or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Sprint buys 30.5M iPhones from Apple for $20B in 'bet-the-company' move
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Sprint buys 30.5M iPhones from Apple for $20B in 'bet-the-company' move - Page 4

post #121 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

If BGR is correct, the reverse will be true. Sprint will get a six month exclusive on the 5, and the other two will get the 4S for six months.

I can see how that could happen if they still aren't able to ramp up production of the iPhone 5 at this point. But then I have to wonder what the hell could the iPhone 5 have in that would require nearly 2 years from the iPhone 4 release before it can be released completely.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #122 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

It makes no sense at all. Sprint has a small fraction of the customer base of ATT and Verizon. We nearly have a duopoly in the US.

Well I agree, but perhaps a duopoly does Apple no good...and they know that.
post #123 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I hope this is true because I've been camping out in front of my Sprint store for the last month.

Is a flag pole involved?
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #124 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corporate View Post

Then at the end Steve Jobs comes out and says 'Oh and 1 more thing....here is the iPhone 5 with the same specs as the 4S for those of you who want a bigger screen. And we mananged to keep the retina display too!"

'And we have a new message service. It's for free. And face time does not count towards your data usage. And we actually eliminated the carrier networks. So you'll have endless call time.
Oh, and it works great with AppleTV. Now you can watch your favorite movie while on a conference call with your friends from over the world. And conference video call as well. And while you're on the phone, just send your photo or file immediately. No need to create an email or sending a mms parallel to your call.' (just bumping out of bounds with my mind)
'One more thing: this is how you pay with your phone. With iCoins'
post #125 of 181
Perhaps the only exclusivity will be the LTE available radio, but only for a quarter or two. Who knows.

Perhaps it's just an exclusivity on unlimited plans for a year at pricing far below AT&T and Verizon.
post #126 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cykz View Post

'And we have a new message service. It's for free. And face time does not count towards your data usage. And we actually eliminated the carrier networks. So you'll have endless call time.
Oh, and it works great with AppleTV. Now you can watch your favorite movie while on a conference call with your friends from over the world. And conference video call as well. And while you're on the phone, just send your photo or file immediately. No need to create an email or sending a mms parallel to your call.' (just bumping out of bounds with my mind)
'One more thing: this is how you pay with your phone. With iCoins'

While reading your post I was thinking you were going to make a point. But it never came.
post #127 of 181
apple should just buy out sprint, in total, and while fixing their network, slowly convert all the at&t's and verizon's to the new player in the game.

apple surely has enough money. it will be sticky at the start but it would be revolutionary and eventually let at&t and verizon know that the game can be played in many ways.
post #128 of 181
The struggle and delay of the IP5 all along has been about 4G. Cook said it in April that it is going to take some time to get good chipsets for LTE, and I posted in July that I was convinced the "delay" was related to 4G implementation.

With Sprint we have a carrier that has a more mature, next-gen network (Wimax) that is relatively easy to implement the technology for. I believe Apple is now willing to "fork" the iPhone for large enough orders (like for China - wait and see). And for a guaranteed sale of 30 million devices, YES, Apple will happily fork the design!

The World Phone is a great idea but there are too many network standards right now to make a decent, lightweight universal phone, and the chips are not yet up to Apple standards. But there is lots of money to be made by Apple in 2011-2012 on these custom phones, before everything becomes standardized on LTE and the IP6 World Phone can be built.

Whether we will call the Sprint phone IP5 or not is irrelevant. It will be a different phone. So what? All the software and functionality of the phone will be the same. Apple does not define itself by the stupid phone network - who cares what network standard they use? Speed is something Apple has rarely emphasized in the Jobs era. Apple is all about the user experience.

Macintosh 512Ke.......

Reply

Macintosh 512Ke.......

Reply
post #129 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Why do we assume that this is a bad deal? Why don't we assume they have done the math and see it as a reasonable risk?

Because the deal, as stated, IS a bad deal for Apple.

It'd make perfect sense for all parties if they dropped the exclusive bit, and that's why that's the true story.
post #130 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by boeyc15 View Post

Are you saying is a Sprint Wimax iP5 MUST come out the same time as a Verizon and ATT LTE iP5?

IF your presumption is that the Sprint phone is LTE also, yes makes sense Apple would not delay ATT/Verizon iP5 just for Sprint. But what if they are not all 3 LTE? I know, I know, but what if?

Then it would STILL be INCREDIBLY stupid for Apple to accommodate Apple by devoting scarce production resources to making a less profitable device rather than a more profitable one.

