or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › PoliticalOutsider › The Fed: What Good Is It Anymore?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

The Fed: What Good Is It Anymore?

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
Nevermind Obama, we've had QE1, QE2, the "Twist", now they're talking up QE3.

What's wrong with this picture?

Edit: Fed as in Federal Reserve Bank specifically.
post #2 of 20
I thought the Twist was QE2?



As soon as I get my time machine working we are going to go back and try rapid bankruptcy on the failed banks and not try to pad every bad loan out there. After I see the results of that experiment we'll go back and get the government out of the housing market. Renting aint that bad. I did it for decades.
post #3 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

I thought the Twist was QE2?



As soon as I get my time machine working we are going to go back and try rapid bankruptcy on the failed banks and not try to pad every bad loan out there. After I see the results of that experiment we'll go back and get the government out of the housing market. Renting aint that bad. I did it for decades.

Agree with you FloorJack 100%.
post #4 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

I thought the Twist was QE2?

Nope, that was kind of a QE 2.5
post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

Renting aint that bad. I did it for decades.

That's the issue right there. If you can afford your rent and are building up your savings through "good investments" then things shouldn't be too bad. Yes, in many housing markets the rate of gain can be 5, 10 or over 20% over many years. But it creates complications too.

Remember, money is only created as debt. The entire financial system as it stands depends on people taking out credit card, car loans, personal loans, and mortgages.

It's reversed for a bank. Every loan is an "asset" on their balance sheet. What's more, since every loan has to be deposited somewhere (you buy a $250,000 house, that goes to the seller's account, not under his mattress, in most cases), so that deposit goes into another bank. Increasing their capacity to lend more, i.e., increase their "assets". Since banking is basically a closed, inbred system, all money created is essentially one big bank lending more and more money to itself.

Hence the Euro crisis now looking to "emerging economies" to help them, since the Euro banks bailing out one another now need somebody to bail them all out. (Unless Merkel discovers a few trillion € under her mattress)

I've experienced debt on a personal level and it is one of the most horrible experiences in life next to physical and mental health challenges. But if you think it's bad for a person, what about entire swaths of otherwise credible, sovereign nations?

The modern banking system is so horribly twisted, finding out about how it really works these past few years is a million times worse than when my parents told me Santa Claus wasn't real. It's like being told Santa Claus actually raped me as a child each time he visited, that's why he left me presents every Christmas.

Algebra? Fuck that, if I could I'd go back to my high school and rip up all the Math textbooks and tell the Math teachers what they really should be teaching.

a^2 + b^2 = c^2? Here's a better problem for the blackboard... This is your ass, this is the government and the bankers, and here comes the choo-choo train...
post #6 of 20
The idea touted to the public is that the Federal Reserve was set up (in 1913) to maintain stability for the US economy. A tiny minority of people understand exactly how it works, and it is also exempt from audit. Furthermore, it is not *Federal, and its main shareholders are privately owned banks.

Some quotes from people who understood what the "Federal" Reserve was and is, all about:
I doubt if anyone contributing to this little corner of the web has equal understanding of this issue...

Quote:
"Most Americans have no real understanding of the operation of the international money lenders. The accounts of the Federal Reserve System have never been audited. It operates outside the control of Congress and manipulates the credit of the United States" -- Sen. Barry Goldwater (R- AZ)

"A great industrial nation is controlled by it's system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the world--no longer a government of free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of small groups of dominant men." President Woodrow Wilson

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes it's laws" -- Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild

"Some people think the Federal Reserve Banks are the United States government's institutions.
They are not government institutions. They are private credit monopolies which prey upon the people of the United States for the benefit of themselves and their foreign swindlers" -- Congressional Record 12595-12603 -- Louis T. McFadden, Chairman of the Committee on Banking and Currency (12 years) June 10, 1932

"The [Federal Reserve Act] as it stands seems to me to open the way to a vast inflation of the currency... I do not like to think that any law can be passed that will make it possible to submerge the gold standard in a flood of irredeemable paper currency." -- Henry Cabot Lodge Sr., 1913

"The financial system has been turned over to the Federal Reserve Board. That Board administers the finance system by authority of a purely profiteering group. The system is private, conducted for the sole purpose of obtaining the greatest possible profit from the use of other people's money" -- Charles A. Lindbergh Sr., 1923


~

* "The Federal Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities..." -- Lewis vs. United States 9th Circuit 1992

"The regional Federal Reserve banks are not government agencies. ...but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations." -- Lewis vs. United States, 680 F. 2d 1239 9th Circuit 1992

*

Carry on.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
Reply
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
Reply
post #7 of 20
Thread Starter 
And now, the solution to the Greek problem... Write of 50% of their debt. Poof! (Really, it's in the news just now)

The ability in which a controlled few can commandeer such unimaginable sums of money makes Kings and Queens quiver. President of a country with tons of nukes? Pfft. Getdafuckouttahere. Better to be a high-level banker, mate.

The market is so bloody elated now. This is like a merry-go-round you can't get off even though you've puked 10 times already.

