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Apple's iPhone 4S event seen lacking 'panache,' allowing Android to gain - Page 5

post #161 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

By releasing a new phone every few months simply for the sake of change, that people still can't upgrade to because of the CARRIERS' lock in?

The smart user does an every-other-year upgrade to coincide with their contracts.
If you upgrade every year (or every other month) then you're just a junkie.
No problems with that, just don't think everyone is similarly addicted.

Did I suggest a release cycle of every few months? No.
I am not a junkie but I agree with folks who think that Apple waited too long to release a phone with the exact same form factor. Regardless of the features, I speak for myself and say that I will not lock myself in another 2-3 year contract just to have a phone that looks like last year's (and more ) model.

Apple caters to the high end so in the very same way, I don't think BMW would ever release the exact same model for 2 consecutive cycles with improved performance and features. Apple belongs in that same market segment. I hope my analogy makes sense

Besides, I am pretty sure they will sell a ton in any case...
post #162 of 280
This is the same idiot who downgraded apple.

http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2011...ngraded-apple/

He is still employed? I guess there's no performance expectations in his firm.
post #163 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by replicant View Post

The thing is this: People do not want to lock themselves down for another 2-3 years with a design that has been around more than a year and a half ago.
And this is where I think Apple can improve on.

Says you. I mean, how can you stand to drive the same car for years? How can you walk into your kitchen and look at the same refrigerator/stove/microwave year after year after year???
post #164 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

Btw, the reaction here strongly reminds me of the reaction after the iPad 2...

And we saw how that turned out.

The reactions remind me more of the iPhone 3GS keynote. And we all know what a complete and total flop that phone was
post #165 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

I'm not picking on you, but this just made be wonder. If the shape was the same, but had a plastic back, wouldn't the glass front be heavier, making it tend to fall face down? Kinda like the butter side of the bread hitting the floor?

Depends on how high up you drop it from. If you drop it from 5+ feet, that thing is going to shatter no matter how much is glass (unless it hits like a mattress). However, a friend of mine set his down on my granite countertop and it popped a corner of the back glass off. It slipped from probably 9 inches above the counter. Had that been a plastic back, no, it wouldn't have flipped over and would have just bounced.


edit: the phone is still beautiful with the glass. Very sharp looking phone, just have to be more careful with it.
post #166 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

By releasing a new phone every few months simply for the sake of change, that people still can't upgrade to because of the CARRIERS' lock in?

The smart user does an every-other-year upgrade to coincide with their contracts.
If you upgrade every year (or every other month) then you're just a junkie.
No problems with that, just don't think everyone is similarly addicted.

The smarter user does upgrade his iPhone every time a new model comes out.

Ask my wife and kids. At least that is what they think knowing that I will be upgrading to an iPhone 4S and passing down my iPhone 4 in a week or so. Just like I have done virtually every year for my MacBook Pros as well.
post #167 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacInsider2 View Post

Not sure. Challenge is resolution issue. To keep things easy to scale up for app devs, they need to do 2x resolution at least to maintain the "retina" marketing with a larger screen. That's a LOT of horsepower to push that many pixels...

And a hell of a drop in frame rate. For some pixel operations, I've seen the 4G iPod Touch chuckle where the 3GS shines.

Although someone pointed that Apple could make the screen a bit bigger and still be "within retina territory". But I personally dread the very idea of pushing the ppi downwards(even if slightly), feels wrong at this stage. I'd rather stay with the current size.
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post #168 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

oh you're one of those -_-

I bet you think every non Apple PC is like a cheap hooker with viruses.

What? Are you saying they're not?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #169 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

I'm not picking on you, but this just made be wonder. If the shape was the same, but had a plastic back, wouldn't the glass front be heavier, making it tend to fall face down? Kinda like the butter side of the bread hitting the floor?

It's a good question. I'm not really sure. My guess is that since the 3G and 3Gs had plastic backs and they didn't exhibit this "buttered bread phenomenon" that the iPhone 4 type design with a plastic back wouldn't either, but you never know. Of course I would prefer the back be curved aluminum like the iPad 2, os not sure if this changes the outcome or not.
post #170 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by replicant View Post

Agreed. It would have been nice to see it come in other colours as well (metallic gray?). Again, a personal opinion but the curved design of the iPhone 3G feels much better if compared to the boxy iPhone 4. The glass and metal is really adding weigh. Let's also keep in mind that if we look at buying habits, the durability factor probably should not outweigh the lightness factor IMHO.
People trade in their phones usually after their contract expires and often, they purchase a case for extra protection anyways.

I agree with you that the 3G/3GS felt really wonderful in the hand. The iPhone 4 is a far more beautiful object but I don't think it feels nearly so nice to hold.

