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Evidence suggests Apple will bring iCloud to Snow Leopard

post #1 of 49
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For Mac users who have not yet upgraded to Lion, new evidence suggests Apple will add iCloud support to its predecessor, Snow Leopard, in the form of an update.

A developer running Tiger updated their MobileMe account to iCloud. After making the changeover, a .Mac preference pane in Tiger mentioned that iCloud requires a computer running Mac OS X 10.6.9 or later, a screenshot provided to MacRumors shows.

"You will no longer be able to sync with this machine because you've upgraded to iCloud," the preference pane reads. "iCloud requires a computer running Mac OS X Snow Leopard 10.6.9 or later for contacts, Calendars and Bookmarks."

The current build of Snow Leopard is Mac OS X 10.6.8, with Apple's attention now turned to Mac OS X 10.7 Lion. Given the aggressive $29.99 price point of Lion on the Mac App Store, support for iCloud in a previous-generation operating system may come as a surprise to some.

iCloud is set to debut this fall, but developers have been testing the software with beta builds of Mac OS X 10.7.2. The latest build of 10.7.2 and iCloud beta 9 were issued to developers last Friday.

For developers, iCloud for OS X Lion is an add-on installer for Mac OS X that adds in-development iCloud functionality to Macs for developers.



The free iCloud service will automatically and wirelessly sync data from iOS devices, like the iPhone and iPad, as well as Macs and PCs. iCloud will include cloud-based contacts, calendar and e-mail, allowing users to access their inboxes, events and contacts across a range of devices. Through iCloud, this data will always be up-to-date and in sync.

iCloud will also automatically and securely back up iOS devices daily when users charge their iPhone, iPad or iPad touch. Backed up content will include music, apps, books, photos, videos, device settings, and application data.

In addition, iCloud Storage will provide users 5GB of space to store important files, such as documents and mail. With the new Documents & Data feature, Apple's iCloud will automatically propagate changes made to a file on one device to every other synced device. For example, users will be able to create a document in Pages on their iPhone, and later access it from an iPad, Mac or PC.
post #2 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

iCloud is set to debut this fall, but developers have been testing the software with beta builds of Mac OS X 10.7.2. The latest build of 10.7.2 and iCloud beta 9 were issued to developers last Friday.

I am unable to upgrade to 10.7.1 (or 10.7.2) for some odd reason. A few others on dev have reported the same thing. I'm wondering if it is because I have web sharing on or the fact that I updated the php and also added MySql, the latter which is not included in Lion.

Anyway, it just says that the disk does not meet the requirements to install the upgrade.

Anyway I'm glad they are offering iCloud for SL since I really don't like Lion that much and plan to stick with SL on my main production machine for the time being.

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post #3 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

For example, users will be able to create a document in Pages on their iPhone, and later access it from an iPad, Mac or PC.

What kind of Pages file do you think it syncs with a PC? Does it convert it back and forth as a Word document or do you think that Pages for Windows will be forthcoming?

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post #4 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

What kind of Pages file do you think it syncs with a PC? Does it convert it back and forth as a Word document or do you think that Pages for Windows will be forthcoming?

There'll never be an iWork for Windows. Office just can't be unseated unless the PCs themselves are replaced with OS X devices.

But Pages syncs .DOC and .PDF files to PCs with iCloud, I believe, though I don't know for sure.

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post #5 of 49
My single iMac Core Duo, out of a 4 Apple Computer Home Network, is the sole machine that cannot support Lion.

Yet I want doc synchronization, a la iCloud !!!

I had actually been researching upgrading the CPU to a Core 2 Duo, and all the mess that entails, just to support Lion.

Now, I will want to wait and see.
post #6 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I am unable to upgrade to 10.7.1 (or 10.7.2) for some odd reason. A few others on dev have reported the same thing.

I had the same problem with 10.7.2. It was because I had Mac OS X Server installed (and was sharing files, etc via it). You have to perform a series of steps to bring your Mac back to non-server mode. I'll see if I can find a link with instructions.

Found it:

1) http://support.apple.com/kb/HT4827
2) and then go to /System/Library/CoreServices/ and remove ServerVersion.plist
3) reboot and good to go
 
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post #7 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

For Mac users who have not yet upgraded to Lion, new evidence suggests Apple will add iCloud support to its predecessor, Snow Leopard, in the form of an update.

