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Apple's iCloud faces consumer confusion over 'cloud computing' - Page 2

post #41 of 72
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Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Access a Pages document on a PC?

Yes. Documents uploaded from iWork are stored in native and PDF format.
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post #42 of 72
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Originally Posted by cowhide View Post

I just can't get cirrus about cloud computing, Maybe a thunderbolt will help.

You sir just made my day
post #43 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

As Apple plans to push its iCloud service to consumers this fall, a new survey has found that most people don't even know what the term "cloud computing" means.

People don't know what "cloud computing" means because the marketing weasels at too many companies don't know what they're hawking, or, even worse, the companies themselves don't really have a grasp of what services they're trying to sell. They know only that the "Cloud" is the next Big Thing, and they're convinced they need to be in it.
post #44 of 72
Or rather, there are dozens of different model. You can store data in the cloud so it will be available to you elsewhere. There's Dropbox. Google apps, where the app's in the cloud, the browser's in the crowd, and you back up to your hard drive.

iCloud is the most radical approach so far, I think. Copying is immediate, ideally you have to do nothing to have the same docs appear everywhere without saying "save." It may represent a new file system, in effect, by spreading things across the net.

I'm glad they seem to be rolling this out slowly, piece by piece.
post #45 of 72
We've had this discussion not too long ago on these forums. Even people here had/have a very narrow view of what the cloud is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleZilla View Post

What's really confusing is that you're not really putting your data in the cloud with iCloud, you're mirroring it there.

They should have called it 'iMirror.'

How about we make rainbow a verb to denote it's effect with the cloud.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post


Note: Anyone who has a MobileMe account* will automatically have the 25GB of storage for free through June 2012.

* I assume that those with family plans will get whatever their MM family plan offers plus 5GB for iCloud, not the 20Gb plus 5GB of the primary and single users.
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post #46 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

But a new survey from the NPD Group also found that just 22 percent of consumers are familiar with the term "cloud computing."

Rather unfortunate choice of acronym there as it also stands for narcissistic personality disorder.
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post #47 of 72
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Originally Posted by allblue View Post

Rather unfortunate choice of acronym there as it also stands for narcissistic personality disorder.

Quick story. I worked in our company's HR Systems department for a while. Every time I heard the business folks talking casually someone on STD I had this fleeting look of shock on my face and chuckled a bit inside (sophomoric, I know). It was weeks until I learned that they were talking about Short Term Disability.
post #48 of 72
Currently writing my post graduate dissertation - the topic is cloud computing. The entire literature review was just on finding out what on earth it actually was! After doing all of that, I am now baffled and rather confused about iCloud. What part of it is "cloud", exactly? So far its just a sync service and web mail, typical web2.0 stuff. I think Apple has taken the buzzword at face value and ran with it.

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post #49 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

I'm not sure I'd even consider Apple's iCloud, in it's current form, as "cloud computing". More like cloud storage. Even with the example of email cited in the article, most people will use their iDevice's or computers email client to access the messages stored in the cloud. They won't be using the web-based email client. So under that usage assumption, it's just the same old email that we've had for over a decade.

Maybe I'm being too much of a stickler with the defintion of cloud computing, but I just don't see a whole lot of computing going on in the iCloud.

Totally agree. Traditionally, cloud computing was about running applications on a remote system, so you wouldn't need a fast machine with loads of storage, and all your programs would be accessible from everywhere. That's what cloud computing is. Apple is simply hijacking the name because it is trendy to talk about cloud computing these days (InformationWeek for example has probably been something like 90% about cloud computing an all the CIO mumbo-jumbo surrounding it, such as SaaS, PaaS and whatever *aaS).

iCloud is not 'cloud computing'. Amazon EC2 or Google App Engine are cloud services. iCloud is also not 'cloud storage'. Dropbox or Google Music are cloud storage. What iCloud is, is cloud storage + automatic synchronization. I think it's actually quite clever, because it concentrates on ease-of-use for consumers, not on enterprise use patterns, or just allowing people to dump their files somewhere online (which is something that has been available for 10 years or something). The whole idea that you want to have your applications 'running in the cloud' doesn't make sense for the vast majority of consumer applications. In fact, most of the time, a native application that pulls it's data from cloud storage is much, much more flexible and enjoyable to use. If the files are automatically synced so every device has fast access to it, even while offline, that's even better. I think Apple is going in the right direction with this.
post #50 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by benanderson89 View Post

