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Microsoft CEO pans Apple's Mac sales, admits 'very small' Windows Phone sales - Page 4

post #121 of 170
I think Ballmer is just hurt because the "I'm a Mac" campaign was such a success and their Windows commercials (with Seinfeld) just sucked!!
post #122 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by arivera71 View Post

I think Ballmer is just hurt because the "I'm a Mac" campaign was such a success and their Windows commercials (with Seinfeld) just sucked!!

He is hurt because the "I'm a Mac" campaign parodied Gates and not him.
post #123 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post

I guess what I am getting at is that some of you don't seem to realize how significant and cutting edge Microsoft is. Anyone would concede that Apple is wins on a retail-customer products, and that Apple is brutalizing MS in the mobile phone segment. But MS literally dominates the market for servers, and other enterprise applications. The XBOX has been an overwhelming success (not financially, but in terms of brand recognition).

Microsoft? Cutting Edge? Good one.

Oh, wait. You were serious? You're out of your mind. Microsoft hasn't done anything cutting edge for years. Their dominance in servers (if that is even true these days) doesn't change that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post

Moreover, while average PC is certainly cheaper than the average Mac, they share 99% of the same components (with the exception of the casing and Operating System).

That is, of course, totally false.

First, look at the iMac. Many of the components are not available on any other PC. The power supply, motherboard, case, display, keyboard, mouse, and OS all come to mind.

Second, there is the matter of specs. Even though the RAM (for example) looks like garden variety RAM, Apple consistently sets their specs well above industry averages. There are plenty of examples where generic third party RAM don't work as the motherboard requires good quality RAM which meets Apple's specs.

Finally, there's the matter of your silly attempt to lump all PCs together. Do you understand the difference between a $399 Walmart PC and your $3,000 hand-built system? Apple doesn't sell anything comparable to the low-end crapware systems out there. I don't think anyone ever said that Mac build quality was significantly different than the BEST PCs out there. But few people are buying those - most people are buying the junk ware systems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post

There is a reason why boutique computer builders only build Windows computers. There is a reason why my $3,000 desktop setup that I built myself runs Windows.

Probably several possible reasons:
1. You're not smart enough to use Macs.
2. You make your living on tech support which means that your income depends on Windows' failures and you feel some loyalty.
3. You're just simply a geek and love to spend time troubleshooting.
4. You're able to keep your Windows system running smoothly -- which is difficult and unusual enough that you like being able to brag about it.
5. Like many rabid Apple haters, you never even considered anything different.

So which is it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post

But I digress. It is plainly clear that Apple beats MS in profitability and in growth in the consumer market. That does not make MS a "low-end" company, nor does it mean that MS has failed to grow.

Actually, it's the fact that Microsoft has not grown significantly which demonstrates that Microsoft has not grown. Compare Microsoft's growth rate in sales, profitability, and market cap to Apple's over the last 5 or 10 years. It is the FACTS which show that Microsoft's growth rate is far below Apple's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post

As an aside, I own both an 11" macbook air and a 13" MBP. I have Windows 7 on both. I cannot remember that last time I even bothered with OSX. I readily admit that OSX is the most user-friendly OS on the planet, but I am far more effective on W7.

That's nice. Care to explain why anyone would care?

Furthermore, it doesn't change the fact that the information you posted above was all wrong.

Oh, and btw, if you really are using a MBA, you just destroyed your own argument. AFAIK, the only part of the MBA which is the same as generic PCs is the CPU. So much for your "Macs are 99% the same as PCs" argument.
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post #124 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I think iOS kinda proved that was wrong. That was certainly the old view, that interface needed to be localized and customized. I very much doubt that Nokia will go down that route again. At any rate the modern clean tile look of WP7 should work perfectly well across a lot of markets.