This would be very welcomed news. Leaving behind my G5 tower was one thing, but to have to also replace my Macbook Pro dual core was irritating. If a computer does what job it is intended to do, there is no reason to get better or faster. BUT... i do need sync between all my devices and the fact I could not use iCloud because it is tied to lion which cannot be installed on my laptop was the pits.
post #8 of 49
This is basically MobileMe. Snow Leopard users will most likely get to sync contacts, bookmarks, and calendars. You still need Lion to sync files and other stuff.
post #9 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Given the aggressive $29.99 price point of Lion on the Mac App Store, support for iCloud in a previous-generation operating system may come as a surprise to some.

The surprise would be if SL offered the full iCloud experience. Many of iCloud's basic features are simple repackaged standards: IMAP for mail, vCards for contacts, CalDAV for events. In other words, the same technology MobileMe uses. I could see the file syncing not making it to SL becuase that's probably a pretty advance implementation of WebDAV to sync fragments of files and leverages a lot of the same code as AutoSave and Versions in Lion.

If iCloud doesn't support SL in at least some minimal fashion, Apple risks losing a lot of people to alternative services such as Google. As much as Apple would love everyone to upgrade to Lion, I think they'd also also prefer to keep those who don't upgrade drinking the kool-aid so they can be influenced to upgrade at some point in the future. Otherwise once someone starts using another service they may not easily come back for iCloud later.
post #10 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by See Flat View Post

This would be very welcomed news. Leaving behind my G5 tower was one thing, but to have to also replace my Macbook Pro dual core was irritating. If a computer does what job it is intended to do, there is no reason to get better or faster. BUT... i do need sync between all my devices and the fact I could not use iCloud because it is tied to lion which cannot be installed on my laptop was the pits.

I wholly agree, why abandon a very well functioning G4 iMac or PowerBook just so I can continue to sync with my iPad and iPhones. Let's bring the support back at least to Leopard. It's bad enough I'm going to be losing my Syncing of my Dock Items, Keychains, preferences and my personal website in Mobileme. Now O'm relegated to update most of the household computers to take advantage Apple's new features. I used to poke fun at the PC community for upgrading every three to four years while the average age my my customers computers (Mac Consultant) was 7 years. That was the reason that the PC market always showed such gains in (sales) market share. My daughter has gone through 2 Dell laptops in the past 5 years while still primarily using her 1999 ClamShell iBook (Vertical Market App that Requires IE 6+).
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post #11 of 49
When iCloud comes out, it sounds like Leopard machines will have a big disconnect when iDisk et goes away. I can live with changes in iWeb, Gallery, etc. changes but I sure would like to retain my current storage options in iDisk on iCloud. iTunes Cloud services are going to work? I have PPC tower, Dual 2.7 GHz, 20 TB of Storage, with iTunes working with MacBook Airs 2008, iPads, Apple TV Gen 1 and 2, as well as iPhone 4s. The transition will be awkward as it seems to be emerging.
post #12 of 49
This would be a monster step forward for every user of Sl that's just on the ragged edge of having a great experience/setup on that platform but not being able to transition to Lion. This will keep MILLIONS of users smiling...
post #13 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I am unable to upgrade to 10.7.1 (or 10.7.2) for some odd reason. A few others on dev have reported the same thing. I'm wondering if it is because I have web sharing on or the fact that I updated the php and also added MySql, the latter which is not included in Lion.

Anyway, it just says that the disk does not meet the requirements to install the upgrade.

Anyway I'm glad they are offering iCloud for SL since I really don't like Lion that much and plan to stick with SL on my main production machine for the time being.

Did you use the revisoner for 10.7.2 first?
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post #14 of 49
This makes sense. I have updated my two home computer to Lion, but am holding off on my work laptop, which still runs 10.6.8. I've had a bug here and there (nothing major) using Lion that it's made me paranoid about upgrading my work computer. But I still want the Lion bennies, such as iCloud.
post #15 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Did you use the revisoner for 10.7.2 first?

No, don't recall hearing anything about that. I actually didn't really want to beta anymore, I just wanted 10.7.1 but when that didn't work I downloaded the 10.7.2 combo updater, which presented the same error I was getting with 10.7.1. I will reinstall a fresh copy of 10.7 and start over, but if the error is really caused by enabling a couple configurations and installing a service or two, then that isn't really very convenient is it? I think Apple just wants you to install Lion and not fiddle around with it because it wasn't really ready for prime time when they released it and the new features they are planning to implement are likely to break things if you make any changes to it while it is in this unfinished state. JMO.

