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Unlocked iPhone 4S coming in November, won't work with CDMA carriers - Page 3

post #81 of 123
10/7/11 at 2:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

Verizon also announced in 2007 that they would open their network to any CDMA device that was qualified in their labs as being compatible with their network. "Any app, any device" was what they touted.

There is no technical reason for any CDMA capable device from working on either Sprint or Verizon. CDMA is sort of the opposite of GSM in terms of locking. With GSM, the devices are locked to accept only certain carrier's SIMs, but any device that can accept the SIM can get on the network. With CDMA, it is the network that is locked, so only devices that are 'registered' by the carrier are allowed. There is nothing preventing them from allowing any and all CDMA devices on their network, other than them denying access to any device ESN not on their list. Given Sprint agreed to this as a settlement and Verizon announced a policy to allow it, it is strange that they are now reneging.

If they were to both honour their obligations and policies, then any iPhone4S, whether purchased unlocked and full price or locked and on carrier subsidy from AT&T or other GSM carrier should be allowed on either Sprint or Verizon. I wonder if Apple agreed to implement some sort of firmware lock where CDMA is disabled if the phone activates with a SIM. That way Sprint and Verizon would be able to say it's not their fault.

I figured that's how it might work, but I wonder why even Apple is saying the unlocked models won't be compatible with the CDMA carriers. I'd really like for some of the news outlets to dig deeper and find out what's really going on.
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post #82 of 123
10/7/11 at 5:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdaddyp View Post

Why the hell do you need a credit check for a pre paid contract free phone?

I believe there is a law requiring this.
I needed a credit check when I bought my iPad 2 at an AT&T store. I thought this was ridiculous, as there was no credit involved (and I wasn't signing up for any airtime). They told me they were required by law to do it. They might have been lying, I don't know, but that's what they told me at the store.
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post #83 of 123
10/7/11 at 5:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdaddyp View Post

Why the hell do you need a credit check for a pre paid contract free phone?

I so totally agree!!!!!

I am 65. I don't use credit. Pay cash always or debit card..no credit cards for 20 years.

I am tired of all the credit check bs!

As I have viewed it over the years, you will have to have a credit check to:

Get a job.
Rent an apartment.
Activate a cell phone.
Rent equipment, or a car? Sometimes!
Open a bank account? Your SS# anyway...(Patriot ax!)..lol...
Probably others I have not noticed, not applying for many things.

These f***ers are cleaning up! They make money approving people for most everything.
I try to deny them any revenue. May they go out of business? Probably not. As long as
they can get away with it.......I'm pissed always...
May require a credit check...Apple can blow me!
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post #84 of 123
10/7/11 at 6:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuttan View Post

Apple can blow me!

Thanks for completely misunderstanding the point and taking your anger (that really has no reason to exist) out on an entity not responsible for it.
PhilBoogie
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post #85 of 123
10/7/11 at 6:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

I believe there is a law requiring this.
I needed a credit check when I bought my iPad 2 at an AT&T store. I thought this was ridiculous, as there was no credit involved (and I wasn't signing up for any airtime). They told me they were required by law to do it. They might have been lying, I don't know, but that's what they told me at the store.

I bought this iPad 2 at the stroke of 12:05am March 2011. Used my debit card.
There was no credit check involved.
I have not tried to buy any Apple products since then, so I don't know if this has changed?

Activating it on AT$T did not require a credit check. If it had, I would have given it away!
I don't know about today?
Every company is getting anal about everything.
Will be their downfall, as people like me are steadfastly not buying into their bs!
Good luck....lol...
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post #86 of 123
10/7/11 at 6:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by regan View Post

Ok...Im interested in the unlocked iphone 4S because i travel internationally alot.

What i want to know is...if i get an unlocked iphone 4S in November....can i turn it on and use it as a wifi only device for awhile? I'm not travelling overseas until January, but would like to use the iphone to shoot pictures and video with its awesome new 8 megapixel camera, and then upload those pics via wifi to youtube etc. I'd also like to use iMessage and other features via wifi, but i don't want to pop an ATT sim in right now to do so. Not interested in a contract.

Basically i want to know if i can activate/use my iphone 4S as a wifi only device without popping a sim in.

