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Apple investigating flat 'key-less' keyboard using acoustic cues

post #1 of 41
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A recently published patent application from Apple reveals the company has looked into a flat keyboard that would detect acoustic pulses from users' taps instead of relying on physical key presses.

The patent, entitled "Piezo-based acoustic and capacitive detection," was published by the U.S. Patent & Trademark Office last week. Apple's invention attempts to solve an issue with touch-sensitive input devices.

"In general, touch-sensitive surface or related input devices may be less reliable in determining a pressed command or intended input when compared with a traditional mechanical keyboard," the filing read. "For example, some touch screens often require that a user tap on the screen several times before detecting the command.

The Mac maker's proposed solution is to couple a capacitive touch sensor with a piezoelectric sensor that can detect an "acoustic signature" from user input. That acoustic signature would then be compared to a database of reference acoustic signatures in order to determine where the input occurred.

One embodiment of the invention would entail multiple piezoelectric sensors to track more than one acoustic pulse. Apple also proposes that "tuning features," such as openings on the surface of the keyboard, could help distinguish various keys by distorting or altering the acoustic signature of taps.




According to the filing, pressure switches and proximity devices could also be utilized to help ensure accurate detection.

Apple suggests that "it may be useful to provide an input device that is flat and has few to no moving pieces, as this may yield a more robust product." The company also noted that the invention could "take any form of a input-surface input device for a computing system, not just a traditional keyboard layout.

The filing provides for several materials for the keys, such as metal, glass and plastic. In the case of metal or plastic, the keys could be "machined, stamped or micro-perforated" into the surface. For a glass solution, keys can be painted on the surface or "provided as graphics on a display screen located below the glass surface."

Additionally, keys could be indented or have textural differences that would help users distinguish between keys. Apple suggests that the flat keyboard could include a "haptic or tactile feedback mechanism" that would provide "force, vibration and/or motion" to a user's fingers or hands in response to pressing on the keyboard surface. The company has, in the past, expressed interest in haptic feedback for touch screens.

Apple filed for the patent on Jan. 20, 2010. Mushtaq A. Sarwar, Omar Sze Leung, Aleksandar Pance, Brett Bilbrey and Andew Ross Richardson are credited as the inventors.
post #2 of 41
I don't like flat keys, they're not natural.
post #3 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I don't like flat keys, they're not natural.

Agreed, unless there’s a reason to “settle” for them, like a touchscreen. But companies patent every idea they come up with. It means nothing about any intention to build it. If some other company wants the idea, they must buy it from Apple, that’s all.
post #4 of 41
This is not to augment any product they currently produce. They are working on something. ©
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post #5 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I don't like flat keys, they're not natural.

c'mon nobody got the pun?
post #6 of 41
Curious to see how they would overcome the problem of keeeeeeeeeeeeey repeats. It would also have to have some sort of pressure sensor i imagine.

Interesting. Might never be done. Kind of like the patent for a camera that captures images from behind a screen.
post #7 of 41
iPad 3 with retina display, haptic feedback and more accurate keypress detection? Yes please.

I can't see myself getting a tablet until haptic feedback is implemented well. The most important difference of a virtual keyboard to a physical keyboard is that on a physical keyboard you can feel the edges of the buttons and the keys pressing down.
post #8 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

c'mon nobody got the pun?

Hehe not very sharp, ey?
post #9 of 41
How hard would you have to tap to make 26 positions sound different? But it should be ok as an addition/ambiguity resolver for a traditional touchscreen.

Personally I think we speak with our tongues, so the most natural keyboard would be some kind of thing where you touch different teeth with the tip of your tongue to make letters. Or, maybe we can subvocalise faster than we can talk, so some sort of bow tie keyboard.
post #10 of 41
We need a microphone that can hear our thoughts.
post #11 of 41
Zero button mouse, soon to come zero button keyboard!

I have a feeling the iPhone 5 will also lose its mechanical home button...
post #12 of 41
Make it so number one.
post #13 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uelogy View Post

Hehe not very sharp, ey?

...
it's hard to laugh at such a minor pun...
post #14 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode View Post

Curious to see how they would overcome the problem of keeeeeeeeeeeeey repeats.

They have already moved away from that in Lion which turns a long hold into a option to chose to accented letter.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

How hard would you have to tap to make 26 positions sound different? But it should be ok as an addition/ambiguity resolver for a traditional touchscreen.

Personally I think we speak with our tongues, so the most natural keyboard would be some kind of thing where you touch different teeth with the tip of your tongue to make letters. Or, maybe we can subvocalise faster than we can talk, so some sort of bow tie keyboard.

I don't see this replacing traditional keyboards, but being added to their current touchscreen technology. Right now, to indicate force of tapped area it relays on the accelerometer to measure vibrations, but it's imprecise. With this patent they could use the idea they could could use the intensity to measure force and location within a touchscreen.
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post #15 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

c'mon nobody got the pun?

It was pretty obscure. I have a Masters in Music and I didn't pick up on it at all.
post #16 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I don't like flat keys, they're not natural.