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post #16 of 49
I would like Apple to put their priorities more in place and let them focus on existing irritations.
WHEN ARE THEY PLANNING TO BRING MULTICAM EDITING TO FCP X.
Thats what most of us professional users are waiting for.
post #17 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

A developer running Tiger updated their MobileMe account to iCloud. After making the changeover, a .Mac preference pane in Tiger mentioned that iCloud requires a computer running Mac OS X 10.6.9 or later, a screenshot provided to MacRumors shows.

Tiger? Do you mean Lion?
post #18 of 49
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Originally Posted by bobborries View Post

Tiger? Do you mean Lion?

Nope. Tiger. Why else would he get that error message?
post #19 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by See Flat View Post

This would be very welcomed news. Leaving behind my G5 tower was one thing, but to have to also replace my Macbook Pro dual core was irritating. If a computer does what job it is intended to do, there is no reason to get better or faster. ...

Yes, but in this case the computer doesn't do the job you want it to do (run Lion and iCloud), therefore that's the reason to upgrade.

The way you are phrasing it is kind of a circular logic (It does what I want it to do so I shouldn't have to upgrade it to make it do that thing that I want it to do, that it doesn't actually do).
post #20 of 49
Wait...why does it say ".Mac" instead of MobileMe ? Is that a developer thing?
post #21 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinnquality View Post

I would like Apple to put their priorities more in place and let them focus on existing irritations.
WHEN ARE THEY PLANNING TO BRING MULTICAM EDITING TO FCP X.
Thats what most of us professional users are waiting for.

Right because an extra feature for a brand new pro app used by just a few is waaay more important than a new baseline feature of the OS used by literally millions of people.

Also, the people working on each of these two problems are not likely to be in the same group at all so there is no equivalency anyway.
post #22 of 49
Just as well, I suppose. I'm in no hurry to move to Lion, personally. What's the exact advantage? I'm on SL and fine with it. SL is stable for me, for the most part. I have some PPC apps that require Rosetta, so Lion is actually a downgrade for me - and again, why do I need Lion? What's the "must have" here? The whole iCloud thing leaves me a bit meh. It's useless to me as far as music goes, because I have 2TB of music on my local hard drives, in lossless format. And as far as synching - other than my late 2009 iMac all I have is an iPod Touch 4G (the 12" PPC ibook with Tiger 10.4.11 doesn't count, I'm sure), so not in a desperate need to synch tons of calendars and the like, plus with wi-fi access, I'm good with google calendar and google docs.

Bottom line: I see absolutely no reason to go to Lion at this time. Therefore bringing SL up to speed on some stuff is OK I suppose, but not decisive for me one way or the other.

I'll wait until Lion is at least as stable as SL before I even think about upgrading for no reason whatsoever. Maybe I'll do it some time next year, or around 10.7.5.

I'm in no hurry and see no compelling reason to upgrade.
post #23 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineWine View Post

Just as well, I suppose. I'm in no hurry to move to Lion, personally. What's the exact advantage? I'm on SL and fine with it. SL is stable for me, for the most part. I have some PPC apps that require Rosetta, so Lion is actually a downgrade for me - and again, why do I need Lion? What's the "must have" here? The whole iCloud thing leaves me a bit meh. It's useless to me as far as music goes, because I have 2TB of music on my local hard drives, in lossless format. And as far as synching - other than my late 2009 iMac all I have is an iPod Touch 4G (the 12" PPC ibook with Tiger 10.4.11 doesn't count, I'm sure), so not in a desperate need to synch tons of calendars and the like, plus with wi-fi access, I'm good with google calendar and google docs.

Bottom line: I see absolutely no reason to go to Lion at this time. Therefore bringing SL up to speed on some stuff is OK I suppose, but not decisive for me one way or the other.

I'll wait until Lion is at least as stable as SL before I even think about upgrading for no reason whatsoever. Maybe I'll do it some time next year, or around 10.7.5.

I'm in no hurry and see no compelling reason to upgrade.

Exactly. Lion is only for those that need the new stuff. If you're happy with the older way of doing things there's no reason to upgrade.
post #24 of 49
I wonder if this is a response to how bad Lion Server Is. If you have not tried Lion Server, it I absolutely horrible compared to Snow Leopard server.....
post #25 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post

I wonder if this is a response to how bad Lion Server Is. If you have not tried Lion Server, it I absolutely horrible compared to Snow Leopard server.....

