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Steve Jobs contacted Samsung in 2010 to resolve Apple patent dispute - Page 2

post #41 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wovel View Post

That is the photo Samsung puts in their ads... Catching on yet?

Where?
post #42 of 134
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post #43 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by walshbj View Post

Hard to argue with this comparison of Samsung and Apple

http://www.reddit.com/tb/kr14a

The top rated comment in that thread does a pretty good job of demolishing that image. Considering the fact that it's posted in the Apple sub-forum in the first place.

Here you go:

Quote:
Ok I am sick and tired of seeing this shit here. Apple makes good products, but it is currently trying to keep competitors off the market. Not a good sign, if you have better products they will sell anyway. You are not supposed to be able to patent obvious things. A thin bezel around a tablet screen? Well holy fuck - the point of a tablet is to have the whole thing to be a screen! It is obvious.

The store is probably just some crappy samsung licensed reseller doing a bad job.

The plug- so now Apple owns the IP for a fucking square? Are you kidding me?

A box with the picture of the product on it? Oh my fucking god, Steve Jobs is a genius and no one would ever have thought of such a concept had he not developed this while he was at Apple.

When you open the box ... YOU SEE THE PRODUCT. Only Apple is supposed to be allowed to ship products! Competitors must only be allowed to sell non functional fakes!

A standard USB cable with the USB logo on it going to a proprietary connector! Without Apple no one would ever have the idea to use a common connector to interface with more obscure hardware, never-mind the fact that USB was designed by Intel with help from other companies.

A voice recording application with a picture of a microphone? Another brilliant innovation by Apple. It's not like the microphone hasn't been the de facto symbol for mic in/voice recording since... ever...

Posts like this are why people hate Apple fanboys.

You can love Apple's products and services, without being a blind fanboy (I'm not implying you are one btw). These patent wars are an absolute joke.
post #44 of 134
I think Apple was trying to pull the same stunt with Samsung as they did years earlier with Diamond Multimedia and it back fired...
post #45 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by shen View Post

The people who would comment here, yes.

Just last night the mother in-law whipped out her samsung POS and said "I haven't used iTunes and put music on it and i don't have apps or anything, because it is one of the first iPhones. I am waiting to get a new one before i do that, this one is too slow and old."

It amazes me the degree to which people think their knowledge and abilities transfer to others. Most of the population are not card carrying geeks who know this stuff. That is what most of Androids sales are made on the back of...

I am not expecting others to be "card carrying geeks who know this stuff". I don't expect my knowledge and abilities to transfer to others. I just expect that most people can read the box, or know someone who can read the box (I guess I assume most people who buy these phones are not illiterate).

I seriously doubt that "most of Android sales" are made by trickery. I have been in my local AT&T store (official store) and I EVERY time I hear a salesperson touting the advantages of an Android phone over and iPhone. They make it VERY CLEAR that this "fantastic Android phone" is better than Apple's phone. They are not telling customers that the Android phone they are selling them is, in fact, an iPhone.
post #46 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

OMG. People are NOT BEING TRICKED into buying a Samsung phone thinking it is an Apple product.

That's not the issue. The issue is the diluting of Apple's brand. Apple spends a lot of time, effort, and money on their designs; they are not a cookie-cutter company. They sell their products based on the designs. Everybody knows this.

So, when lazy Samsung decides to glom onto Apple's "cool factor" by stealing Apple's designs, it makes Apple's products look less special. Apple's brand is no longer distinct.

Samsung has got to be the dumbest company on the face of the earth, because they are willing to risk an almost $9 billion dollar supplier relationship with Apple just so a couple of their products can have cases that look like Apple's.
post #47 of 134
Samsung will do what they have to do to make money. Apple will do what they will have to do to make money. Personally I love apple and I dont care what the courts end up finding at the end. The iphone changed the phone game and people are copying. Samsung goes too far with the copying as a result I am personally boycotting ANY Samsung product. People/consumers should do what they feel is right.

http://www.reddit.com/tb/kr14a



Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Before the patent battle between Apple and Samsung became a worldwide legal mess, Apple co-founder Steve Jobs reportedly initiated contact with Samsung in an attempt to resolve the issues out of court.

Jobs was said to have reached out to Samsung in July of 2010, initiating negotiations between Apple and Samsung, Apple attorneys told an Australian court this week. But Jobs was no longer involved once the actual talks over Samsung's Galaxy S smartphone began, according to Bloomberg.