Thanks :-)

Me too. If a new iTouch is not forthcoming this is what I would like to do if I can.
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post #87 of 123
10/7/11 at 6:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by b1937 View Post

Me too. If a new iTouch is not forthcoming this is what I would like to do if I can.

Logitech discontinued the iTouch in 2008, so I can't imagine why you're waiting around for a new one.

You should be able to use an iPhone without service if you jailbreak it. Whether the 4S will be jailbroken this side of the year's ending is left to be seen.
PhilBoogie
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post #88 of 123
10/8/11 at 10:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Logitech discontinued the iTouch in 2008, so I can't imagine why you're waiting around for a new one.

Fantastic reply! Gotta love this one. And you took the time to look this info up; can't imagine you know this from the top of your head.
Even if you disagree, he is entitled to his opinion, isn't he? Just as you're entitled to your blinders? (Stelligent)
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Even if you disagree, he is entitled to his opinion, isn't he? Just as you're entitled to your blinders? (Stelligent)
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post #89 of 123
10/8/11 at 7:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thataveragejoe View Post

Actually yes. Verizon will unlock SIM slots for free after a full 30 days of the phone being active on your account. I've done this twice with other world phones.

Excellent thanks for the explanation.
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post #90 of 123
10/9/11 at 8:35pm
So just for clarification, the idea of an 'unlocked' iphone is still a huge joke of which US consumers are at the butt end of. Apple is offering more carrier support outside of the US than than within. Does this not make anyone but me absolutely furious?

The idea of a true pentaband/world phone is not a new or impossible one. What they've given us is nothing more than an unsubsidized AT&T iPhone that you can use outside of the US.
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post #91 of 123
10/9/11 at 11:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo42 View Post

So just for clarification, the idea of an 'unlocked' iphone is still a huge joke of which US consumers are at the butt end of. Apple is offering more carrier support outside of the US than than within. Does this not make anyone but me absolutely furious?

The idea of a true pentaband/world phone is not a new or impossible one. What they've given us is nothing more than an unsubsidized AT&T iPhone that you can use outside of the US.

Yup, people have been laughing since the first iPhone only had Edge, and MMS took a long time to come to the US. Most of rest of the world is still wondering what CDMA is and why it's on the iPhone spec sheet... some might think it's some new 4G technology they haven't heard of.

The "joke" goes two ways though, it means that people travelling TO the US can't roam on Verizon and Sprint, hence reducing Verizon and Sprint revenue as well.
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post #92 of 123
10/9/11 at 11:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Yup, people have been laughing since the first iPhone only had Edge, and MMS took a long time coming to the US. Most of rest of the world is still wondering what CDMA is and why it's on the iPhone spec sheet, reflecting on if it's some new 4G technology they haven't heard of.

The "joke" goes two ways though, it means that people travelling TO the US can't roam on Verizon and Sprint, hence reducing Verizon and Sprint revenue as well.

It's a sad state of affairs. I'm still not sure if you buy the Verizon or Sprint iPhone if you can use it in Canada's UMTS '3G' for bands that are shared with AT&T or not.

I'm not a fan of calling this a "world mode" phone in the US if it's just going to locked to a specific carrier. I do hope, like with the anonymous location database issue a few months back, that politicians see how hindered the US market is with these locked phones. With CDMA-based networks is understandable but as we move closer to a homogenous LTE network that uses a SIM I hope we'll have a better cellular system for consumers in the near future.

I'd also like to see virtual SIMs come into play but that for another thread.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #93 of 123
10/10/11 at 6:21am
Question, why is it that it can work as a world phone, but I can use it on US CDMA (the unlocked version). I'm so lost....
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post #94 of 123
10/10/11 at 6:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Question, why is it that it can work as a world phone, but I can use it on US CDMA (the unlocked version). I'm so lost....

That's the definition of "world phone".

I'm so lost about what you're trying to say
PhilBoogie
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post #95 of 123
10/10/11 at 6:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

That's the definition of "world phone".

I'm so lost about what you're trying to say

As in is there a way to take the 4S (Let's say, the Sprint version) and unlock it for like ATT. Does it even have a GSM sim card slot?
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post #96 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

As in is there a way to take the 4S (Let's say, the Sprint version) and unlock it for like ATT. Does it even have a GSM sim card slot?