You're right about durability. Phones only ever stay with most of us for 2 years max but it's more than durability. I get a real kick out of having such a well-made thing. It adds to the joy of ownership, just like my unibody MacBook.
post #171 of 280
What Android gains?

Android and iPhone do not compete on the same market.

Android gains in:

1) people with not enough money to buy an iPhone

2) people who don't care about smartphones and apps, and just get what the clerk at the telco store gives them.

3) cheapos

4) OSS "Libre" freaks

5) Tinkerers

6) Anti-apple contrarians

Now, (1), (2) and (3) are a huge market, but not exactly luxurious or desirable.

(4),(5),(6) are insignificant.

It's like in the desktop: PCs for the masses and that 0.5-1 % of Linux desktops, and Macs for the high end, high margin buyers.

That's how Apple has 10-12% market share in the desktop but the MOST profits than any other company, and that's why Dell is falling apart.

Oh, and Google is even in worse place than Dell. At least Dell sells it's hardware. Google just gives Android for free, with minuscule returns from ads viewed on the devices...
post #172 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by thesmoth View Post

Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.

I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.

Then, please feel free to go away, and allow us to wallow in our stupidity....

Bye.
post #173 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asherian View Post

Someone came out with something more than equivalent (and in some ways superior) months ago. The phone coming out on October 11th will trump the iPhone 4S in every way, including screen res (1280x720).

This is why analysts are disappointed. The iPhone 4S is not going to be the class leader like all other iPhones were, by a good margin. It's starting out behind.

Superior only in some hardware specs. Which DON'T MATTER.

People didn't buy Archos mp3 player+fm stereo+coffee maker+games console+hand sanitizer devices. They bought the iPod which did what it did, elegantly, more user friendly and with attention to detail.
Less is more.

For example, even the higher screen resolution mentioned on that "October 11th phone" is a disadvantage for MULTIPLE reasons:

1) Android graphic pipeline was not really designed for speed. It even lags in scrolling content. Higher res screen = worse performance.

2) Android does not have just one or two resolutions. There are all kinds of devices. So most apps will cater to the most common denominator and look like crap in the high res screen compared to the native controls. Apps cannot be just doubled here (as from iPhone 3 to iPhone 4), so their controls will look either fuzzy (zoomed in), or tiny (same dimensions, higher screen dpi).
post #174 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by JupiterOne View Post

Says you. I mean, how can you stand to drive the same car for years? How can you walk into your kitchen and look at the same refrigerator/stove/microwave year after year after year???

Maybe you should have asked: how can you stand buying the same looking car?
Then you would have made the same point that I was making
post #175 of 280
Wall Street continues to be clueless about AAPL.
post #176 of 280
bottom line....we are the problem following and praying to the alter of "rumors"

hey...i'm upgrading, because it is a huge upgrade....i feel the form factor of the ip4 is near perfect
improved speed, ram, gpu, much better video and camera---siri is world changing
and its not this big ol brick like some of those big screen
and i'm upgrading getting two ASAP

my only question buy from apple or att how do i get it first

already ordered my otterbox cases....wish they had more bright colors but hey
better than the ip4 launch....couldn't get quality cases for a long time

i'm in....200%
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post #177 of 280
I think the biggest thing we're missing about the lack of excitement in this rollout is that the iPhone 4S was delayed in order to have something, anything, big to talk about at the IOS 5 event. No one seems to notice that except for small changes to the Nano, the entire iPod line is stagnant. now, it's a damn good lineup to start with, but not upgrading the iPod Touch to at least the iPhone 4 level of screen, camera, etc. is a bit of a downer.

So if you think this was a disappointment, imagine what the reaction would have been to a new nano with a wristwatch face and nothing else would have been like.
post #178 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by NIZZARD View Post

Who cares about 4G speeds? Remember you're still limited (most of us) to 2GB. All 4G will do is help you burn through that in a week.

You are not limited to 2GB. If you use it all, you get more for an additional $10.
post #179 of 280
Here's what I find more often than not. Most people want an iPhone, but of those, most don't want to pay for it and opt for a cheaper Android model. Some people are particular about features that just aren't available on the iPhone, regardless of how practical those features are. There are some limitations associated with the iPhone, but my guess is that only a tiny percentage of the market are technical enough to know not only what they are, but want/need those missing features. And some people just hate Apple.

The only reason people are disappointed is because Apple didn't introduce this 'rumored' super thin handset and b/c the iPhone 4S "looks like" the same iPhone 4. Had Apple introduced this phone in a new shell design with the same specs, I have a feeling everyone would be raving about it. Because it looks the same people only seem to see an "update" rather than a total new phone.

Of course I'm an Apple user and therefore in the eyes of Apple-haters I just another guy drinking the Apple-flavored koolaid - in their eyes Apple's success is all marketing and zero substance - which is ridiculous.