"Samsung is an important supplier with whom we have a deep relationship," Apple patent attorney Richard Lutton reportedly said in court on Thursday. "We wanted to give them a chance to do the right thing."

Those negotiations proved unsuccessful, which led Apple to file a patent infringement suit against Samsung in April, accusing it of copying the look and feel of the iPhone and iPad. Samsung quickly fired back with its own accusations, and the two companies are now involved in lawsuits that spread across four continents.

Based on the popularity of products like the iPhone and iPad, Apple is said to be the largest customer of rival Samsung, from which it buys components like chips and memory. Earlier this year it was estimated that Apple would buy some $7.8 billion in parts from Samsung.



But that number may have shifted as Apple looks elsewhere for components. For example, Apple is said to have inked a deal with another chipmaker, Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co., for new mobile processors that will power future iPhone and iPad models.

Earlier this month, it was also said that Apple has begun purchasing memory from Japan to reduce its reliance on Samsung. The iPhone maker has reportedly aligned with Toshiba and Elpida Memory for orders of DRAM and NAND flash.
post #48 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mock Turtleneck View Post

The top rated comment in that thread does a pretty good job of demolishing that image. Considering the fact that it's posted in the Apple sub-forum in the first place.

Here you go:



You can love Apple's products and services, without being a blind fanboy (I'm not implying you are one btw). These patent wars are an absolute joke.


That's a good job? It sounds like the typical ignorant internet android fan rantings to me.

Anyone who looks at this stuff can see that Samsung is blatantly copying it. Anyone who isn't a biased fanboy anyway.

But we also know that this is the real world, and that everyone copies everyone. So did they copy it enough to break the law? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Or a judge.
post #49 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mock Turtleneck View Post

The top rated comment in that thread does a pretty good job of demolishing that image. Considering the fact that it's posted in the Apple sub-forum in the first place.

Here you go:
etc. etc. etc.

You can love Apple's products and services, without being a blind fanboy (I'm not implying you are one btw). These patent wars are an absolute joke.

I really wonder if anyone has ever stepped back and said to themselves, "Hmmmm... if the general public thinks that these patent wars are a joke then what does Apple think? Cannot they see that this appears really lame to a lot of people? Cannot they also see that people will think they are trying to stifle competition? Hmmmmm... why would they take the risk of possibly damaging their reputation to pursue these patent wars?".

In my opinion, there's something much deeper here and if Steve went to Samsung beforehand then that heightens my suspicions even more. Is about egos? Possibly. I think it goes deeper (and, yes, I've said it before). I think that Samsung broke a trust that is not provable in court and Apple is going after them in any way it can.

To me this all sounds like it's Steve's baby and I'd really like to know what Tim Cook "really" feels about this whole thing.

I'm really not sure what is right or wrong anymore because there are so many things to consider.

jmho
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post #50 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by ort View Post

That's a good job? It sounds like the typical ignorant internet android fan rantings to me.

Anyone who looks at this stuff can see that Samsung is blatantly copying it. Anyone who isn't a biased fanboy anyway.

But we also know that this is the real world, and that everyone copies everyone. So did they copy it enough to break the law? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Or a judge.

I'm not a lawyer or a judge either, but I know there are only so many ways you can make a rounded rectangle. The original Galaxy S phone does bear striking similarities to the 3GS despite the size I'll give you that. But the Galaxy Tab Apple's been trying so desperately to get it banned? Hardly.
post #51 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

Thanks for the personal attack. My statement stands.

I think you'll find I was responding to smaceslin's idiotic statement, not to anything that you may have said, idiotic or not.
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post #52 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

I am not expecting others to be "card carrying geeks who know this stuff". I don't expect my knowledge and abilities to transfer to others. I just expect that most people can read the box, or know someone who can read the box (I guess I assume most people who buy these phones are not illiterate).

I seriously doubt that "most of Android sales" are made by trickery. I have been in my local AT&T store (official store) and I EVERY time I hear a salesperson touting the advantages of an Android phone over and iPhone. They make it VERY CLEAR that this "fantastic Android phone" is better than Apple's phone. They are not telling customers that the Android phone they are selling them is, in fact, an iPhone.

If you really think most people can read the box, you have a higher opinion of most people than modern psychology gives us reason to have. That isn't being illiterate, it is just that being able to reading, reading, and understanding it are three separate issues.

