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Google's Schmidt: Apple responding to Android with lawsuits, not innovation - Page 3

post #81 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

Google doesn't have any patents on them.

Google has less than 500 patents, including stellar ones like the one on the doodle.

Last time I checked USPTO came up with about 700 assigned to them.
post #82 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07 View Post

+1

And I think Apple wouldn't mind too much if Android is just not an iPhone clone. If they're being successful by looking like BB I don't think Apple would mind that at all.
That said I don't have problem with Android in general. It has its place. What I have problem with is a company like Google who claimed to "be no evil.." yet...

Google isn't doing any evil, they're letting their partners do it for them. See, no moral problem.

BTW, great new case for the Samsung iTab, huh? What a bunch of friggin' copying wankers. You could be handed one of those tablets in that case and not know which product you're holding - which is exactly why these design infringement suit DO have merit. Instead of trying to do their own thing, they keep copying even more. Unreal.

Anyway, the OS side isn't any better - where it differs, it's generally more complicated and less polished.
post #83 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger View Post

Nothing personal so far? I'd disagree. To wit:

How was my comment disparaging Schmidt? All you did was repeat what I said essentially "we don't know other than being dismissed for a conflict of interest".
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post #84 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjthomps View Post

Seriously?

If someone ripped off Google and tried beating them over their head with their own intelligent property they wouldn't defend it?

Innovate? Why so they can copy more?

LOL

Vote: +1
post #85 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger View Post

There is always more to a story than meets the eye, even if you're personally engaged in the situation. Since we are all sidelines spectators here, I just don't see justification for the venomous passion. Instead, I worry about some of you. Are you unemployed? Do you have anger management issues? Sadly, there is no app for that.

Unemployed?! WTF??!!

What's wrong with the unemployed?

I think YOU have issues... but that's just my opinion.

[ ... and that photo of Schmidt does look creepy... ]

[ ... I'm fully employed... just in case you are wondering... ]
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post #86 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by spliff monkey View Post

If I'm not mistaken the average college GPA for a CEO is something like 2.8 or 2.6. So academically speaking they are neither the hardest working nor the most intelligent people. You can graduate from Berkley with a C allot easier than you could graduate with all A's at just about any school. I don't think SJ graduated from college and we all know Gates didn't either. CEO... toughest job to get, but the easiest job to perform.



Obviously none of us really know the details, but as I recall months after Schmidt was dismissed from the Apple board for a conflict of interest Android came out. It doesn't take much to put two and two together.

Google was working on a Black Berry like phone OS. Schmidt got to check out iOS (as a board member) and realized Google was heading in the wrong direction. "poof" the market magically gets a "free" OS that resembles iOS in many ways.

He abused his privileges as an Apple board member and used them to conduct "corporate espionage" IMO.

Schmidt has a Ph.D. What's your point, again?

Steve and Bill left school to start companies. Both of them had high marks when they left. What's your point again?

The arrogance of Schmidt as an acting CEO or top executive is well documented from his days at Sun to Novell and now Google.

He's very well aware of the line of ethics he toe-danced and that arrogance will be his downfall as a professional.
post #87 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrstep View Post

Google isn't doing any evil, they're letting their partners do it for them. See, no moral problem.

BTW, great new case for the Samsung iTab, huh? What a bunch of friggin' copying wankers. You could be handed one of those tablets in that case and not know which product you're holding - which is exactly why these design infringement suit DO have merit. Instead of trying to do their own thing, they keep copying even more. Unreal.

Anyway, the OS side isn't any better - where it differs, it's generally more complicated and less polished.

You mean this case? How could you possibly confuse this with Apple's case? How dare you accuse samsung of copying anyone!

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post #88 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrstep View Post

Google isn't doing any evil, they're letting their partners do it for them. See, no moral problem.

I'm talking about the company in general. Not the HTC case or any Android case vs Apple. The way it disregarded others' intellectual property (Oracle, for example) and privacy, to name a few.
post #89 of 228
If Google really wanted to support its hardware partners it would help compensate them for their legal and licensing costs. They're not doing that. Just like everything else they give away for free, it only comes with a bare minimum of support. That goes for end users and partners these days.
post #90 of 228
Wow! Google copies the iPhone and then has the nerve to accuse Apple of not innovating? What a fucking hypocrite.
post #91 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkichline View Post

Basically Google purchased startup Android in 2005. In 2006 Schmidt joined the Apple Board of Directors and was thus, very privy to the development and launch of the iPhone in 2007. At the same time, Google was furthering development of Android. After iPhone launched out of secrecy in 2007, Google launched Android, but now instead of having the Blackberry copying look-and-feel, it became a replica of the iPhone. They continued to work on Android, copying many of iPhone core features.

