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ITC rules HTC violating two of Apple's iPhone-related patents - Page 2

post #41 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

Apple dropped 5 voluntarily - presumably to speed the process, the other 3 were

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/5,481,721

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/6,275,983

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/5,566,337

(from foss patents)

So it's basically just Apple browbeating HTC with patents necessary for the creation of any modern competitive OS, not anything specific to iOS innovation. Well within their rights, but it's a bit too Microsoft-esque for me to get behind.
post #42 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

2012: two Apple products MIGHT be 4G. No others will.

Nokia has nearly half of all the 4G/LTE IP and didn't need to bid for the Nortels, so I think they may have something to say about that.
post #43 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoboTone View Post

Nokia has nearly half of all the 4G/LTE IP and didn't need to bid for the Nortels, so I think they may have something to say about that.

Say about what? Apple sells two products that will be upgraded to LTE. Their other products don't have anything to do with cellular telephony. My response had nothing to do with Nokia or anything they might think they 'have to say'.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #44 of 83
Oops, You said no others and I thought you were inferring out right exclusivity, rather than just apples products..
post #45 of 83
Nokia added those to a second lawsuit filed much later, which should tell you that wasn't the main grievance. It was the lawyers trying to up the game.

I read the original Nokia complaint and Apple's response. Nokia's initial grievance was strictly the standard body held patents. Apple always knew it was going to pay for those. The issue always was going to come down to how much Apple was going to have to pay.

The settlement certainly covered the second lawsuit that did involve other Nokia patents. However, I doubt Apple is paying any money for the licensing of those Nokia's patents. Apple publicly stated it licensed Nokia some of it's patents. My guess is the settlement of the smartphone claims by Nokia was resolved with a no money exchange for some of Apple's less important iPhone patents.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

Actually I believe Apple is also licensing some of Nokia's smartphone patents too, certainly Nokia's lawsuit against Apple wasn't all GSM patents. Hopefully the next results will shed some light on the royalties being paid.
post #46 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoboTone View Post

Oops, You said no others and I thought you were inferring out right exclusivity, rather than just apples products..

Ah, I get it. Though it'd be interesting if Nokia refused to let anyone use LTE.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #47 of 83
That would probably finish nokia off..
post #48 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaim2 View Post

So it's basically just Apple browbeating HTC with patents necessary for the creation of any modern competitive OS, not anything specific to iOS innovation. Well within their rights, but it's a bit too Microsoft-esque for me to get behind.

Bull.

Try reading more than just the title of the patent next time. These patents represent Apple inventions and are between 12 to 15 years old. Apple did it first, they patented it, and they deserve those patents in every way.

See that's the way patents work. If you think of something *first* you get to claim that idea as your own.

What's obvious *now* wasn't obvious when they were patented or someone else would have done it wouldn't they?
post #49 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Ah, I get it. Though it'd be interesting if Nokia refused to let anyone use LTE.

Except that would be classic "restraint of trade." Never happen.
post #50 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radjin View Post

Or maybe, each maker will be innovative and make their own OS and actually not be an Android clone.

Oh boy - just like the 70s when we had CP/M, Apple, Commodore, TRS-80, Compucolor, the S-100 boxes, etc, each with their own OS (though CP/M came closest to being multi-hardware; heck it was even on Apple 2's).
post #51 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

The settlement certainly covered the second lawsuit that did involve other Nokia patents. However, I doubt Apple is paying any money for the licensing of those Nokia's patents. Apple publicly stated it licensed Nokia some of it's patents. My guess is the settlement of the smartphone claims by Nokia was resolved with a no money exchange for some of Apple's less important iPhone patents.

Sure, most likely the whole thing just ended up with an agreement over GSM royalties, but still the fact is that we know very little about the settlement. It would be quite astonishing if Nokia didn't have at least a few significant smartphone patents, I guess we'll have to see if they decide to go after an Android maker with them.
post #52 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecphorizer View Post

Oh boy - just like the 70s when we had CP/M, Apple, Commodore, TRS-80, Compucolor, the S-100 boxes, etc, each with their own OS (though CP/M came closest to being multi-hardware; heck it was even on Apple 2's).

So? These are mobile devices. We have file standards, but we don't necessarily need OS standards. Having the code written in the same language would be nice, though, for developer portability.

We certainly don't need look-and-feel standards. Windows Phone 7 is the best thing Microsoft could have ever done in the mobile world.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #53 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

What's obvious *now* wasn't obvious when they were patented or someone else would have done it wouldn't they?