Huh? Lion Server is the world's most advanced server operating system. It's fantastic technology.
post #26 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bwinski View Post

This would be a monster step forward for every user of Sl that's just on the ragged edge of having a great experience/setup on that platform but not being able to transition to Lion. This will keep MILLIONS of users smiling...

Apple has to reach the half million paid user base first before they can keep millions smiling.
I'm not sure they would get 'millions' even if it were a free service.
They have a ways to go.
post #27 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Yes, but in this case the computer doesn't do the job you want it to do (run Lion and iCloud), therefore that's the reason to upgrade.

The way you are phrasing it is kind of a circular logic (It does what I want it to do so I shouldn't have to upgrade it to make it do that thing that I want it to do, that it doesn't actually do).

Are you just being cute?

What I'm saying is that I found it irritating that I should replace my tower (2700.00) and laptop (1895.00) because they are taking away the sync feature I've been paying 100$ a year since there is a fee. It would be great if they just gave a bit of syncing capability to older machines. It would less smell like we are removing features so you addicted lazy people HAVE to buy new machines.
post #28 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

The surprise would be if SL offered the full iCloud experience. Many of iCloud's basic features are simple repackaged standards: IMAP for mail, vCards for contacts, CalDAV for events. In other words, the same technology MobileMe uses. I could see the file syncing not making it to SL becuase that's probably a pretty advance implementation of WebDAV to sync fragments of files and leverages a lot of the same code as AutoSave and Versions in Lion.

If iCloud doesn't support SL in at least some minimal fashion, Apple risks losing a lot of people to alternative services such as Google. As much as Apple would love everyone to upgrade to Lion, I think they'd also also prefer to keep those who don't upgrade drinking the kool-aid so they can be influenced to upgrade at some point in the future. Otherwise once someone starts using another service they may not easily come back for iCloud later.

Precisely. If Apple fails to support these basic services, every MobileMe subscriber who can't or who'd prefer not to upgrade to Lion would be dramatically downgraded. I'd like to think that Apple has finally heard the protests.
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post #29 of 49
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Originally Posted by Mode View Post

I'm not sure they would get 'millions' even if it were a free service.

More people use Apple's Game Center than do Xbox Live and Game Center SUCKS.

So

Originally posted by Marvin

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post #30 of 49
They'd get a lot more people buying Lion if they just added Rosetta support.

People don't want to just throw away the apps they have spent a lot of time and money on. In a perfect world, if you are rich like Steve Jobs, you can afford every new platform or OS or processor or software change. Many of us can't do that.
post #31 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuffyzDead View Post

My single iMac Core Duo, out of a 4 Apple Computer Home Network, is the sole machine that cannot support Lion.

Yet I want doc synchronization, a la iCloud !!!

I had actually been researching upgrading the CPU to a Core 2 Duo, and all the mess that entails, just to support Lion.

Now, I will want to wait and see.

I have the same machine and a newer one that I haven't upgraded yet so yeah, great news!
post #32 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by eksodos View Post

Huh? Lion Server is the world's most advanced server operating system. It's fantastic technology.

You have got to be kidding... Lion Server Broke just about everything that was working in Snow Leopard. The fact that it does not correctly support virtual hosts is horrible...
post #33 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

They'd get a lot more people buying Lion if they just added Rosetta support.

People don't want to just throw away the apps they have spent a lot of time and money on. In a perfect world, if you are rich like Steve Jobs, you can afford every new platform or OS or processor or software change. Many of us can't do that.

You are absolutely correct, and I think Apple has moved far to quickly to squash PPC apps.
I would have already upgraded if not for this fact.
I specifically purchased a new Mac this year BEFORE Lion was released so I would not be forced to use it. I made that decision after learning that Lion would not support Rosetta.

Apple's developer community must be thrilled by this move, however. I know I have been spending cash trying to update apps from PPC to Intel, in preparation for the inevitable move. Unfortunately, some of the apps I use are no longer supported, so I will have to purchase new apps to replace them. Not happy about it.
post #34 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Applecation View Post

You are absolutely correct, and I think Apple has moved far to quickly to squash PPC apps.
I would have already upgraded if not for this fact.
I specifically purchased a new Mac this year BEFORE Lion was released so I would not be forced to use it. I made that decision after learning that Lion would not support Rosetta.