You need to give it up, you don't have a clue.
post #131 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by boeyc15 View Post

What you say may be true if it is correct.

But for some on here its just having some fun speculationg back and forth... waste time at work

At least that confirms my feeling that you have no business sense. Go back to being the pointless counterpoint to the rest of the world's obvious fake story, and wasting your employer's money.
post #132 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Because the deal, as stated, IS a bad deal for Apple.

It'd make perfect sense for all parties if they dropped the exclusive bit, and that's why that's the true story.

I agree, to an extent. Ergo, it's more sensible to assume something is wrong with the details of the story, rather than the accountants being stupid.
post #133 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ezduzit View Post

apple should just buy out sprint, in total, and while fixing their network, slowly convert all the at&t's and verizon's to the new player in the game.

apple surely has enough money. it will be sticky at the start but it would be revolutionary and eventually let at&t and verizon know that the game can be played in many ways.

Yes, that would be great. Profitability plunges, stock price cut in half, and ATT and Verizon stop buying iPhones.

You my friend are brilliant.
post #134 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ezduzit View Post

apple should just buy out sprint, in total, and while fixing their network, slowly convert all the at&t's and verizon's to the new player in the game.

apple surely has enough money. it will be sticky at the start but it would be revolutionary and eventually let at&t and verizon know that the game can be played in many ways.

Apple is successful because of their focus. They focus on what they do well, and what makes sense to them. Being a carrier does not make sense to them.
post #135 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

I agree, to an extent. Ergo, it's more sensible to assume something is wrong with the details of the story, rather than the accountants being stupid.

Yep - or stated more forcefully - more likely that unnamed sources being quoted by amateur writers on a rumor website are incorrect than business people paid millions to make the best decision about billions of dollars.
post #136 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilgto64 View Post

Oh yeah - and Betamax is better than VHS, just you wait and see.

Betamax totally was the better technology of the two, FWIW. The marketing battle story is interesting and was followed by a whole series of Sony proprietary techs that never gained traction, e.g., ATRACS, memory sticks, etc. Until they won one as part of a consortium with Blu-Ray, unfortunately for them, tho' at the sunset of physical optical media.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Wonder if Obama already has the new iPhone 5. He got the iPad early from Jobs.

He did, but he left it in a bar in San Francisco.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akac View Post

Personally I think it makes sense. LTE chip sets are not near being usable yet. The iPhone 5 may already be ready, except for LTE. Sprint has had WiMax for a long time now so their chipsets are more mature.

We already know there is no LTE iPhone coming until next year. So at best all this does is give Sprint a 4G iPhone sooner.

If the the 4S/5/whatever is going to support HSPA+ (a mature chipset) that gives AT&T a further leg up on Verizon for net speed (along with simultaneous data/voice) until the next iteration. If WiMax chips are small and power-sipping as well, that could make the next iPhone "semi-4G" on some networks but not others.

And that would have marketing/sales consequences for carriers. Verizon certainly wouldn't enjoy being the only 3G-capped US carrier of the new phone.

Which raises another possibililty in the one phone/two phone 4S/5 fevered speculation: Apple is waiting for an LTE chipset that meets their specs and expect it early next year, meaning the iPhone 5 could follow on only months after the 4S - in much the same shell as the 4S.....

....my two air-cents......

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

Reply
post #137 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Then it would STILL be INCREDIBLY stupid for Apple to accommodate Apple by devoting scarce production resources to making a less profitable device rather than a more profitable one.

Well, I am not sure Apple still has "scarce" production resources. More than 25M devices (current capacity) a quarter is hardly scarce, and I assume they are still increasing capacity.

At this point they are probably seeking additional opportunities, and a guaranteed order of 30M/$20B, ON TOP OF THEIR EXISTING VOLUME, would make any manufacturer, even Apple, drool. That is the size of an entire large corporation - bigger than all of Apple for most of its history.

Apple will find a way.

Macintosh 512Ke.......

Reply

Macintosh 512Ke.......

Reply
post #138 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by tt92618 View Post

Guys, there is nothing 'cool', 'smart' or 'savvy' about this. A move like this would be, if Apple actually did it, one of THE most idiotic business moves of the year if not decade. That said, it's just a dumb idea and a really bizarro story that somebody dreamed up. Just think about it. In order to believe this is true, one has to accept that:

1) Apple would spend the last 16 months developing a new and groundbreaking design, and then intentionally tie it to a carrier who represents < 18% of the subscriber market in the US, AND:

2) That Apple would do this just because that carrier promissed to buy 30.5 million phones over a four year period (just 7.6 million a year), DESPITE:

3) The fact that AT&T and Verizon sell about 24 million iPhones a year, which would be 116 million devices over the same four year period (as opposed to 30), and DESPITE:

4) The fact that it would immediately anger millions upon millions of customers who are currently locked into contracts with Verizon and / or AT&T but who would otherwise be eligible for early upgrades, and DESPITE:

5) The fact that it would massively alienate their current carrier partners.