Wow, conclusive proof that all patents are valid! Wonderfully pithily wrong.
post #54 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Bull.

Try reading more than just the title of the patent next time. These patents represent Apple inventions and are between 12 to 15 years old. Apple did it first, they patented it, and they deserve those patents in every way.

See that's the way patents work. If you think of something *first* you get to claim that idea as your own.

What's obvious *now* wasn't obvious when they were patented or someone else would have done it wouldn't they?


Well said. Hey I admit my bias


I came across this link (apologies if it's been linked already) that seem to take a non partisan look at this. http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011...gement-of.html
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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post #55 of 83
I can see how one can read these patent titles in the Summer of 2011 and think "Duh!".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

You don't know that. No one knows that. And only two Apple products have any chance of having LTE at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

In 2012 Apple products will contain both 3G and 4G

Yes, we can easily infer that in 2012 there will be non-LTE '3G' connectivity. Just look at the devices that have '3G' that have yet to drop '2G' support.
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #56 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShepherd View Post

HTC not Google

No, Google is not device makers, thus is not affected by device related patents. Google just provide cash cows to sue in one organization, OHA.
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post #57 of 83
To the people gloating about this: None of us are patent lawyers or judges, and none of us really have any clue what any of this means in the long run, but let's just stop with the talk about Android being in trouble somehow. This isn't going to stop Android from spreading, and it's certainly not going to stop companies from using Android.

Realistically, we can expect some kind of payment and/or cross-licensing deal to happen, and that will be the end of it. Android will continue to operate as a cheap, utilitarian, good-enough, wannabe rip-off of iOS, and Google will continue to rake in billions by selling the information they gather from people's texts, emails, searches, and map queries.

This changes nothing.
post #58 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

What European carriers have 4G networks (or plans for them within the next few years) at all?

My post lacked a /sarcasm indicator

Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

For one thing, the new OS will include new languages, possibly including yours.




Just tea ... sing ...

Thanks, but I think most of them have Spanish or Catalan, which are my mother tongues, not English. So sorry for not speaking it correctly.
post #59 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

What European carriers have 4G networks (or plans for them within the next few years) at all?

Currently operational:
- Tele 2 (Sweden)
- Telenor (Norway + Sweden)
- Telia (Norway + Sweden)
- Sonera (Finland)
- Vodafone (Germany)
- EMT (Estonia)
- Lithuania (don't remember operator)
- Poland (Don't remember operator)

Near future commitments:
- Austria
- Belgium
- Croatia
- France
- Hungary
- Ireland
- Italy
- Luxembourg
- Netherlands
- Portugal
- Russia
- Slovenia
- Switzerland
- UK

At the moment though, LTE offers little improvement over HSPA+ in regards to bandwidth or delay. This will naturally change, but there is no real hurry in Europe to deploy LTE as the current service is in general, good. Voice call continuity and the lack of real mobile devices (except for some USB dongles) is the other issue that is not causing the operator's to hurry with LTE. The mass rollouts will happen in the next few years.

These are the reasons that I don't see Apple or other phone vendors bringing out LTE voice capable handsets "real soon". LTE at the moment is for data. Seamless voice 3G<->LTE takes time to deploy properly and iron out the bugs.

Regs, Jarkko
post #60 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

What European carriers have 4G networks (or plans for them within the next few years) at all?

All of them have plans, been planning for years
post #61 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

But don't forget HTC has an ace up its sleeve that it can use - it has acquired S3 Graphics, which has won the first round of judgement in suing Apple for infringement of its image compression patents.

S3 Image compression technology is used everywhere, you can find it in any GPU (desktop or mobile) on the market today, and all the GPU manufacturers license it, including Imagination Technologies, who make the GPU's Apple uses. S3 does not have any patents that Apple would infringe on, if anyone would be infringing, it would be Imagination. If S3 sued Imagination for infringment, that would affect Android handset manufacturers just as well as Apple, since Imagination chips are used everywhere. S3 has no patents that pertain to anything directly related to image compression in iOS, unless S3 thinks they have patents covering JPEG and PNG, which would -again- mean almost the whole world infringes on them.
post #62 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

These are very fundamental patents covering how a user interacts with a smartphone (or similar device), and consequently with a data network. It's not obvious how Google can code around this. Apple is also suing Motorola over the same patents.

