will not by Apple under any circumstances, and everyone else will if given the chance.

Apple blew it, no matter how much AT&T gave them.

Actually I don't see any evidence of lock-in, or "stickiness" in Android.
post #28 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcoz View Post

The Iphone 5 will have a huge surge

Something else to consider...
http://www.investorplace.com/46718/a...d-google-goog/
post #29 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

Is iPod Touch a phone??? Is iPad a phone??? Try to stick to SMARTPHONES ecosystems... you know iPhone, iPhone3G, iPhone3gs, iPhone4. When the iPad and iPod can be classified as a phone, you welcome to add them.

iOS is a mobile OS, and so is Android.

They aren't SMARTPHONE OS's.......this is particulaly important because it MATTERS to developers, which contributes to the overall ecosystem.

So even if you don't want it to be included in your little comparison, it does matter, and it does contribute to what the big picture is regarding the state of iOS and Android...and all other mobile OS as well.
post #30 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

Is iPod Touch a phone??? Is iPad a phone??? Try to stick to SMARTPHONES ecosystems... you know iPhone, iPhone3G, iPhone3gs, iPhone4. When the iPad and iPod can be classified as a phone, you welcome to add them.

Apparently, being able to make video and VOIP calls doesn't count as being a phone? iPads and iPods aren't listed as "smartphones", but they can still make calls using Skype and other VOIP services, plus vid calls with Facetime, they just happen to be dependent upon an internet connection, vice a cell tower.

If you like Android, you'll manipulate stats to show how Android-based phones outsell the single iPhone by 2:1 or 3:1.
If you like Apple, you can show that iOS in total outsells Android 2:1.
Both are correct. It's easy to manipulate stats though. The only stat of import lately though is the loss of Anroid marketshare in the U.S. If that continues for a second straight quarter, Android using manufacturers may start to get nervous... if they aren't already from the tons of money they are losing in the tablet arena.
post #31 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

Something else to consider...
http://www.investorplace.com/46718/a...d-google-goog/

What, the economy in general, and peoples willingness to spend on a new smartphone?

I hope thats what you were referring to, because it was the only thing even remotely relevant in that mess.

I doubt we will see much of an impact, people these days are pretty good at having thier priorities out of whack. Some kid just sold a kidney for an ipad.

I stand by what I said before, the iPhone 5 will be a rousing success.
post #32 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Really? Someone should tell the HTC and Samsung accountants they have got their numbers all wrong. HTC made a profit of $0.5B in the Q4 of 2010 alone. I'd love to be a fool in that game. Many, many companies are making money off Android, although not as nearly as much as Apple making money off iDevices.

How do you jump from HTC making a measly $500 million to that being profit directly from Android? There are plenty of ways that company can put off debts or cut corners so they can show some modicum of profit to investors by the end of the quarter. Based on their previous efforts, the reason they and others have had to cling to Android, and even Dell saying it's cheaper to pay WP7 licensing than to use the free Android I'm stumped at how you can say that Android is the reason HTC turned a slight profit last quarter.
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post #33 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcoz View Post

iOS is a mobile OS, and so is Android.

They aren't SMARTPHONE OS's.......this is particulaly important because it MATTERS to developers, which contributes to the overall ecosystem.

So even if you don't want it to be included in your little comparison, it does matter, and it does contribute to what the big picture is regarding the state of iOS and Android...and all other mobile OS as well.

AT&T does not sell iPods (or even iPad WiFi). Verizon does not sell iPods (or even iPad WiFi). Try to stick to phones when you are comparing what phone companies sell.
post #34 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

AT&T does not sell iPods (or even iPad WiFi). Verizon does not sell iPods (or even iPad WiFi). Try to stick to phones when you are comparing what phone companies sell.

I do, chief.