It's just a stupid, STUPID story, with a capital 'S'.

I agree the details do not fit. BUt there's something to the Sprint story. WSJ almost always releases some juicy and accurate tidbits on the day before or the day of an Apple show-n-tell. In fact, they must have had the story before hand but agreed to hold off until the last minute. All to say, there's some kind of a deal between Sprint and Apple. Could be as simple as Sprint having to pre-commit to a certain sales figure before Apple would support them. After all, if Apple is going to offer a Spring iPhone, they will eventually have to support Wimax. The commitment may simply be the enticement for Apple to start working on it sooner rather than later.

As for BGR, I don't buy that he decided against running his story until WSJ. I believe more that he took the WSJ lead and embellished it with other possibly relevant rumors.
post #139 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Yep - or stated more forcefully - more likely that unnamed sources being quoted by amateur writers on a rumor website are incorrect than business people paid millions to make the best decision about billions of dollars.

Geez man, are you vying to become the model of a run-on sentence?
post #140 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONOROM View Post

Well, I am not sure Apple still has "scarce" production resources. More than 25M devices (current capacity) a quarter is hardly scarce, and I assume they are still increasing capacity.

Yeah, it's scarce. Sorry you don't understand.

Quote:
At this point they are probably seeking additional opportunities, and a guaranteed order of 30M/$20B, ON TOP OF THEIR EXISTING VOLUME, would make any manufacturer, even Apple, drool. That is the size of an entire large corporation - bigger than all of Apple for most of its history.

It's not anything guaranteed. First of all, it's guaranteed to COST them sales if they don't allow Verizon and ATT to have a new iPhone. Dumb.

Second, Sprint isn't guaranteed to be a going concern in 4 years.

Third, just as many Sprint users will buy the iphone if it's available on Sprint AND Verizon AND ATT as will buy it if it's only on spring. Do you think zero users will buy it on Verizon and ATT, to make this deal smart? Dumb.

Quote:
Apple will find a way.

Thankfully, you're wrong.
post #141 of 181
"The addition of Sprint would make Apple's hot-selling handset available on the three largest carriers in the U.S. That would only leave out T-Mobile among the "big four," though AT&T hopes to acquire T-Mobile with regulatory approval."

Now that you can buy an unlocked Iphone, T-Mobile should just offer to reimburse a few hundred bucks if you sign a 2 or 3 year contract. Why do they need to directly sell the iPhone? Seems like a pretty simple and effective work-around to me.
post #142 of 181
Some are saying Sprint will get the new phone exclusively for 6 months before AT&T and Verizon. If true that worries me greatly, that's April. Does that mean their future iPhone release schedule will always be October-ish and not June/July?? If so, that stinks - to me!!! If I don't like this new phone I was hoping to get next years model next summer not next Autumn. I dont like late year phone releasing - This stinks (if true)!!!
post #143 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cykz View Post

In spite of the ludicrousy of the idea that Sprint would have the iPhone5 exclusively for four years I do think it sounds logical.

Since the introduction of the iPhone it became immediately clear that mobile phone services were about to change drastically. First the iPhone introduced Visual Voicemail. A replacement for a succesful service then provided by carriers as an add on for which you had to pay extra. Visual Voicemail actually brought the data to your phone, which could be done by wireless connections as wel...

Then came the apps.. such as WhatsApp diminishing lucrative SMS services.
And Skype was among them, artificially prohibited on 3G networks but clearly capable in delivering mobile telephony at a fraction of the cost. At a certain point the iPod Touch became a serious alternative for having low cost telecommunication through local wireless networks.

Now... my guess is that the future of mobile telephony is internet only. Sure we need frequencies for that, but as long as carriers are not willing to ditch lucrative old fashioned services, Apple is not capable of innovating towards their (I guess unknown) vision.

So in order to improve this it might be an excellent strategy to team up with a carrier who has the guts and despair to innovate alongside Apple, who is large enough to gain traction and put competition in quality service back again for the top carriers. I'd say Apple single handedly is protecting competitiveness among the largest carriers. And I wish Sprint success in their desperate but bold jump back in the race. They might prove to be Apple worthy partners really innovating the telcom industry.

