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University study finds students with Apple's iPad perform better - Page 2

post #41 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Thanks for providing the link to the actual source that AI forgot to include.


Ah. Now we see why AI "forgot" to include it.

Oh for crying out loud, this study was from 18 students? Good grief. Why do I even come here anymore.
post #42 of 67
Quote:
One study found that "students who annotated text on their iPads scored 25% higher on questions regarding information transfer than their paper-based peers."

Compare Apples to apples, please. How did they do compared to students who annotated text in their textbooks? Or took decent notes? Or did anything other than pick their nose?

How did the students playing Angry Birds on their iPad do vs. kids who took notes on paper?

And if we're comparing those kids who left their iPads at home or destroyed them vs. those who were active enough to remember, causation is pretty much too strong.

(And as others have pointed out... n = 18? I HATE social scientists who take themselves seriously and have the nerve to make serious claims, not that I know these guys have.)

[And though Al Gore's app is pretty cool...]
There's nothing magic about iPads. There's something magic about open minds.
post #43 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Correlation is not causation.

Agreed. In fact, even the correlation is questionable.
post #44 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

Guys, I was FAILING college. Then I bought an iPad and now I'm acing. Explain that!

lol just kidding, this is all nonsense glad to see people point it out though

Yes, people have dismissed this as nonsense without having the faintest idea what the methodology was, which is always a great idea. Glad it warmed your heart.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #45 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kvnptrck11 View Post

Go to acu.edu/connected

There's a lot of "studies" shown and the papers that have been published. All I'm saying is studies done on 18 students at a private university yield statistically insignificant results. Everyone has their own thoughts about this but I recommend reading the studies from their original source. Don't think I dislike any iDevice, I just dislike how this "study" is reporting its results.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Thanks for providing the link to the actual source that AI forgot to include.


Ah. Now we see why AI "forgot" to include it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

Oh for crying out loud, this study was from 18 students? Good grief. Why do I even come here anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rufwork View Post

(And as others have pointed out... n = 18? I HATE social scientists who take themselves seriously and have the nerve to make serious claims, not that I know these guys have.)

Just noting the irony of a bunch of people deciding, sans evidence, that the methodology of the study must be useless or was very casually conducted, while immediately taking up an unsubstantiated (and apparently made up out of whole cloth) figure of "18 students" as proof of same.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #46 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by rufwork View Post

Compare Apples to apples, please. How did they do compared to students who annotated text in their textbooks? Or took decent notes? Or did anything other than pick their nose?

How did the students playing Angry Birds on their iPad do vs. kids who took notes on paper?

And if we're comparing those kids who left their iPads at home or destroyed them vs. those who were active enough to remember, causation is pretty much too strong.

(And as others have pointed out... n = 18? I HATE social scientists who take themselves seriously and have the nerve to make serious claims, not that I know these guys have.)

[And though Al Gore's app is pretty cool...]
There's nothing magic about iPads. There's something magic about open minds.

Yes, I'm sure none of this occurred to the researchers, who probably just wandered into a class for the first time completely unaware of possible complicating factors. And I have no doubt that no one thought to lock down these iPads so that students couldn't download games, because who would ever think of that?

After all, these problems occurred to you, and who could be smarter than you?
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #47 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

Guys, I was FAILING college. Then I bought an iPad and now I'm acing. Explain that!

lol just kidding, this is all nonsense glad to see people point it out though

Just kidding? So you're still failing? Get back to your homework!
post #48 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

I'm not sure where this is going to lead to. There are going to be an awful lot of iHaters out there saying that it's unfair for Apple to have reign over education and that they'd rather see 'open source' tablets that are cheaper or something to that effect. Apple is definitely going to take the lead in pilot programs. The iHaters continue to keep saying that $500+ is too expensive and I don't see it. They're getting a very high quality tablet with an excellent ecosystem that developers love. All iPads are basically the same unlike those various Android tablets with altered UIs. It appears that Apple is going to be around for a long time so there doesn't seem like any risk of them going out of business. Apple also seems to have the most cash reserve to just about get anything done in regards to design and manufacturing.