I am just saying that it is not an entirely irrrelevant point in this thread, considering the point many are trying to make about Android in general based on just smartphone sales.
post #35 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Will people stop saying Android is not making money? Just because Apple is making the most profits does not mean everyone is losing their shirts. Gawd, get your facts right and I'm not talking about reading each other's comments, or Gruber's "somewhat" biased blog.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

How do you jump from HTC making a measly $500 million to that being profit directly from Android? There are plenty of ways that company can put off debts or cut corners so they can show some modicum of profit to investors by the end of the quarter. Based on their previous efforts, the reason they and others have had to cling to Android, and even Dell saying it's cheaper to pay WP7 licensing than to use the free Android I'm stumped at how you can say that Android is the reason HTC turned a slight profit last quarter.

They always seem to quietly slink away when one asks them actual data......
post #36 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

Is iPod Touch a phone??? Is iPad a phone??? Try to stick to SMARTPHONES ecosystems... you know iPhone, iPhone3G, iPhone3gs, iPhone4. When the iPad and iPod can be classified as a phone, you welcome to add them.

When Google excludes Samsung PMPs and various tablets from their 100,000,000 number, than Apple will exclude iPod Touches and iPads from their 200,000,000 number.

Stick to the reported PLATFORM ecosystem. While Android is winning in the sole category of "Market Share of smart phones", Apple is dominating Android in the areas of:

1) Market share of PMPs (what 10:1 ? ).
2) Market share of tablets (what 6:1 ? ).
3) Sales share of all handsets (20%).
4) Sales share of smart phones (35%).
5) Profit share of all handsets (55%).
6) Profit share of smart phones (65%).
post #37 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

They always seem to quietly slink away when one asks them actual data......

I kind of understood the Windows 'PC' v. Mac wars, but the Android v. iPhone wars make no sense to me. I think Android does a great job at filling the hole that Apple created when they created the iPhone.

From the way I see it, it's the natural order of things. It's like a drought in everglades. Alligators will dig holes down to the water line which will become pools from which other animals drink. Without the alligators these other animals would have fewer numbers. Apple has done this with the iPhone. If not Android some other phone OS would have taken up the back and bottom of the cell market to drink from the hole Apple created.
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post #38 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Will people stop saying Android is not making money? Just because Apple is making the most profits does not mean everyone is losing their shirts. Gawd, get your facts right and I'm not talking about reading each other's comments, or Gruber's "somewhat" biased blog.

It has a lone shinning star in HTC and a bit from Samsung. LG? Losing money. MMI? loosing money? SE? On the edge to losing money. Android is used by the industries biggest losers from a financial standpoint.

Then if you look at developer revenue, it is just as bad. Blackberry developers do better than Android developers. Lots better. Revenue per developer on Android is the lowest, by far, of any mobile platform on the planet.

For Android, as a platform, to survive it must find a way to reliably monetize its strengths for more than just Google. If Google does nothing to address the serious financial (and legal) issues within the Android eco-system, it will go down as the most interesting rise and fall of a platform in tech history.
post #39 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

How do you jump from HTC making a measly $500 million to that being profit directly from Android? There are plenty of ways that company can put off debts or cut corners so they can show some modicum of profit to investors by the end of the quarter. Based on their previous efforts, the reason they and others have had to cling to Android, and even Dell saying it's cheaper to pay WP7 licensing than to use the free Android I'm stumped at how you can say that Android is the reason HTC turned a slight profit last quarter.

I understand you're stumped. But I am not. By doing quarter to quarter, year to year comparisons, you can make some conjectures about trends. Can I be 100% sure that HTC's increasing profits and revenues are due mostly to smartphones? No. But if you study the data and their financial reports, only an idiot and a recalcitrant Apple zealot would say the conclusion is pretty compelling.

If you keep arguing the point, then explain to me how you say say how much of Apple's profits are from iPhone. Maybe they lose money on iPhones and make it up by selling T-shirts. Intelligence is a good tool. Use it if you have it.
post #40 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

They always seem to quietly slink away when one asks them actual data......

Slink away? Talk about premature ejac.
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