Finally in 2009, Schmidt "resigned" the board of directors, but Steve Jobs was very upset at the fact that Google decided to enter their market when they never thought twice about entering the search market.

So what Schmidt did was betray trust and non-disclosures in creating Android by copying Apple's years of research in the field.

You honestly believe Steve Jobs wasn't aware of what Google was doing with Android? And there's a claim by Apple that Schmidt violated NDA's? Apple management certainly hoped they wouldn't aggressively push Android as a mobile OS free for use. And Mr. Jobs probably was disappointed when they showed him their initial mockups and made it clear they were moving forward. But they were very open with Apple from all the reports I've seen, even inviting Apple engineers into the Google labs. And I'd be shocked if Mr. Jobs didn't pick Andy Rubin's brain for iPhone ideas. No, I don't think Schmidt was stealing from Apple. Steve Jobs would have failed Apple stockholders if he thought that was going on and didn't immediately remove him from the board. That he stayed on until 2009, when he voluntarily resigned, should be proof enough that he wasn't slinking around the Apple back corridors.

As for the original Google mockup that's mentioned every time this comes up, even Blackberry's don't look like Blackberry's from three years ago. It was an obvious choice to go with a touchscreen once Apple had shown it would be accepted by consumers. \ Surely you're not arguing that only Apple has the right to a touchscreen, or that every other phone manufacturer should have stubbornly clung to an old inferior interface. Big cans of worms. . .

So AFAIK, Steve Jobs has never said Eric Schmidt was stealing anything from Apple/doing things behind his back. It all came down to Google becoming a competitor and less valuable to Apple as a hedge against Microsoft. I'd imagine it was "do things our way or the highway".

Makes a better story to claim theft tho. . .
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post #92 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by spliff monkey View Post

you mean this case? How could you possibly confuse this with apple's case? How dare you accuse samsung of copying anyone!



shameless!

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post #93 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

It will be decades before we know what really happened here, if ever.


Sure, I'm getting carried away here, no problem admitting that. But to your point about taking Eric to court, they would never do it that way, even though he did what he did. They would first let the product (Android) fly or fail in the court of public opinion, study what was violated and then attack that. Apple still has business arrangements with Google and is likely to far into the future.

There was personal violation in the form of Erics dealings, but this is still business. While Apple isn't interested in licensing, if one of the remedies is getting money from the sale of every Android unit, they would take it. It would be a bit more than they would ever get out of Eric.
post #94 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlayer View Post

If Google really wanted to support its hardware partners it would help compensate them for their legal and licensing costs. They're not doing that. Just like everything else they give away for free, it only comes with a bare minimum of support. That goes for end users and partners these days.

Apple could also support it's developer's in their Lodsys patent suits by promising to pay their legal fees and compensate them for their licensing costs if it comes to that. It's really the same thing in essence, isn't it? I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for HP, Microsoft, Apple, or Google to jump in with offers for monetary support every time one of their licensee's sees a lawsuit.
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post #95 of 228
Funny coming from the guy who responded to iOS with theft.



LOL

The guy headed JAVA at Sun and *somehow* ended up with something exactly like JAVA.
The guy was on the board of Apple and *somehow* ended up with something that looks exactly like an iPhone.

This guy is laughable.
post #96 of 228
Someone please remind Eric Schmidt what Google's phone looked liked before Steve Jobs showed him the iPhone.
post #97 of 228
googles next product

smart cases for android
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post #98 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

I think that photo of Schmidt is creepy.

That's why they called him Creep Executive Officer. He's a creepy, psychopathic guy, the camera doesn't lie
post #99 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Schmidt has a Ph.D. What's your point, again?

Steve and Bill left school to start companies. Both of them had high marks when they left. What's your point again?

The arrogance of Schmidt as an acting CEO or top executive is well documented from his days at Sun to Novell and now Google.

He's very well aware of the line of ethics he toe-danced and that arrogance will be his downfall as a professional.

We agree and disagree?

I've gotten to known a couple of CEO's well over the years. They aren't the most impressive humans. (implying humanity in their spirit). My point is they are usually arrogant pinheads and not the hardest working or best at anything. Usually their "minions" or "underlings" as they like to call them are doing most of the hard work.

Not criticizing. I'm just saying grades don't prevent people from becoming CEO's and rather it seems better that they focus on being social butterflies.

How does the old joke go? What do you call a doctor with a C average? Doctor. So Schmidt has a PHD. Good for his resume, but I'm pretty sure his ascension in the corporate ranks had much more to do with who he knows than what he knows.
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post #100 of 228
It's a classic response from a free-loader to respond "why you coming after me from taking something from you, just make more!" It's like a child assuming that mom and dad are made of money. Until eventually you cut them off and say - go make your own!

I'm all for competition, but competition by copying, and competition by innovation are two different things. Schmidt/Google should take his own advice. Where was their innovation? They basically copied Apple's recipe and added extra icing on top.