So you're just not even bothering to look at Apple's pages about it?

There is ONE phone. ONE hardware for all three carriers.

It's sold locked and unlocked. Eventually, we'll unlock the locked one. No one knows what sorts of carrier-changing restrictions are applied to the hardware of either right now.
PhilBoogie
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post #97 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you're just not even bothering to look at Apple's pages about it?

There is ONE phone. ONE hardware for all three carriers.

It's sold locked and unlocked. Eventually, we'll unlock the locked one. No one knows what sorts of carrier-changing restrictions are applied to the hardware of either right now.

I already look at the page....several times actually. I was just wondering if I'd be able to switch providers (from Att...to verizon....to Page Plus!). I'm assuming the unlocked version is for GSM carriers because:

"CDMA available only if iPhone 4S is sold and activated for use on a CDMA network."......apple.com
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post #98 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

I'm assuming the unlocked version is for GSM carriers because:

"CDMA available only if iPhone 4S is sold and activated for use on a CDMA network."......apple.com

No, you can buy an unlocked one, get it activated with a CDMA carrier, and then you can pop in any GSM SIM you want to use it around the world/in the U.S. with someone else.

Why it wouldn't work otherwise is beyond me.
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post #99 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

No, you can buy an unlocked one, get it activated with a CDMA carrier, and then you can pop in any GSM SIM you want to use it around the world/in the U.S. with someone else.

Why it wouldn't work otherwise is beyond me.

Oh, okay I get it now. I for some reason was think the CDMA carriers we're gonna put some restrictions. Maybe I read it from a tech site though.

But I'm happier now! So now the phone isn't competely useless IF I have to swtich carriers.
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post #100 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:31am
I'm guessing that Apple released the unlocked GSM phone because that is what international customers expect.
The phone also has value in the US until AT&T is able to work out their acquisition of T-Mobile. T-Mobile customers can get the iPhone 4S unlocked and use it now.
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post #101 of 123
10/10/11 at 8:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottdburnett View Post

I'm guessing that Apple released the unlocked GSM phone because that is what international customers expect.
The phone also has value in the US until AT&T is able to work out their acquisition of T-Mobile. T-Mobile customers can get the iPhone 4S unlocked and use it now.

But it won't use T-Mo's 3G speeds.
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post #102 of 123
10/15/11 at 7:01pm
I am going to buy an unlocked iphone 4s, but I am wondering how apple says CDMA is not workable? I think Sprint can active CDMA on an unlocked iphone. One possible is apple removed the CDMA model for unlocked one, another is they disabled the firmware for CDMA part.

Currently UK and Canada are selling unlocked phone, will those phone work on CDMA?
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post #103 of 123
10/15/11 at 7:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by truelies View Post

I think Sprint can active CDMA on an unlocked iPhone.

Good luck.

Quote:
One possible is apple removed the CDMA model for unlocked one

Physically impossible.

Quote:
another is they disabled the firmware for CDMA part.

Which doesn't make much sense, though.
PhilBoogie
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post #104 of 123
10/15/11 at 8:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Good luck.



Physically impossible.



Which doesn't make much sense, though.

So what does "The unlocked iPhone 4 or iPhone 4S will not work with CDMA-based carriers such as Verizon Wireless or Sprint. " mean? If CDMA is inside, verizon can easily burn service into it. Maybe we need to wait people in China who imported the iphone from uk or Austrilia to test it, China Telecom has CDMA. Seems like a huge amount of unlocked iphone will come there in Oct 18.
If unlocked one have GSM+CDMA, I will sure buy one.
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post #105 of 123
10/15/11 at 9:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by truelies View Post

So what does "The unlocked iPhone 4 or iPhone 4S will not work with CDMA-based carriers such as Verizon Wireless or Sprint. " mean?

I don't think any of us will know until someone actually takes one to Verizint and asks them to put their service on it.

Quote:
If CDMA is inside, verizon can easily burn service into it.

