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Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits

post #1 of 43
Thread Starter 
Apple's share of the mobile phone industry's profits has swelled to around two thirds, as the company's iPhone sales have remained profitable while achieving the top spot in sales.

Even before displacing Nokia as the world's top smartphone maker in the most recent quarter, Apple has long consumed a disproportionate slice of the industry's profits.

Apple first grabbed the largest slice of phone profits in mid 2008, just a year after the iPhone went on sale. That slice climbed to 50 percent of the industry's profits by last year.

This quarter however, an overall decline in profits among top mobile makers kicked Apple's share of total profits up past 66 percent, with Samsung pulling in the next largest slice of profits with just 15 percent, RIM collecting an 11 percent share, and HTC bringing in 7.4 percent.

Nokia, Motorola, Sony Ericsson and LG all managed to lose money selling phones in the quarter, as presented graphically in a chart by Horace Dediu of Asymco (below; other charts on the Asymco site).



The role reversal of Apple and Nokia since the appearance of the iPhone in 2007 is particularly striking. Just after the iPhone debuted, Nokia had a 55 percent share of mobile profits while Apple claimed just a 5 percent sliver.

This year, Apple's slice of the pie is even larger than Nokia's was four years ago, and Nokia can't claim any percentage of the industry's profits.
post #2 of 43
Way to go, Apple!
post #3 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

This year, Apple's slice of the pie is even larger than Nokia's was four years ago, and Nokia can't claim any percentage of the industry's profits.

It's also a much bigger pie, which is interesting.
post #4 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

It's also a much bigger pie, which is interesting.

And the pie now has apple filling, instead of blackberry filling.

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post #5 of 43
The dissenters will point out that Apple's profit growth rate is slowing down as if one doesn't expect them to plateau as the reach toward 100% of the profits.
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post #6 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

And the pie now has apple filling, instead of blackberry filling.

The filling was Nokia before, which I guess means it was canned fish.
post #7 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The dissenters will point out that Apple's profit growth rate is slowing down as if one doesn't expect them to plateau as the reach toward 100% of the profits.

and Apple has broken up out of its trading range and not even the fiasco in Washington has put much of a dent in its rise. In fact it represents buying opportunity at $390 on its way to 450 by end of year and 500 after that. I just bought another mac after my iPad2 all paid for by profits on the stock. God knows what will happen when the Apple HDTV comes out and takes Samsung, Viseo and the like down. Why can't these idiot TV manufacturers do a half decent interface - all they understand is boneheaded hierarchical menus. Oh well more profit and market share for Apple I suppose. I bet the folks at Apple can't wait to take them on and show up their inferior products. What other devices can Apple destroy? DVD's prob not! Camera's gee I wish I had a half decent interface for my digital camera, they all suck so bad. how about a half decent interface on a car nav?
post #8 of 43
Just so I am clear ... this isn't just the 'smart phone market' this is the overall mobile phone market?
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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post #9 of 43
Bloodbath.
post #10 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Just so I am clear ... this isn't just the 'smart phone market' this is the overall mobile phone market?

Good question. Also, is this U.S. or worldwide? I can't imagine it's worldwide; far too may cheap flip-phones are still sold in less-developed nations for Apple to even make a dent there.
post #11 of 43
Samsung releases some sour puss news.
post #12 of 43
BIG Apple fan here. Been a user since the very start. But this is getting scary.
post #13 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Just so I am clear ... this isn't just the 'smart phone market' this is the overall mobile phone market?

yes, this is all handsets - the entire mobile phone handset market globally. Some OEMs and ODMs are maybe excluded, like ZTE - if there's no good data for them, but they are all pretty small.
post #14 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

yes, this is all handsets - the entire mobile phone handset market globally.

Sheesh!
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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post #15 of 43
WOT

I just got delivery of a top of the line, custom configured, bo-wah-diddle iMac 27 (the Promise RAID ships next month)

FWIW, I have Final Cut Pro X, Motion 5, and a YouTube Flash page -- all open, with files, and idle...