un-uh. first, iOS and its Android knock off offer a very simple top level UI - a grid of apps. that can readily be adapted for anything/anyplace just by simply adding more icons (i.e., specialized apps for a certain market). Apple of course does not allow any telco to customize the iOS UI beyond that at all. but Android does, which makes it the most flexible of all (it's open!).

second and further, Apple is not trying to make the iPhone all things to all people. its target is consumers with pretty good incomes. but Nokia's Symbian phones were all things to all people. that was the market - volume sales - that WP 7 would have to take over.

but the key idea of WP 7's tiles is grouping/cross linking of apps and web services/notifications by specific activities. that's a neat idea, but it was designed for a typical USA user situation. the differing popular local apps and services in India, Indonesia, Brazil, etc. - if they work in WP 7 at all (they don't now) - may not be tile-integration-friendly.

and MS has said that, like Apple, it will not let telcos cusomtize the WP 7 UI and put their telco services up front, which is how they make lots of money.

with all these complications i just don't see WP 7 working globally in Nokia's prior position.
post #125 of 170
[QUOTE=jragosta;1899422]Microsoft? Cutting Edge? Good one.

Oh, wait. You were serious? You're out of your mind. Microsoft hasn't done anything cutting edge for years. Their dominance in servers (if that is even true these days) doesn't change that.



The only way MajorCrap could become cutting edge would be to include a 10-pack of double-edge safety razors with every Windoze 7 purchase.
post #126 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

And, bottom line, Apple's market cap is significantly higher than Microsoft's.

End of discussion.

Ballmer is an embarrassment.

actually factually... market cap is not a bottom line... it's a market's perception on the bottom line.

the bottom line is and will always be: profit.

the more profit, the more market cap should be. and if market cap doesn't track, then the company can buy back the stock and become private again. Get rid of stockholder meetings, 10Qs etc etc, mutual fund meddling, public retirement fund oversight... all that crap.

As to your 2nd point. I dunno... I'm sure his mother loves him...

... unless she owns MSFT

;-)
post #127 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

In reality, he's using binoculars to see ahead of him the Mobile space accelerating away from him where Apple and Android are speeding off, and in the rear-view he's ignoring the traffic behind him that is gaining ground on him and shrugging it off as nothing.

I'm sure he thinks that once Microsoft releases Windows 8 which will be preferred by businesses and by most consumer tablet users that everything will change in Microsoft's favor. There are some that honestly believe that the first Windows 8 tablet will be much better overall than Apple's 3rd or 4th generation iPad because the Windows 8 tablet will supposedly do EVERYTHING by running a full desktop OS in a 3/8" thick case. I'm sure if it were that easy then Apple could just as soon recompile Lion and run that on the iPad or some new iPad Plus. However, I doubt it. Most consumers are looking for simplicity, not complexity on a tablet.
post #128 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

The problem MS has is that it's huge and businesses like Apps for iOS just wouldn't materially affect its bottom line, in the way that say 100mil WP7 phones a year would if it could only get people to buy them. The desktop is stagnant, and all the trends are against windows there. The rise of China. The rise of thin-clients. The rise of notebooks as primary computers. Notebooks are a little better, but there we see windows losing out to linux/chrome powered netbooks at one end, and MBP/MBAs at the other - and Tablets may end up eating a big chunk of that market.

Productivity software? Increasingly people find that google docs or iWork is enough, very few people really need the pivot table power of Excel or the monstrosity that is Word. Lets not even talk about Powerpoint.

MS can only choose between fighting on Apple or Google's turf, or becoming a stagnant 'cash-cow', that slowly dwindles into irrelevancy.

Are you trying to set a record for number of posts?