That's the inherent problem with free-loaders - they seldom appreciate the hard work that goes into making and creating something. They assume it's all one big free-for-all, taking for granted the genius that may have came before them.
post #101 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger View Post

Nothing personal so far? I'd disagree. To wit:

Still insist nothing personal has been written here?

No one here knows exactly what happened. It's all hearsay. We do know, however, that Schmidt left the Apple board meetings on specific occasions to avoid conflict of interest. We also know that Schmidt only left the Apple board (either voluntarily or not) in 2009 and not earlier. Surely, if Apple felt so strongly about Schmidt acting unethically, they would have been rather dumb to keep him as a director for two years after the launch of the iPhone, particularly since Google acquired Android a few years earlier. In fact, the evidence suggests that Apple was not particularly smart in keeping Schmidt on. If indeed Google learned a few tricks via this relationship, shouldn't Apple shoulder the blame at least in part for missing the obvious? To repeat, Google bought Android in 2005!!!

There is always more to a story than meets the eye, even if you're personally engaged in the situation. Since we are all sidelines spectators here, I just don't see justification for the venomous passion. Instead, I worry about some of you. Are you unemployed? Do you have anger management issues? Sadly, there is no app for that.

Actually only the photo one is a personal attack, must have missed that. The rest are instead commentary on his public behavior which by definition is not a personal attack. You should also keep in mind then many people on this forum have a significant interest in Apple beyond being fans and consumers. These people are rightfully upset when someone like Schmidt "abuses" his position and then comes by a couple years later to try and point the finger the other way.

Look at your own comments through the prism you define and you will see something both amazing and sad. Suggesting people must be unemployed or havie anger management issue for participating in an Internet forum you participate in is priceless.
post #102 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by spliff monkey View Post

You mean this case? How could you possibly confuse this with Apple's case? How dare you accuse samsung of copying anyone!


http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=3476
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post #103 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

You honestly believe Steve Jobs wasn't aware of what Google was doing with Android? And there's a claim by Apple that Schmidt violated NDA's? ...

So, you're saying your boss, Eric, violated Google's NDAs?
post #104 of 228
Google, because it prospers from searching, does not respect intellectual property.
post #105 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

We will openly share your innovations.

All your innovation are belong to us.



- someone had to say it
post #106 of 228
Being an apple fanboy, I am laughing at you guys for defending them trying to coup up a monopoly. If you cant beat em, sue em.

Android has far more activations than iOS will have, but there are SO many more devices. I'll always choose an iPhone over android but lets be real here. These suits are bullshit. We need to fix the patent and trademarking system in the USA..
post #107 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Makes a better story to claim theft tho. . .

And yet, per Erics own mouth, Jobs gave him the mother of all tongue lashings for copying the Iphone, once Android was revealed. Eric was either at Burning Man or on his way at the time ...

If, as you claim, Apple was well aware of Googles 'borrowing' of the iPhone look and feel for Android before it was released, that wouldn't make much sense. But sure, the story is more nuanced than the simple theft. Making outrageous statements like Eric just did takes that nuance away.

Look at what Google is facing of late - Nokia going with MS, MS winning their license suit and now making money from every Android sale, Apple getting an initial validation in the HTC suit, tales of developers following the money to OSX users (this one rather anecdotal) ... Eric is out there defending his brand. And he is a poor choice for poster boy.

If Apple made money from every Android sale also, that would be OK. It's not what Apple wants, but damage has been done, so what other remedy is out there. They aren't going to shut Android down.
post #108 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

So, you're saying your boss, Eric, violated Google's NDAs?

You're such a funny guy Anonymouse. Every time you use that line of reasoning with me or someone else it cracks me up.

At least you lighten up the mood around here.
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post #109 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickmccally View Post

Being an apple fanboy, I am laughing at you guys for defending them trying to coup up a monopoly. If you cant beat em, sue em.

Android has far more activations than iOS will have, but there are SO many more devices. I'll always choose an iPhone over android but lets be real here. These suits are bullshit. We need to fix the patent and trademarking system in the USA..


fix the patent system so scumbag companies like Google/HTC/Samsung/Motorola can FREELY STEAL Apple's innovation? I Don't THINK SO!


You don't get to give away something you don't own GOOGLE.

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post #110 of 228
From the original article:

Quote:
Asked if Google would help foot HTC's legal bills should they lose, he said: "We will make sure they don't lose, then."

This seems like a pretty reckless thing to say, although not atypical for Schmidt. Google can throw money at litigation but they can't guarantee victory. If HTC loses I predict this statement will be used to paint Google as feckless and cavalier, and Google's partners will have to take any further assurances of support from the mothership with a grain of salt.