Guess which uses the most resources?

0.8% CPU 992 MB RAM -- FCPX

0.3% CPU 1.76 GB RAM -- Motion 5

8.0% CPU 216.4 MB RAM


The Apple iPhone and iPad paid for my new toys...

Thanks Apple, Keep up the good work!
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post #16 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Good question. Also, is this U.S. or worldwide? I can't imagine it's worldwide; far too may cheap flip-phones are still sold in less-developed nations for Apple to even make a dent there.

This is profits, though. It's not units "sold." How many of those cheap phones would it take to equal the profit from the sale of a single iPhone4?
post #17 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Good question. Also, is this U.S. or worldwide? I can't imagine it's worldwide; far too may cheap flip-phones are still sold in less-developed nations for Apple to even make a dent there.

This is profits, and unsurprisingly the profits on those phones are tiny, in fact given that the biggest vendor in those markets is Nokia, the profit on those products is currently negative.
post #18 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

WOT

I just got delivery of a top of the line, custom configured, bo-wah-diddle iMac 27 (the Promise RAID ships next month)

FWIW, I have Final Cut Pro X, Motion 5, and a YouTube Flash page -- all open, with files, and idle...

Guess which uses the most resources?

0.8% CPU 992 MB RAM -- FCPX

0.3% CPU 1.76 GB RAM -- Motion 5

8.0% CPU 216.4 MB RAM


The Apple iPhone and iPad paid for my new toys...

Thanks Apple, Keep up the good work!

Enjoy that sweet rig Dick!!
If you are going to insist on being an ass, at least demonstrate the intelligence to be a smart one
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post #19 of 43
Apple the sole USA company that is less USA centric and perhaps the last true USA innovative minded corporation.


Apple competing with TWO powerful cartels …
PC vendors cartel and now android vendors cartel,
… And still making profit.


: All that without compromising Steve Jobs infamous bad temper.
: A marvel Indeed!


I still see Microsoft and sadly joining it, Google as USA ( manufacturing lacking model economics ) and Apple as Germany ( manufacturing wisely inclined .)
post #20 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

Samsung releases some sour puss news.

they don't' have the guts to report their tablet sales. the 7" Galaxy had to be a total disaster, and the 10" Galaxy ain't doing that great either. so they are using Apple as an implied excuse for a cover up to avoid embarrassment.

of course the Android-loving tech websites are not going to call them on this. they don't' want to know the truth either.
post #21 of 43
Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

What does this mean? Profits? It means Apple Overprices their phones and services over and above the rest. And you all pay for it and say Yay!

I would not be proud to admit I was not smart enough to shop around.

Congrats on your phones!
post #22 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

What does this mean? Profits? It means Apple Overprices their phones and services over and above the rest. And you all pay for it and say Yay!

I would not be proud to admit I was not smart enough to shop around.

Congrats on your phones!

I stopped reading when you mentioned Apple is only on 2 carriers (and you mean worldwide).

Ignorance is bliss. Do trolls even know how to read? It isn't like google is that hard to use.

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post #23 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

What does this mean? Profits? It means Apple Overprices their phones and services over and above the rest. And you all pay for it and say Yay!

I would not be proud to admit I was not smart enough to shop around.

Congrats on your phones!



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: You mean nonsense?
\: Sounds like one BBC journalist, forgot the name.
post #24 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

I stopped reading when you mentioned Apple is only on 2 carriers (and you mean worldwide).

Ignorance is bliss. Do trolls even know how to read? It isn't like google is that hard to use.

Really? That's the best you can come up with? No explanation for how companies which sell their phones for the same and less than the iPhone manage to sell more of them and make less profit? Nothing to argue their markup is as high or higher than Apples?

Or no argument because you are too busy trying to not feel ripped off. Not my fault son. Not my fault.....
post #25 of 43
The data chart is misleading.

This isnt profits from the hardware sales alone.

It's hardware + software (as in Apps sales).