Currently writing my post graduate dissertation - the topic is cloud computing. The entire literature review was just on finding out what on earth it actually was! After doing all of that, I am now baffled and rather confused about iCloud. What part of it is "cloud", exactly? So far its just a sync service and web mail, typical web2.0 stuff. I think Apple has taken the buzzword at face value and ran with it.

Once Apple starts up iCloud, then Cloud Computing will mean iCloud. Everybody will know that it is the "real deal" and that everyone will consider the other companies to be just copying.
post #51 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by d-range View Post

Totally agree. Traditionally, cloud computing was about running applications on a remote system, so you wouldn't need a fast machine with loads of storage, and all your programs would be accessible from everywhere. That's what cloud computing is.



That is called "Software as a Service", or SAAS.
post #52 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleLover2 View Post

That is called "Software as a Service", or SAAS.

I know, that's why I mentioned it in my previous post

SaaS is just the now-hip-and-trendy-in-the-enterprise name for what originally was called 'cloud computing'. The fact that cloud storage and synchronization is now also called 'cloud computing' only contributes to the confusion mentioned in this article.
post #53 of 72
Who cares what is its called as long as it works?
post #54 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post

As for myself, I have a PC (Mac) and I see no pressing reason to use iCloud as a backup but I'll certainly use the secondary features.

Having an off-site backup for the most critical files is a good idea. If you're not doing it already, this is a convenient way to do so.
post #55 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

I'm not sure I'd even consider Apple's iCloud, in it's current form, as "cloud computing". More like cloud storage.

But a crippled Cloud storage. I can't store just anything there, only specific documents which Apple has blessed. Yes, I'll be missing iDisk alot. I've been an Apple fan since I bought my first Apple //e, but I think they made a major error not accommodating an "iDisk-like" file storage service.
post #56 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by mactoid View Post

But a crippled Cloud storage. I can't store just anything there, only specific documents which Apple has blessed. Yes, I'll be missing iDisk alot. I've been an Apple fan since I bought my first Apple //e, but I think they made a major error not accommodating an "iDisk-like" file storage service.

Have you not read a damn thing or choose to spread FUD? Do you not understand that iDIsk is an app on iOS and that Dropbox, SugarSync et al. could easily tie into iCloud with the APIs?

You have a fraking year before iDisk goes away, even after you start using iCloud, so if you can't find one of the many better solution in that time then the fault falls on you, not Apple.
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post #57 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by grmac View Post

Indeed. It will help folks understand better by relating the concept to their primary exposure to technology. For instance, the Cloud to me is similar to handing my boxes of punched cards to the man in the white cloud coat at the data center. I can then access my program from various terminals...

Yeah... That's an explanation that will resonate with about .005% of the Apple user base.
post #58 of 72
'cloud' essentially means anything being stored or run other than on your own local machine, where you have neither control nor responsibility.
It can mean that you don't have to maintain local apps, or that you don't concern yourself with storage and backup. Or in the case of iCloud, simply that you have an authoritative source available from any device.
Apple has hardly 'hijacked' anything here. It's essentially a marketing term that can mean about anything.
post #59 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Have you not read a damn thing or choose to spread FUD? Do you not understand that iDIsk is an app on iOS and that Dropbox, SugarSync et al. could easily tie into iCloud with the APIs?

You have a fraking year before iDisk goes away, even after you start using iCloud, so if you can't find one of the many better solution in that time then the fault falls on you, not Apple.


Geez dude...calm down, grab a beer...go get laid....

Of course I can replace iDisk functionality...I can replace my whole Mac with a Windoze machine if I were self-destructive. But I liked the seamless integration of iDisk with my Mac, and I still maintain that the direction they're heading is a mistake, IMHO.

Oh...and if you think iDisk was just "an app on iOS"..then you haven't been paying attention either.

