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Samsung lawyer couldn't tell iPad and Galaxy Tab apart from 10 feet away

post #1 of 194
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When asked by a judge in a California courtroom to tell the difference between a Samsung Galaxy Tab and an Apple iPad held side-by-side 10 feet away, an attorney for Samsung couldn't do it.

U.S. District Judge Lucy Koh this week held both a Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 and iPad above her head, and asked Kathleen Sullivan, a lawyer representing Samsung, to identify what company made which. According to Reuters, she could not do it from a distance of about 10 feet.

"Not at this distance, your honor," she reportedly said. Koh then asked if any of Samsung's lawyers could identify which tablet was made by Apple and which was made by Samsung. Another lawyer supplied the correct answer "moments later."

Koh asked for the attorneys to distinguish between the two devices after she repeatedly commented on the similarity between each company's tablets. The judge has yet to rule on Apple's request to bar some of Samsung's products from being sold in the U.S.

However, the judge did say that Samsung's Galaxy-branded tablets do infringe on some of Apple's iPad-related patents. Apple must still prove to the court that its patents are valid under the law.



Koh also tentatively said she would not grant Apple an injunction based on one "utility" patent the company has accused Samsung of infringing upon. She has not given an opinion on three-other design-related patents, but promised a formal order will come "fairly promptly."

The latest turn in Apple's push to have the Samsung Galaxy Tab line barred from sale in the U.S. comes just after Apple won an injunction in Australia, earning a preliminary ban on sales of the Galaxy Tab 10.1. The same device has also been blocked in Germany.
post #2 of 194
post #3 of 194
Wow! I can't even make this stuff up.
post #4 of 194
Ha ha ha.

J.
post #5 of 194
While a ban on selling Galaxy pads would be brutal for Samsung, the sting felt as Apple slowly withdraws from every contract with them will hurt even more.
post #6 of 194
I think this whole lawsuit is just a warning shot to Samsung. They obviously copy the style, which, no coincidentally, is what most of Apple's and Steve's patents are for: design.

They must have been off because Android does not look like iOS.
post #7 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerARSgm View Post

While a ban on selling Galaxy pads would be brutal for Samsung, the sting felt as Apple slowly withdraws from every contract with them will hurt even more.

Why in the world would you think this?
Don't you think the forward thinking apple has thought of the pros and cons?

I think Samsung will be the one hurting due to the bans and the possibility of losing apple as a client.

"Just follow the money"
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post #8 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by modernmagic View Post

Why in the world would you think this?
Don't you think the forward thinking apple has thought of the pros and cons?

I think Samsung will be the one hurting due to the bans and the possibility of losing apple as a client.

"Just follow the money"

Isn't that what he just said?
post #9 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by modernmagic View Post

Why in the world would you think this?
Don't you think the forward thinking apple has thought of the pros and cons?

I think Samsung will be the one hurting due to the bans and the possibility of losing apple as a client.

"Just follow the money"

You're probably going to want to reread his post.
post #10 of 194
This is really getting stupid.
post #11 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

U.S. District Judge Lucy Koh this week held both a Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 and iPad above her head, and asked Kathleen Sullivan, a lawyer representing Samsung, to identify what company made which. According to Reuters, she could not do it from a distance of about 10 feet.

"Not at this distance, your honor," she reportedly said.

lmao. that's pathetic.
post #12 of 194
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post #13 of 194
Apple now have to prove their patents are valid. I would bet that is not a foregone conclusion by any stretch.
post #14 of 194
hahahaha OH SNAP!!!

Epic Fail!!!! That dude career is over..... and he kind of deserve it for been unprepared...

post #15 of 194
Whatever... They look different from the back since the iPad has an Apple logo on it. That is the part that has the value. People who want a Galaxy tab aren't Apple's type of customer anyway. I think the blatant knock offs like the ones in China a far more damaging to the brand since they actually put an Apple logo on it. One of my Chinese friends told me about a fake iPhone her husband bought. You couldn't let it touch your face while on a call since it didn't have a proximity sensor and would hang up the call if you touch it.

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post #16 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Whatever... They look different from the back since the iPad has an Apple logo on it. That is the part that has the value. People who want a Galaxy tab aren't Apple's type of customer anyway. I think the blatant knock offs like the ones in China a far more damaging to the brand since they actually put an Apple logo on it. One of my Chinese friends told me about a fake iPhone her husband bought. You couldn't let it touch your face while on a call since it didn't have a proximity sensor and would hang up the call if you touch it.

lol my cousin bought one of those fake iPhones in NYC.

which is super odd because he had the iPhone before that (and broke it)
post #17 of 194
This lawyer should have at least guessed. She had a 50/50 shot haha.
post #18 of 194
The fact that she did that experiment at all, shows she thinks that it's a copy (of the iPad). That's a pretty big hint what the verdict will be.
post #19 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

This lawyer should have at least guessed. She had a 50/50 shot haha.