But don't forget HTC has an ace up its sleeve that it can use - it has acquired S3 Graphics, which has won the first round of judgement in suing Apple for infringement of its image compression patents.

The whole point of patents was two-fold, to protect someones IP and foster innovation. Unfortunately the US patent system is crazy with triple damages for even looking at a patent. It needs overhauling to balance this once again and stop all the stupid tit-for-tat stuff.

At the end of the day Apple has borrowed ideas from the best, Jobs has even said that publicly.
post #63 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin.mcintyre View Post

All of them have plans, been planning for years

Considering AT&T has been calling HSDPA+ '4G', many European countries already have partial 4G coverage, for over a year already. For example here, in the Netherlands, the 4 major cities have had HSDPA+ coverage with network speeds up to 28 Mbps, since somewhere in late 2009. Strictly speaking, HSDPA+ is '3G technology'.

I always find it pretty entertaining how US folks are so obsessed over the acronyms put on the network technology they are using by the way. While they are all going nuts over '4G' today, in practice 3G network speeds over here have been faster than many of the US '4G' networks being rolled out. For example, I've been getting 7 Mbps (HSDPA) 3G speeds in major cities for over 2 years here already. All this time it has been the processing power of my phone that was the limiting factor for pulling in data, not the network speed.
post #64 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"HTC will vigorously defend these two remaining patents through an appeal before the ITC commissioners who make the final decision," Grace Lei, general counsel for HTC, reportedly said.

WTF? What kind of "lawyer" is this?

HTC are not "defending" these two patents. They are challenging the patents. Apple are defending them. You'd think a high-profile lawyer for a huge corporation would get this language straight.
post #65 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Bull.

Try reading more than just the title of the patent next time. These patents represent Apple inventions and are between 12 to 15 years old.

I wish I didn't read past the title, then I could at least retain an illusion about the situation. I assume you're 100% gung-ho about Lodsys sueing app developers using the same system well?

Quote:
What's obvious *now* wasn't obvious when they were patented or someone else would have done it wouldn't they?

Not necessarily. In case you've forgotten people exist outside the US and therefore outside the US patent system.

Not sure what your argument is, as your general conclusion is about the same as mine. It's only the tone which differs. Its well within Apple's right to attempt to shut down HTC using their age-old Platform-independent cross-licensed with Microsoft patents (some of them even explictly include MS Windows). Where we differ is that it just doesn't sit well with me.


Check out the table of HTC's infringements by FOSS patents:

http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011...infringes.html

So basically just by having a processor, screen, RAM and OS HTC are infringing. To me this is the equivalent of yanking out your opponents controller whilst playing a game.
post #66 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin.mcintyre View Post

All of them have plans, been planning for years

So none of them have a real 4G network built yet, right?

So what's the point of an LTE iPhone yet?

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #67 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20 View Post

To the people gloating about this: None of us are patent lawyers or judges, and none of us really have any clue what any of this means in the long run, but let's just stop with the talk about Android being in trouble somehow. This isn't going to stop Android from spreading, and it's certainly not going to stop companies from using Android.

Realistically, we can expect some kind of payment and/or cross-licensing deal to happen, and that will be the end of it. Android will continue to operate as a cheap, utilitarian, good-enough, wannabe rip-off of iOS, and Google will continue to rake in billions by selling the information they gather from people's texts, emails, searches, and map queries.

This changes nothing.

bingo, you get the pony, great summary
I APPLE THEREFORE I AM
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I APPLE THEREFORE I AM
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post #68 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOFEER View Post

bingo, you get the pony, great summary

Shit!! He gets a pony??!! Why didn't someone tell me there would be a prize for the best summary?! Damn! Did I miss a memo!

[ ... and I too thought it was a great summary. ]
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post #69 of 83
I doubt you know what the posters on this site do for a living. With that said, you are correct that none of us likely know the final outcome. Apple can appeal any patents that were ruled as not being violated by HTC. HTC can appeal the two it is claimed to have violated. Further, Apple recently filed a new complaint concerning 5 new iPhone related patents.

If HTC is ultimately found to have violated Apple's patent(s) after the appeal process, Android may still continue to spread, but HTC will have to stop using the patented ideas if Apple doesn't give HTC a license. Otherwise, HTC's products using the idea(s) will be seized at the border. That is undebatable. That no doubt would make Samsung and Motorola nervous.