The only problem Apple might have is a good one, and that is, will Apple/Foxconn and various component vendors be able to keep up with iPad demand. If Apple were to really lock down the educational sector and actually change schools from textbooks to digital learning with iPads, it would be a really, really huge win for Apple. It would go back to the days when Apple was a leader of placing computers in the school system. The sky would be the limit. Maybe Apple should just start building factories on its own. I'm probably just getting carried away, but if students, teachers and school management really think iPads are worthwhile for learning, maybe Apple has a chance to make a breakthrough like never before. I sure hope it's true that students are able to study better with iPads than plain textbooks. That would be a great advance for overall education. I sure hope Apple doesn't blow this chance in some unexpected way.

An Apple II with two floppy drives (no hard disk) and monochrome monitor was about $2K, as I remember it, which is probably about $4K in 2011 dollars and education bought them in droves, so the $500 price shouldn't be an issue. Print textbooks are also very expensive.

But having said that, while this might be a great tool for college students, I would be a little more wary for elementary schools students who need to learn to read and need to put pen to paper, which leads to all kinds of cognitive advances too detailed to go into here.

Furthermore, while I'm sure having textbooks on the iPad improved efficiency, would they not have had the same efficiency (or even greater, since the keyboard is better) on a laptop? Also, I've seen other surveys that claimed that college students (surprisingly) still prefered their textbooks in print form.
post #49 of 67
In other news, students from families with higher incomes outperform students from families with lower incomes....
post #50 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

In other news, students from families with higher incomes outperform students from families with lower incomes....

Because, again, a study such as this probably just asked kids with iPads how they were doing, instead of, oh, I dunno, doing a pilot program where they provided some classes with iPads to see how they performed compared to those without.

Because, obviously, whatever this so called "university" is, it probably involves a bunch of morons and Apple fanboys who couldn't be bothered to even pretend to have a way of getting useful data before telling everyone about it. Because by God that's what builds a reputation for a university-- making childish mistakes with your public projects that everyone can instantly detect!
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #51 of 67
+1 I'd like to see more studies on the effect of the iPad on the human EYEs, especially children and teenagers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

That's pretty cool. I'd like to see more studies on the effect of the iPad on education.
post #52 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post

In other news, tuition fees have been increased starting this year, by exactly $500.

And perhaps the researchers on this study missed correlation ≠ causation because they were busy playing Angry Birds in Stats?

There should be a study of playing Angry Birds on ipad will boost your brain.
post #53 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Just noting the irony of a bunch of people deciding, sans evidence, that the methodology of the study must be useless or was very casually conducted, while immediately taking up an unsubstantiated (and apparently made up out of whole cloth) figure of "18 students" as proof of same.

Judging by all the people you've quoted throughout this thread I'd say there should be more studies about how we can get people to learn.
post #54 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

Exactly.

More like rich students have more resources and time for their studies than poor students struggling to pay tuition.

We lack details about the test group, but it is possible they accounted for 'the rich factor' in their study.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #55 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ipen View Post

There should be a study of playing Angry Birds on ipad will boost your brain.

I know you are trying to be funny but there have actually been studies about using games such as sudoku and crosswords puzzles as 'brain exercise' to slow dementia and memory loss. They would probably include physics games like Angry Birds as well

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #56 of 67
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post #57 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

One of the people he quoted has more than a decade of experience working with researchers to design exactly this sort of qualitative methodology, certainly enough to appreciate that the researchers in question have wisely chosen not to publish results at this time; more wisely, it seems, than AI's jumping to conclusion from a handful of off-the-cuff comments.

So someone who should know better jumped on the "18 students" thing without bothering to check if it were true. I guess we all make mistakes.