The rate at which money (ie. supposedly a measure of resources for what we need as physical beings) increases and decreases is getting ridiculous.

Forget coke, marijuana, ecstasy, crack, speed, tobacco, alcohol... The world's addiction now is DEBT.

And like most addicts we as a world are still telling ourselves, "It's okay, I can cut down anytime... I'll just start taking a little less each day, you'll see, you'll see..."
post #8 of 20
I want you to know I appreciate the posts nvidia. I haven't chimed in much because I'm solidly in agreement and you've got such flair with what you are posting right now.

Please keep it up.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply
post #9 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

i want you to know i appreciate the posts nvidia. I haven't chimed in much because i'm solidly in agreement and you've got such flair with what you are posting right now.

Please keep it up.

+1

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #10 of 20
Thread Starter 
Cheers... We'll see when inspiration hits next.
post #11 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

And now, the solution to the Greek problem... Write of 50% of their debt. Poof! (Really, it's in the news just now)

The ability in which a controlled few can commandeer such unimaginable sums of money makes Kings and Queens quiver. President of a country with tons of nukes? Pfft. Getdafuckouttahere. Better to be a high-level banker, mate.

The market is so bloody elated now. This is like a merry-go-round you can't get off even though you've puked 10 times already.

The rate at which money (ie. supposedly a measure of resources for what we need as physical beings) increases and decreases is getting ridiculous.

Forget coke, marijuana, ecstasy, crack, speed, tobacco, alcohol... The world's addiction now is DEBT.

And like most addicts we as a world are still telling ourselves, "It's okay, I can cut down anytime... I'll just start taking a little less each day, you'll see, you'll see..."



Who's holding that debt? Often the public dept is bought up by pension funds. It could be a bunch of hedge fund types and foreign government. Who exactly is taking the hair cut?

Wait? French banks held some of this and we're told they are safe and not in jeopardy? Right!
post #12 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

Nevermind Obama, we've had QE1, QE2, the "Twist", now they're talking up QE3.

What's wrong with this picture?

Edit: Fed as in Federal Reserve Bank specifically.

Please clue me in on what these stand for? thanks Marv
post #13 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Please clue me in on what these stand for? thanks Marv

Basically the US Federal Reserve has injected huge amounts of money into the banking system in the hopes of fixing the economy. It doesn't seem to have really worked.

QE stands for Quantitative Easing. This was done once (QE1), twice (QE2), kind of ("Operation Twist") and now they're talking of QE3.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantitative_easing

Please spread the word on how the US Federal Reserve, not really as pointed out, a "Federal" entity, is throwing more and more money into a sinking hole, ie. the corrupt banking and institutional investment system.

Or even better, just watch and spread this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTUY16CkS-k

For the gory details, try: http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=ohKQP_wSO9k

For the spin (ie. lies) check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9wRq6C2fgo
post #14 of 20
Thread Starter 
We've got a little neighbourhood, with a crazy uncle. Kids generally like and depend on this crazy uncle, because he has a magic toy factory and can give people a lot of cool toys and even stuff like lemonade makers to make lemonade and bicycles for paper routes that can help the kids earn some money. For many years in the past, he brought toys to the regular kids in the neighbourhood, lent them to each kid for a penny, and it helped the kids learn, read, play, make money and have fun. This lead to the kids in the neighbourhood being happy and fulfilled.

One day, instead of the crazy uncle lending out the toys himself, he says, maybe some of the kids could do it themselves. So he gives a ton of these cool toys, lemonade makers and bicycles to a few special kids, and then says to them, hey, why don't you take care of the toys and be sure to share it with all the kids? Just charge them, say, a quarter per toy, you guys make the money instead of me, since, you know, my toy factory runs on magic. So the special kids say, awesome!

Now, several years later, all the regular kids start to go back to the crazy uncle and they say, hey, what happened to all the toys? You said you'd always lend them to us to play with... We used to have a lot of toys, and we've still got a lot of quarters, but these days the special kids aren't lending us enough toys!

So the crazy uncle goes to the special kids (lets call them bullies now) and says, what's going on? I thought I gave you lots of toys to lend!

The bullies say, oh, you know, we lent a bunch to Skinhead Sam and he broke them, so now we're scared other kids may lose the toys, or break them, so, you know, we better not lend out our toys too much. Also the grown ups aren't drinking that much lemonade or reading papers so we don't think the regular kids will make full use of the lemonade makers and bicycles.

The crazy uncle pauses for a while, then says, okay, no problem! I think if you had more toys and more lemonade makers and bicycles you wouldn't be so worried. Here, I'll give you more toys from my magic toy factory, so that should cover the need for more toys and any problems with the regular kids losing or breaking them... Since you bullies obviously are the best judge of lending toys to kids, not me, the grown up. Also, the toys that Skinhead Sam broke and owes you? Don't worry, I'll take care of that myself, here are replacements for the toys he broke. I'll speak to him and I'm sure he'll promise to replace the toys for me somehow.

Great, say the bullies, will do! Thanks, Mr. Crazy Uncle, you're the best!