Notice the drastic change in the profit margins from Q2 2008 to Q3 2008.

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post #26 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Really? That's the best you can come up with? No explanation for how companies which sell their phones for the same and less than the iPhone manage to sell more of them and make less profit? Nothing to argue their markup is as high or higher than Apples?

Or no argument because you are too busy trying to not feel ripped off. Not my fault son. Not my fault.....

Another day, another troll joins AI and starts posting. You've got all the talking points down pat. 1. Only clueless "sheeple" buy Apple products. 2. Apple hardware is overpriced in spite of the fact that 20 million "sheeple" bought iPhones last quarter. 3. Any day now Android tablets will start taking over. 4. Apple is doomed.

Do you guys go to some web site every day to get your talking points coordinated? It's getting really boring you know. You need to get more creative.
post #27 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

What does this mean? Profits? It means Apple Overprices their phones and services over and above the rest. And you all pay for it and say Yay!

I would not be proud to admit I was not smart enough to shop around.

Congrats on your phones!

Rather, it suggests Apple make phones that people think are worthy of such a mark-up in price, because of quality.

Android phones, however, aren't considered to have such quality, and so people won't pay as much for them. They will barely pay cost price. Considering the market share for Android, it's pathetic that they can't even hold Apple at 50%.

This isn't about overcharging, it's about quality of product and the value of an iPhone to each person.
post #28 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

The data chart is misleading.

This isnt profits from the hardware sales alone.

It's hardware + software (as in Apps sales).

Notice the drastic change in the profit margins from Q2 2008 to Q3 2008.

Apple released the iPhone 3G in calendar Q3 2008. They had reduced supply of the iPhone original beforehand so naturally Q2 2008 profits were considerably lower. This has nothing to do with the tiny App profits, and everything to do with product cycle.

Once again you post obviously rubbish. No doubt you'll not appear on this thread again as you'll be busy posting the same rubbish on every other site it's your job to cover.
post #29 of 43
Are these profits just counting hardware sales or profits from the app store as well?
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post #30 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdaddyguido View Post

Are these profits just counting hardware sales or profits from the app store as well?

I'm sure Horace Dediu did his best to subtract out any App profits, but we know them to be minimal anyway - The total up till June 2011 could not have been more than a billion, even if Apple had absolutely no costs associated with the App store. More likely they were a few hundred million.

Oh and Samsung don't split out Tablet profits, nor have they reported Tablet sales, so their numbers will include their tablet profits, not that they are enough to matter of course.
post #31 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

I'm sure Horace Dediu did his best to subtract out any App profits, but we know them to be minimal anyway - The total up till June 2011 could not have been more than a billion, even if Apple had absolutely no costs associated with the App store. More likely they were a few hundred million.

Oh and Samsung don't split out Tablet profits, nor have they reported Tablet sales, so their numbers will include their tablet profits, not that they are enough to matter of course.

Thank you. I was wondering more in response to people who claim it's all because apple overcharges for hardware. The more I think about it, the more it makes sense that very little profit would come off a 30% charge for app sales, a good portion of that would have to go to other costs, like server costs and credit card charges. The beat argument against the "apple charges too much" would be the extreme lack of buyers remorse. I've never had even the slightest remorse over any apple product (from iPhone, to iPod, to tablet, to MacBook pro to mini) and I think almost every other product I've bought over $200 I've at least felt some part of me felt it was unnecessary expense (cars, pcs, game consoles, appliances, etc.)

I'm generally pleased with how I spend my money, but I never feel more worth for my dollar than apple products.
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post #32 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Really? That's the best you can come up with? No explanation for how companies which sell their phones for the same and less than the iPhone manage to sell more of them and make less profit? Nothing to argue their markup is as high or higher than Apples?

Or no argument because you are too busy trying to not feel ripped off. Not my fault son. Not my fault.....

I always enjoy the collision of Standard Apple Bashing 101 (Apple charges extra for nothing) with the new reality of iOS (Apple's economics of scale and manufacturing efficiencies allow them to charge the same or less than the competition while still delivering best of class quality).