Personally, I have an iPhone 3GS and while I'd love to have a new model, the truth is that it's still adequate for my needs and I don't want to part with another 3-4 hundred dollars. That being said, I'm very interested in Siri and if the real-world reviews live up to what seems to be the case, well, it's going to be hard to keep my you-don't-need-it-discipline going.
post #180 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

There does seem to be quite a bit of disappointment over this, I know that three of my friends will not be upgrading based on the announcement.

Had Apple released the iPhone 4S back in June not many people I know would have complained, but to be 4 months later than usual and then show off a "S" model....... Well what did Apple expect? They screwed up plain & simple.

Still, as a 3GS owner it's good enough for me so I'll be pre ordering on Friday.

You do see the hypocrisy of your comment, right? You are also buyer of an iPhone that has an 'S' appended to the model name of the previous generation. A model that outsold the iPhone 3G that came before it.

Based on the continued record sales of the iPhone 4 over the last 16 months and new internals of the new iPhone 4S I'll bet anyone that will sell more units than it has previously.

PS: Why is there an expectation for a phone to be completely alter its casing with a radical new design every year? They didn't with the iPhone 3G and iPhone 3GS so why are so many feeling it's unexpected, or a slap in the face. More importantly, why do people care about the appearance being radically different if the internals are upgraded to make your experience better?
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post #181 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaioslider View Post

Here's what I find more often than not. Most people want an iPhone, but of those, most don't want to pay for it and opt for a cheaper Android model. Some people are particular about features that just aren't available on the iPhone, regardless of how practical those features are. There are some limitations associated with the iPhone, but my guess is that only a tiny percentage of the market are technical enough to know not only what they are, but want/need those missing features. And some people just hate Apple.

The only reason people are disappointed is because Apple didn't introduce this 'rumored' super thin handset and b/c the iPhone 4S "looks like" the same iPhone 4. Had Apple introduced this phone in a new shell design with the same specs, I have a feeling everyone would be raving about it. Because it looks the same people only seem to see an "update" rather than a total new phone.

Of course I'm an Apple user and therefore in the eyes of Apple-haters I just another guy drinking the Apple-flavored koolaid - in their eyes Apple's success is all marketing and zero substance - which is ridiculous.

Personally, I have an iPhone 3GS and while I'd love to have a new model, the truth is that it's still adequate for my needs and I don't want to part with another 3-4 hundred dollars. That being said, I'm very interested in Siri and if the real-world reviews live up to what seems to be the case, well, it's going to be hard to keep my you-don't-need-it-discipline going.

So let me get this straight...people buy Android because they are cheap or broke correct?

Yet you won't update your 3GS because of money?

So which is it, are you cheap? or broke? if so why aren't you on Android?

Did...did you defeat your own argument?
post #182 of 280
I find that a visualization of the problem helps.

Apple iPhone 4:


What the critics wanted:


Apple iPhone 4S:


Apple iPhone 5:


post #183 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbro1999 View Post

Exactly. I've had this argument with 2 people. They say apple didn't do something innovative. I ask what they are looking for. They couldn't give me an answer. Haters with be haters. And I'll have a phone that ALWAYS works.

Always works? An iPhone? Ya never had to reset the phone to get it to update messages? Mybe reset to actually get it to open the phone app? Or best, when it has decided twht it doesn't want to connect to any 3gnetwork that it chews through the battery trying, and then dies.
Maybe when you open the camera app and it sits with the shutter closed until the app is reset.

Maybe iOS5 will enable it to always work, but otherwise it's a nice dream.
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post #184 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrail View Post

I think the biggest thing we're missing about the lack of excitement in this rollout is that the iPhone 4S was delayed in order to have something, anything, big to talk about at the IOS 5 event. No one seems to notice that except for small changes to the Nano, the entire iPod line is stagnant. now, it's a damn good lineup to start with, but not upgrading the iPod Touch to at least the iPhone 4 level of screen, camera, etc. is a bit of a downer.

So if you think this was a disappointment, imagine what the reaction would have been to a new nano with a wristwatch face and nothing else would have been like.

1) Aren''t the iPod Nano changes all SW based and already available for the iPod Nanos of that design sold over the last year? [It looks like they added an accelerometer internally for Nike+.]

2) It's very surprising that they wouldn't update the iPod Touch. They even talked up what a great mobile gaming device it is, so why not give it the A5 chip with 7x faster graphics, more RAM and faster CPU?
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post #185 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

oh you're one of those -_-

I bet you think every non Apple PC is like a cheap hooker with viruses.

Let's just say I never touch a Windows machine without a condom.
post #186 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by battlehamster View Post

I find that a visualization of the problem helps.