Well said. One thing about Sprint is that it has been trying to innovate while other carriers like Verizon and AT&T have relied more on marketing dollars than investments in improving the quality of their service.
post #144 of 181
Here's my wild speculation: The iPhone 5 is a SIMless, data-only phone that uses VOIP and iMessage for voice and SMS. You only need a data plan to use it. Only Sprint was willing to sign up for this revolution but Apple is producing the less revolutionary 4S for reluctant carriers. The idea is that Apple is hoping lots of people will flock to the carriers like Sprint that have the iPhone 5, forcing the other carriers to give in to Apple's demands.
post #145 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

Here's my wild speculation: The iPhone 5 is a SIMless, data-only phone that uses VOIP and iMessage for voice and SMS. You only need a data plan to use it. Only Sprint was willing to sign up for this revolution but Apple is producing the less revolutionary 4S for reluctant carriers. The idea is that Apple is hoping lots of people will flock to the carriers like Sprint that have the iPhone 5, forcing the other carriers to give in to Apple's demands.

While this kind of revolution would be great for consumers, it would suck for Apple. The entities that currently pay 2/3 of every iPhone dollar that Apple gets are the carriers worldwide, and this would screw them and thus hurt Apple. Not going to happen.
post #146 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by poke View Post

Here's my wild speculation: The iPhone 5 is a SIMless, data-only phone that uses VOIP and iMessage for voice and SMS. You only need a data plan to use it. Only Sprint was willing to sign up for this revolution but Apple is producing the less revolutionary 4S for reluctant carriers. The idea is that Apple is hoping lots of people will flock to the carriers like Sprint that have the iPhone 5, forcing the other carriers to give in to Apple's demands.

I would defect if this was the case. Hell I may defect anyway if Sprint is the only one with an iPhone 5.
post #147 of 181
Whatever, however this Sprint deal turns out to be, it punctuates one clear point - Apple is in the driver's seat of the mobile industry and steering it like no one else before it.
post #148 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mesomorphicman View Post

Some are saying Sprint will get the new phone exclusively for 6 months before AT&T and Verizon. If true that worries me greatly, that's April. Does that mean their future iPhone release schedule will always be October-ish and not June/July?? If so, that stinks - to me!!! If I don't like this new phone I was hoping to get next years model next summer not next Autumn. I dont like late year phone releasing - This stinks (if true)!!!

Boo Hoo.

The release schedule is based on selling the most phones and making the most money possible. If they did this for Sprint (and I really doubt it, for many of the reasons others have given) then it was all well-calculated and will maximize Apple's realization of its goals.
post #149 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Not a single reason that you needed to quote the whole thing. Or any of it, for that matter.

1. Don't be a dick. 2. If unsure, see rule 1.
post #150 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

Boo Hoo.

The release schedule is based on selling the most phones and making the most money possible. If they did this for Sprint (and I really doubt it, for many of the reasons others have given) then it was all well-calculated and will maximize Apple's realization of its goals.

You're actually wrong. Although Apple never officially commented why this years phone was pushed back (I don't think they did) it was highly said that it was pushed back this year due to in part because of the Japan tsunami/earthquake and miscellaneous production problems. NOT because Steve Jobs thought to himself, "hmmm... October, we'll make more money and sell more phones if we release it just before Halloween than we would if we do it in July." You sound like one of those people if Apple decided to knock-down an orphanage in a low cost area to make office space, you'll say it was needed and they must do what they must to maximize profits. I like Apple, but I'm not a sycophant.
post #151 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by boeyc15 View Post

Thats very possible. But again, Sprint WIMAX is different than Verizon/ATT LTE... so thats the out for 6 months. I have no proof one way or another, but can see the wimax coming out different timeframe than the LTE.

I used to be a wimax sub and on good nights I get the same download speeds on my iPhone 4 via AT&T (evidently I live near a fast tower). Plus the wimax buildout is very sketchy...hence I'm an ex-wimax user.

I can see Sprint getting their own iPhone 5 CDMA/wimax version but not a iPhone 5 exclusive. Perhaps Sprint has a low power CMDA/wimax chip that Apple has agreed to make a specialized iPhone 5 with for $20B. Then they can claim the "exclusive 4G iPhone" title until the LTE iPhone 6 comes out next year. Altair had a reasonably thrifty chip a couple years ago but it wasn't CDMA/WiMAX.

If nothing else AT&T will get a HSPA+ iPhone 5 IMHO. Which AT&T claims is 4G...but isn't any more 4G than early LTE or WiMax. Still, if it gets anywhere close to 21 Mbps that's plenty fast.
post #152 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

I can believe a purchase commitment of 1.9 million per quarter.