What other reason could you have for 1000+ posts in a month? Just come out of a coma?

post #129 of 170
Anyone who thinks the component design and parts in a Mac Pro, iMac, Macbook, etc., are the same as the standard generic PC motherboard you can buy from ASUS, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSi, etc., I can only assume:
  1. You've never studied IC Design
  2. You've never built a Clone PC from Barebones to Workstation/Server Class
  3. You don't mind fabricating as second nature
  4. You are paid to spread disinformation
  5. or you just repeat what you read from others.
post #130 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Anyone who thinks the component design and parts in a Mac Pro, iMac, Macbook, etc., are the same as the standard generic PC motherboard you can buy from ASUS, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSi, etc., I can only assume:
  1. You've never studied IC Design
  2. You've never built a Clone PC from Barebones to Workstation/Server Class
  3. You don't mind fabricating as second nature
  4. You are paid to spread disinformation
  5. or you just repeat what you read from others.

Are you saying that my mac mini runs rings around my bf's acer netbook is because of better components and NOT pixie dust and the ground up hopes and dreams of virgin unicorns?! I'm shocked!

But seriously, claiming PC's (from the cheapest to the most expensive) have the same guts as a mac is ridiculous. Heck, apple even uses better screens than most PC laptops I've seen. And look at Dell's current advertising campaign. They're making a big deal over changeable covers. Really?! That's important for a potential buyer?
2010 mac mini/iPad OG/iPhone 4/appletv OG/appletv 2/ BT trackpad and keyboard/time capsule/ Wii
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2010 mac mini/iPad OG/iPhone 4/appletv OG/appletv 2/ BT trackpad and keyboard/time capsule/ Wii
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post #131 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by iVlad View Post

And..... that's why Microsoft is dying. Sorry but Google took your place long time ago.

Not where its been.

Ballmer is lost. But keep on keepin on Ballmer.

Google and Apple are creating a new world order while you're still eating steak in the executive suite...getting fatter and sloppier with each bite.

   I am long on my shares of AAPL at $37.00

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post #132 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherGeoff View Post

actually factually... market cap is not a bottom line... it's a market's perception on the bottom line.

the bottom line is and will always be: profit.

the more profit, the more market cap should be. and if market cap doesn't track, then the company can buy back the stock and become private again. Get rid of stockholder meetings, 10Qs etc etc, mutual fund meddling, public retirement fund oversight... all that crap.

No, you're using only one definition of 'bottom line'.
http://education.yahoo.com/reference.../bottom%20line

The definition you are using is #1 - a financial statement term.

The definition I was using is #2 - the final result.

The final result (if you prefer) is that according to the evaluation of millions of investors, Apple is worth 50% more than Microsoft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Anyone who thinks the component design and parts in a Mac Pro, iMac, Macbook, etc., are the same as the standard generic PC motherboard you can buy from ASUS, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSi, etc., I can only assume:
  1. You've never studied IC Design
  2. You've never built a Clone PC from Barebones to Workstation/Server Class
  3. You don't mind fabricating as second nature
  4. You are paid to spread disinformation
  5. or you just repeat what you read from others.

And, yet, the same stupid claim is being made constantly by the Apple-hating trolls. Go figure.
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post #133 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Microsoft? Cutting Edge? Good one.

Oh, wait. You were serious? You're out of your mind. Microsoft hasn't done anything cutting edge for years. Their dominance in servers (if that is even true these days) doesn't change that.

We should be nice to MS, if WP7 had been 3 or 4 years earlier it would have been cutting edge. By MS standards 3-4 years late is bang up to date.
post #134 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwell View Post

Are you trying to set a record for number of posts?

What other reason could you have for 1000+ posts in a month? Just come out of a coma?


Hey, it's good to have a goal
post #135 of 170
Funny how Balls-mer is shouting about 350M new PCs per year when he just announced 400M Windows 7 licenses sold. Everyone thought that was so impressive yesterday. Now we see that it is really just over a year's new PC sales.

Since I doubt that the 400M number is excluding new PC sales, given that since Oct 2009 when Win 7 was launched, there have been about 600M PCs sold, that 400M is about 2/3 of that total. Assuming that 25M were Macs, the the same were Linux/Unix boxes, then the 400M number is not so very impressive. When XP was launched in 2001 the total new PC market was 130M, it is no wonder that Win & has outsold XP 18 months into its life. Perhaps they should look at share of new PC/installed base etc. I would think that XP was probably doing better in replacing WinME or Win98 since i don't think there were many who actively searched for WinME downgrade.

