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iPhone 5 4G

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
Lots of speculation about this feature in iPhone 5. I will not buy another Mac product iPhone, iPad or Macbook Air unless 4G is integrated.

I wonder how many Apple customers/users feel the same way and if this will have a negative impact on projected unit sales of iPhone 5.

Please comment
post #2 of 18
If that's your line in the sand, I think you're going to be waiting a while, presuming 4g = LTE for you.

Eventually, Verizon and ATT, and even later Sprint, will sell a 4G WiFi hotspot. Once you get that, you can use it for all of your devices. I do think it is crazy to replace your home cable/DSL/fiber broadband with an LTE modem. I don't think LTE will ever get there. But for on the go, an LTE WiFi hotspot thing will be a good short term solution.

Apple is very unlikely to ship a LTE iOS device until they can get battery life to 7+ hours for 4G browsing. That's at least a year away.
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrike View Post

If that's your line in the sand, I think you're going to be waiting a while, presuming 4g = LTE for you.

Eventually, Verizon and ATT, and even later Sprint, will sell a 4G WiFi hotspot. Once you get that, you can use it for all of your devices. I do think it is crazy to replace your home cable/DSL/fiber broadband with an LTE modem. I don't think LTE will ever get there. But for on the go, an LTE WiFi hotspot thing will be a good short term solution.

Apple is very unlikely to ship a LTE iOS device until they can get battery life to 7+ hours for 4G browsing. That's at least a year away.

Yes 4G=LTE for me. I have invested in an LTE Samsung MIFI through Verizon and it works great. The performance is unbelievable. I did this because I believe Apple is at least a year away from integration within their products.

I also believe lacking this feature will have a negative impact on iPhone 5 projected unit sales.
post #4 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

I will not buy another Mac product iPhone, iPad or Macbook Air unless 4G is integrated.

Enjoy your PCs. We don't really care.

It'll be next year at the earliest that Apple makes an LTE iPhone/iPad and it will be never at the earliest that they make a 3G-enabled laptop.
post #5 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

Yes 4G=LTE for me. I have invested in an LTE Samsung MIFI through Verizon and it works great. The performance is unbelievable. I did this because I believe Apple is at least a year away from integration within their products.

I also believe lacking this feature will have a negative impact on iPhone 5 projected unit sales.

Verizon, who appears to be the farthest ahead in LTE among carriers worldwide, is about 10% of Apple's iPhone sales. Take a partial of that 10% as obviously, not everyone requires LTE for their phone, say 50% (really really generous there), and Apple may sell 1m fewer than the analysts project 25m or so. But then again, there could be other inducements to get people to buy and would result in more sales. Who knows.

It's not that big of a deal for Apple's target market.
post #6 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Enjoy your PCs. We don't really care.

It'll be next year at the earliest that Apple makes an LTE iPhone/iPad and it will be never at the earliest that they make a 3G-enabled laptop.

Haven't owned a PC in over 25 years........
post #7 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

Haven't owned a PC in over 25 years........

You'll have to look elsewhere for phones and ultraportable laptops, though.

Windows Phone 7 is nice, if a little threadbare. Think of it as iPhone OS 1.1.4 right now.

And that one expensive MacBook Air challenger's coming out sometime late next year. Ultrabook, is it?
post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrike View Post

Verizon, who appears to be the farthest ahead in LTE among carriers worldwide, is about 10% of Apple's iPhone sales. Take a partial of that 10% as obviously, not everyone requires LTE for their phone, say 50% (really really generous there), and Apple may sell 1m fewer than the analysts project 25m or so. But then again, there could be other inducements to get people to buy and would result in more sales. Who knows.

It's not that big of a deal for Apple's target market.

You need to include the disgruntled AT&T iPhone user in your model above.

I own a 3GS on the AT&T network. And like the majority of 3GS/AT&T customers. Love the phone and hate the network. The Verizon iPhone was a ray of hope but not quite the answer. Having to hang up the call to check email is an issue and even though Verizon may have more data coverage the throughput is lacking. Except for their LTE network......

I live in downtown Washington DC and can't get service for my 3GS in my home. I had to get a house phone from the cable company to forward my cell phone to, I want to RUN from ATT.(my 4G router from Verizon works great in the house.)

My contract with AT&T is over and I will consider an iPhone 5. However, if it doesn't solve the "love the phone, hate the carrier" issue there is no reason to make the move.