I didn't catch it at first either but it is a sharp idea. The major problem with such a minor pun is including just enough of contextual chorus so that people pick up on the rhythm of your idea. Do like the pun though - sorry I couldn't come up with something better to beat it.

Cheers.
post #17 of 41
Surface Acoustic Waves (SAW) touch screens were popular in the late 80's and early 90's with CRT monitors. However, it had performance issues and resistive touch screens became preferred technology..
post #18 of 41
You should be careful you're not suspended...
post #19 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by kasakka View Post

iPad 3 with retina display, haptic feedback and more accurate keypress detection? Yes please.

I can't see myself getting a tablet until haptic feedback is implemented well. The most important difference of a virtual keyboard to a physical keyboard is that on a physical keyboard you can feel the edges of the buttons and the keys pressing down.

As Apple is reportedly in the "investigation" stage, my guess is that there's still about 5-10 years until haptic interface technology gets into the mainstream. You really wanna wait that long?
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post #20 of 41
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Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post

We need a microphone that can hear our thoughts.

We really, really don't.

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post #21 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

How hard would you have to tap to make 26 positions sound different? But it should be ok as an addition/ambiguity resolver for a traditional touchscreen.

It wouldn't so much be about different positions sounding different. It would be more like passive sonarthree sound detectors (erm. I guess they call them "microphones" meh. ) would be able to figure out where you're tapping the surface, and from that, figure out which "key" you "pressed". Combine that with standard multitouch technology, and you could have a pretty accurate interface.

Personally, I'm old-school, I guess. I would miss the keyboard if it was replaced with this fancy, new-fangled, haptic tech. Then again, mice (mouses??), touch pads and multi-touch were new at some point as well. And those big, clunky Olivetti typewriters are part of ancient history now.



Point being, if/when "traditional" keyboards are phased out and replaced with haptic keyboards or whatever, we, and the generations that follow us will adapt or get left behind.
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post #22 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

c'mon nobody got the pun?

not many musicians on this board.

It is a nice pun.
post #23 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

How hard would you have to tap to make 26 positions sound different? But it should be ok as an addition/ambiguity resolver for a traditional touchscreen.

Personally I think we speak with our tongues, so the most natural keyboard would be some kind of thing where you touch different teeth with the tip of your tongue to make letters. Or, maybe we can subvocalise faster than we can talk, so some sort of bow tie keyboard.

I worked on a keyboard encoder for Smith Corona back in the early 80s that used a similar principle but limited to the technologies of the time. Below is the Patent Abstract.

A simplified, symmetrical encoding apparatus of the acoustic rod type with polarized output signals, e.g., where key-actuated strikers impact an acoustic bar having a number of differently-shaped tabs on the bar, the impact giving rise to divergent acoustic waves sensed by a transducer at each end of the bar. Providing paired sets of a non-polarizing tab and oppositely-oriented raked (polarizing) tabs in mirror image form at desired locations on right and left halves of the bar, preferably with a first tab located at the bar's midpoint, facilitates distinguishing between impacts on the different tabs.

Don't know if this patent is still active since it's 30 years old but it could be the source for another patent infringement lawsuit
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post #24 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by xsu View Post

not many musicians on this board.

It is a nice pun.

Maybe some music glue will help.
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post #25 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by KennMSr View Post

I worked on a keyboard encoder for Smith Corona back in the early 80s that used a similar principle but limited to the technologies of the time. Below is the Patent Abstract.

A simplified, symmetrical encoding apparatus of the acoustic rod type with polarized output signals, e.g., where key-actuated strikers impact an acoustic bar having a number of differently-shaped tabs on the bar, the impact giving rise to divergent acoustic waves sensed by a transducer at each end of the bar. Providing paired sets of a non-polarizing tab and oppositely-oriented raked (polarizing) tabs in mirror image form at desired locations on right and left halves of the bar, preferably with a first tab located at the bar's midpoint, facilitates distinguishing between impacts on the different tabs.

Don't know if this patent is still active since it's 30 years old but it could be the source for another patent infringement lawsuit

They both use sound but the patent blurb you quoted seems very specific putting it out of the scope of Apple's patent.
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post #26 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacificfilm View Post

...
it's hard to laugh at such a minor pun...

I didn't even C it
post #27 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I don't like flat keys, they're not natural.

. This is about innovation, Apple way to leave competitors far behind.
post #28 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post

Personally, I'm old-school, I guess. I would miss the keyboard if it was replaced with this fancy, new-fangled, haptic tech.

If you were truly old-school, you'd be clamoring for a quill, inkwell and parchment.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post

Then again, mice (mouses??), touch pads and multi-touch were new at some point as well. And those big, clunky Olivetti typewriters are part of ancient history now.



Point being, if/when "traditional" keyboards are phased out and replaced with haptic keyboards or whatever, we, and the generations that follow us will adapt or get left behind.