What is interesting is how Apple will respond. Generally, if the plaintiff gets the upper hand at the ITC, you will quickly see a settlement in favor of the plaintiff. However, it is unclear if Apple is willing to settle for a licensing fee or will it take a riskier approach and continue to push for the ban on imported products. If the ITC ultimately rules in Apple's favor and the matter isn't settled, HTC's offending products will be banned as that is the whole purpose of the ITC.


Right now, HTC undoubtedly is likely willing to pay Apple licensing fees (as HTC is doing with Microsoft). I think Apple would be smart to take it. If Apple rejects receiving licensing fees, and ultimately loses, it will take some of the wind out of its conflict with Motorola and Samsung. Further, if HTC is successful with any patents claims against Apple with the ITC, Apple would have more to loss if the iPhone was banned from the US.

It might cost more to build in the US, but doing so would shut these ITC battles down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20 View Post

To the people gloating about this: None of us are patent lawyers or judges, and none of us really have any clue what any of this means in the long run, but let's just stop with the talk about Android being in trouble somehow. This isn't going to stop Android from spreading, and it's certainly not going to stop companies from using Android.

Realistically, we can expect some kind of payment and/or cross-licensing deal to happen, and that will be the end of it. Android will continue to operate as a cheap, utilitarian, good-enough, wannabe rip-off of iOS, and Google will continue to rake in billions by selling the information they gather from people's texts, emails, searches, and map queries.

This changes nothing.
post #70 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20 View Post

To the people gloating about this: None of us are patent lawyers or judges, and none of us really have any clue what any of this means in the long run, but let's just stop with the talk about Android being in trouble somehow. This isn't going to stop Android from spreading, and it's certainly not going to stop companies from using Android.

Realistically, we can expect some kind of payment and/or cross-licensing deal to happen, and that will be the end of it. Android will continue to operate as a cheap, utilitarian, good-enough, wannabe rip-off of iOS, and Google will continue to rake in billions by selling the information they gather from people's texts, emails, searches, and map queries.

This changes nothing.

Wrong, it changes everything.

Operating margin on Andriod smartphones is 10-13%, on Android tablets, it's 2-3%. MS is already getting $5/phone from HTC, they'll eventually collect it from every manufacturer.

Throw in the close relationship between Nokia and MS, and we can look forward to Nokia going after Android as well.

It won't take much to make Android too expensive for the manufacturers to produce.

There are 49 different suits active against Android, including Oracle's. Android will die the death of a thousand cuts...
post #71 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

I doubt you know what the posters on this site do for a living. With that said, you are correct that none of us likely know the final outcome. Apple can appeal any patents that were ruled as not being violated by HTC. HTC can appeal the two it is claimed to have violated. Further, Apple recently filed a new complaint concerning 5 new iPhone related patents.

If HTC is ultimately found to have violated Apple's patent(s) after the appeal process, Android may still continue to spread, but HTC will have to stop using the patented ideas if Apple doesn't give HTC a license. Otherwise, HTC's products using the idea(s) will be seized at the border. That is undebatable. That no doubt would make Samsung and Motorola nervous.

What is interesting is how Apple will respond. Generally, if the plaintiff gets the upper hand at the ITC, you will quickly see a settlement in favor of the plaintiff. However, it is unclear if Apple is willing to settle for a licensing fee or will it take a riskier approach and continue to push for the ban on imported products. If the ITC ultimately rules in Apple's favor and the matter isn't settled, HTC's offending products will be banned as that is the whole purpose of the ITC.


Right now, HTC undoubtedly is likely willing to pay Apple licensing fees (as HTC is doing with Microsoft). I think Apple would be smart to take it. If Apple rejects receiving licensing fees, and ultimately loses, it will take some of the wind out of its conflict with Motorola and Samsung. Further, if HTC is successful with any patents claims against Apple with the ITC, Apple would have more to loss if the iPhone was banned from the US.

It might cost more to build in the US, but doing so would shut these ITC battles down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoom View Post

Wrong, it changes everything.

Operating margin on Andriod smartphones is 10-13%, on Android tablets, it's 2-3%. MS is already getting $5/phone from HTC, they'll eventually collect it from every manufacturer.

Throw in the close relationship between Nokia and MS, and we can look forward to Nokia going after Android as well.

It won't take much to make Android too expensive for the manufacturers to produce.

There are 49 different suits active against Android, including Oracle's. Android will die the death of a thousand cuts...