Most of Apple's target market is in this situation, as you pointed out only 10% went to Verizon. Because the Verizon iPhone wasn't the answer. I fear iPhone 5 won't be the answer either.

It will be the next "thing" another nice toy but I believe it will disappoint and not live up to the hype because it falls short of solving the issue of the disgruntled 3GS/AT&T user. The iPhone5 will not meet it's current unit projections through jan 2012
post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

You'll have to look elsewhere for phones and ultraportable laptops, though.

Windows Phone 7 is nice, if a little threadbare. Think of it as iPhone OS 1.1.4 right now.

And that one expensive MacBook Air challenger's coming out sometime late next year. Ultrabook, is it?

But I can get 3G in the iPads, and iPhones today. As soon as the industry works out the power and size issues regarding the 4G LTE chipset I believe we will see this capability integrated into iPhones, iPads and the MacBook. Even apple admits not integrating 3G into their MacBooks as hurt them.

I don't see them making the same mistake twice. I agree it's a year away but that is an industry issue.
post #10 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

But I can get 3G in the iPads, and iPhones today. As soon as the industry works out the power and size issues regarding the 4G LTE chipset I believe we will see this capability integrated into iPhones, iPads

I mentioned that, yeah.

Quote:
and the MacBook

Eh, not gonna happen.\

Quote:
Even apple admits not integrating 3G into their MacBooks as hurt them.

Ooh, something I don't remember. Nice! Do you have a link to that? Or at least know what keynote that's from? I can find it from there.

Quote:
I don't see them making the same mistake twice.

They got close in aught seven (even built a working prototype MacBook Pro with a slide-up antenna), but didn't. They obviously had a reason. Maybe we WILL see LTE built in to the MacBook family once third-gen LTE chips come out, we'll have to see.
post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

You need to include the disgruntled AT&T iPhone user in your model above.

I don't think there are many of those, disgruntled AT&T iPhone users. If there were, there would have been an explosion of Verizon iPhone customers earlier this year. The reported churn rates from carriers are generally 1% to 2%. Even Sprints downward spiral of a few years ago was a slow, small loss of customers on the order of 0.5 to 1m customers per quarter after quarter.

In addition, iPhone customer satisfaction rates are industry leading on the order of 80 to 90%.

Quote:
I own a 3GS on the AT&T network. And like the majority of 3GS/AT&T customers. Love the phone and hate the network. The Verizon iPhone was a ray of hope but not quite the answer. Having to hang up the call to check email is an issue and even though Verizon may have more data coverage the throughput is lacking. Except for their LTE network......

There aren't a lot of people who hate the "network". It's all empty talk. If they truly hated their network, churn rates would be much higher. It could be the case that all carriers suck, people recognize that and thusly, their words aren't met with action.

Quote:
I live in downtown Washington DC and can't get service for my 3GS in my home. I had to get a house phone from the cable company to forward my cell phone to, I want to RUN from ATT.(my 4G router from Verizon works great in the house.)

My ATT 3GS has horrible service in my house (radiant barrier, grrr). Unfortunately, all carriers suck in my house. A 500 MHz frequency band network might have a shot, but that isn't coming.

Quote:
My contract with AT&T is over and I will consider an iPhone 5. However, if it doesn't solve the "love the phone, hate the carrier" issue there is no reason to make the move.

Most of Apple's target market is in this situation, as you pointed out only 10% went to Verizon. Because the Verizon iPhone wasn't the answer. I fear iPhone 5 won't be the answer either.

It will be the next "thing" another nice toy but I believe it will disappoint and not live up to the hype because it falls short of solving the issue of the disgruntled 3GS/AT&T user. The iPhone5 will not meet it's current unit projections through jan 2012

Apple's iPhone has industry leading customer satisfaction. Not by a little. But by a whole lot, and spanning back since its first model. Through all this time, at least in the USA, when it was on AT&T exclusively which by most accounts has the worst voice service at least in terms of dropped calls, people have continued to buy iPhones and have been the most satisfied with it.

Apple will lose customers certainly due to people who value LTE over an iPhone w/o LTE, but I think you're way overestimating the number of those people. It's not most, it's not some, it's not a few. It's going to be something pretty small. 1m? I think that number is too high. 500k? Maybe.
post #12 of 18
I have a 3gs, and I will not upgrade until the iphone goes 4g


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post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by DustinX View Post

I have a 3gs, and I will not upgrade until the iphone goes 4g

Do you live somewhere that 4G exists?
post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Do you live somewhere that 4G exists?