Now another several months go by, and sadly we see the regular kids are all kind of down in the dumps. You see, they still can't borrow enough toys from the bullies for all of them to enjoy, even though there's still lots of toys in the bullies' houses. Moreover, some of the few toys that the regular kids have are worn out, and don't work. They can fix them, but the bullies don't want to lend them the toy toolboxes. Some of the kids were doing well with the small little lemonade makers to sell lemonade, but the bullies came by and said they weren't selling enough lemonade and that the grown ups want orange juice instead, so they took back the lemonade makers even though they were still working. To make matters even worse, Skinhead Sam changed his name to Careful Colin and so somehow managed to lend more toys from the bullies, but broke even more toys this time.

As such the regular kids go back to the crazy uncle, and say, uncle, this really, really sucks now! But, you're the only Crazy Uncle in the neighbourhood with the magic toy factory, so you're the only one we can depend on!

So the crazy uncle says, no problem! I can fix this, because I want all the kids to have enough toys to learn, earn pocket money and have fun! He goes back to the bullies and gives them even more toys. Only the bullies start getting a bit wiser... This time the bullies kind of say, okay, well, we'll think about what to do with it... because, don't forget who's in charge now, right? And the crazy uncle goes, yeah, sure, I trust you, since you now have probably more toys than me and know better about toys, right? And my toy factory is starting to run out of toy-making magic so, well, you guys take care of the toy-lending, okay?

....

Eventually, the magic toy factory runs out of pixie dust and the Crazy Uncle is nowhere to be found. The neighbourhood kids are selling drugs instead of lemonade. They can barely afford to feed or clothe themselves, the grown ups seem to be spending all their time with the other grown ups from other neighbourhoods in the town hall arguing every day. The regular kids, now a bit more grown up, start to dig around a bit. They learn something startling. The bullies all along have been lending many of their toys to the rich kids in the neighbourhood right across town, charging the rich kids $5 up front for each toy. Also, the regular kids find out that for some reason the crazy uncle liked some of the toys for himself, so he paid the bullies for them, even though he has a magic toy factory.

One day they sneak into his abandoned toy factory and discover that the crazy uncle, before he was given the keys to the magic toy factory, was a bully himself.

~The End~
post #15 of 20
Thread Starter 
That's the story of the Fed and Quantitative Easing, including purchases of "toxic assets" (the broken toys due to Skinhead Sam) in a nutshell.

In the analogy above, it sounds absolutely ridiculous and something a popular but eccentric children's book writer might come up with, and you can even imagine the whimsical illustrations.

But delve into it, watch the YouTube videos, and it will dawn on you this is happening in real life. The toys are of course money, the crazy uncle the Federal Reserve bank, the bullies are the Bankers, and the regular kids are things like small businesses and consumers...

This stuff is not in the media, it's not taught in schools or college except to the people that want specifically to become the bullies.
post #16 of 20

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #17 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Federal Reserve Crisis Solution Chart


"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
Reply
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
Reply
post #18 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

That's the story of the Fed and Quantitative Easing, including purchases of "toxic assets" (the broken toys due to Skinhead Sam) in a nutshell.

In the analogy above, it sounds absolutely ridiculous and something a popular but eccentric children's book writer might come up with, and you can even imagine the whimsical illustrations.

But delve into it, watch the YouTube videos, and it will dawn on you this is happening in real life. The toys are of course money, the crazy uncle the Federal Reserve bank, the bullies are the Bankers, and the regular kids are things like small businesses and consumers...

This stuff is not in the media, it's not taught in schools or college except to the people that want specifically to become the bullies.

We agree on a lot but we have a fundamental disagreement on the relationship of the Fed and government. In my opinion you essentually are seeing the tail wag the dog, aka you believe the banks to be bossing around government when I believe of course it is the reverse, that governments are bullying the banks. No one can truly be subservient to an entity that they completely control. Governments control the banks and have the banks do their bidding. They can regulate them. They can print as much currency as they want. They could put banks out of business the second they decide to do so. The banks are used to help distract from and cover up corrupt government practices. The creation of the Fed in the first place was to help confiscate gold and allow government to do whatever they desire via printing and inflation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Federal Reserve Crisis Solution Chart




There's still got to be a bigger hammer in that toolbox somewhere. Everything looks like nail when all you've got is a hammer after all.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

Reply
post #19 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

I thought the Twist was QE2?



As soon as I get my time machine working we are going to go back and try rapid bankruptcy on the failed banks and not try to pad every bad loan out there. After I see the results of that experiment we'll go back and get the government out of the housing market. Renting aint that bad. I did it for decades.

I rented all my life and still do. The government should not regulate the housing market. I agree with you. Stay out of it and worry about more jobs and the reducing the deficit.
post #20 of 20
Renting is better for the job market too. A lot of people cannot take other jobs because they are stuck with an under water house. If you rent you can walk away and lose at most your deposit (forgetting that the landlord could come after you for all months rent remaining).
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: PoliticalOutsider
AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › PoliticalOutsider › The Fed: What Good Is It Anymore?