Apple's developer community must be thrilled by this move, however. I know I have been spending cash trying to update apps from PPC to Intel, in preparation for the inevitable move. Unfortunately, some of the apps I use are no longer supported, so I will have to purchase new apps to replace them. Not happy about it.

When you consider 1) the number of years since the Apple has been using Intel chips, 2) the average usage of a computer, and 3) the growth rate of Macs I wouldn't think there are too many people inconvenienced by Lion. And shouldn't you blame the app maker for not upgrading their app? After all, it's been over 6 years since Apple announced the transition. How many decades should Apple support legacy code for lazy developers and at what expense? Do you think they should also be supporting Motorola chips because some app developers never made the transition to PPC?
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post #35 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Applecation View Post

You are absolutely correct, and I think Apple has moved far to quickly to squash PPC apps.

Stock phrase here: "Tech changes. Get over it."

You can go with Apple and have current software that runs well on current hardware or you can go with Microsoft and run Windows 3.1 and every single Windows application ever created on any computer made today. That's the price you pay for compatibility.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

And shouldn't you blame the app maker for not upgrading their app?

I'll answer that: Yes, you should.

Originally posted by Marvin

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post #36 of 49
It would be a huge mistake not to bring Snow Leopard into the cloud.

It would be a good idea to Leopard into the cloud as there are a great many PPC Macs still out there (and will be for quite some time to come) which are EOL at Leopard.

Simply put, it increases the number of potential customers appreciably.
post #37 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by RBR View Post

Simply put, it increases the number of potential customers appreciably.

And the load on Apple's FREE TO THE USERS service appreciably. Servers don't run on magic.

How about lets not let the PowerPC crowd use iCloud and just leave it to people with

1. Modern computers
2. Modern OS'

And who are part of a much smaller user base so that we don't have the system crash on launch day and stay down for a month?

The fewer people using iCloud, the better. At least at the start so that Apple can slowly scale it up as more people buy new computers.

Originally posted by Marvin

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post #38 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by RBR View Post

It would be a huge mistake not to bring Snow Leopard into the cloud.

It would be a good idea to Leopard into the cloud as there are a great many PPC Macs still out there (and will be for quite some time to come) which are EOL at Leopard.

Simply put, it increases the number of potential customers appreciably.

You've got to be kidding right? iCloud for a 4 year old OS that it's successor has been surpassed by a newer operating system? The last PowerPC's were sold five years ago, time to move on.

Although the chances are, Apple is using the POWER7 architecture (a successor to POWER4 which the PowerPC 970 [G5] ran on) for iCloud.
post #39 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGJ View Post

You've got to be kidding right? iCloud for a 4 year old OS that it's successor has been surpassed by a newer operating system? The last PowerPC's were sold five years ago, time to move on.

Although the chances are, Apple is using the POWER7 architecture (a successor to POWER4 which the PowerPC 970 [G5] ran on) for iCloud.

"I kid you not." (Jack Parr) One of the sales point that Apple always makes is that their machines have a longer service life than most PCs. Besides, we are talking about a "thin client" setup whenever you are "in the Cloud" and it simply can't be that difficult to accomplish. Failure to do so will likely cause people to simply ignore iCloud, perhaps forever and maybe Apple along the way.

I am not too sure that anyone outside of Apple actually knows what platform will be used for the server center. Unless there has been a major change recently, the servers are a contract bit. Apple has gone through several of them trying to get the discussion forums working right and still has problems.

I am also not too sure that it really matters what the platform (or OS for that matter) may be. Most server farms are now run with anything the client wants in virtualization anyway. The whole idea of "the cloud" is data anyway and data really does not care much about the system it sits on.

If I had to guess, Apple really would not be too fond of using an IBM system anyway. The divorce was a bit messy.

Cheers

[Edit]

P.S. The Snow Leopard bit is probably more important than most people think as there is going to be a reluctance of many users in the professional environment to move to Lion any time soon for a variety of reasons such as just plain not liking it to the fact that it will take some time for the bugs to get worked out in Lion and various and sundry app related issues that will keep many a professional on Snow Leopard for some time to come. They don't care about having the latest offering. They care about getting work done and stability. (How many times have professionals waited for the dot two release before making the commitment to trying to make things work?)
post #40 of 49
Decided to upgrade to Lion Not a fresh install.

Runs pretty damn fast, I can tell a huge difference between lion and Snow Leopard in terms of speed: Lion is faster

How do I sync everything with iCloud? I thought it was possible, lol.
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