Just assume that the poster does. Individual people have specific needs, wants, and desires for a device they have to pay money for. For some, it is LTE. For others, it is 64 GB storage, larger screen, longer battery life, better GPU, T-Mobile AWS compatibility, ad infinitum. The problem is of course, some individual thinks his or her needs represent the overall market or the conventional wisdom. Apple isn't your typical company when it comes to that.

For Apple: the needs of the many outweigh the needs of a few, or the one. Eyes on the prize, they have to balance technical features, usability features with cost and schedule and wrapped in elegance and simplicity. They have to get the right balance for the largest population possible because they just ship one or two devices a year. This does not mean every feature gets in. They choose the features they want to advance, that's strategic to them, and delay other features to get there.

And as Jobs has stated before, if they does lose some customers, it's ok.

I do have an interesting anecdote. One of my co-workers waited anxiously for about 6 weeks to get the Droid Thunderbolt to replace a Droid Eris. After asking how LTE is, he says LTE is never turned-on on the phone! Because of the obviously, it drains the battery too fast and the bandwidth from LTE isn't that necessary for him, and he's satisfied with it being on CDMA. There's always pros and cons to certain features. Not all people will be like that, but it should be illustrative that not all people will be the contrary either: LTE-on all the time.

Those who want it, should get another phone or wait. For others, the iPhone is one of many options. Apple will put together a set of features that they think makes the best all around phone. Their track record on doing this well is pretty good.
post #15 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

Lots of speculation about this feature in iPhone 5. I will not buy another Mac product iPhone, iPad or Macbook Air unless 4G is integrated.

I wonder how many Apple customers/users feel the same way and if this will have a negative impact on projected unit sales of iPhone 5.
Please comment

Remember midway through the first iphone? The forum was full of similar statements regarding 3G. If you have stuff that will last you until this happens, then it shouldn't be of any concern. I'm sure we'll see it once it's practical to integrate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

But I can get 3G in the iPads, and iPhones today. As soon as the industry works out the power and size issues regarding the 4G LTE chipset I believe we will see this capability integrated into iPhones, iPads and the MacBook. Even apple admits not integrating 3G into their MacBooks as hurt them.

I don't see them making the same mistake twice. I agree it's a year away but that is an industry issue.

Same mistake on what? This is the same thing as when people said they wouldn't buy a mac without lightpeak/thunderbolt two years before it debuted.
post #16 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

Lots of speculation about this feature in iPhone 5. I will not buy another Mac product iPhone, iPad or Macbook Air unless 4G is integrated.

I wonder how many Apple customers/users feel the same way and if this will have a negative impact on projected unit sales of iPhone 5.

Please comment

Unfortunately, by "4G", they probably mean HSPA +. I wish Apple would get on the actual 4G, LTE bandwagon, as it's much faster than HSPA+...in real time/average speeds. I have an Iphone 4 for my primary phone, and a HTC Thunderbolt, and Motorola Bionic, and the LTE speeds on average, that I've gotten is 17-24mbps on the downlink. Again, that's not how fast it can get...just the average, daily speed. That would be a true upgraded feature. There is a chance I'd get the Iphone 5 with a larger screen, dual core processor, and better camera, but added LTE would guarantee that I get it.
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post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by briankeith513 View Post

I wish Apple would get on the actual 4G, LTE bandwagon

They are. All the chips that exist suck eggs, so they're not going to waste their time with trash until the chips are ready and the networks exist.

Quote:
but added LTE would guarantee that I get it.

2012 at the earliest.
post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewoliv View Post

Lots of speculation about this feature in iPhone 5. I will not buy another Mac product iPhone, iPad or Macbook Air unless 4G is integrated.

I wonder how many Apple customers/users feel the same way and if this will have a negative impact on projected unit sales of iPhone 5.

Please comment

- The networks couldn't cope with Macs having 4G. (my data usage on iPad is 5x that on iPhone and on a Mac would be more still)

- 4G networks are barely deployed globally (so limited market for Apple to sell to)

- 3G networks don't seem (to me) to bottleneck in the technology but rather the network capacity and coverage.

- Battery life probably isn't acceptable on 4G yet.

Also iPhones and iPads aren't Mac products!
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