And FUD? really? REALLY!? 1. No fear, an observation. 2. Not uncertain. Apple has announced termination of iDisk support. 3. No doubt about it (see #2).
post #60 of 72
Personally I reject many cloud solutions not because of the technology but the impossibility of ever having full security for your data. In a nut shell the cloud is no place for sensitive information.

As to the problem with marketing the cloud and getting people to buy in, it is pretty clear that any value in cloud computing is fairly superficial. People aren't stupid thus I don't expect a mad rush to cloud services.

This then brings up the question of iCloud and exactly what it is. If anything it is less of a cloud service than MobileMe, a step backwards if you will. It actually looks like a file server that Apple uses to swap files back and forth on.

In the end I suspect Apples biggest problem will be people asking: what do I need this for? For many of us it is less compelling than MobileMe.
post #61 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleZilla View Post

What's really confusing is that you're not really putting your data in the cloud with iCloud, you're mirroring it there.

They should have called it 'iMirror.'

God no.
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post #62 of 72
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Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

That would have been poignant indeed... had the year been 2005 instead of 2011.

Well said.
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post #63 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by cincytee View Post

People don't know what "cloud computing" means because the marketing weasels at too many companies don't know what they're hawking, or, even worse, the companies themselves don't really have a grasp of what services they're trying to sell. They know only that the "Cloud" is the next Big Thing, and they're convinced they need to be in it.

Yep they have fallen prey to a hype machine. Personally I've been around the computer industry for a long time, one thing that is obvious is that could computing has no foundation to build upon and in some cases it's success depends upon getting people to use services they have no rational reason to do so.

For example there is a rational reason to Go to a business to order something online. That capability has existed for some time so I'm not sure if you would call it cloud computing though I believe it could be considered as such. On the other hand you have organizations like Google trying to get you to run your apps in the cloud - this is beyond stupid. The lack of success here should be an indication that people reject the concept.
post #64 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by mactoid View Post

But a crippled Cloud storage. I can't store just anything there, only specific documents which Apple has blessed. Yes, I'll be missing iDisk alot. I've been an Apple fan since I bought my first Apple //e, but I think they made a major error not accommodating an "iDisk-like" file storage service.

Not that using iDisk was all that much of a joy, but it was very useful to have in conjunction with other Apple MobileMe features. In the end I see us loosing some rather useful features with iCloud, making iCloud far less compelling.
post #65 of 72
I dunno, I'm pretty tech savvy, but every time I read what iCloud will and won't do, I get a bit dizzy and quit reading. One would think that someone like myself who once owned a server farm (aka these days, "the cloud") could understand this stuff, but I certainly don't understand all the ins and outs yet. Whats replaced on .Me, whats not replaced. Whats backed up automatically, and whats not. What interferes and continues to run in the background, etc etc. It all seems to be too feature rich for me, but I'm sure I will grow to understand and adapt over time. I just hope the default setting is OFF, so you can turn on what you want to use and don't. Then, one can try, modify, and learn.

I am still not sure exactly what docs will sync to the cloud. Nor am I sure what pics will sync. For instance, will ALL my recent pics in iPhoto from my digital cams sync, or just the iPhone pics? And, thats just a starter. I'm sure my questions will be answered when I can sit down and digest this stuff piece by piece.

I'm beginning to think that Apple devices are getting feature creep, just like we talked about over the years with MS Office. Poor new users, they won't know what to do with all this stuff.
post #66 of 72
"Most U.S. consumers do use some form of cloud computing, which refers to a software application or process accessed from the Internet rather than a local hard drive. But a new survey from the NPD Group also found that just 22 percent of consumers are familiar with the term "cloud computing."

I think most of US consumers still think there is a ham in a burger and therefore its name is hamburger.
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post #67 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by d-range View Post

I know, that's why I mentioned it in my previous post

SaaS is just the now-hip-and-trendy-in-the-enterprise name for what originally was called 'cloud computing'. The fact that cloud storage and synchronization is now also called 'cloud computing' only contributes to the confusion mentioned in this article.