This is all just wishful thinking. I'd be willing to bet that nobody here would be able to come up with a recent patent case related to electronics that resulted in a product being banned from import. It just doesn't happen.

What does happen is that the cases get settled via payment or cross=licensing and business moves on. Even if Android really does have 49 different suits lined up against it (though I don't generally accept a bunch of numbers being thrown around without links posted to prove the numbers are real), it's immaterial if the companies involved find they each have patents the others need, which they likely will since the patent landscape is such a murky mess.

Some other company will always have at least one patent you need if you're both in the same business, so they'll just wind up cross-licensing, and all this will have been for nothing.

There is absolutely no reason to think anything different will happen in this case, nor is there reason to honestly believe Android is going away due to any court case. I'm so certain, I'd stake my life on it.
post #72 of 83
Everyone forgets about NTC & RIM....
post #73 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20 View Post

This is all just wishful thinking. I'd be willing to bet that nobody here would be able to come up with a recent patent case related to electronics that resulted in a product being banned from import. It just doesn't happen.

Injunctions against importation or production do indeed happen.

http://www.patentlyo.com/patent/2006...tion_gran.html
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20070607/194145.shtml

You just lost your bet, how much was it for?

Quote:
There is absolutely no reason to think anything different will happen in this case, nor is there reason to honestly believe Android is going away due to any court case. I'm so certain, I'd stake my life on it.

Please don't kill yourself just cause you were wrong
post #74 of 83
deleted
post #75 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Has me wondering why Google didn't patent these:

5 things Apple borrowed from Android for iOS 5
http://www.betanews.com/joewilcox/ar...S-5/1307414477


Do you know (and if so, can you provide any evidence) that it was Google's to patent, or is it just another one of your endlessly passive-aggressive anti-Apple missives?

Sheesh.
post #76 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Do you know (and if so, can you provide any evidence) that it was Google's to patent, or is it just another one of your endlessly passive-aggressive anti-Apple missives?

Sheesh.

I doubt Google can patent these things. Like Cloud Sync, MobileMac has been doing this for years even longer than Google. So who should have the patent?
post #77 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Has me wondering why Google didn't patent these:

5 things Apple borrowed from Android for iOS 5
http://www.betanews.com/joewilcox/ar...S-5/1307414477


The only plausibly patentable feature there would have been the notifications system - the others all had huge amounts of prior art. As to why google didn't, I guess you'd have to ask them. They have around 700 patents so it's not like they never patent things like this, so quite plausibly there was prior art there too that I'm just not aware of.
post #78 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaim2 View Post

So it's basically just Apple browbeating HTC with patents necessary for the creation of any modern competitive OS, not anything specific to iOS innovation. Well within their rights, but it's a bit too Microsoft-esque for me to get behind.

It's unclear. At first blush the '721 patent is devastating and applies to any distributed object system, but that's clearly not true - as even the patent acknowledges distributed smalltalk existed already. It must therefore be more limited, and it's not clear exactly what that limitation is to a mere technologist such as myself.

At any rate, it's really hard to get behind any software patent ever. They are the dark side of the IP force.
post #79 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

It's unclear. At first blush the '721 patent is devastating and applies to any distributed object system, but that's clearly not true - as even the patent acknowledges distributed smalltalk existed already. It must therefore be more limited, and it's not clear exactly what that limitation is to a mere technologist such as myself.

At any rate, it's really hard to get behind any software patent ever. They are the dark side of the IP force.

NeXT has a series of Portable Distributed Objects Patents and so did Apple's Taligent. Smalltalk generically having Distributed Objects is not in question.
post #80 of 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoom View Post

Wrong, it changes everything.

Operating margin on Andriod smartphones is 10-13%, on Android tablets, it's 2-3%. MS is already getting $5/phone from HTC, they'll eventually collect it from every manufacturer.

Throw in the close relationship between Nokia and MS, and we can look forward to Nokia going after Android as well.

It won't take much to make Android too expensive for the manufacturers to produce.

There are 49 different suits active against Android, including Oracle's. Android will die the death of a thousand cuts...

This is (potentially) informative. Can you provide a link to a credible source where it states the operating margins of Android smartphones and tablets? By credible sources, I am sure you'd agree that they would have to be the companies themselves.

Isn't Apple the company that is sued for IP infringement more than any other? I might be wrong, but it would be good to know that Apple too is dying the death of (more than 49) lawsuits?
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