To recap, 600M PCs sold since Win7 launch, the same for non-Windows PCs, 400M Win 7 licenses, (of which let's say 50M were upgrades to people who could not wait for their next PC to get off Vista/XP), then MS sales of Win 7 is about 63% of new PC sales - yawn (a lot of XP on cheap netbooks and cheap laptops in 2009/10).

(600 - 25 - 25)/(400-50) =63% of new PCs shipped with Win7 since Oct 2009.

(suggesting 200M shipped with XP).

As of April/May 2011, XP was still about 8 points higher than Win7 in the installed base (38% vs 30%).

Mentioning that Apple takes 1/3 of PC industry profits off 4% of unit sales is just rubbing it in.
post #136 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleStud View Post

Steve Jobs conceded defeat in the "PC wars" 14 years ago. Ballmer still thinks it's the first or second inning. That said, Mac sales are growing at a rabid pace, and every time somebody buys their first mac, that's one less sale for MS.

One less sale for MS, again and again till Windows goes away and MS makes something better than Mac OS X.

Though this seems very improbable, MS will end up making something else and eventually get out of the OS department if it survives the death of Windows OS at all.

It's interesting that people don't upgrade Windows as much as they do their computers (most still use 10 year old XP! meaning people don't buy Windows itself much). A great majority of Mac users upgrade Mac OS X every time, till they want to, or have to upgrade their Mac. (Or simply buy more, different Macs)

In other words people like Mac OS X and want the newest and best, where as most Windows users don't get excited about newer versions of Windows because there just isn't much to get excited about. Malware and Windows problems are still there.
post #137 of 170
But were those very small sales at least "smooth"?
post #138 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

Apple is Hardware maker, not a Software maker

Actually, Apple is selling you an experience. The hardware and software (both of which Apple is a maker) are tools they use. Jobs had a very nice quote in this year's iPad 2 presentation about how Apple merges the best of technology and the liberal arts to create great products.
post #139 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by freckledbruh View Post

Are you saying that my mac mini runs rings around my bf's acer netbook is because of better components and NOT pixie dust and the ground up hopes and dreams of virgin unicorns?! I'm shocked!

But seriously, claiming PC's (from the cheapest to the most expensive) have the same guts as a mac is ridiculous. Heck, apple even uses better screens than most PC laptops I've seen. And look at Dell's current advertising campaign. They're making a big deal over changeable covers. Really?! That's important for a potential buyer?

Don't forget the unicorn tears. That's at least a quarter of the cost of a Mac.

BTW "The new iPad 3 Air. Now 25% more magical."
post #140 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcphoto View Post

It's like comparing Apples to Oranges, one Company sells well designed products at a premium price while other sells products to the masses at discount prices.

Yep. It's easy to have tons of sales when you make machines that are lucky to last over a year.

Also, how do the dollars stack up. and what's Windows marketshare etc.

It might be 10 to 1 Windows over Mac but there was a time when was more like 20 to 1. And Ballmer really wants us to think that he's not a tad nervous about that


Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post


But seriously, I think the "let's sell a super-cheap Mac to boost market share" plan would backfire. The reason being that for the last two decades, Apple has been a premium brand—the Apple logo means something.

Yep it means a machine that doesn't break down in two years. It means a machine that is backed by in store techs, trainers etc. Hate to break it to folks but your AppleCare etc barely covers the cost of a single repair. And certainly doesn't cover the cost of the staff to fix it. Not to mention the trainers etc for the free workshops. Where do you think that money comes off. It's part of what you buy when you buy the computer. Or the ipad or whatever. There's also licensing fees that many 'the components only cost' folks aren't taking into account. etc.