Apple iPhone 4:
image: http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...-man-pose2.jpg

What the critics wanted:
image: http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...Ironman2wm.jpg

Apple iPhone 4S:
image: http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...n-2_markVI.jpg

Apple iPhone 5:
image: http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...gw_9gBRDdrSyo2


This is a Droid user:


Yet this is how they see themselves:

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post #187 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicNReason View Post

Do people still think analysts know what they're talking about? If so, I have a bridge to sell yah

AppleInsider, apparently

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #188 of 280
If the iPhone 4 style is already perfect why fix it? Oooh give it a curved back and make the style worse. Some people are a trip.

All these fandroids talking about how the hardware is better seem to always conveniently leave out the software component. iOS software and ecosystem is much better than Android. iCloud is the game changer here in my opinion.

I have used Android before and it was a crappy experience.
post #189 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

There does seem to be quite a bit of disappointment over this, I know that three of my friends will not be upgrading based on the announcement.

Had Apple released the iPhone 4S back in June not many people I know would have complained, but to be 4 months later than usual and then show off a "S" model....... Well what did Apple expect? They screwed up plain & simple.

Still, as a 3GS owner it's good enough for me so I'll be pre ordering on Friday.

If Apple had changed the design of the case to be something different, changed the model number designation to "5" but had exactly the same guts and features that the 4s has, everyone would be saying how wonderful it is.

But because Apple did this conservatively, giving it the 4s designation and keeping the same case as the 4, everyone is disappointed.

The problem is that many owners of the "4" wanted a new model to upgrade to, but that's absurd - no one is expected to upgrade every year. I'm still using a 3G. And I will upgrade to the 4s, even though I suspect the 5 will be released in substantially less than 12 months.
post #190 of 280
Can I be an Analysts? No? Then please tell me what it takes to be an Analysts. What more do these guys want? It is faster, SIRI, great graphics, the best software, the cloud, great service and protection plan, call reception is as good as you can get right now. What do they want? I got it, they wanted a bigger screen. I get it now, all of the rest Apple could have forgotten. Apple, have a bigger screen and call it an iPhone 5 and you have it.
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post #191 of 280
Most of the complaints are really groundless, but with the 4 month delay, it is at least understandable why so many anticipated an all new hardware design. I for one am glad that the iP4S has the same design, and I'm going to get one just as soon as Sprint figures out how to update their website with the pertinent information.
post #192 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by sticknick View Post

The reactions remind me more of the iPhone 3GS keynote. And we all know what a complete and total flop that phone was

The reaction on Wall Street is now quite positive... One. Day. After. the unveiling.

Everyone who doubts Apple just has to look back at antennagate. When the 4 was released AAPL dropped 10% over the next couple of weeks and another 2% beyond that over the next 2 months. Apple was doomed. Wait! What!?
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post #193 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

This is a Droid user:


Yet this is how they see themselves:


It'd have been funnier if you used the robot from Lost in Space...

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #194 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

Always works? An iPhone? Ya never had to reset the phone to get it to update messages? Mybe reset to actually get it to open the phone app? Or best, when it has decided twht it doesn't want to connect to any 3gnetwork that it chews through the battery trying, and then dies.
Maybe when you open the camera app and it sits with the shutter closed until the app is reset.

Maybe iOS5 will enable it to always work, but otherwise it's a nice dream.

I've never had any of the problems you describe, not even once. The only problem I've had (with my 3G) is that sometimes the map application doesn't respond or gets very sluggish. I've never had to reset the phone. I do shut it off late at night. I generally recharge it every other day unless it's gotten excessive use on any given day.

The only thing that I've found that chews through the battery quickly is when I use a bicycle app that tracks my ride when I'm also listening to the iPod app at the same time. When I first bought the phone, I was so paranoid about the battery not lasting that I bought one of those accessory batteries that you can plug into the bottom of the phone which then recharges the internal battery. Over several years, I've used it less than ten times.
post #195 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

This is a Droid user:


Yet this is how they see themselves:


I think you meant:

or
Some droid phones are formidable.. well suited for specific purpose, mass production, and expendability:
post #196 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by replicant View Post

Apple caters to the high end so in the very same way, I don't think BMW would ever release the exact same model for 2 consecutive cycles with improved performance and features. Apple belongs in that same market segment. I hope my analogy makes sense

Besides, I am pretty sure they will sell a ton in any case...

A car cycle lasts about 5 years. They don't dramatically change the exterior every year in the model cycle. Still, the iphone4 is the most popular phone on the planet. Why change it the following year?
post #197 of 280
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post #198 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by battlehamster View Post

I think you meant:

or

He lost.
Hmmmmmm...
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post #199 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

It'd have been funnier if you used the robot from Lost in Space...

You know, now that you mention it...


post #200 of 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

It'd have been funnier if you used the robot from Lost in Space...

At least he had a replaceable battery pack.....

Of course, the phandroids will forget that the replaceable battery pack was his biggest weakness.
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  • Apple's iPhone 4S event seen lacking 'panache,' allowing Android to gain
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