You sure about that? Then why didn't we see Verizon iPhone 4s being turned into Sprint iPhone 4s back when it was Verizon-exclusive?
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post #106 of 123
10/16/11 at 1:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by truelies View Post

So what does "The unlocked iPhone 4 or iPhone 4S will not work with CDMA-based carriers such as Verizon Wireless or Sprint. " mean? If CDMA is inside, verizon can easily burn service into it. Maybe we need to wait people in China who imported the iphone from uk or Austrilia to test it, China Telecom has CDMA. Seems like a huge amount of unlocked iphone will come there in Oct 18.
If unlocked one have GSM+CDMA, I will sure buy one.

My understanding is that it means Verizon and Sprint have said no to allowing iPhone 4S' that haven't been specifically bought with Verizon or Sprint service onto their network. So you may call to add your phone to their network, and they may reply 'sure... but only if you sign up to a 24 month commitment'.
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post #107 of 123
10/16/11 at 5:21am
Um....can this access T-Mobile 3G?
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post #108 of 123
10/16/11 at 5:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Um....can this access T-Mobile 3G?

T-Mobile in the US, no, T-Mobile is other countries, yes.
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post #109 of 123
10/16/11 at 5:36am
I don't understand all this veribiage. I could have SWORN Apple said the same EXACT models are on all carriers. So how the hell does this not work?
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post #110 of 123
10/16/11 at 6:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

I don't understand all this veribiage. I could have SWORN Apple said the same EXACT models are on all carriers. So how the hell does this not work?

For a phone to work on a CDMA network, it has to be registered with the network; i.e., you need to call them and ask them to authenticate your phone on the network. If that supplier has a policy of not allowing certain phones onto their network, even though the phone is unlocked and could work on any network in theory, if they refuse to let you use it, there's nothing you can do about that.
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post #111 of 123
10/16/11 at 6:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrochester View Post

T-Mobile in the US, no, T-Mobile is other countries, yes.

This damn pisses me off. So basically, I'm buying an unlocked ATT iPhone that virtually only works with....ATT?
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post #112 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

This damn pisses me off. So basically, I'm buying an unlocked ATT iPhone that virtually only works with....ATT?

I knew you'd mess it up: It still works with T-Mobile, just not 3G.

And maybe Verizint if they let you add it to their network.

And every GSM network anywhere else on the planet.

You want more networks, write your congressmen.
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post #113 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

I knew you'd mess it up: It still works with T-Mobile, just not 3G.

And maybe Verizint if they let you add it to their network.

And every GSM network anywhere else on the planet.

You want more networks, write your congressmen.

You messed up, because I don't know what company Verizint is.

Second, I was refering to the network (3G) as you can see from the context of my previous posts. It's almost useless to use a smartphone without an adequate data connection in this world.

I'm aware that GSM is everywhere. But that does NOT mean that my data will work with that particular brand. I mean, there different 3g bands.

What does the last statement have to do anything?
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post #114 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

You messed up, because I don't know what company Verizint is.

And you can't parse out that I'm talking about both national CDMA carriers?

Quote:
Second, I was refering to the network (3G) as you can see from the context of my previous posts. It's almost useless to use a smartphone without an adequate data connection in this world.

Your statement that it only works with AT&T, however, does not lend to this theory, so I felt it was necessary to mention that the iPhone does actually work with T-Mobile, just not data past EDGE.

Quote:
I'm aware that GSM is everywhere. But that does NOT mean that my data will work with that particular brand. I mean, there different 3g bands.

Far as I know, T-Mobile USA's the only carrier to waste their time with the 1700MHz band, so you should be fine anywhere else.

Quote:
What does the last statement have to do anything?

I'll ignore that because there's really no way you could miss its meaning, given that it's relevant to the entire point you're making.
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post #115 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:28am
But it's not relevant because I wasn't talking about a creating a unified 3G network. It will be unified if and when ATT occupies T-Mobile. Even it it was to change, it wouldn't change what is now considering we'd have new phones by then.

We all know that the original iPhone even works on ATT (I'm assuming here) just not with the data. Didn't the CEO of T-Mobile say that 1 million iPhone users are with Magenta?

Fine everywhere else? I'm not talking about the whole world, but North America (USA) where I live. Either you have VZW's network, ATT, Tmobile or Sprints (and a few others here and there).
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post #116 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

We all know that the original iPhone even works on ATT (I'm assuming here) just not with the data.