You pay a lot but you get a lot for your money.
post #141 of 170
Mango? Really?

Perhaps Steve Ballmer is planning an advertising tie-in with Chris Kattan's character from the Saturday Night Live. You know, to make a play for the young crowd, show them Microsoft is still as cool as ever.

The adverts will feature Steve and Chris in gold lamé hot pants -- Aarrrrgggghh! I've gone blind!
post #142 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwell View Post

Are you trying to set a record for number of posts?

What other reason could you have for 1000+ posts in a month? Just come out of a coma?


In this defence, I think Cloudgazer does post some of the most informed and interesting posts. I don't mind reading them!
post #143 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"We've got a lot of competition in the Windows business," Ballmer said.

Er... from whom? Who else sells Windows? I think Microsoft may be resting on some laurels here... the Mac will never outsell Windows because most of Microsoft's sales are automatic. And who really cares? Microsoft won that one decades ago - and they're still gloating over it? Sounds like Mr Ballmer's company needs a dose of Vitamin V...
post #144 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by fearless View Post

Er... from whom? Who else sells Windows? I think Microsoft may be resting on some laurels here... the Mac will never outsell Windows because most of Microsoft's sales are automatic. And who really cares? Microsoft won that one decades ago - and they're still gloating over it? Sounds like Mr Ballmer's company needs a dose of Vitamin V...

MS uses windows to mean PC, they've had the monopoly so long that they've lost the ability to distinguish, and yes the competition is actually significant. Obviously there's Apple and Linux taking an increasingly large segment of laptops, even without tablets being counted as PCs. Linux and variants are even starting to take corporate desktop seats, especially in call centres and the like. I'm not sure what is going on in the server room these days, but I presume Linux is slowly taking share there too.

What's really hurting though is that MS is being hammered in the browser space
( see for instance http://gs.statcounter.com/ ). The loss of the IE monopoly and the inexorable rise of Webkit powered browsers is what is allowing all these other attacks to take place. MS knew the risk which is why it killed off netscape in the 90s, but the DoJ wouldn't stand for it again, and besides the web community has grown wiser to MS-style 'embrace & extend'.

The Windows monopoly is a lot more vulnerable than it was, hence all the chest thumping.
post #145 of 170
To all those saying MS can't innovate I have a few items for you:
Kinect http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/06/mf_kinect/
Surface http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx
Photosynth http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx

And MS crushes Apple in the business enterprise space. MS knows how to handle big corporate customers. Apple does not - see the recent FCP fiasco.

I completely agree that MS could be so much more with a more tech-savvy instead of business-savvy leader. But they are not headed to bankruptcy any time soon.

- Jasen.
post #146 of 170
Microsoft did not actually sell any computers.
post #147 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by sagan_student View Post

I personally would never go without my magic trackpad. It's been over a year sans mouse and am loving it. You should really give it a good go.

It's so great that I tried changing my user name to anonytrackpad.
post #148 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1 View Post

To all those saying MS can't innovate I have a few items for you:
Kinect http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/06/mf_kinect/
Surface http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx
Photosynth http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en/us/default.aspx

Innovation doesn't just mean throwing technology out, it means making technology take. MS has on occasion innovated, but I wouldn't consider any of those good examples of it. Oh and your last hyperlink is wrong
post #149 of 170
Even the most casual observer will note that everyone listens when Steve Jobs speaks, but nobody cares what Blowhard Ballmer says.
post #150 of 170
Steve Ballmer needs to stop complaining about the other guy. The other guy is winning and Ballmer does not know what to do.

PC sales are 350 million because they cost $4 ... lot's of people are going to buy $4 PCs ... but where is Zune? Where is Windows Phone? Where is the tablet?

MS is failing in these other areas because they are following, not leading.

Memo to Steve Ballmer ... shut your pie trap and start innovating.
post #151 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

What a tard this guy is. He should be removed immediately. Every time he opens his mouth, he's blasting Apple and making excuses for Microsoft's failures. Apple's growth--particularly in this economy--is unreal. The more they succeed, the more Ballmer goes monkey boy-batshit crazy.