I am not saying most sales are made by trickery. In fact I suspect very very few are. It is more a matter of ignorance. People ignore what they don't care to be bothered with. A little confirmation bias, a little cognitive dissonance, next thing you know you bought the "totally way better than an iPhone" that happens to be all they have in stock. Welcome to the human mind.
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post #53 of 134
Apple Fan-boy status or not, it's not hard to see a "death by a thousand cuts" scenario affecting Samsung in this matter...any one element might be argued away, but in toto, the similarities in so many areas, from product, to UI, to packaging, to accessories, make a pretty strong case that Samsung was attempting to leverage Apple's success through infringement on Apple's IP - presuming Apple can show that the majority of what Samsung did occurred after the public disclosure of Apple's products themselves.

It doesn't help Samsung either that it appears, from what I've read so far, that most of these elements in question were very different prior to the announcements of Apple's products, and Samsung's design inspiration followed Apple...
post #54 of 134
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post #55 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

I think you'll find I was responding to smaceslin's idiotic statement, not to anything that you may have said, idiotic or not.

Yep, you are right. I missed that. Today is National Coffee Day, and yet I made a mistake because I haven't have my coffee yet.

My error. Apologies.
post #56 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

I really wonder if anyone has ever stepped back and said to themselves, "Hmmmm... if the general public thinks that these patent wars are a joke then what does Apple think?

I don't think the general public even knows there is a lawsuit. The general public can't name their congressman and thinks their OS is "internet explorer" and that their internet connection is through google. Nerds and most males under 25 might be the exception, and that is why the forums where this is so often discussed are such a joy, they involve thousands of testosterone crazed gamer virgins whose identity is all tied up in whatever product they spent their hard earned dell tech support money on.....

What does Apple think? I suspect that you are mostly right, Steve and the culture he formed at Apple would never behave like samsung has, so to them it is a breach of honor. And above mentioned males lacking identity aside, samsung copied so blatantly they should be embarrassed. But I doubt it has any chance legally.
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post #57 of 134
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post #58 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by smaceslin View Post

What was 'idiotic' about the comment?

It is idiotic because you chose to completely ignore the alleged facts being presented - in a court of law. Do you think that this would not be challenged by Samsung if it wasn't true? Do you think that Apple's legal team would, if knowing this to be untrue, say it and not expect it to be challenged? Do you think that they are that stupid?
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post #59 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by shen View Post

I don't think the general public even knows there is a lawsuit. The general public can't name their congressman and thinks their OS is "internet explorer" and that their internet connection is through google. Nerds and most males under 25 might be the exception, and that is why the forums where this is so often discussed are such a joy, they involve thousands of testosterone crazed gamer virgins whose identity is all tied up in whatever product they spent their hard earned dell tech support money on.....

What does Apple think? I suspect that you are mostly right, Steve and the culture he formed at Apple would never behave like samsung has, so to them it is a breach of honor. And above mentioned males lacking identity aside, samsung copied so blatantly they should be embarrassed. But I doubt it has any chance legally.

I include any fans or forum members as the general public... just meaning people who really don't have a clue as to what is really going on between Apple and Samsung. I was just positing the idea that if we can think then surely Apple can think it.
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post #60 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

Yep, you are right. I missed that. Today is National Coffee Day, and yet I made a mistake because I haven't have my coffee yet.

My error. Apologies.

No worries. Have and enjoy your coffee!
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post #61 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by shen View Post


I don't think the general public even knows there is a lawsuit. The general public can't name their congressman and thinks their OS is "internet explorer" and that their internet connection is through google. Nerds and most males under 25 might be the exception, and that is why the forums where this is so often discussed are such a joy, they involve thousands of testosterone crazed gamer virgins whose identity is all tied up in whatever product they spent their hard earned dell tech support money on.....

That is why Apple is focusing on the "general public" with all of its newest products.

The testosterone crazed gamer market is very small compared to the market filled with people who know nothing except "Internet Explorer", "Google" and 'iPhone". The general public has made Apple a very wealthy multinational corporation. They sell to the general public, and they don't care about the geeks or the enthusiast market.

Let Samsung cater to the geeks. Apple sells to Grandma.
post #62 of 134
And the Samsung guy said to Jobs...

"When I left you, I was but the learner; now *I* am the master!"
post #63 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by shen View Post

If you really think most people can read the box, you have a higher opinion of most people than modern psychology gives us reason to have. That isn't being illiterate, it is just that being able to reading, reading, and understanding it are three separate issues.

I am not saying most sales are made by trickery. In fact I suspect very very few are. It is more a matter of ignorance. People ignore what they don't care to be bothered with. A little confirmation bias, a little cognitive dissonance, next thing you know you bought the "totally way better than an iPhone" that happens to be all they have in stock. Welcome to the human mind.