They both looked like Samsung Galaxy Tabs.

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post #20 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

The fact that she did that experiment at all, shows she thinks that it's a copy (of the iPad). That's a pretty big hint what the verdict will be.

I tend to agree with you.
post #21 of 194
All this proves is that the samsung lawyer is an idiot. The aspect ratio is different between the two devices and this should be obvious at 30+ feet to anyone that isn't blind
post #22 of 194
deleted
post #23 of 194
Hey, I think MLB is hiring umpires!

post #24 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Other highlights from the article:

HEADLINE: "Apple must show patents valid in Samsung case: judge"

"Apple has a problem establishing the validity of its patents in the latest courtroom face-off between the technology giants."

"'Can any of Samsung's lawyers tell me which one is Samsung and which one is Apple?' Koh asked. A moment later, one of the lawyers supplied the right answer."

"She did not say whether she would grant the injunction based on three other Apple "design" patents."

"Koh characterized her thoughts on the utility patent as 'tentative' but said she would issue a formal order 'fairly promptly.'"


So one lawyer's near-sighted, others have no problem identifying the tablet, and the headline is about the much deeper question of whether Apple has any case here at all.

What a way for AI to miss the point of the stories they selectively edit for their audience here.

The headline you quoted is from a completely different court case. That one refers to the one in the United States. The case referred to in this article is from Dutch.

Only Apple's and Samsung's lawyers know the complete details and they'll eventually duke it out. We're just getting tidbits here and there, so it's unfair for us to judge either way.
post #25 of 194
1st lawyer: "Damn, I am soooo fired!"

2nd lawyer: "Hell yeah! I guessed it right!"
post #26 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Other highlights from the article:

HEADLINE: "Apple must show patents valid in Samsung case: judge"

"Apple has a problem establishing the validity of its patents in the latest courtroom face-off between the technology giants."

Actually, I would like to see the direct quote from the judge. I suspect that this is incorrect.

Under U.S. patent law, a patent is considered valid unless overturned. If Samsung wants to challenge the patents, it would be up to Samsung to challenge them - and then show evidence that they are not valid.

I suspect that the judge actually said that Apple has to prove infringement. That would be a legally correct statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

So one lawyer's near-sighted,

So you're claiming that Samsung isn't paying their attorneys enough for them to be able to afford glasses?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

The fact that she did that experiment at all, shows she thinks that it's a copy (of the iPad). That's a pretty big hint what the verdict will be.

Exactly. The judge would not have done the experiment if there wasn't reasonable suspicion that the Samsung tablet was a copy.
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Gatorguy 5/31/13
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Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #27 of 194
This actually only showed 1 thing: Samsung hired clueless lawyers who're totally unprepared. I mean, when you pay that kind of dollar for these lawyers, they're supposed to study every detail of each device and could see all the differences without any trouble.
post #28 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

This actually only showed 1 thing: Samsung hired clueless lawyers who're totally unprepared. I mean, when you pay that kind of dollar for these lawyers, they're supposed to study every detail of each device and could see all the differences without any trouble.

Wrong.

Legally, one shouldn't have to study every detail to be able to tell the difference. A layman who has never seen the devices before should be able to tell the difference if Samsung were not blatantly copying.
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post #29 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

Other highlights from the article:

HEADLINE: "Apple must show patents valid in Samsung case: judge"

"Apple has a problem establishing the validity of its patents in the latest courtroom face-off between the technology giants."

"'Can any of Samsung's lawyers tell me which one is Samsung and which one is Apple?' Koh asked. A moment later, one of the lawyers supplied the right answer."

"She did not say whether she would grant the injunction based on three other Apple "design" patents."

"Koh characterized her thoughts on the utility patent as 'tentative' but said she would issue a formal order 'fairly promptly.'"


So one lawyer's near-sighted, others have no problem identifying the tablet, and the headline is about the much deeper question of whether Apple has any case here at all.

What a way for AI to miss the point of the stories they selectively edit for their audience here.

Yes! An embarrassing faux pas by one of Samsung's lawyers probably means Apple's case is toast! Keep 'em coming!
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post #30 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post

In a world where OJ was found innocent of crimes but also found financially liable for crimes he didn't commit, how this weird case plays out is anyone's guess.

But a little stroll down Multi-touch Prior Art Lane suggests where it may be headed:

Pinch and zoom circa 2006:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKqyn-gUbY

Microsoft Multi-Touch Patent App Predates Apples
http://www.bnet.com/blog/technology-...tes-apples/609

Tablet UI concepts, circa 1994:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBEtPQDQNcI

Touch gestures, including two-finger pinch, circa 1992:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...30828816089246

Multitouch UIs, 1970s forward:
http://www.billbuxton.com/multitouchOverview.html

And then there's this summary from Wikipedia:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-touch

By the time this is done, the scope of enforceable "non-obvious" elements in Apple's patents related to multitouch will likely be so slender as to have very low liabilities if any at all.