What's weird is it doesn't make sense. Ballmer is right...Windows PCs outsell Macs more than 10 to 1. Yes, Apple is kicking ass in the mobile segment. But why even go after "the other guys" like that? It's got to be some sort of psychological disorder. Otherwise you'd think Ballmer would lead M$ in a direction that compliments Apple's market rather than competes with it. M$ should focus on its core business...Windows PCs, Office, Exchange and the Xbox division. They should embrace the Mac success, expanding their Mac Business Unit. You want to offer a Windows phone OS? Fine...go for it. But focus on making apps for the already dominant market players...iOS and Android. M$ can easily have a symbiant relationship with Apple. They certainly don't need monkey boy up there constantly bashing Apple.

Problem here is - MS needs new markets. They simply cannot grow much more - any more - in desktops, servers, office software. Even if Apple would decide to ditch desktop OSX and completely move to phones/tablets/media players, MS would grow, what? Another 10% in US, 5% worldwide?

Like them or not, MS has reached pinnacle in what they are already good at. Now they can comfortably stagnate or try to conquer - or, at least, bite as much as they can - from newly emerging, still growing markets: smart phones, tablets.

I'm finding it amusing that so many people here think MS is chasing after Apple; they are not. They are chasing after markets where it just happens Apple is very strong, but they are not chasing those markets because Apple is strong there - they are chasing them because they are weak and can expand. Likewise, they were chasing game console market where Apple did not exist (at the time) but where Sony and Nintendo were strong... and when you thing of it, Apple is chasing that market as well, though from a bit different angle of approach.
post #152 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

Problem here is - MS needs new markets. They simply cannot grow much more - any more - in desktops, servers, office software. Even if Apple would decide to ditch desktop OSX and completely move to phones/tablets/media players, MS would grow, what? Another 10% in US, 5% worldwide?

Apple is rapidly acquiring the same problem, and they still have to figure out what to do with the rapidly burgeoning war-chest. Still, as problems go it's a good problem to have.
post #153 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

Apple is rapidly acquiring the same problem, and they still have to figure out what to do with the rapidly burgeoning war-chest. Still, as problems go it's a good problem to have.

True that... though, Apple has very strong position in the markets that are expecting to grow enormously - smart phones, tablets. In a way, they are better than MS - who has strong position in a market that will grow very little at best, stagnate at average or even shrink at worst - and who need to expand in market they haven't even make a decent breakthrough yet.

But at the end of the day, they both have surplus of money they need to invest where they can expand their market share and profit.
post #154 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronbo View Post

A long time ago, Jobs said, "We have to get rid of the idea that for Apple to win, Microsoft has to lose." Apple deftly stepped around Microsoft. And Microsoft is still looking at where Apple was.

Well, they are looking at Google as well. They were looking at Sony and Nintendo when they started Xbox thing.

And Apple is looking at RIM, Google, Samsung, HTC. Apple is also growing taste for gaming, so I'm pretty sure they are closely watching (and analysing) Nintendo and Sony.

And Apple, MS and RIM are together behind Rockstar Bidco who out-bided Goggle for Nortel patent portfolio. Enemies or best buddies..?

Trust me - they all look where others are. Only some of them do that a bit less obvious.
post #155 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by timgriff84 View Post

People say this a lot but seriously why? Right now MS is releasing better products more consistantly than they ever have. Even Bing has somehow become a success!

I tried to argue with that but I gave up eventually.

The fact is, however, that MS has released number of quality products in the years after Gates, compared to product being released in the same number of years before his retirement.

Also worth considering is that Vista was Gates legacy (after more than 6 years of XP), and Windows Server family didn't change much from 2003.

Now... SB is hardly likeable (though I'm finding his appearances amusing)... but then again, I'm finding SJ hardly likeable, even if very different reasons.