AFAIK, SAAS was a meme ten years or so ago. Long before online backup was offered by anybody. And long before broadband was popular enough for it to work.
post #68 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by cowhide View Post

I just can't get cirrus about cloud computing, Maybe a thunderbolt will help.



Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDog View Post

"I put my stuff in the Cloud, but then it rained. What do I do now?"

Surely that will be heard at a support center someday soon.



Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Access a Pages document on a PC?

Quote:
Originally Posted by diddy View Post

You can get at the file, Opening it is another story. Maybe iWork.com?

With iWork.com, you can send an iWork document up there. You can then edit it on any Mac, iPad or iPhone, in native format if you have the appropriate iWork apps. Otherwise you can download a Word, PowerPoint or PDF to view/edit/etc. eg. on a PC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post

You do realize you can't just put arbitrary files on iCloud, right. Only apps that support iCloud can put their documents in the iCloud. There is no iDisk functionality. If you want that, you'll need DropBox or a similar service.

Now, it may be technically possible for an app to accept arbitrary files and put them in the cloud. But I suspect they'd have to be encapsulated in some sort of archive first. I haven't read the developer docs yet to know if this is possible.

Yeah, we'll have to see how it goes. Apple's developer agreement may disallow them from cloudifying arbitrary files not related to the developer's app... Or they may allow it, so the first developers to create Dropbox-like functionality for iCloud will gain some traction.

As for me, I ponied up $99/year for 50GB of Dropbox, in the past few days I sent up about 6GB of stuff I 100% need to be "offsite". I.E. in case of catastrophic hardware failure or loss. I will be travelling overseas as well at the end of the month, so I will be carrying my MacBook Pro, Time Machine HD and USB stick. If all gets lost or damaged MobileMe, Gmail, Evernote and DropBox should have me covered. Lion can be re-downloaded from the App Store. Actually, heck, I'm going to send up my Lion, iWork and iLife DMGs to DropBox.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post

Apple should refer to it as "North Carolina computing".
When someone asks "where is my data?"...in North Carolina.

I definitely hope it's not *all* in North Carolina and that backups are somehow mirrored off-site, outside the US.

Putting on my "Don Draper" hat, I would say, the key concept is that "Cloud" must mean "Anywhere, anytime, peace of mind" to the layperson for them to "get it".

I'd love to see someone do a 60's retro-style add advertising iCloud, just for kicks. One day I will teach at art schools and give them the most bizarre and punishing assignments! Muah ha ha ha ha ha

Anywhere, anytime, peace of mind. Perhaps divinely ethereal yet comforting in a way.
post #69 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleLover2 View Post

AFAIK, SAAS was a meme ten years or so ago. Long before online backup was offered by anybody. And long before broadband was popular enough for it to work.

Poor SUN, they had it kinda right, but a bit too early. The network is slowly becoming the computer. Or more accurately at this stage the network and the computer are both intertwined, and one cannot function without the other.

Try doing almost anything on the computer without a broadband connection. Pretty much impossible. Conversely, a network alone with just thin clients (also something that was much vaunted for decades) and "dumb devices" is not sufficient.
post #70 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

Any time you see the word "cloud" in the context of computing, just mentally substitute "internet" for "cloud." And see how much clearer things become.

That is exactly what I was thinking. That's how you ease in the concept. Then you start off explaining photostream when they start wondering how space on their iPad is running out even though they take all their photos on the iPhone!!

But seriously, I think this is a kind of non-story. I'm sure people will get used to it in no time. And, like every portable cassette player was a "Walkman" and every MP3 player is an "iPod", cloud computing will simply be known as "iCloud"!!
post #71 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by BestKeptSecret View Post

And, like every portable cassette player was a "Walkman" and every MP3 player is an "iPod", cloud computing will simply be known as "iCloud"!!

That would mean that Apple will hire even more lawyers and file even more lawsuits. They are extremely litigious when it comes to service marks.
post #72 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleLover2 View Post

That would mean that Apple will hire even more lawyers and file even more lawsuits. They are extremely litigious when it comes to service marks.

dont you mean iLawyers with their iLawsuits?

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