That would leave only the hardware design patents, which are increasingly seen as questionable in the courts since they rely on attributes such as round corners, black frames, and slender form factors which are not only utilitartian in nature but have also been in existence throughout so much of consumer electronics that their application to tablets seems likely to face the same scrutiny, forcing Apple to describe their specific non-obvious contributions over prior art which may form a subset of enforceable elements, again reducing penalties down to something closer to zero.

Wow, why did Apple even bother litigating when they could have checked with internet lawyers who have decisively concluded that they have no case?
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post #31 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo42 View Post

All this proves is that the samsung lawyer is an idiot. The aspect ratio is different between the two devices and this should be obvious at 30+ feet to anyone that isn't blind

Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

This actually only showed 1 thing: Samsung hired clueless lawyers who're totally unprepared. I mean, when you pay that kind of dollar for these lawyers, they're supposed to study every detail of each device and could see all the differences without any trouble.

So basically the company that so many people are wailing and gnashing teeth over how unfairly it has been treated that also rakes in billions of dollars a year has hired incompetent counsel? No wonder Samsung has lost three (3) injunctions in three (3) different countries.

P.S. if either of you have passed the bar, I suspect there is a lucrative job opening available.
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post #32 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by spookychief View Post

asking a lawyer to point out which is the galaxy and which is the ipad is irrelevant honestly. first of all they are lawyers im willing to bet people who actually work for samsung could point the difference out. and if they couldnt have that would have carried a little more clout that asking some idiot lawyer. Apple needs to get over itself their products arent anything special. Apple is just overpriced tech. Most Apple consumers are snobs or wanna be snobs. Anytime someone i know buys a imac or macbook "pro" i laugh in their face so hard for getting ripped off. it just people are so misinformed about apple and how restrictive the company is to consumers. Thats why i will never own a product of theirs.

That's ridiculous. The whole point of trade dress is to decide if the infringing product dilutes the brand of the suing party which relies on NORMAL consumers. Having an "expert" employed by the possibly infringing party choose between the products would prove nothing.
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post #33 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by spookychief View Post

first of all they are lawyers im willing to bet people who actually work for samsung could point the difference out.

Thanks for COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY MISSING THE POINT, going so far as to be THE EXACT OPPOSITE of the point.

WHO GIVES A FRICK if Samsung employees know the difference? THAT'S NOT THE LAWSUIT. The lawsuit is if regular people can tell the difference. And Samsung's own lawyers have just proven they can't.

Quote:
and if they couldnt have that would have carried a little more clout that asking some idiot lawyer.

Should have asked some idiot consumer.

Quote:
Apple needs to get over itself their products arent anything special.

In the immortal words of Tommy Wiseau: "OH, HI, TROLL."

Quote:
Apple is just overpriced tech.

Please look up the definition of 'overpriced'. Then come back and laugh at yourself.

Quote:
Most Apple consumers are snobs or wanna be snobs.

Reported. Shortest troll account ever? I think so.

Quote:
Thats why i will never own a product of theirs.

So go away.
post #34 of 194
From about a mile and half away I can't tell the difference between Angelina Jolie and Kathy Bates.
post #35 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

This actually only showed 1 thing: Samsung hired clueless lawyers who're totally unprepared. I mean, when you pay that kind of dollar for these lawyers, they're supposed to study every detail of each device and could see all the differences without any trouble.

Maybe they weren't real lawyers... just copies of real lawyers
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post #36 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Wow, why did Apple even bother litigating when they could have checked with internet lawyers who have decisively concluded that they have no case?

serious question, and can you put your unbridled dislike for me aside for a second, what of what he posted do you not agree with?
post #37 of 194
Why is AI not covering the MEAT AND POTATOES of this recent court proceedings: that Apple's patent might be invalid throwing the entire case out the door?

Because it would disfavor Apple.

I found the right place.

How about giving a link to your sources?

How pathetic and unethical is it for you people to not cite sources?

That is journalism 101.

Even high school students know how to do it.

AI, "Are you better than a high schooler?" Season 1 first episode showing in Oct 30.

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post #38 of 194
Why is there a picture of an iPad in this story about the Samsung model?
post #39 of 194
You can't loose when you use the My Cousin Vinny Defense...



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post #40 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by plokoonpma View Post

hahahaha OH SNAP!!!

Epic Fail!!!! That dude career is over..... and he kind of deserve it for been unprepared...


Um, that dude's name is Kathleen.
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