I just think this exclusivity thing is baloney. Let's face it, for Sprint to lock exclusivity of the handset, they would basically need to guarantee any potential revenue loss from other carrier sales.

They don't have the resources. How much revenue is Apple recording from handset sales each quarter? $13 billion? $15 billion? A number which is destined to climb?

This exclusivity thing is a joke.

I misunderstood. I agree this exclusivity deal is crazy talk riding into crazy town on a crazy horse.
post #153 of 181
I suspect it has more to do with software, then hardware. Apple's software team was finishing up OSX Lion right around the time iOS would normally be updated. The same team works on both. Presumably they's then switch focus on iOS 5.

Further, it makes sense for an iOS update to come out around September as opposed to the beginning of Summer. The update would apply to all iOS devices going into the busy Christmas season. It might even have something to do with Apple managing adding carriers to the network.



Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I can see how that could happen if they still aren't able to ramp up production of the iPhone 5 at this point. But then I have to wonder what the hell could the iPhone 5 have in that would require nearly 2 years from the iPhone 4 release before it can be released completely.
post #154 of 181
I have been saying that for a while. Apple benefits from there being as many carriers as possible. It increases it negotiation leverage. Since T-Mobile is a big question mark, it makes sense Apple will go with Sprint first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cykz View Post

Well I agree, but perhaps a duopoly does Apple no good...and they know that.
post #155 of 181
LOL. Summarized nicely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Yes, that would be great. Profitability plunges, stock price cut in half, and ATT and Verizon stop buying iPhones.

You my friend are brilliant.
post #156 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj View Post

Because the deal, as stated, IS a bad deal for Apple.

It'd make perfect sense for all parties if they dropped the exclusive bit, and that's why that's the true story.

2 deals are stated, one confirmed by Sprint and WSJ is very, very good for apple. One is speculation and a lot of crap just made up over at BGR. I suggest you believe only one. I will let you choose.
post #157 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post

I misunderstood. I agree this exclusivity deal is crazy talk riding into crazy town on a crazy horse.


Its ok because it was made up by crazy people trying to generate crazy hits. It has no basis in reality, crazy or otherwise.


Why do people bother repeating anything BGR claims. They have never had an exclusive that proved to be true.
post #158 of 181
You might be right about the Japan ramifications. I think, however, it has more to do with managing earnings. Apple didn't need a new iPhone in July, as the bulk of AT&T people were one year into a two year contract. Apple instead brought Verizon on board with essentially the same phone, which sustained Apple's earnings. Now Apple is bringing Sprint on Board at a different time of the year then the other carriers. This will give Apple a big surge in Sprint users. Six months from now Apple will bring T-Mobile on board (it it is around). Getting people into two year contracts at different parts of the year sustains earnings in the future as well assuming these people keep getting iPhones in the future. Apple doesn't want a bunch of sales at one. It wants a bunch of sales spread out.

Apple is very smart about timing product announcements to manage growth. Bringing all the carriers on at once wold make it hard for Apple to top itself next quarter.

As stated earlier, it could be Apple couldn't get iOS 5 out the door in the new frame, as it was working on Lion.

In reality, only Apple knows why the changed time frame. Many speculated that Apple would change the time frame iOS was updated to coincide with the release of the iPod Touch. Perhaps instead of moving just iOS, it decided to more the iPhone as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mesomorphicman View Post

You're actually wrong. Although Apple never officially commented why this years phone was pushed back (I don't think they did) it was highly said that it was pushed back this year due to in part because of the Japan tsunami/earthquake and miscellaneous production problems. NOT because Steve Jobs thought to himself, "hmmm... October, we'll make more money and sell more phones if we release it just before Halloween than we would if we do it in July." You sound like one of those people if Apple decided to knock-down an orphanage in a low cost area to make office space, you'll say it was needed and they must do what they must to maximize profits. I like Apple, but I'm not a sycophant.
post #159 of 181
Sprint is only worth $9.21 billion.

If Apple was going to handicap itself by only offering the iPhone 5 on Sprint, they should just buy the company and roll out their own service.
post #160 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patranus View Post

Sprint is only worth $9.21 billion.

If Apple was going to handicap itself by only offering the iPhone 5 on Sprint, they should just buy the company and roll out their own service.

Google Stocks has their market cap at $8.17 billion at end of day. How much revenue and profit are bringing in? (will look up later)
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Sprint buys 30.5M iPhones from Apple for $20B in 'bet-the-company' move