Uh, what? The first-gen iPhone works with data on AT&T. And every other GSM network.

Yeah, he said something like that. That's all five models of iPhone, though.

Quote:
Either you have VZW's network, ATT, Tmobile or Sprints (and a few others here and there).

And now we're back to your original question: Why buy an unlocked iPhone if it only works with three (one) carriers?

Because it also works with T-Mobile. That's why. And if you want more than one cell phone carrier in the future and plans that a human being can actually afford, you'll have to get the government to do something about it.
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post #117 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Uh, what? The first-gen iPhone works with data on AT&T. And every other GSM network.

Yeah, he said something like that. That's all five models of iPhone, though.



And now we're back to your original question: Why buy an unlocked iPhone if it only works with three (one) carriers?

Because it also works with T-Mobile. That's why. And if you want more than one cell phone carrier in the future and plans that a human being can actually afford, you'll have to get the government to do something about it.

1. I meant T-Mobile.

2. But I'm talking about how it does make any sense really because I really only have two carriers to choose from. Unless it's like Page Plus (are they only CDMA?), then that'll be a different case. The freedom IS being unlocked. But due to so many limitiations due to company choices then it's kind of throwing everyone in a catch 22.

I'm simply stating to get the best out of a network (3G speeds and all) then you're kind of stuck with ATT. And you can't even go to Verizon apparently so it's not unlocked for all.

Come to think of it, COULD page plus add the phone? The possiblites...
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post #118 of 123
10/16/11 at 7:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

1. I meant T-Mobile.

2. But I'm talking about how it does make any sense really because I really only have two carriers to choose from. Unless it's like Page Plus (are they only CDMA?), then that'll be a different case. The freedom IS being unlocked. But due to so many limitiations due to company choices then it's kind of throwing everyone in a catch 22.

I'm simply stating to get the best out of a network (3G speeds and all) then you're kind of stuck with ATT. And you can't even go to Verizon apparently so it's not unlocked for all.

Come to think of it, COULD page plus add the phone? The possiblites...

There we go, I gotcha now.

Yeah, it pretty much sucks eggs right now. We used to have Centennial from which to choose, but they were gobbled up by AT&T, too. Two optometrists I know had first-gen iPhones unlocked on Centennial (because we had no AT&T service at all where we live) and when they got absorbed, they just went legit.

They still can't get 3G on either of their phones because AT&T has no 3G here, but they're forced to pay the data plan all the same.
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post #119 of 123
10/16/11 at 8:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

There we go, I gotcha now.

Yeah, it pretty much sucks eggs right now. We used to have Centennial from which to choose, but they were gobbled up by AT&T, too. Two optometrists I know had first-gen iPhones unlocked on Centennial (because we had no AT&T service at all where we live) and when they got absorbed, they just went legit.

They still can't get 3G on either of their phones because AT&T has no 3G here, but they're forced to pay the data plan all the same.

Yeah, I agree.

I think this all stems from the fact that technically all the big carriers were part of the the same company (not sure about T-Mobile). Verizon was spunoff from ATT and so was Sprint. I'm thinking that sort of control is still in the hearts of the companies. We only have 4 major carriers and the smaller carriers depend on THEIR networks (Boost, Virgin, US Cellular, etc.).


I will contact my congress about this issue (though lobbyists are a tough fight). But I don't see anything changing soon. Look at what Verizon is trying to do with net neutrality.

I just want a phone that I can use on any network. They need to fight in terms of prices and networks. Not price gouging.

I feel like it's all one big monopoly (again, going back to the history of the companies/Baby Bells/etc) because have you noticed when one company does something, they ALL do it? Not in a good way either. Oh, let's ALL have data limits! I swear they must sit on each other's Board of Directors.
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post #120 of 123
10/16/11 at 8:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

I feel like it's all one big monopoly (again, going back to the history of the companies/Baby Bells/etc) because have you noticed when one company does something, they ALL do it? Not in a good way either. Oh, let's ALL have data limits! I swear they must sit on each other's Board of Directors.

They've been colluding for decades. The people who are supposed to stop that are being paid off not to. So whachagonnado
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