I am not arguing psychology here. I simply stated that most people can read the box (97 - 99 percent literacy in the U.S.) and understand the difference between an Apple product and a Samsung product. IF they choose to ignore this and then claim ignorance instead of doing some basic research via a simple Google/Bing search (like the aforementioned radio celebrity who bought the side loading washer and dryer) deserve what they get.

Either way. These patent wars are out of control. Nothing good will come from them. We are just giving money to lawyers which could be used on innovation. So what if Samsung schleps a few products that are somewhat similar in appearance to the iPhone and iPad. Apple is still making a fortune and the only thing that will ruin Apple is Apple's hubris (see Sony's downfall in the digital music market). If they keep that in check, they will do well. The simple fact is NOT everyone is going to buy an Apple product.

Apple needs to accept this and move on and keep doing what they do best, create great (usually - cough Pippin cough) products. So what if Apple only makes 90% of the money they potentially could have made....it will still be in the BILLIONS of $$$. Sooner or later these copycats (as they are described here) will make a mistake and it will cost them dearly. Apple shouldn't be suing Samsung as it is a waste of money, time and energy. They SHOULD follow through with taking their semiconductor business away from Samsung as fast as possible. Not THAT will hurt Samsung.

Also, we need competitors in the market. It is just a bonus that the competitor makes a sub par product compared to Apple. Apple will do better by having someone buy a competitor's product and being disappointed with it. Apple might get new business, the competitor loses business, the competitor gets negative mind share, etc. This will have a much more profound effect that a bunch of lawyers (I hate lawyers - several friends and family members are lawyers - nothing but professional liars) siphoning $$$ from companies that could be used somewhere else.
post #64 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"We wanted to give them a chance to do the right thing."

This line was hilarious.
post #65 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by shen View Post

I don't think the general public even knows there is a lawsuit. The general public can't name their congressman and thinks their OS is "internet explorer" and that their internet connection is through google. Nerds and most males under 25 might be the exception, and that is why the forums where this is so often discussed are such a joy, they involve thousands of testosterone crazed gamer virgins whose identity is all tied up in whatever product they spent their hard earned dell tech support money on.....

What does Apple think? I suspect that you are mostly right, Steve and the culture he formed at Apple would never behave like samsung has, so to them it is a breach of honor. And above mentioned males lacking identity aside, samsung copied so blatantly they should be embarrassed. But I doubt it has any chance legally.

I find it interesting that Apple sues Samsung for copying the look and feel, but then does the following (just two simple examples):

Apple has added the notification bar to iOS 5. It looks a lot like the notification bar in Android.
Apple is touting wireless syncing in iOS 5, yet the laughed at the same feature when it was introduced in the Zune a few years ago.

Apple is not as honorable as you might think. They are a corporation out to make $$$ for their shareholders.
post #66 of 134
If there is one thing that characterizes Apple's corporate history, it is its ability to learn from its mistakes (lost bar iPhones aside). Apple should never again leave itself open to the kind of extortion and leverage that Samsung has. Too many eggs in one basket. Fortunately, they have a CEO in place who has made his reputation on supply chain management. The right man for the job.
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post #67 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Beige View Post





Consider how much disdain Samsung has for its customers when they find out there's no iTunes, no App Store, and the Samsung UI lacks the intuitiveness and elegance of iOS. Samsungs arrogance is stunning.

I think you meant to post
post #68 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerryb View Post

I wonder if Samsung believed the iPhone GUI was okay to use because Google was behind it? Why should Apple sue Samsung when it is Google that created Android? Or do they sincerely believe there is no shame in blatantly copying another company's product?

Wizard of Oz (Samsung): "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!"

Dorothy (Apple): "Why ... why ... you're nothing but a humbug!"

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post #69 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mock Turtleneck View Post

I'm not a lawyer or a judge either, but I know there are only so many ways you can make a rounded rectangle. The original Galaxy S phone does bear striking similarities to the 3GS despite the size I'll give you that. But the Galaxy Tab Apple's been trying so desperately to get it banned? Hardly.

There are so many ways that Samsung could have made the Galaxy Tab different than the iPad. Color, button placement, style of icons, different backgrounds , arrangement of icons. The iPad isn't perfect..... play on its weaknesses instead of copying.

The copier should get a boot in the keester.

I think Samsung has a stunning lack of imagination.
post #70 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by ort View Post

That's a good job? It sounds like the typical ignorant internet android fan rantings to me.