More generally it fits into a pattern of oddly unprofessional behavior on Google's part, most recently typified by their eccentric bidding for the Nortel patents. That slightly devil may care vibe may endear them to geeks, but for the people depending on Google to keep the lights on it must be a tad unnerving. It suggests that they regard success and failure as a kind of game. I'm pretty sure HTC doesn't share that feeling.
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post #111 of 228
Being inspired by someone else's work is fine. It happens all of the time.

Having inside knowledge of another company's plans and future products while posing as a "partner and board member" and then using that info to (cough) "compete" with them in the same space (cough) is despicable. The man is morally bankrupt and I hope that Google and their partners are forced to negotiate licensing fees for the IP that they ripped off from others.

BTW, I expect Apple to follow the same rules. If Apple is proven to have crossed a line where inspiration morphs into stealing another company's IP, they too need to license the tech. Live by the sword, die by the sword.
post #112 of 228
Has Google EVER actually been innovative and created something new?

They copied internet search from other search engines...

They copied maps from other map sites....

Gmail? copied...

Android? copied...

How do they think they have the virtue to assail Apple as not being innovative. Every computer and every smartphone and every tablet today is a direct result of what Apple created out of thin air.
post #113 of 228
Memo to Eric: Grow up.
post #114 of 228
This is so sad really. You guys think that these phones are copies? REALLY?

I've never used on that made me think "man this is as good as my iphone"

Lets all pay one company a licensing fee to make tee shirts, because one company should own the right. Lets me one company own licensing for laptops so NO ONE but one company can making portable computers. If anything, Apples inspiration came from PALM years ago. This is ridiculous you guys are agreeing with having another monopoly in the USA. I guarantee that HTC wins this time round.
post #115 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by FriedLobster View Post

Let me do it.

Remember Fandroids. Android used to look like this BEFORE Google COPIED the iPhone.

Besides, many speculated that iPhone would not sell, because it doesn't have physical keyboard ...
post #116 of 228
Some of us still remember the pictures of what Android looked like before iPhone. Back then, Android was ripping off Blackberry. Then iPhone came along, and Android switched gears and decided to rip off iPhone OS instead. Where exactly were (are) Android's innovations?
post #117 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Youarewrong View Post

http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=3476

Thanks for the link. Samsung must have choked on their morning coffee when they saw this. They know they have to prevent it from reaching the market lest products like this become part of another suit. Still... have you seen Samsungs dock connector? Funny how things like that get overlooked when we discuss the lawsuits. it's not just about the OS or the tablet itself.
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post #118 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger View Post

No one here knows exactly what happened. It's all hearsay. We do know, however, that Schmidt left the Apple board meetings on specific occasions to avoid conflict of interest. We also know that Schmidt only left the Apple board (either voluntarily or not) in 2009 and not earlier. Surely, if Apple felt so strongly about Schmidt acting unethically, they would have been rather dumb to keep him as a director for two years after the launch of the iPhone, particularly since Google acquired Android a few years earlier. In fact, the evidence suggests that Apple was not particularly smart in keeping Schmidt on. If indeed Google learned a few tricks via this relationship, shouldn't Apple shoulder the blame at least in part for missing the obvious? To repeat, Google bought Android in 2005!!!

Well, at least we've identified the Eric Schmidt apologist on the thread.

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post #119 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickmccally View Post

This is so sad really. You guys think that these phones are copies? REALLY?

I've never used on that made me think "man this is as good as my iphone"

Lets all pay one company a licensing fee to make tee shirts, because one company should own the right. Lets me one company own licensing for laptops so NO ONE but one company can making portable computers. If anything, Apples inspiration came from PALM years ago. This is ridiculous you guys are agreeing with having another monopoly in the USA. I guarantee that HTC wins this time round.

Yeah. The design and technological particulars of the iPhone are much like a t-shirt. Thanks for sharing.
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post #120 of 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickmccally View Post

This is so sad really. You guys think that these phones are copies? REALLY?

I've never used on that made me think "man this is as good as my iphone"

Lets all pay one company a licensing fee to make tee shirts, because one company should own the right. Lets me one company own licensing for laptops so NO ONE but one company can making portable computers. If anything, Apples inspiration came from PALM years ago. This is ridiculous you guys are agreeing with having another monopoly in the USA. I guarantee that HTC wins this time round.

It's not about "copying" every detail. It's about copying specific implementations. See my post above and check out Samsungs doc connector.

It could be said that Palm inspiration came from the newton. I don't think Palm or Visor's (which used palm OS) were much akin to the iPhone except in form factor. The visor actually had a phone adapter and mobile internet in one device before either.

I just remember the palm OS was very very different VS Android which other than being a terrible copy is still a copy of iOS in specific ways.

I said it earlier. We'll see how this turns out, but we already have clues that it's not going to be a case of at least some of Apple's claims not to be supported.
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