"Wisely chosen not to publish their results at this time"? You are truly and utterly full of shit.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #58 of 67
I go for the theory that smarter people prefer Apple products. People who prefer Apple products are more likely to be early iPad adopters.
From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
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From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
Long on AAPL so biased
Google Motto "You're not the customer. You're the product."
Reply
post #59 of 67
One shudders to think of what constitutes a "learning moment" at a Christian university, tech-assisted or otherwise.
post #60 of 67
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post #61 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

One of the people he quoted has more than a decade of experience working with researchers to design exactly this sort of qualitative methodology, certainly enough to appreciate that the researchers in question have wisely chosen not to publish results at this time; more wisely, it seems, than AI's jumping to conclusion from a handful of off-the-cuff comments.

You design studies like this yet didn't feel compelled to respond the people addabox did?
You either need to take more pride in your work or be honest with us about the work you really do.
post #62 of 67
deleted
post #63 of 67
I have found that the iPad is not that great for college so far. I bought an iPad2 in hopes that I would be able to have all my textbooks on the iPad, but none of my textbooks are in a digital format. I found Evernote's Peek to be a great app in studying for a quiz. I think that for the iPad to work, universities need to embrace it and start making specific apps for the iPad or get the textbook publishers to start pushing out digital copies of their books.
post #64 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

You would do well to read a thread before replying to it.

I noted only that the researchers in question have not chosen to publish any conclusions about their data, in contrast to the attention-grabbing headline about here on AI.

It was actually in reading this thread that led me to doubt your claim of having spent ten years designing tests like this one.
post #65 of 67
I imagine that the researchers have "chosen not to publish their results at this time" because people died, it turned out iPads cause brain damage and the methodology involved little more than watching reruns of "Welcome Back, Kotter" while playing Angry Birds. It's a huge scandal that will set back electronic learning by decades.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #66 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Correlation is not causation.

Agreed, hand a student an iPad instead of pen & paper & suddenly a student who once never took notes or paid attention finds a new interest in taking notes. Give it a few years when the nostalgia has worn of & I'm sure there will be little difference.

I will say however, an iPad is a much handier tool for school than lugging a ton of books around and has more possibilities when you start talking about interactive content but that is more to do with the content & method of interaction with students. Credit there goes to the device only as a window of opportunity and not as the opportunity itself.

I personally love the idea of using more technology in education but I do not believe it should become the education. Too many kids already can't do math without a calculator or write/read cursive, it's just plain ridiculous. These kids get in the real world where they have to do work that isn't actually fun & they whine about life being unfair. Learning how to self discipline is an extremely important part of education.
post #67 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by sternapples53 View Post

We need good teachers not tech toys in the classroom.

And yet these are few and far between.

Back when I was at school most of the teachers just got us to write crap from the board which was just stuff taken from the teacher's edition.

Now I put it to you why the hell do we need teachers for that when an iPad could do a better job of making learning more fun?

For instance what if there was an app that allowed us to mix chemicals together and show us the results? Chemicals that are too expensive for classrooms? We'd have more people interested in chemistry.

Interactive patients without the setup costs? More people interested in biology, anatomy, better class of doctors because they can learn when they want wherever they are.

This simply cannot be done in a classroom.

What's more is on average you have 30 kids to one teacher. It is IMPOSSIBLE to teach everyone reliably and how they need to be taught. As a result some kids are getting left behind because the teacher either has given up on them, doesn't have the resources to tailor their teaching methods, or simply doesn't have time to invest in one student beyond normal school day. An iPad will NEVER leave a child behind although the child might leave it behind.

I don't think an iPad could replace a teacher but it can definitely help the child beyond the classroom. The child being able to learn at his/her own pace is far better than having a teacher give up on them. Trust me, it sucks having a teacher disregard you simply because they think you're dumb. As a result we play up and mess around. I learnt more out of school than I did in it. About the only thing I did learn at school is that if you twist three wires together and place them in a power socket and turn the power on a great big spark flies out across the table and blows the fuse to two desks. :-)
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