Anyone who looks at this stuff can see that Samsung is blatantly copying it. Anyone who isn't a biased fanboy anyway.

But we also know that this is the real world, and that everyone copies everyone. So did they copy it enough to break the law? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Or a judge.

Samsung is copying...

the Galaxy S in some iterations looked just like a 3GS (the T-mobile Vibrant)

Touchwhiz is not a copy of iOS but it favors it a lot (though not as much as people act like it does)

The proprietary connector (though not an apply invention) is probably one...and the USB plug MAYBE (probably)

but that picture of the store display with the wall behind it having Apple icons is not made by Apple.
post #71 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorotea9999 View Post

There are so many ways that Samsung could have made the Galaxy Tab different than the iPad. Color, button placement, style of icons, different backgrounds , arrangement of icons. The iPad isn't perfect..... play on its weaknesses instead of copying.

The copier should get a boot in the keester.

I think Samsung has a stunning lack of imagination.

let me guess...you're another person who thinks the injuntion on the Tab is based on it looking like an iPad huh?
post #72 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorotea9999 View Post

There are so many ways that Samsung could have made the Galaxy Tab different than the iPad. Color, button placement, style of icons, different backgrounds , arrangement of icons. The iPad isn't perfect..... play on its weaknesses instead of copying.

The copier should get a boot in the keester.

I think Samsung has a stunning lack of imagination.

How many TVs aren't black? There is a good reason for this as perceived contrast is higher. Even insinuating Apple has a design patent on a black bezzel is absurd. Can you imagine TV companies suing each other because they are all black glossy rectangles? Look at the picture below and tell me where you see any buttons on the bezel? Do the icons and background look like an iPad? I love my iPad because of the apps, but this whole "Apple has a patent on the glossy black rectangle" is absurd.

post #73 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

I think you'll find I was responding to smaceslin's idiotic statement, not to anything that you may have said, idiotic or not.

While I may have misspoke when stating an 'Order' was issued, I would still not be surprised (though I don't know for a fact) that Steve's legal team asked Samsung to 'cease and desist'. Calling this statement idiotic is both rude and uncalled for in this forum. This is supposed to be a place where opinions can be made without someone being rude.
post #74 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwlaw99 View Post

How many TVs aren't black? There is a good reason for this as perceived contrast is higher. Even insinuating Apple has a design patent on a black bezzel is absurd. Can you imagine TV companies suing each other because they are all black glossy rectangles? Look at the picture below and tell me where you see any buttons on the bezel? Do the icons and background look like an iPad? I love my iPad because of the apps, but this whole "Apple has a patent on the glossy black rectangle" is absurd.


I am confused...is that an iPad...an iPhone....what? So S A M S U N G is how to spell Apple these days? I now see why people were confused. It is blatant copying!!! Let keelhaul them all!!!
post #75 of 134
the estate of Stanley Kubrick is suing Apple and Steve Jobs for ripping off the design of the 2001 spaceship for the new Apple campus.

post #76 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by iKol View Post

the estate of Stanley Kubrick is suing Apple and Steve Jobs for ripping off the design of the 2001 spaceship for the new Apple campus.

Your Mother would be proud of your brilliance...
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post #77 of 134
I'm still shocked at how many people think the Tab was banned for looking like an iPad though. lol

Even the courts agreed the Tab doesn't look like an iPad.
post #78 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

Your Mother would be proud of your brilliance...

I take that as a compliment as I am synthetic, not capable of having a Mother unless you mean as in "board".
post #79 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

I'm still shocked at how many people think the Tab was banned for looking like an iPad though. lol

Even the courts agreed the Tab doesn't look like an iPad.

Enlighten us then ...
post #80 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing View Post

You went from a reasonable argument in the first paragraph to hearsay in the second paragraph. So this person couldn't read the box that clearly stated Samsung Galaxy S or what not? Really?

Trust me, you are correct in your logic, but wrong in how it actually plays out. The number 2 man in our company visited our office last month, and sat down with our Web dept lead (my boss), with a keen interest in getting tips about it "iPhone." Turns out he didn't have an iPhone. It was (shocker) an Android-powered phone. He had ZERO idea. There are a lot of (older, perhaps) people who are in fact buying these "smart" phones with zero understanding of the differentiation. They know through word-of-mouth that the iPhone is the gold standard, but somehow they are talked into another option at the point of purchase. Still, they think they have an iPhone. Totally illogical, but rampant. I know it's hard, but -- deep breath -- let your argument go.
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