SB is not visionary, but he is wise enough to realise that and let more capable people do their job without much interference from his side. If you accept you cannot have man of SJ's talents in every company (and it probably wouldn't work for every company anyway), SB is doing fine job where he is.
post #156 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by tangential View Post

I think Steve is right 350 is bigger than 20.

The only areas where Apple leads Microsoft are Revenues, EPS, Market Cap, Growth Rate and Customer Satisfaction (not to mention Security and Stability as well.)

Does anyone really think any of those are all that important?

Actually Microsoft's customer satisfaction was higher than Apple's after Windows 7 was released; don't know how do they compare right now, but it wasn't long ago. But don't confuse MS customer satisfaction to Dell, HP, Asus... and other hardware vendors' customer satisfaction.
post #157 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilgto64 View Post

How many Macs that have been sold are still in use compared to how many PCs are in the recycle bin? And how often to people switch from Mac to PC?

If there was a reliable way to determine how many computers of each type are being used the "market share" charts would look very different I think.

And while Apple certainly needs certain amount of market share to ensure that third parties etc do not leave the platform - it is not the focus for Apple relative to profits. What MS may be missing is that each quarter their use base is eroded as more and more people switch to alternatives.

That is normal. Think percentages.

If 5% (1 in 20) users switch from Mac to Windows, Windows market share will hardly notice that. The growth will not be even close to 1%.

If 5% users switch from Windows to Mac, Mac market share will explode. It will almost double number of Mac users world wide.

When you have 5% of worldwide market share, it is so much easier to grow. When you have 95%, you simply don't have any more space to grow.
post #158 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeymantle View Post

Ballmer should look at partnering with Apple and have a Windows operating system installed on every Mac, as well as MS Office. Think about making a profit with apple instead of bad mouthing the company. At least hold on to the office monopoly.

I already said this, but just for the lolz... If every Mac would come with bootcamp-ed Windows and MS Office, MS would see 5% of growth sales worldwide. It is hardly something to write home about.

But if MS and Nokia play it right, they can see much bigger growth in mobile market.

It is not given, but it can be done. MS did it with consoles, taking on unquestionable leader Sony was at the time (with PS and PS2).
post #159 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80025 View Post

[In the address, Ballmer highlighted sales of 350 million Windows-based PCs in the last year, and used the number to criticize Apple without referring to the company by name.

"We've got a lot of competition in the Windows business," Ballmer said. "But we're driving hard with just in the last year alone 350 million -- 350 million -- new PCs sold. That might compare with numbers from other guys that are in the 20 million range. Now, 20 is too much, but 350, last time I checked, is a lot more than 20."}

When is Bawlbaby Ballmer going to realise that MajorCrap does NOT make hardware? It's time to separate the Windreck OS from the hardware. Apple makes the hardware and software. MajorCrap only makes softeare.

And yes there a number of companies that make PCs, and yes the sales of the PC hardware might be higher than a sole company that makes an integrated software/hardware product, but MajorCrap makes no computer hardware. So Bawlbaby can toute all the "I'm a PC" and "Make my home a PC store" commercials he wants. But he ought to really stop taking credit for the hardware.

Like they say, it maybe "Life Without Walls" but it's still a pane (pain).

Dude. Are you 12 or something? That name-changing is really lame.
post #160 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by _Hawkeye_ View Post

You forgot to add in the additional expense of all the virus software and subscriptions required to run Windoze.

You also seem to mistake cost for value.

You managed to discredit yourself with first sentence. Not bad achievement.

Microsoft Security Essentials, growing to be No.1 consumer AV in US. I believe they are already No.1 free AV, before Avira, AVG, Comodo Security. Free of charge.

Windows SkyDrive, 25GB of online storage for free. This will grow into MS cloud space for syncing desktops and mobile devices.

What subscriptions do you believe are required to run Windows, anyway?
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