So we're left to contemplate how the Apple tax works, exactly, when no one seems to be able to deliver a tablet that undercuts Apple's pricing while delivering anything like Apple's quality or UX. I guess the idea must be that Apple should be selling iPads for a few hundred dollars, even thought they can sell all they can make at the current pricing, just to prove they're not greedy. Or something. I don't guess "making sense" was at the top of the poster's to do list.

Also, pay no attention to the $49 iPhone at AT&T or the myriad of $200 Android phones.
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post #33 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone View Post

Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

What does this mean? Profits? It means Apple Overprices their phones and services over and above the rest. And you all pay for it and say Yay!

I would not be proud to admit I was not smart enough to shop around.

Congrats on your phones!

Your argument is that as a consumer, the fact that Apple makes the most profit is of no benefit to the consumer. On the contrary, consumers should be ticked off that Apple makes so much money off of their phones. On the same token, why should it matter where Apple's products are manufactured? How does the fact that the products are made in the USA of any benefit to the consumer?

Also, have you heard of any company say, "Oh, we're making too much money so we're gonna cut our prices."
post #34 of 43
Quote:
:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dymone
Read that headline one more time.

"Apple now taking 2/3 share of mobile phone industry profits"

The key word in that headline is profits. Now consider the fact that there are a multitude of Android based phones on the market, which now sells more world wide than Apple. Consider there are even more old flip and candy bar style phones which also (albeit non smartphones) outsell Apple. Apple has 1 phone, 1 iStore, 2 Carriers (Verizon and At&T) There are more cell phone providers than you can shake a stick at, nevermind the "pay as you go" style companies out there. So 1 iPhone, 1 iStore and 2 Carriers vs The rest of the mobile phone World! Apple is a small market share in comparison to the rest, however, and yes reference the headline, 2/3 of the profits are in apples pockets.

The iPhone is available something like 250 carriers. Likewise, the name of the game is to make a product people are actually willing to pay for.
post #35 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudgazer View Post

The filling was Nokia before, which I guess means it was canned fish.

Lutefisk.

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GOA

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post #36 of 43
The benefit of margin isn't profit, the real benefit is the ability to reinvest.

The alleged surplus is in the bank being used wisely.

To drive innovation you need a lot of cash. In terms of investment in new technology and refinements they are clearly way ahead.

It isn't as if someone has pocketed all that money..
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post #37 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by cy_starkman View Post

The benefit of margin isn't profit, the real benefit is the ability to reinvest.

The alleged surplus is in the bank being used wisely.

To drive innovation you need a lot of cash. In terms of investment in new technology and refinements they are clearly way ahead.

It isn't as if someone has pocketed all that money..

The real scandal is how many handset makers are making no profit at all.

S-E, Moto, LG & now Nokia, probably some others scattered around like Sharp.
post #38 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

The data chart is misleading.
This isnt profits from the hardware sales alone.
It's hardware + software (as in Apps sales).

Notice the drastic change in the profit margins from Q2 2008 to Q3 2008.

Do you realise that those two quarters you have selected cover a period where iPhone sales grew by 626% ?

That's the single largest YoY increase in iPhone's history.

Try harder!
post #39 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

Do you realise that those two quarters you have selected cover a period where iPhone sales grew by 626% ?

That's the single largest YoY increase in iPhone's history.

Try harder!

He has long since gone off to spread his misinformation on other sites. Galbi does this with pretty much every story, he posts once with something that is either outright false or just extremely misleading, then he leaves. I generally don't like it when people get accused of being 'shills', but increasingly it seems like he is a (very bad) PR guy for samsung. He's not a troll, because trolls stick around to argue, whereas his style is strictly ring and run.
post #40 of 43
What's hysterically sad about Galbi's attempt to paint Apple as some loser is that if the profits did include the ecosystem it would make Apple even more dominate in the market.
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