Exactly. If you think about the things we do today (and not just with high-tech stuff) most of it is "fancy" and "new-fangled." We adapt when it makes sense and the benefits outweigh the cost of change.

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post #29 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

If you were truly old-school, you'd be clamoring for a quill, inkwell and parchment.

Nah, If you were truly old-school, you'd be chiseling hieroglyphics on sandstone.
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post #30 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Nah, If you were truly old-school, you'd be chiseling hieroglyphics on sandstone.

Touché!

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post #31 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

If you were truly old-school, you'd be clamoring for a quill, inkwell and parchment.

Does pen/paper count? I still do a lot of writing/note-taking that way. Then later, I compile my notes on my computer.
Quote:
Exactly. If you think about the things we do today (and not just with high-tech stuff) most of it is "fancy" and "new-fangled." We adapt when it makes sense and the benefits outweigh the cost of change.

Or, we adapt when Uncle Steve uses his Jedi Mind Tricks on us and tells us to (you do not need floppy drives... Netbooks are crap...)

ZING!! .
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post #32 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post

Or, we adapt when Uncle Steve uses his Jedi Mind Tricks on us and tells us to (you do not need floppy drives... Netbooks are crap...)

ZING!! .

Whatever it takes.

Seriously though, think about all of the things we use and do today that would have seemed insane a generation ago.

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post #33 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Seriously though, think about all of the things we use and do today that would have seemed insane a generation ago.

Or vice versa.
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post #34 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post

Or vice versa.

Good point.

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post #35 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacificfilm View Post

...
it's hard to laugh at such a minor pun...

Any humor is purely accidental.
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post #36 of 41
As some have stated, and I hope to clarify - The idea its not about generating a unique sound when striking a key and then using the differences in each sound to resolve a 'key press'. This idea is about using three receivers to triangulate exactly where the sound originates to resolve the key press. Just as GPS uses the minute differences in time code from three separate signals to triangulate a coordinate, this system uses the distances from the source to triangulate the key position and map it back to the keyboard configuration.
post #37 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeo View Post

It was pretty obscure. I have a Masters in Music and I didn't pick up on it at all.

Now I feel diminished
post #38 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuristic View Post

... [several other good points]... Point being, if/when "traditional" keyboards are phased out and replaced with haptic keyboards or whatever, we, and the generations that follow us will adapt or get left behind.

Perfectly stated. I was thinking "ye olde school mechanical-keyboard-typers will need to die off before technology can move beyond us."

Another thing to consider is that Apple is heavily promoting multi-touch across all their product lines. Even Macs, with the Magic Trackpad. Apple has done "Back to the Mac" with iOS features. Now they're doing "Back to the Desktop" with MacBook trackpads and gestures. Especially in Lion.

But trackpads, either on MacBooks or as Mac accessories, are still only an interim step. No, I don't think Apple will ever ship a full touchscreen MacBook or Mac. "Gorilla Arm" would be the result. It's a very well-known and unsolvable problem in touchscreen interface design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gorilla_arm#Gorilla_arm).

When you think about it, using a trackpad is just as inconvenient, from a time and motion standpoint, as using a mouse. You type away, then move one of your hands several inches to grab the mouse. Then you slide the mouse around to move the on-screen cursor, then you click and/or drag, then you release the mouse and move your hand back over the keyboard, then you re-position your hand to the correct typing position, then you continue typing. All of that takes time. If you do it hundreds of times a day, that time adds up.

The solution? Build a keyboard that can also be used as a trackpad. Instead of moving your mousing hand all the way off the keyboard etc. you can just do your multi-touch gestures right on the keyboard itself. This requires either a totally flat surface for pixel-perfect cursor positioning, or some way of precisely detecting finger positions even with physical keys in the way. Sure, it's far harder to type on something without haptic feedback. But Apple has the solution: auto-correct. And it could be extended into detecting how big any user's hands are, and compensating for missed keys etc.

The result? Instant switching between old-fashioned typing and new-fangled multi-touching and mousing. And, as multi-touch gestures evolve, two-handed gestures could be developed. Gestures that can't be done on a small trackpad. (E.g. "sleep" could be a 10-finger gesture: pinch all 5 fingers of each hand together.)

The first typewriter was invented in 1870, the keyboard was designed to slow down typing to reduce jamming of the mechanicals, and precious little has changed in keyboards since then. It will be pretty hard to make the next big step beyond the comfortable if awkward status quo. And by then, maybe voice commands will be how we control computers anyway. No need to learn how to touch type or to hunt-and-peck. (But that's a different post...)

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post #39 of 41
I remember my Razr, yes the cell phone, had this flat metalic look to it. although you could press the buttons in a bit, i liked the look and feel, of the metal and how the little bumps let your fingers know they were in the right position. Not to mention that when it lights up it looks cool.

If apple did a flat keyboard like that, i would not mind it, with an OLED display, SUPER THIN MACBOOK PRO!
post #40 of 41
If it's anything like the on-screen keyboard on the iPad, it's going to slow down your typing speed by half. Not practical.
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